Controls for homebrew games

[Controls for homebrew games]

The one thing I DON'T like is a homebrew that requires an entirely NEW or unique controller to play.

 

Nuts... There go my dreams of releasing Pressure Gauge Special Ultra Mega 2003 Edition with the "Mega Just-a-Button" controller.

 

-John K. Harvey

[Activision Anthology for GBA Announced]

Awesome!!! Finally, a portable version of Pitfall 2! This will make my Christmas list indeed.

 

Is the list of games set in stone? I assume the cutoff date for homebrews has long-since passed, since you're in beta-testing.

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[DASM sideways representation of data ?]

New Question for DASM users:

 

Say that in 2600-land, you've got a six digit score routine that does fetches from 6 different locations:

 

F500

F580

F600

F680

F700

F780

 

The code does a LDA F500,X stored to GRP0 and then LDA F580,X stored as GRP1, etc... So, all you need to do is increment X to point to 6 new points of data.

 

From a disassembly perspective, this sucks a bit. You'll have 6 vertical blocks of graphics data that are all supposed to be sandwiched together, and you can't grasp the full effect unless the code is running, or spliced together.

 

So, in DASM, is there any way to do the following (perhaps with a macro):

 

macro Unknown

...

endm

 

 

Unknown (F500_data, F580_data, F600_data, F680_data, F700_data, F780_data)

Unknown (F501_data, F581_data, F601_data, F681_data, F701_data, F781_data)

 

I have a feeling if I create some data re-arrangement macros, they will fail due to origin-reverse-indexed errors.

 

Any ideas?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Paddle circuit question]

ldx #$20

Lfb8e:

ldy #$00

Lfb90:

iny

bne Lfb90

dex

bne Lfb8e

bit INPT0

bpl Lfba0

 

Hmmm... this doesn't seem to be all encompassing. Last I remember, the worst-case that I had for paddle detection when the paddle was at maximum resistance was 400 scanlines. So, if your paddle is at full resistance, it may not get detected. See this stella list link for confirmation:

 

http://www.biglist.com/lists/stella/archiv...7/msg00146.html

 

So, since there are no WSYNCs in this loop, how many WSYNCs does it equate to (just computationally, by cycles)? If your paddle is at maximum resistance, will it not get detected? Perhaps some more experiments are in order.

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Paddle circuit question]

Hello,

 

I had a quick question for any of you hardware people out there.

 

I don't understand too well the hardware info for the paddles, since I'm mostly a software guy. I want to make some hardware that I could put into joystick port 1 in order to simply make a game like Astroblast detect that I have the paddle installed. I believe these games just check to see if INPT0 or INPT1 gets set (or cleared; I don't remember) after a certain amount of time. If the transition occurs, then the paddle is installed.

 

So, I was wondering what the simplest circuit would be that does the following:

1) sets or clears inpt0 (whichever state means that the paddle is there)

2) sets or clears inpt1

(whichever state means that the paddle is there)

 

Would I just wire pin 5 to ground (pin 8 ) fot the first case and pin 9 to GND for the second case? Or perhaps tie them to VCC? Or, do I need resistor or something so that nothing explodes?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Which Homebrew should be the first?]

Hello,

 

I own:

Space Treat

Marble Craze

Pressure Gauge

Edtris

SoundX

Mental Kombat

 

I've played a lot of the others as well; indeed most of them are fun too.

 

All are fun, but my recommendation goes out to Marble Craze.

 

-John K. Harvey

[Atari 2600 Link System]

Are you talking for some kind of two-player (via two screens) game?  So far no one's made a game that does it

 

No, one eh? Well, I had made a demo once...

 

Check out the "[stella] Teleterm 2600" thread under:

http://www.biglist.com/lists/stella/archiv...08/threads.html

 

It wasn't so much a game as it is a text transmission mechanism; send and receive true rs232 serial (no UARTS) with just a few wires. It was an awesome project

 

Thanks,

-John

[NES games on 7800?]

