Gunstar
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Posts posted by Gunstar
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The 1200XL's hidden side cartridge ports has always been one of my favorite reasons for the 1200XL being my favorite in the 8-bit line. Starting out first with a 130XE, I too, always hated the rear port that made it difficult to plug and unplug cartridges and the flimsy feeling of them just hanging there and the top ports of the 600/800XL, though convenient, I always hated the aesthetics because it made them look like consoles instead of serious computers as well as the pass-thru issues and towering carts looking bad and getting in the way of view-ability. I feel the same for the XEGS too, though I know it was released as a console. The 400 and 800 were great with the hidden ports under a door, and barring that I feel the recessed side cart port is the best alternative. As too the issues of non-Atari carts not fitting, it wasn't one, for me, until I got Dropcheck's SSDX cartridge which uses a C64 cart case. She didn't release the cart extender until after I purchased the SSDX cart. But I just used my Dremel and sanded down the sides of the 1200XL's side plate cartridge "tunnel" and now every cartridge I insert fits perfectly fine. Though the SSDX cart stays inserted 99% if the time now anyway, and I use it's pass-thru.
I also always preferred slightly larger 8-bit computers too, another reason I love the 1200XL is the larger footprint makes it look like a more seriously powerful computer, like the large Apple II's and 800's that became my standard as too what a quality and powerful computer should look like. That preference has never changed for me. That along with the beautiful aesthetics, cartridge port and controller placement, fantastic feeling keyboard, and room for upgrades inside all played a part in my falling in love with the 1200XL. So much so that I was willing to go the distance to correct it's minor faults and final design limitations and in the spirit of the original "sweet sixteen" 1000 and later 1400XL designs gave it the missing PBI port, factory-edge-connector style and all the incredible upgrades that, together make it far more than was dreamed of with even the 1000 or 1400XL. I made it into the dream machine it should have been from the start, and far surpassed it.
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While I've never owned one, I refer to all of them (65/130/GS) as an "X-E" or XE computer. Because that is really what it is. Repackaging the XE in a new case and calling it a "video game system" I always thought was just lame. It's just another Atari 8-bit computer to me. especially since it's cartridges are compatible with all XL and XE computers with enough memory and some can even be played on the 400/800 with 48K and vice-versa. I have referred to it as the "X-E-G-S" in posts just to differentiate it from the 65XE and 130XE among the A8 community, but if I speak of it in real life conversation to people in general, it's just an XE computer
The 5200 is the only Atari 8-bit based system that I consider a console or video game system because that is exactly all it is; no keyboard, no SIO port, no drive, modem or printer peripherals, it only takes cartridges like any old-school console.
The "XEGS" is just a marketing ploy, which is proven (not that it needed to be) by the fact that they did package and sell 65XE's as the same thing in some parts of the world.
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3 hours ago, Tempest said:Yep. The Coleco Adam and Tandy CoCo both require this. Pain in the butt, but it works.
I still have my red disk notcher from back in the day, it's one of my prized positions. Sort of like my version of a red stapler.
My prized positions are a couple involving the fairer sex, and one is sitting on the porcelain throne.
How about a picture of you in your prized position with your disk notcher?
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4 hours ago, Keatah said:Otherwise you have to disassemble the disk and make another timing hole.
I've done this successfully (for Coco 2) just by spreading the sleeve and magnetic disk from one another from the inside ring enough to carefully cut a hole with an Exacto blade. Just make sure it's a new blade so it is sharp enough to poke and cut without much pressure to ensure it doesn't slip too far and damage the magnetic disk. I've thought about using a paper hole punch this way too, but I've never tried because the hole would be much bigger than needed and the chance of the punched plastic circle falling in the disk and getting stuck, which would then require a full disassembly anyway.
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18 hours ago, mistapaul said:Write protect switch, easy to make
Good point, for those who can and don't mind modifying cases (I don't mind personally). Though I already have drive select switches (front bezel) installed on my Happy 1050's and it's easier for me to just make flippy disk than installing another switch and the same with my 810, though I will installed a write protect switch on the 810 soon, while installing my Happy upgrade; because I also have 2 Indus GT's connected that have a stock write protect button. So once the 810 has one too, I'll never need to notch disks for my Incognito 800. I'll stick with notching disks for my 1050's & 1200XL. A paper hole punch is always at hand.
