orrimarrko

You're joking, right? If I didn't know any better (not that I do), I'd say you have it in for me CPU... Tell me, what did I say this time that makes me sound like a dumb-ass? I didn't see anything in the thread or the auction that indicated either way (although I admit that I may have missed something...) What - did they not make these in PAL format? In for you? The Venezuela guys have been flooding the market with these for months and months, there are tons of threads about it everywhere. Everyone and their mom have bought a set of these. Clearly, I missed the boat on that. I wouldn't ask a question I already knew the answer to. I say "in for me" because I seem to get a lot of "ponder" and "rolling eye" treatment in your replies to my questions. Like I said, I obviously missed the fact that all of these coming from Venezuela were NTSC. Thanks.

You're joking, right? If I didn't know any better (not that I do), I'd say you have it in for me CPU... Tell me, what did I say this time that makes me sound like a dumb-ass? I didn't see anything in the thread or the auction that indicated either way (although I admit that I may have missed something...) What - did they not make these in PAL format?

I've always equated the legend of Air Raid to that of the "company" - ie. garage workshop - that created Cheetahmen II for the NES. If it wasn't for some last minute "assistance" (let's just call it that), that game wouldn't have made it out the door. Years later, they would have found a copy here, a copy there...

Does anyone know if these are NTSC or PAL? Thanks, Steve

Again, I do not believe it ever has, who has seen it? The guy who claimed that this cart is called Air Raid, claimed to have the box, claimed that the company name is Men-A-Vision. The same guy who also mysteriously disappeared? Does that really make it a fact? I have seen the box for Rocky & Bullwinkle, prove me wrong! Certainly, your point is well taken. It goes without saying (but I will anyway), that your knowledge of the 2600 is light years beyond my own. I guess the individual's story (who claimed to have held the box in his hands) is not taken with much regard. That's all I meant by "public." Orri-

This one's easy. "Mexico" is the answer to your question, "Any way you could ask whoever u got it from, if they remember where the bought it or got it ?" He bascially gave you a short answer to your question. They got it in Mexico. That would be how I would interpret that response.

Just my two cents... I think that the cart will ultimately hover around $1500. Wonder is correct about one thing (for the moment) - there are only so many available. Barring some technological miracle which allows us to definitively verify that this is NOT a PAL cart, it's NTSC. Those two factors will be enough to keep the price at that level in the future. Now, should that "boxed" Air Raid come out in public again...we have a new player in the "most expensive boxed game" category. Again, just my opinion.

Wow - thought for sure that someone on this site would have a few for sale....hmm.

Looking for Brand new, Sealed Atari 5200 games - Any title. Requirements: Pics are a must. Picky about condition, so the box must be in near mint/mint condition. (No dents in the box, writing, or other damage.) If you have any for sale, let me know. I'm very familiar with the 5200 market (it's the 2600 market that I'm new to), so I'm not going to pay crazy eBay prices. However, I will be fair. Thanks in advance, Steve

It's almost Christmas time!!

If there are only ten, then everyone can pretty much forget getting a hold of one. I'm sure there are at least 4 or 5 of the "elite" collectors on this site that have one. Mean Guns would make #6, and Bloated Monkey would be #7. Perhaps they're all accounted for?? I honestly hope that there are more than 10...

This may be a stupid question, but oh well... For those of you who have removed so many labels, my question would be, "Why?" What do you do with the carts, labels, etc? I'm sure I'm missing something, but since I'm new to the various aspects of collecting for the 2600, I thought that I would ask. Curiosity peaked...

In my opinion, and based on some very recent information, the Lochjaw seems a little high. $1300-$1500 seems more accurate. You guys know more than I do on the subject, however. Orri-

Even being a HUGE Star Wars fan, I simply can't explain or justify this type of behavior. After all, you aren't using the item for what it was intended. To that end, in relation to action figure collecting, I completely agree with you. However, at least video games are playable items. They may not be worth playing, but if you're a completist, then they need to be part of your collection. To that end, I'm sure we both agree. Yet, I'm also sure that we would disagree as to whether a ROM would suffice to that extent... Lots of funny stuff in there. I do agree that stereotypes exist, and some justified, certainly. What I was commenting on was the over-generalization that if you can afford expensive games (regardless of whether they should cost that much or not), you must have no life. In this day and age, you should know that that's simply not going to be the case. (Though I'm certain there are actual cases that fit your mold... ) Not sure I agree with the first part of the sentence, but either way, I wish you luck on your convert quest. It would help everyone's piggy bank. If you're successful, please let me know - it will save me time and money. Peace! Orri-

LOL - Funny, being one myself...