Hi-res mode wasn't used because it sucks.

 

The main issue with hi-res sprites is the lack of palletes. You're limited to 2 in this mode. So, that's a total of 7 colors possible (background, plus 2x3-color).

 

However, in this mode when objects overlap, there is no transparency (so any overlapping objects will display the background color to show around the sprites, causing crappy-looking results). If you turn transparency on to circumvent this issue, you lose your resolution (back to 160), and in addition, you lose some colors in your palette (now limited to 5 colors, IIRC).

 

So, these sprites are pretty useless for any functional game-play sort of thing. So, that limits you to picture drawing. But, who wan't to draw a high-res picture with only 7 colors?

 

Thanks,

-John

["make sure both difficulty switches are to the right..&]

I remember taking Tower Toppler back to Toys R Us as a kid because I thought it was defective. When the exchange copy exhibited the same problem, I then read the manual

 

-John

[Has anyone ever finished the 132 days of rampage destruction]

Just curious as to if anyone's ever been that bored. Does it loop after that point, or is there an end screen?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[2600 joystic port automatic diagnostic hardware]

Hello,

 

I just checked, and I found 'em at Best. Thanks for your help, CPUWIZ; you got me thinking about it, and I managed to track them down.

 

-John

[2600 joystic port automatic diagnostic hardware]

Thanks, CPUWIZ,

 

I think that sounds like it could be it.

 

There is no mention of this at the Diagnostic cart page on atariage. Does someone have a picture they could post, or know of one on the 'net?

 

Also, are these items rare, or can they still be obtained for a reasonable price (say, through Best Electonics or somewhere)?

 

If they can't be obtained easily, does anyone know how to replicate the hardware? I'd be interested in creating or buying one of my own, just for kicks, and for some experimentation.

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[2600 joystic port automatic diagnostic hardware]

Hello all,

 

I remember somewhere in my travels seeing someone who had an interesting device that plugged into a 2600 joystick port; it had a red and a green LED on each side (I think).

 

I believe that you had to run some cartridge software with this thing in the joystick port, and afterward, it would light up "green" or "red" depending on success/failure. Unfortunately, it's been a long time since I saw this item, so I don't remememeber much about it.

 

1) Does anyone know what I'm talking about? Does anyone have this item? What is known about it?

 

2) If you don't have the device specified in my crappy paragraph above, but know of something else that was made for automatic joystick diagnostic purposes (not of the homebrew era), can you describe it here?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Fatal Run: the ending screen]

FYI; here's the article in question:

 

http://2600connection.atari.org/fatal.html

 

So, has anyone ever finished the game? I know there have got to be some people on this list determined to do it (heck, some people invested time on 2600 Double Dragon!)

 

 

-John K. Harvey

[Ninja Golf is great!]

What about themes? My favorite was the urban city idea; you could have all sorts of odd ideas for holes (drainpipes, etc). Plus, you'd have all sorts of city-type obstacles. I think it would be fun to decide if you were going to go around a building or "play through".

 

Then again, there would also be the city-driving range. It could simply be from the rooftop of a building, and you aim at the empty shy beyond; or the ocean near the city; but, I don't know how practical it would be to have a mode with ninjas attacking you whilst you try to finish off a bucket of balls with a 3wood.

 

Perhaps other setting would be cool too.

 

Or maybe even a Ninja-mini-golf! With mini-Ninja's. "Take that, shrimp!" Suddenly, your adversary is caught in the vanes of the windmill hazard.

 

Ah.. the possibilities....

 

-John

[Ninja Golf is great!]

How about adding club fatigue to the game? So, the more guys you hit with your clubs, the more bent-out-of-shape your 1 wood becomes. If you break all of your clubs before the last hole, you lose. So indeed, you may end up hitting the final hole with only a putter.

 

-John K. Harvey

[What "unreleased 7800 titles" exist?]

* Scrapper Story

 

I have never seen a reference to this game anywhere. I always wonder how it managed to infiltrate the rumor mills It's definitely a genuine rumor, but one created by the community, methinks.