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19 hours ago, Stephen said:I just used a cheap paper punch.
Same here, a paper punch since the 80's. I just line it up with the notch on the other side and place the punch so slightly more than half the circle is punched out.
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2 hours ago, 1200XL M.U.L.E. said:Another experiment.
I formatted a 360kB disk in MyDOS and copied my SynCalc files to it. SynCalc was able to read the directory. The free sector count was garbled and only one or two of the filed could be read in. I did not necessarily expect this to work but I wanted to try it and see what happens.
That's OK. Even SS, DD disks at 180kB is excellent. To get the full 360kB I can flip the disk over. All I need now is a disk notcher to cut the notch!
This is fantastic, all my drives are SS DD and I've notched disks and flipped them for decades; standard procedure, even with 90K disks which all of mine ae 180K flippies. Now it seems perfectly feasible to be able to have spread-sheets using at least 180K and saving the whole file to one disk. That's only 65K short of the 800+Axlon Syncalc memory limit of 245K. I'll do plenty of tests myself with my Incognito 800 in Colleen mode with 48/52K main memory and one megabyte Axlon with Happy 1050's and Indus GT's 180K drives. I'll also try both Colleen OS options of OSB and OSB + Fastchip too.
But I am currently very busy with my landscaping business, with a new season on top of me. So it will be probably Saturday night or Sunday before I get a chance. Now I'm off back to work getting ready for work tomorrow...
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Payment for one V3 sent yesterday.
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Great show, one of my favorites as is the original movie. Great nostalgia-based modern show that makes me feel better about my age too when I see Johnny and Daniel looking as old as me and still bad-ass actors and characters. Though Martin as Kreese is looking ancient.
Thanks for the image!
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1 hour ago, DjayBee said:Hi Mathy, this is exactly what I said. Syncalc loads like a blob and contains a DOS.
Btw. today I finally wrote a program to find out what exactly is loaded to where.
Unfortunately I couldn't find out yet, how to start it when loaded as a XEX using standard DOS 2.0, but I have hope.
That is a partial wish of mine, at least SDX can load DOS 2.0 files, so I could use the XEX to load from SDX or an SD 3.2 partion and use it with Snapshot*; still using a full 245K for Syncalc and the rest of 1MB memory for other software with Snapshot. even if I have to save to my 810. My full wish is to have all the Syn-series apps installed on and SDX/SD 3.2 APT partition on Incognito's CF card with Fat loader. But I still like using it as is with my real floppy drives if only for another excuse to use my Atari and drives.
I've used Synfile+ now for a while, as a customer data base, etc. and I've been using the personal finance program 'Your Personal Net Worth' for personal and business, but I want to really start learning what I can do with Syncalc and spread-sheets. Especially since I've acquired quite a few disk images with Syncalc templates from various sources. I purchase original, complete copies of SynFile+, SynCalc and SynTrend (I've never tried Trend yet) from Ebay last year. all three for $25 + shipping. Mostly for the manuals with the nice ring binders so I don't have to look at the PC screen PDF or use up valuable ink and paper. Right now we have to use all these applications from real or virtual drives. Applications are one genre I'd rather have on an APT partition and use SpartaDOS (and Snapshot) I'd still rather play games and do graphics from my virtual and real floppy drives.
*Snapshot first mentioned in Post #57 in this thread, with on-going replies:
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18 hours ago, David_P said:Well, Anything larger than 90K won't fit on a SS/SD disk, so...
If 90K is the limit for disk saves, then so be it. But it my be nice if even 130K/180K save disks could be used, even if a dream 245K ATR image can't be realized. All this available memory and possible disk space may never be needed by me anyway, but it's nice to know it's there to use and I'd sure love to be able to save to a disk image all that can be in memory. Unless there is a way to use more than one 90K disk/image for larger files. I wouldn't mind loading up several disk images into memory once a year for taxes or whatever, just so long as I can have the entire year of data in memory at once, assuming a couple hundred K at least for a full year of small business data. Or even quarterly or whatever...
