Gunstar

Maybe a better answer is a spool somewhere in-between those two positions.

Disclaimer: This is not meant to be a how-to tutorial or a step-by-step guide. This is merely photos of my upgrades with some description and explanation. But feel free to ask any questions about any aspect of it. This is my blog on all the upgrades, modifications and hacks that have turned a standard 800 into a machine that is still the original vision of Jay Miner's Colleen 800 at heart, and still fully compatible, but includes advancements and upgrades that Atari never envisioned. At it's core, my new 800AI includes an Incognito board which expands it's capabilities to not only that of an XL/XE machine with 64K main memory, but far, far more including; 1MB extended ram multiple OS's and hi-speed SIO, bult-in BASIC and SpartaDOS X, as well as room for other cartridges from any point in the 8-bit era, a CF card virtual HDD and PBI capabilities and much more. Beyond the Incognito the 800 has been upgraded to Stereo sound first, with a DIY dual-POKEY, then replaced with multiple POKEY cores and Covox DSP with the Pokeymax Quad + Covox board. Also a Sophia 2 GTIA replacement and upgrade board (adding more graphic modes) and modern video out with either DVI/HDMI or RGB or VGA. Also a dual PIA board for double the controller output jacks allowing many more exteral devices to be connected and controlled by the 800. An extra SIO jack, Stereo out headphone jack, S-video, composite and mono audio jacks installed for direct connect of standard cables and no more mess of various cables hanging out the side of the 800. The original SIO port is left open for easy temporary connection of peripherals or dead-end SIO peripherals. Fujinet will become a part of the Atari 800AI system as well, and will plug into the side SIO port. Also, a real PBI edge-connector port has been installed on the rear left side of the 800, and is now capable of using any exterior PBI devices, the first of which is a Turbo Freezer. With all these advanced upgrades I felt that just '800" was not good enough anymore, and there needs to be an addition to the name for it's advanced features just like the XL/XE (eXtended Line/eXtended line Enhanced). But another X and some other letter on the end is a bit unimaginative. So I came up with AI for advance(d) plus Incognito, or a playful, if fictional suggestion on the abbreviation A.I., for artificial intelligence. Or maybe in reference to Alpha and Omega, since there's the original 800 in there, but then also the probably final upgrade to the heart of the machine, the Incognito. Yes I know AI is not the same as the Greek letters Alpha and Omega, but it is the first and last letters of ATARI, the beginning and end of the name signifying Alpha and Omega in a way. So AI stands for all of the above. So now I've explained what my 800AI computer is and why, on with the details and photos. The first upgrades I did are Incognito board and a dual-Pokey upgrade (less the actual audio output). And I did some repairs on the keyboard and modified a shift key to be more balanced and sturdy by inserting an extra plunger and spring in an empty key spot below it. Hopefully this will solve a design problem that causes the plunger to crack and stop the new plunger from cracking in the outside corners that make the shift key bind. After the successful incognito and DIY dual POKEY installation, Plans have been changed to a Pokeymax Quad+covox audio upgrade. Quite a leap from just stereo, but I want the best for this upgrade project. The Pokeymax is plugged in the socket and is currently working as a standard Pokey until I get a couple of wires connected to the CPU and audio output with a simple pre-amp circuit to bring it up to line-level audio. I also installed a second SIO port and due to the placement of these new I/O ports I am combining the Pokeymax audio out with the SIO out on the same circuit board. The first step on the new board was to attach the SIO connector (one of half a dozen new 3D printed ones I bought from The Brewing Academy) to the board and a cable to the new SIO port that is connected at the other end to the original SIO port, continuing the SIO daisy-chain internally in the 800. I went with shielded VGA cabling since I have plenty on hand and it's the best thing to use to ensure no interference in close proximity to the motherboard. The cable is directly soldered to the new SIO connector and it's board, but I installed Dupont connectors to the SIO port on the 800's PSU board for easy removal and installation in the future. I fanned out the pins on the back of the SIO so I had room to plug in the Dupont connectors with the capacitor for the PSU in the way. The next step was to install a headphone jack stereo audio out to the new circuit board and attach a wire harness to the Pokeymax that will run to the new board. I then attached the wire harness to the Pokeymax, with three wires going to the CPU on the CPU board and three wires going to the SIO/Stereo out board. I used a headphone jack style stereo audio out so it would fit on the board with the SIO port, and both will fit nicely where I make cut-outs for them on the underside of the case, leading out the back left recessed area of the 800 case underside. I used DuPont connectors at the audio out for easy separation from the motherboard and CPU board. The only thing left for the Pokeymax upgrade is to make a spot for the audio out wires to go through the heavy shielding. I suppose I'll have to drill a hole through the shielding near the Pokeymax chip. And I just remembered I need to connect the headphone jack's ground to ground on the SIO connector which is connected to ground through the cable to the PSU to ensure proper grounding. (Pictures are not in the order of the descriptions above) The next modification was S-video, composite and mono audio out board directly opposite the 2nd SIO/audio out board, it will be hidden underneath the PSU board and connected to the original monitor port in close proximity. Once that board is done, then I will cut out spots for all the new I/O connectors in the 800's bottom case, then mount the boards and I/O connectors. Next I made a DIY S-video/Composite/mono audio out board. Like the second SIO, these are just direct lines from the nearby