 

-John K. Harvey

[Ninja Golf is great!]

My favorite flaw is the fact that on one of the holes, you can get stuck in an infinite loop Remember, the ball only goes up and right. So, look for the green where there's a thin strip of regular terrain on the outside edge-- you can get the ball stuck in the corner. I was really bored to figure that one out.

 

Never got anywhere in Kamikaze mode.

 

I think it's a great game. I thought it would be a great game to remake nowadays-- 3d Ninja Golf. Imagine having to hit the ball in city-type areas, and having local gangs attack you for being on their turf. Could be fun!

 

-John K. Harvey

[Question about some 2600-code (shadow equates)?]

In the Atari 7800 BIOS, there's some code that helps to put the the 7800 into 2600 mode, by cleaning out regs, RAM, etc.

 

(I found a copy here: http://kontek.net/pp/technical/a7800/bios7800.asm.txt)

 

I see this code, but it confuses me:

 

BIT RSYNC

BMI LF813

LF80A: LDA #$02

STA COLUBK

STA LF112

BNE LF831

LF813: BIT WSYNC

BMI LF823

 

Obviously, RSYNC ($03) and WSYNC ($02) are write-only. So, what does the read-only value pull? Is it some sort of shadow-reference to one of the collision or INPT registers?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Programming the 7800]

The general consensus on the Stella mailing list was it was okay (with most people) to use it also for 7800 programming topics, as long as this is indicated in the subject.  (I recommend starting the subject with MARIA since the biglist search engine doesn't handle numerics.)  The assumption is the volume will be low enough not to be a big problem.  Plus it might encourage some of the existing 2600 homebrewers to give the 7800 a try.

 

Hmm.. that'll get you the perspective of 2600-programmers, yes, but what about the 7800 community? Maybe they do not wish to infiltrate the stella list. Personally, I do not wish to re-join stella list. I left mainly because of 50+ emails a day, and most that were not relevant. Bin files fly in a lot, and every week there's the "hi, I'm a newbie" thread. Most conversation is just rehashing of things that could have been found by simply browsing the archives. I grew tired of filtering most of the emails into the trash.

 

Note that a 7800 mailing list is something that I definitely do NOT want to miss out on. If I need to rejoin stellalist, I'll consider it, but I strongly object. Of course, this may be simply limited to my unique perspective and experience. Does anyone else feel this way?

 

How much does an account at biglist count? I *may* be interested in helping to fund a separate 7800-biglist account, depending on price, and usage of the community-- but, if only 5 people use it, it may be easier (and cheaper) to grow this list as a simple email list without any real biglist archives until more people are on board. All that is really needed is a moderator. Archives can be kept later in the 7800 lifecycle, because I don't think they're too necessary at this stage. Would anyone be interested in doing it this way? That way, it can start small, and grow when needed. I have a fear of this dying out on the stella list, or of people changing the subject of these emails to make them 2600-related. It's too big, and the 7800ers are too few. I don't think it makes sense.

 

Opinions?

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Screenshot of diagnostic cart]

Thanks, man!

 

-John K. Harvey

[Screenshot of diagnostic cart]

Are there any screenshots of the 7800 diagnostic cart anywhere? I know it's a lame request, but I thought it odd that I couldn't find it anywhere!

 

Thanks,

-John K. Harvey

[Programming the 7800]

I agree John, there is a lack of verified info for the 7800 out there.  Maybe we can come up with a revised version of the 7800 Software Guide and fix some of the errors.

 

Good idea. Some sort of 7800 development web repository should be opened up to the community, where the following documentation can be stored:

1) Latest software guide

2) Addendum to the software guide (list of bugs in the guide). Eventually this would get integrated into a new release of the software guide. This could even contain other information: (if someone was daring enough to use test modes A or B), SIO port info, POKEY equates, bankswitching schemes, POKEY installation on a cartridge, and a basic run-down of pros and cons for each screen mode.