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Apparently, it seems that Syncalc will also use the extra 4K of base memory for 52K, Assuming this is still used even if extended memory is available. I load it up under Incognito Colleen with 52K+Axlon 1024K later today and see what is what. I'm also curious to see if the OS+fastchip speeds of calculations too, from standard OS B.
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On 3/25/2021 at 11:42 PM, Nezgar said:SynCalc can export "DIF" "Data Interchange Format" which was the pre-CSV way of doing it - so I presume it should have an import function for that format too. A quick search found an online tool that claims to be able to convert to that format:
https://www.files-conversion.com/spreadsheet/csv
There's a good writeup about SynCalc here, with some notes from @luckybuck about importing from VisiCalc .VC files:
Thank you, and @DjayBee for all of this. I have the original '83 versions myself, but according to the write-ups and memory available on the different computers, I'm surprised to find out I actually have more available ram for the program for my Incognito 800 in Axlon mode that even for my 1200XL 512K port B extended memory, even if base memory is 16K less. I haven't read through it all yet, but is it possible to set up a virtual drive .atr image that isn't bound to the 90K per disk barrier? I haven't had files go beyond this yet myself, but (still being a some-what noob to Syncalc) I've wondered what good having 245K of ram to use would be if you can only save up to 90K of it on a disk/image.
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14 hours ago, AW127 said:To be true, I have my doubts about that.
When it comes to the C64, i can guarantee that a Mega-Drive controller definitely can and maybe also will (when you use it longer or often) kill the CIA of the computer sooner or later. This indeed happened in the past to two people, that i know from different C64 forums. And on various places on the internet different users have written about that thing too. Here is a good technical explanation of the problem:
https://www.c64-wiki.com/wiki/64JPX
It begins there with the sentence
"While some game controllers, notably the Sega Master System and Sega Genesis, are physically compatible with the C64 at the connector formfactor and pin level they are not fully electrically compatible ..."
and it continues in the next paragraph with the technical explanation of the pinout-differences that can cause the problem on a C64.
When it comes to other 9Pin-systems, like for example Atari consoles, Atari-8bit/16bit computers or Amiga computers, then it seems, that these systems are not as sensitive as the C64, when it comes to Mega-Drive controllers. But I would still be careful, because of the not insignificant differences in the pin-assignment of Mega-Drive controllers to all the normal Atari pin-assignments, to connect controllers there, which actually do not belong to the system. When they can destroy something in the C64, maybe they can also harm Atari or Amiga systems too and it was so far just lucky, that nothing has broken yet.
But of course, everyone can do what he wants on his own systems. Just wanted to point out, that it may not be 100% safe and you don't want to risk anything with your beloved retro hardware, do you? Modifying a Mega-Drive controller, that nothing bad can happen at all to other retro-systems, is also not a big thing. Only problem is, then this controller should no longer be used on the Mega-Drive anymore for the same reason. For example, here is written something about building an own adapter-cable and also about making a modification on the gamepad itself:
https://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=57614&sid=e40fd3bd50b160c0b89730541739d213
C64 is NOT Atari and the ports, even if the pin-outs are the same, cannot be considered in the same way, sbecause those circuits go to completely different IC's on a machines with completely different design that just happen to have some similar things about them, and both happen to use 9-pin controller ports, but do not connect to the same IC's, so one has NOTHING to do with the other. I only know any Atari 9-pin port, NOT C64 can use Sega controllers without any problem at all. The CIA is NOT a PIA and the SID is NOT a POKEY (PIA and POKEY are what use the controller ports on Atari's.).So you are contradicting a guy who just said he's been using Sega controllers for over twenty years on Atari's (who also has a degree in electronics and works on all types of vintage electronics). Obviously you know little about Atari's and shouldn't be giving advice for them based on the C64; you might as well be saying you are an expert on Ford vehicles, therefore you know you can transpose that experience and include Chevy's that you have little or no experience with just because they both have internal combustion engines, so they must be identical and all the same rules apply, when they don't. Therefore, there is no reason to be careful, I know from vast years of daily experience this to be true. It's not luck, it's FACT.