monitor jack. As per usual now, at least one end is attached with Dupont Connectors so that all upgrades and boards can be easily separated if need be. I had left/right audio jacks on hand, so the red one has been re-purposed for composite video (I only want this for NTSC high-res games for artifact colors). The mono audio out is white. Instead of attaching a switch to one of the Pokeymax lines to change between mono and Quad-stereo out, I left it so Quad-stereo is always on as I will use the mono out for programs that don't use stereo. And of course, the main reason for the DIY mod board, is a real S-video jack. The S-video on both my Atari's gets fed through either video-to-VGA or video-to-HDMI outs and they don't make the adapters with separate chroma/luma lines. But my 1200XL uses a break-out-box for video which does have separate chroma/luma for when I get my CBM 1084S monitor repaired which does have these inputs. The 800 will always be connected to a converter. (pictures are not in order of descriptions above) Now, except for the power jack, I no longer have to have cables coming out the side of my 800 getting in my way on the desktop. All other I/O will now be discretely placed in the recesses on the underside of the 800 with all cables hidden and running out the back like XL/XE machines. Though I'm out of space there now, since the 800's motherboard fills the rest of the bottom case, my PBI and extra controller ports will have to be mounted to the rear left side of the 800 coming directly out of the back. So all that is left for these upgrades and mods is to cut port holes in the 800's case and mount the boards. Continuing my 800 upgrades and mods, I made a true PBI edge-connector port for the 800. It was already upgraded with full PBI capabilities from the Incognito, but there is a 50-pin (SCSI?) style connector on it that is the gateway to PBI devices being connected. As with my DIY PBI upgrade on my 1200XL, I created and actual PBI edge-connector port on the rear of the 800. With the 1200XL, I salvaged parts from a 600XL for the mod/upgrade. With the 800 I was able to use the a XE ECI-to-PBI adapter that I don't need for an XE and never will, that came with my Turbo Freezer 2011. I still have to get the connector and 50-wire ribbon cable to connect to the Incognito and create the physical buss. On the 1200XL I purchased a length of 50-wire rainbow ribbon cable for it, and of course had to make all connections directly to the IC's, instead of a connector to plug in. I also made an enclosure for the Turbo Freezer's PBI board, with a connector on it for the actual Turbo Freezer housed in a cartridge case. I just used an old, small, project box that has been laying around for years, the board didn't quite fit, so it has "wings" out the side, but I think it still looks better than a bare board, and I'll paint it to match the 800. The Sophia 2 board upgrade was the next and second to last upgrade (dual PIA IC's will be the final upgrade). Since it's a plug-in board I didn't bother taking pictures of the Sophia 2, though I did removed the original socket for the GTIA chip on the CPU board and installed a precision socket to lower it's profile so it can fit inside the shielding were the CPU board is hidden. After that, I had to cut an opening in the heavy metal shielding so the video cable from the board could "escape." I decided to place the Sophia board in between the Shielding and PSU board's heat sink vertically as there was few other choices with the modifications I've already made. I next cut out a spot on the back of the 800's upper case half to mount the Sophia 2 board. I again used E6000 adhesive to mount it as I did for the PBI and other audio/video upgrade boards. It's strong and will hold the upgrades in place without the need for screws and bolts and holes drilled, yet easily removable, if needed with a razor blade and peeling away excess. Later on, when the dual-PIA board is installed, another 2-4 controller ports will be mounted next to the DVI output. This bog is not yet completed as I still have to install another multi-part upgrade/modification to my 800 will be dual PIA board to be used for additional controller ports. This upgrade and mod is there are still more than two controller ports when I'm using the 800 Incognito in XL/XE modes and ports 3 and 4 are used for Port B memory banking. I also will be using more than 4 ports, even in 800 mode on the Incognito along with a half-dozen AtariLab Interface devices and DIY clones of the AtariLab Interfaces for help in a future project of building a robot, with an Atari 800 brain, that will eventually be autonomous, but while in the research. experimentation and prototype building stage it will be controlled through the 8 controller ports. AtariLab Interfaces are basically break-out-boxes that make it easier as I can use standard RCA cords between the Atari and all the sensors for the robot to know where it is and avoid obstacles or interact and also Ardruino boards that will control arms and trax of the Robot as well. The intention being a 100% 8-bit robot Some other changes or previous upgrades and fixes to the 800 include: luma output resister change mod (for improving picture clarity as luma is over-boosted for today's standards), The RF has been disconnected to avoid interference from signal bleed on S-video and composite, the channel switch has been re-purposed for a mono/Quad stereo switch, a wire modification to the right cartridge port (and trace cut on the left port) so that a needed signal is available so that The!Cart and MyIDE II will work in the left cartridge slot on the 800 and internal RGB-LED lighting and keyboard lighting. I also have a Fujinet on the way for this 800 too. Another possible upgrade would be a MIDI board. The problem with more upgrades is locations to mount them internally in the 800. There is still plenty of room on the left side of the 800,, but the issue is that anything mounted internally there would either need port extension modifications so I can mount them on the back by the DVI and 2nd PIA controller ports. Obviously there is the left side of the 800 to mount jacks, but I just went through a lot of trouble getting rid of side ports with cables in the way, and I don't want to start populating the left side either.