3) Mess buglist with software examples

4) Any disassembly work

 

I would be willing to contribute what I've got (which isn't too much, but at least a little bit); maybe people can add on.

 

Regards,

-John K. Harvey

[I need an Atari 2600 programmer!]

Thomas, was that the same one that was available at Hozer? You could have your own text message burned into a cart. That sounds like what she needs.  

 

1. Is the ROM floating around out there?

2. If so, does someone know how to program in the message?

3. Can someone then burn it onto a cart?

 

Hey there. That was mine Eckhard and I both took 2 separate approaches and made 2 separate scrolling text demos. His became the engine for the Rime of the Ancient Mariner (part 1) text demo, IIRC, and mine was released on Hozer (as Alphanumeric Madness and 2600-post-it-note).

 

No one's contacted me about re-selling, tho...

 

Regards,

-John K. Harvey

[Programming the 7800]

I would love to see a homebrew community for the 7800.

 

Me too. I don't think the time has been right for awhile, and now it doesn't seem so bad. I think the 7800's finally starting to get the backing that it needs in order to promote its own homebrew community.

 

Now that I've done some playing around with the 7800, I think it has great potential.  The MARIA GPU is fairly powerful, but relatively simple.  And unlike the 2600, there is no need for tricky cycle counting.  CPU and GPU time are still at a premium, so efficiency is more the rule.

 

Well now, it's not *that* much better than the 2600. There are a lot more pitfalls in the 7800 simply because of lack of knowledge. Plus, cycle counting may have gone away, but DMA timing has replaced it.

 

There are also things that make programming the 7800 devastatingly painful. I've whipped up a few demos in the past (I started doing this about 2 years ago, before the encryption info was released, because backdoor.bin was available). I was forced to reduced my game code revisions into demos, simply because I'd eventually hit a wall with everything that I developed that couldn't be crossed.

 

For example, one of my problems occurrend with a mode I chose to develop in. 320x2 (or is it 320B) mode looks to be the best mode for the system (hey, it could even rival Nintendo!). But, if you want to try to program anything practical for it, it's virtually impossible. You are limited to 2 palletes and a background, which is pretty bad (7 colors only per zone). Then, if you want sprites to cross each other's paths, you'll find a limitation with transparency in Kangaroo mode, so you'll be stuck with only 5 colors. This will make all of your 7-color effort end up shot, and you'll find yourself going mad trying to make the cutoff decision-- drop 2 colors, or disable transparency. It's these decisions/setbacks that stopped most of my development, because there is simply no good solution when these roadblcks arise.

 

The lack of information is killer. I've hit walls with DMA cycle counting, pallete limitations, and Kangaroo mode, cycle counting (per frame; it does happen, surprisingly), and others. Even the manual is chock full of lies (the CTRL bit for color vs. black and white is inverted, as are others). Likewise, the emulator support (though EXTREMELY appreciated) still has holes. If you have transparency disabled in Kangaroo mode (320x2), it still appears as enabled in emulators. Though this is a minor inconvenience, you'll find yourself up nights trying to figure out why the stuff on screen doesn't match what's on your console.

 

The only way I ever envision development happening for the 7800 is with a few things:

 

1) a Stella-List twin for 7800 homebrewers. It would need rules/moderation since the community is very small at this time. StellaList at its birth was VERY regulated: hacks were not allowed to be posted due to potential copyright infringement, and it had an exclusive feeling (strictly development, no OT ramblings on the list). Something like this would be a great help.

 

2) Emulator support. If we find bugs, it'd be great to create reports for the MESS team to inegrate changes.

 

3) A dedicated website with tools, doc's, demos, stella-list type archives, a FAQ on mode support, a FAQ on starting out, etc...

 

Sorry to be more pessimistic than optimistic, but I'm pretty sure the lack of 7800 homebrews has a reason-- it's a lot harder than it sounds.

 

But, I would be interested in joining a development community. Maybe I could help bridge some gaps so others wouldn't fall where I have.

 

Regards,

-John K. Harvey