I don't know why you keep warning people, even after I've set the record straight, from experience as long as an entire career worth, that we should be careful using them on Atari's. This is just not the case, PERIOD. You show me a person who has had an Atari "break" while using a Sega Genesis controller with it, and I'll show you the same guy who's Atari coincidentally "broke" when he happened to have a Sega Genesis controller plugged into it. Does a line normally used for power on a Genesis controller plug into an Atari pin that isn't a power line? YES. Does it hurt the Atari at all? NO. But yes, it is also 100% true that it will hurt a C64, but it's a completely different circuit design among a lot of other differences, so of course you can't judge one by the other, but you insist on ignoring the facts and doing so anyway.
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I have been using a Sega Genesis/MD controller with my Atari 8-bit for over 20 years with absolutely no ill effects on my systems. I've also used it over those years with a 2600, 7800 and ST computers, again, with no ill effects (though they are completely compatible ports on all these systems). I actually modified this same controller just a few weeks ago for 3-button Joy2B+ upgrade, but only because most Atari games will only recognize one button on the Sega controller, including most Joy2B+ compatible games. I can personally guarantee that no harm will come to any Atari system that uses the standard Atari 9-pin ports, with the SEGA Genesis/MD controller. So all Atari computer and console systems but the Jaguar and 5200. So no, no modification is needed "to be on the safe side." They are 100% completely safe to use.
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When I said I'd "finished" Donkey Kong, I personally meant I'd made it through all the screens/levels, that's what I consider as finishing it because I've seen it all. I assumed that's what @oo7 meant as well. The only games I consider "unfinishable" are the early arcade games like Space Invaders, Galaxian, Asteroids, etc. since there is no additional screens. I consider Pac-man "unfinishable" for the same reason, but Ms. Pac-man has different mazes so I'd consider myself "finishing" it if I made it through all the different mazes until they repeat. Get it?
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My first Atari related 3D print is done. Not a great print, but not bad and quite serviceable. A bit of touch up and some paint and it will look great. So now I finally have a display for half my British cassette collection. The other half as well as any cartridges not in the two cart holders shown already have a home in vintage Flip-n-File cases, so for the time being, I have all I need. So it's time to move on to Atari hardware cases, and I need to make a cartridge case like the original SDX and Diamond GOS pass-thru carts as I just got a reproduction Diamond 3 cart board to replace the original I lost about 25 years ago. I don't suppose someone has already made a model and posted a STL for an SDX cartridge somewhere already?
I think my next print will be a case for the Ralph David XL/XE eprom burner I purchased from Dropcheck a couple years back, as I think she has an STL for a case on her site. So I'm off to go look into that, reset some slicer settings and whatnot as @Mr Robot suggested.
Double-wide cartridge (and tape) holder.
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I'm too A.D.D to just stick with one "currently playing" game at a time. I have about a dozen "every day" titles that slowly change over weeks or months. Donkey Kong, the improved "hack" version of the original, 'Donkey Kong Arcade' is one of them. I think I finished Donkey Kong once...the original cartridge version.
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4 hours ago, mytek said:I know some will want the original Atari cards made for it, so as to complete the original how it could have been picture. And I'm sure that will happen. Personally if I were to make a card, I would probably go down the path of creating a data acquisition card having general purpose analog inputs with at least 12 bits of resolution (more likely 16 bits), maybe incorporate some thermocouple inputs for temperature, general purpose digital I/O, and either PWM or analog outputs.
I missed this bit earlier...this is exactly the type of unique-to-A8-PBI device/expansion card, quoting myself, "something totally new" I had in-mind. Because besides a couple devices like Syscheck or Turbo Freezer* (*that I know of), no other PBI device, legacy or newer, doesn't already have an alternative version internally or using the cartridge port, or both or isn't already included in Syscheck and/or Turbo Freezer devices. . I for one, won't ever (except due to upgrade failure) need PBI versions of upgrades I've already installed internal versions of in my 1200XL, and I'm not waiting and see for ones I don't have yet, I've no problem installing the internal versions. But I'd want a DA card for a 1090 or just a plain PBI version even, because it would be new and unique, not something I already have in a different variety.