@[email protected] Altirra you have to set it for artifact colors or it will show only B/W, this is also true if your using real hardware with S-video out or one of the other modern video upgrade boards that put out RGB/DVI. Only composite out or RF out will show colors on a real machine.

@[email protected], well I wrote the ATR images that @Mclaneinc posted to a floppy (side A 90K, side B 130K 1050) and first, it will only work on my 1050, it won't work with my Indus GT in 130K mode, but anyway I started the game in XL/XE mode with standard XL/XE OS and 64K, BASIC disabled (I tried other setups and with BASIC on or not, 800 OSB, XL/XE, Q-meg OS, Altirra OS, etc. and all different memory configurations from 64K (48K in OSB mode) up to 1088K and every option in between. It's the same result no matter what). It loads to the title screen and main character choice menu, then I choose a character, it tells me to put in the dungeon disk (the 130K side) and it loads to the game fine, as always. Then I proceed out the first room, second room loads fine, I go straight across to the secret passage (I went other directions previously and it worked for a couple more screens) it transports me to another room, and once I leave that room it either crashes to a solid blue screen without cursor or back to the main character menu every time. When I've gone other directions in the game I generally can go through a room or two more, but eventually it crashes and I see a brief moment where it flashes a run-time error, but it doesn't stay on screen long enough to see all the details, and with BASIC enabled (I know it's not supposed to be) instead of the run-time error it goes to a blue screen with a an error at line such and such like I said before. Was the original game done with the boot disk a 90K and dungeon 130K? When writing the first ATR image to disk, the 90K single density, it only uses about a third of the disk space and the dungeon side uses all the 130K of enhanced density. It seems like the game would fit onto two singled density sides/disks so I'm wondering why the disks were done this way. Anyway, every disk image version I've found fails the same way and no matter what compatibility settings I choose on my 800 Incognito as to machine, OS, memory, BASIC or not, etc., it does the same thing. It may all have to do with them being cracked versions of the original without the bad sector copy protection? Has anyone else successfully played this game with available disk images and gotten it to work properly?