So much for the video game discussion... Here's my two cents. California is just like NYC - expensive as hell. If that's all you know, then so be it, and more power to you. However, there's a whole lot of real estate in between. I'm almost 35, have a wife, a second child on the way, and own my own home. We're a single family income and I don't own stocks or income property. Paranoid, you've made several illogical assertions, as well as stereotype when one shouldn't be made. You've said (pretty much in no uncertain terms) that even if you can afford to spend $1000+ on a cart, that you're an idiot to do so. If that's your opinion, fine. However, you keep trying to defend this assertion like it's your dissertation or something. I don't think that anyone here has the right to judge, so unconditionally, what others find important enough to spend their money on. If you think that emulation is the way to go - cool; whatever floats your boat. You don't have to "understand" why people spend their money how they want. Quite honestly, it's not for you to understand what others decide to do with their disposable income. I don't understand why some people spend $1000+ on a mint packaged original Star Wars figure, but I don't feel the need to analyze it. Whatever does it for those people. The other problem is the stereotyping. I volunteered my personal information to point out that I don't fall into the sterotypical pool that you've offered, and I'm not affluent by any means. I don't do drugs, but I do party with the best of them. However, I would spend $1,000 on a cart in a second if it didn't cause financial detriment to my family, and it brought me happiness. It's all part of setting personal limits. Limits on collecting, limits on spending, limits on expectations. I get creative in various ways to come up with disposable income to afford what I can. I've paid $1000 for a game before, just not a 2600 game. Not yet, anyway. I limit my expectations on what's reasonable to attempt at this point in time. You just make it seem as though the only people who can afford high-cost collecting (of any kind) must be lacking in some other capacity. "He can afford to spend $1000 on a game, therefore, he must be some clone of the Comic Book Guy on The Simpsons." Come on man, seriously. The real point that you could be making is that it's a shame that things have gotten so expensive. It's a shame that more people can't afford to enjoy the hobby the way it could be, without the dollar-value-add. It's a shame that younger kids feel as though they have to spend tons of money on games, 'just because' - running up credit cards, etc. Bottom line is, you're trying to assert a logical conclusion where one cannot be made. This isn't a simple formula where 'collectors who spend too much money have no life', or that 'it's insane to spend your hard-earned money on a cart that doesn't play as well as a inexpensive rom.' You simply have an opinion, which is your prerogative. Trying to continually defend it, in my opinion, is unnecessary. Let's move on. I believe the topic was real estate, or something... Orri-

Personally, I'm just glad that Wonder007 is getting this stuff now. By the time I'm ready, he'll be all done! Like someone said - if he wants the auction, it's his. Hard to compete with that kind of bankroll...

That's pretty cool actually! Plain, but strangely cool in it's own right. Thanks for the pic CPUWIZ! Steve

Coke vs Pepsi complete = cart + box Atlantis II complete = cart + box + manual + contest paperwork Eli's Ladder complete = cart + manual + paperwork w/ stickers Cubicolor complete = cart + box + manual + letter from Fulop Magicard complete = cart (or pcb) + manual + overlays Music Machine complete = cart + box + manual Color Bar Generator complete = cart + manual + shipping box Cheers, Marco Thanks a lot Marco! There was a box for Coke Wins? Anyone have a pic or description? Thanks again, Steve

What constitutes "complete" for these titles? As a general conscensus, that is... Thanks, Steve

You're correct in theory about the possibility that should the retro-collecting "fad" fade away, that the prices will fall on many titles. However, there's two flaws with this, as it pertains universally to every hobby. When the supply of an item is far below the demand, the price rises, but eventually will level off or even decrease to a point. A "rare" item that is in high demand will continue to rise to a price level that will only be comensurate with someone who has the money and is willing to spend on that item. We all know this too well. When a duplicate of that item surfaces, it's illogical to think that it is "worth" the same amount of money. All the previous sale does is to provide evidence that someone who had the money felt that it was okay to use it to purchase that item at that particular time. At a later date, they may not chose to, or even have the money to do so. So what happens at that time? The price decreases to a level at which the next person who wants the item is willing and able to purchase it. For example: Air Raid. It does NOT matter what anyone thinks of this game. All that matters is that there is a public perception (perhaps realistically so) that this is one of the rarest games out there. That alone will drive up the price. However, let's say that this one sells for $2500 instead of what the last one went for. Does that mean it's worth that, or that the value has decreased? No. All that it means is that the person who won the auction at that time was willing and able to spend that amount on it. It's not to say that the next one wouldn't sell for $4000 or $2000. Point one - there will ALWAYS be someone who can and will spend a lot of money on something they want. Every hobby has those who can afford more than the average person. They can, and undoubtedly will, be able to pay more than you or I, and will help to raise the asking price of a hard to find item. It doesn't matter whether it's worth it to anyone else or not. For that reason, reproductions simply don't factor into the equation. The original item will always be worth it to a handful of collectors, enough to keep the price relatively high. That, however, is cyclical. For every hardcore collector who helped to raise the asking price for the next poor schlep, there's a new one to fill his/her place. So, the known supply is reduced by one, but the demand remains the same. As it pertains to the 2600, there are only so many "known" complete copies of any given rare title. Typically, the hardcore collector is going to hang onto his for quite sometime, so when the next copy surfaces, they (should) would be out of the running. If the asking price is higher than the most someone is offering, then the seller is faced with a tough decision - sell at this price (temporarily affecting the publicized value) or hang onto it for a buyer willing to pay the higher price. Point two - comparing unlike hobbies with dissimilar histories is unfair for the basis of comparison. However, let's make the comparison, as you've illustrated. Beanie Babies were a fad (perhaps like retro video game collecting - probably so), and when interest was lost, the market was flooded with unwanted items. Too much supply, no demand = low prices or no sales at all. I'm still certain, however, of two things in regards to the Beanie Babies collecting circle - there were "rare" items in that hobby, and there are STILL people who collect them. To that end, those "rare" beanies are still rare, and in fact, probably in high demand amongst the hardcore collectors. It's the common crap that is in supply enough to insulate your house with. Those hardcore collectors will still pay top dollars for items that the rest of the world could care less about - because they aren't involved as part of "the fad." Same thing goes for the 2600. Sorry to ramble, but it seems to me that acknowledging that these prices exist as a point of reference and discussion is fine. However, it also serves to a negative effect, IMHO. Steve

They're actually different topics, in my opinion. Some people here are probably reluctant to say how much they've actually spent on a game - in fact I know that some would never tell you because it's 'nunya business'. However, asking the question of "What is the most $ you've seen a game go for?" is totally different. Many people might offer up generic information that may not even relate to themselves on this question. Again, just my opinion.

Thank you very much for that explanation. Easy to understand even for the technically challenged like me! One question: If you have the normal cart, what do you need the Krok cart for? I'm not completely sure what the Krot cart is for, perhaps that would help... Thanks again. Steve

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