Non-hardware people interested in upgrades would want remakes of current internal upgrades for a 1090 or just a PBI version, but not all of us hardware hackers are necessarily going to be interested if they already have an original version installed, I know I won't.
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If you build it (and some cards), they (I) will come.
That being said, I was planning on creating my own simple-as possible expansion box just for current (non-legacy) PBI devices, but so far there is nothing else I need that is a PBI device besides the Syscheck 2.2 and Turbo Freezer 2011 right now. These devices include most of what is available in other PBI devices making them redundant and unnecessary. We need more unique PBI devices as it is before I need simple PBI expansion box or anyone needs modern take on the 1090 with versions of legacy cards or modern PBI device; 80-column devices, U1MB&VBXE&Rapidus PBI versions, Fujinet PBI, something totally new...
And, it might just be better to bring many of these together on one inclusive PBI device with all it needs in buffering, signal generation, power. etc. on-board, with modern miniature surface-mount tech than an expansion box. So there's really no point that I see, at this point. Is there anyone out there now using more than two PBI devices connected at once? If no, is it because more than two causes signal/power/lack of buffering/resistance/capacitance issues or just because there aren't enough unique PBI devices you want to even try having more than 2 connected at once with pass-thru PBI? Maybe you could but don't for all the reasons I stated.
History has already shown that a new device or upgrade created and intended with future expansion and development in mind , or just allowing for the possibility, doesn't mean that future expansion and development will happen. Very little for the VBXE, nothing devloped for use specifically with Rapidus, no expansion cards designed for the 800 slots and Incognito yet, except possibly for the VBXE adapter board. Maybe the audience for a modern 1090 with modern cards will draw a much larger audience than these above, making their development history a moot point, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
But an original equipment 1090 is a different story, for the love of old tech itself and having a piece of Atari 8-bit tech we missed out on. It should be planned and built as @kenames99 has been planning and developing.
If someone decides to make all-new modern cards for it for stuff not included in the planned legacy cards, on the back end, great, but it should be thought of as a possible bonus for those who want it, just like possibly cards for the 800 memory slots for the Incognito owners. but not the reason to get a 1090 or Incognito 800. As always, I'm interested in all of the above because I like vintage tech upgrades and new tech upgrades for my Atari's just because I like all kinds of Atari 8-bit related hardware and upgrades old and new. Useful or not, I have fun using them.
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48 minutes ago, Mr Robot said:The print bed is the piece of paper you are drafting on. x is along the bottom, y is up the side, z is in/out (the 3rd dimension)
On a screen we can rotate arbitrarily or use a different projection to the ortho we used on paper at school but that added freedom does confuse things.
Using 2D drafting directions for something being made in 3D space is what is confusing to me, not added freedom of rotation. My mind is too used to thinking of X/Y as an invisible plane directly in front of me, not below me, and even when drafting I still think of it that way because I usually use my drafting desk tilted up or when painting canvas with an easel, and I still think of X and Y as left-right and up-down. But I'll get used to it, I understand now, and am an experienced drafter. And thank you for showing me why I was getting confused with dimensional axis for 3D printing.
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4 minutes ago, Mr Robot said:In your picture, where the eye is looking is above the printer looking down onto the print bed
I see, and now understand, but I don't see any logical reason why it's done this way. It seems pretty arbitrary to me for "them" to choose correct orientation in 3D space to be looking down on the printer from above. But it is what it is and I'll try and keep it in mind.