I think the PBI "device" we need most is an expansion box. I'm not talking about the 1090 or something similar, just a box (similar to a 1090 only as far as the case goes) that has multiple PBI slots and PCB edge connectors for multiple PBI devices (so we don't have to string a bunch of devices out the back like the TI 99/4A did out the side (and which they eventually brought out the expansion box for this very reason. And Atari's own 1090 was meant for too). I've been planning on making one DIY for myself anyway, for my 1200XL. I've nothing on paper yet, just ideas swirling about in my head. But I only make things for myself and have no intention of trying to make some to sell, as I don't have the facility or money to lay down upfront for production costs. But if someone else who has the proper facility and finances to do so, then I'd buy it. My idea is just a box with multiple PBI slots and edge connectors that many of the current PBI devices as well as future ones can plug into: the plan is to also incorporate ribbon cables for current devices which already have a PBI pass-through, like the one I used from my Incognito to a PBI edge-connector out on my 800. But much shorter ribbon cables since slots/edge connectors would be right next to each other. I am thinking something like the first is a card edge that has a device plugged in, then a ribbon cable with two PCB connectors on either end, coming off the pass-through of the first device, to the second device which would connect via cable, and it's pass-through plugs into the second slot, the third a card edge, and so on, i.e.,This means the first spot would be a card edge, the second a slot PCB connector, the third a card-edge and so on. either alternating like that, or all PCB slot connectors but then have double-male cards like how the Atari Jaguar's CD unit plugs into the base Jaguar to allow chaining of PBI devices that way. The only other thing besides multiple slots would of course be a built in PSU and maybe PHI2 signal generation for PBI devices without them. Of course I plan on forging ahead with my DIY project within a year or two if no one else makes something similar for sale.

I agree, that is total nonsense. I guess there are some very weak-willed people out there if they complain about trainer menus, if they don't want to use them, it's not like crack for crack addicts and if it is to some, that's a personal problem they should find help for. I myself still prefer no cheats, but the day may come when I need some, but trainers never bothered me, I just ignore them.

Well, since it doesn't require BASIC due to being compiled, that may be my problem right there as I haven't been disabling BASIC to play it...it does sometimes show BASIC code when it crashes like : error at line 12937 blah blah blah (this is not an actual error I see, just something random I typed for an example), which made me think it required BASIC so I was trying different OS's and versions of BASIC to get it to work right. I will load it with BASIC disabled and see if that solves my issues.

@[email protected] This site is pretty much the center of the Atari community universe, the rest are just out-lying systems. There are a couple out there that though they have a microscopic amount of members compared to this one, they are active with new posts and content daily. Check out https://atari-owner.com/ for example. As to charging for a copy, I'm more interested in original packaging, etc. for it's collect-ability. As per the first post that started this thread, I had circled your ad years ago and fully intended to order a copy back in the early 90's and just forgot about it for some reason. And that circle is what caught my eye when I was browsing my old mag collection, and apparently it all led to you joining here...

@[email protected] It may just be a corrupted disk image or something. I'm going to try the ones that were posted above, because if it worked for you on and 800 and a 130XE, then it should work fine on my computer, so either I have some advanced settings* set to on that shouldn't be or a bad disk image, or something like that. *My 800 has an Incognito in it, I don't know if you know what that is, since you seem to be new to Atari Age, but just do a search for it in this forum and it will come up, or go look it up on Youtube or something, it's now well known and documented in the community and internet. I'm not an emulator user myself either, except on rare occasion, I use real hardware still, but there are plenty of people here who can help you get going with one, I think the best one is still supposed to be Altirra. It's what I use on the rare occasion. If you happen to still have original copies for it you sold, I'd sure like to buy one! By the way, what made you suddenly decide to pop by and join Atari Age?

Hello @[email protected], glad to see you here. I do really like your game, what I've been able to see of it, but it keeps crashing on me. I can usually go through a few screens, but then it crashes going from screen to screen after a little bit. Maybe it's an OS thing, so maybe you could tell us what OS it was developed on? OSA, OSB, or XL/XE OS's? I've been playing it with standard Atari Basic Rev. C in rom*. I would really like to play the game but it's pointless if I get 5 minutes into it and it crashes. Now maybe it's a corrupted disk image(s) as I downloaded it from Atarimania.com. I have been playing it on a *heavily modified 800 with multiple OS's available to try. I see that @Mclaneinc posted some disk images above, so I will give them a try. I guess maybe I should also be asking if anyone else has had issues with it crashing?