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36 minutes ago, Mr Robot said:The extruder is the thing by the Z axis lead screw (X is left/right, Y is back/front, Z is up/down) that you squeeze and push the filament through. I updated my post with a pic of how they break
Oh, I guess I must keep mixing them up , because I'm used too and currently learning/using CAD programs I use on the Atari 8-bit and Z-axis is used for depth in both Super 3D Plotter 2 and ChromaCAD, toward and away from the screen (back/front) and Y is vertically oriented. I thought that was the standard for 3 dimensional thinking for pretty much everything that deals with X,Y,Z axis (are modern CAD programs used for making model for 3D printing done like 3D printer too? With Z axis up/down?). This (as pictured below) is the way I was taught to perceive and understand 3 dimensions for traditional art too, and the way I've thought of 3 dimensions my entire life. I've even read stuff on aerodynamics and flight physics and mechanics regarding pitch and yaw, etc. (though it's been years now so I might be wrong about it), and I thought I remembered it being the same too. I guess that's why I keep getting confused when I'm reading other's talking or reading about X, Y and Z axis with 3D printing; it's very un-natural for me to think of 3 dimensional directions like is done with 3D printing. And I don't really see any logical reason for the Z-axis on a printer to be up/down instead of in-out either...
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16 minutes ago, Mr Robot said:Are you still using the stock extruder? I wonder if that has cracked under the pressure yet!
Still?!? I've only had the printer for just over a month! I've done a total of 5 print jobs so far. Are you referring to something by the nozzle or the filament feed by the y-axis screw? The filament feeder where you squeeze to open and insert the filament is perfectly fine still, but I've only ever touched it when I first installed the filament spool and fed the filament in when I first set it up, I'm still on my first spool of filament, otherwise it's been untouched except for installing a knob on top. If it's constantly under stress there, it's been performing like a champ so far; no cracks.
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The New Atari 1200xl!
in Atari 8-Bit Computers
Posted · Edited by Gunstar
Mine is slated to get at least a Rapidus, and VBXE, and other unique DIY upgrades. I've been upgrading along different lines for both my 1200XL and 800 as I see no reason for two Atari's that are virtually identical in upgrades. I went with a 32-in-1 OS and Rambo 512K and a MyIDE 2. Except for the MyIDE 2, these and dual Pokey were installed in the 1200XL long before U1MB, VBXE and Rapidus even existed.
I felt exactly as you, and others have mentioned at the time; that I had no use for a PBI with the modern upgrades like MyIDE 2 (and U1MB/Side-1/2/3). I gave it a PBI port simply because I knew I could. But my hobby is as much about retoring, maintaining, modding and upgrading vintage hardware at least as much as it is about using the hardware and software (in as many diverse ways as possible, just for the joy of using them). It was a challenge just like climbing a mountain metaphorically. Especially in making an authentic edge-connector PBI port out the back like other XL's, instead of a parallel port that then requires an adapter with said edge connector as other used in their PBI mods. Another reason is to create my own version of the "sweet sixteen" project's Atari 1000, and the legendary 1400XL sort of rolled into one and taken far beyond the next level with modern OS, graphic and memory expansions. The only difference before and after the PBI is that I have removed the internal Rambo 512K upgrade (Atarimax clone) and reverted it to 64K internal dram memory, and now have a Syscheck 2.2 XL that I use for a total of 576K memory. There's actually nothing else I can think of needing or wanting to use the PBI port for a this time, except a Turbo Freezer*.
This leads me back to my 800 and the *Turbo Freezer, which I have, but I actually use it with my Atari 800 which I also made a real PBI port for as well, since I got an Incognito with it's PBI support and connector. And of course the Incognito, for all intents and purposes, is an U1MB+Side for the 800. Both computers still have more upgrades slated for them, common and unique, but both different. Another example is the 800 has a Pokeymax 2 Quad+Covox in it, and the 1200XL is getting the latest Pokeymax 3 with the 2 has and more, like dual SID.
Besides gaming, both machines are used for different over-all purposes. The 1200XL for programming, word processing, and finances and records for personal and business. (that is learning to program) and the 800 for a research and development of real-world projects with connect exterior machines and devices. And not only make use of all four controller ports of the 800 for I/O to other devices in the real world. I'm also about to install a dual PIA board and ad an additional four controller ports for even more external I/O possibilities. The 800, instead of VBXE, has a Sophia 2 with it's new GTIA modes. Both machines And while both were NTSC machines, both have been converted to PAL, though I intend to revert the 1200XL to NTSC again. Both machines will be used for their unique audio/video upgrades. I have a blog of my 800 and it's mods and upgrades so far in my profile. I intend to have a blog for my 1200XL too soon.