I've got a Sophia 2 on the way for my 800, and a 1080S to go RGB myself. So screen image quality will be even better than my current S-video out to Ambery Video2VGA converter. I also have an RGB2VGA upscaler/converter and CRT VGA to use too, for when I upgrade my 1200XL to either VBXE or Sophia 2. I'll definitely be getting a VBXE for my future 1088XEL, so I may just stick with Sophia 2 for my original equipment. I highly recommend my Ambery RGB2VGA if you don't have an RGB CRT monitor, it works great with both LCD and CRT VGA monitors. Below is my Jaguar connected to the converter and out to VGA on my LCD TV and, of course, my 800 out to a VGA converter and LCD TV.

It definitely looks good, for sure, and I may get a VBXE eventually, but it's 80 columns still isn't the reason I'd get one if I do, I want it more for doing art with the graphic modes. But I don't think anyone has written a graphic art program for it yet (if I'm wrong point me to it). If I do get one I'll use it's 80 columns too, but I'm happy enough with the software 80-column that it still isn't a priority to me for getting a VBXE.

@DrVenkman Is that VBXE 80 column?

I use the SDX 64 and 80 column output without the need for a VBXE, with an upgraded S-video out or UAV/Sophia 2/etc. it's already quite clear and legible, and very useful on my color monitors. I'm quite happy with the results of the software drivers or for The Last Word with it's 80 column software driver and so I've felt no need for hardware 80 columns like Bit-3 or XEP80, or even a new hardware 80 column PBI device like was just suggested in a new thread that was just posted. But of course if you already have a VBXE then you might as well use it!

Yes, I've said the same thing before myself and a few years ago was going to wait for the tech to reach the "deskjet" printer era and prices drop to about what I just paid for my 3D printer. But I decided that "dot matrix" quality is o.k. for me, for now, since Uncle Sam is giving out "free" money right now, whether I need it or not, which I'm lucky enough to not need for living expenses. So I'm spending it on hobby toys to do my part in helping the economy. If they end up passing another stimulus package to the American people, I'll invest it in more equipment for my business. I spent the first $1200 on my business.

Like you guys said, to keep an eye on it when I'm not in the office, I guess. I may not need it, as you say, but I'm not always in my office space, except maybe over the winter months like now when my business is slow (mostly landscaping and lawn maintenance with light construction and remodeling sometimes), because it's where my Atari computers are too, so it doubles as my computer-playground. What's the average time for printing, like say, the cartridge holders?

I have a window right next to where I'll be setting up the printer, and a small fan to blow any fumes out. And at this point, upon suggestions from you guys, I only plan on using PLA filament.

I have this older Uniden mini camera that I never use anymore, it has an SD card and USB, so maybe I can rig it up to the printer. It does pictures and video. It's about 2.5" x 1.5" in size. I don't know why this forum sometimes posts my pictures side-ways or upside down,,,

I asked about the enclosure in a couple of posts and that question went unanswered, no biggy, you guys have been extremely helpful. But I intend to set the printer up next to my PC in my home office area so it should be at room temperature all the time.

Noob question: Why would a camera be needed?

I'll make another attempt, I really want to do this, but in the past, with my busy life, I just keep forgetting, or, like last season, I started upgraded my 800 and then had a keyboard issue that wouldn't let me use the computer, and I spent months when I had time trying to figure out what went wrong. And of course, in the end, it was something simple but the problem was that I had to turn on the computer without the keyboard attached and then plug the keyboard in after it was on to finally track down the issue, as it would just didn't do anything when I turned on the computer with the keyboard already plugged in. I just wish I'd thought of it sooner. it turned out to be the space bar; one of the fingers on the wings/brushes that complete the connection when the key is pressed had broken and was keeping it "connected" permanently. An easy fix just removing the broken bit causing the short.

Ok, thanks. Since I'm a complete noob here, I'll have to learn about all of this and move forward from there.

I was about to buy the (apparently legit) Pro for about a $100 more, until I saw this one on sale. I knew it wasn't exactly the same, but luckily, as you guys have done, it's up-gradable. I'll look into the upgrades you have posted links for once I get it and give it a try.

Here is a picture of the exact model I purchased, it should be here in a couple of weeks. I ordered two spools of Hatchbox PLA Filament off Ebay too, which will probably last for a minute. Apparently they will take about a week longer to arrive, according to estimates, but by the end of the month, I should be in the 3D printing business!