CGE 2004 in SAN JOSE August 21 & 22

[CGE 2004 in SAN JOSE August 21 & 22]

In light of recent discussion group postings regarding California

Extreme and the Classic Gaming Expo, a few words of clarification

are needed. While I am out of touch with the climate and decorum

in discussion groups, I was concerned with the words used to

discuss such business in a public forum. I appreciate frank

discussion, however when incomplete or apocryphal statements

are made or people are publicly disparaged without compelling

reason, a more complete understanding must be brought to light.

 

I'll try to make a "long story" short, but not so short as to

give a misleading picture.

 

To quote John (cx2k) from Wed Feb 18, 2004 7:21 pm

(http://www.atariage.com/forums)

"As previously stated, we tried to join forces with CAX but they weren't willing to work with us on the level we wanted. It seems they got burned pretty bad by the Vintage Computer Festival people and want no part of joining shows where there's any chance they might not get as much revenue."

 

and from John (cx2k) Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:59 pm

(http://www.digitpress.com/forum)

"We have approached them several times regarding teaming up and hosting one big event. They have no interest in doing this. They are afraid of losing some of their revenue since they had a previous bad experience with the Vintage Computer Festival. Our intention was to have one show with one admission price, they wanted attendees to pay $40 admission to them and then $35 admission for us which is totally unacceptable in our eyes. We tried many times to work something out but no such luck."

 

It is unfortunate that John has chosen to stress questionable

points and leave out relevant facts. Months ago, John called

me on the telephone a couple of times to discuss the possibility

of connecting CGE and CA Extreme. I liked the idea of convenience

for attendees (although there barely seems to be enough time in

a weekend for ONE show) but indicated that a formal combination

of the two shows would bring a lot of problems. It was suggested

that all the convenience could be had by locating the shows

next to each other on the same weekend. John advocated a single

admission price, but that seemed to the Extreme staff a risky

prospect. I suggested it would be difficult to determine a way

to allocate any "combined" revenues that would be likely to

end up "fair", and that any rules would need to be established

in advance, that's just good sense. After asking the advice of

our entire staff and some savvy friends, no one had a good way

to set this up. If the shows were run at a profit, some risk

could be taken in transferring revenue between shows, but CAX

budget is run out of pocket, and to date no personal profit

has been made, with all revenue going to cover show expenses.

It seemed clear that a combined admission equal to the current

single show price, which John seemed to advocate, could not

possibly cover the costs of both shows. A higher price was then

considered. Our concern was that some show attendees would have

little interest in the other show. For example, many Extreme

attendees are pinball fans with no interest in video games,

coin-operated or home console. It seemed unreasonable to ask

such people to be compelled to pay more, regardless of

their range of interest. We suggested offering a $10 evening

discount for attendees of both shows. That would make full

admission to CGE and Saturday Night at CA Extreme $35+$15=$50,

adding Sunday at CA Extreme bringing the total to $65. Those

numbers seem fair, and are in the ballpark of what Chris

(vectrexer) Posted on: Sun Feb 08, 2004 4:52 pm at

http://www.digitpress.com/forum as a suggestion.

 

As to the combined show location, in our early conversations,

I described our venue to John. The space in Parkside that we

don't use was not to John's liking - it was too small and

could not accommodate a separate museum room. I suggested they

look into the Civic Auditorium, which is just across

the plaza from our hall, and was available the same weekend.

Apparently it didn't suit their purposes. John did not

suggest any other venue.

 

The following quotes from email I had sent to John support

this view:

 

A quote from a private email from me to John on January 23, 2004:

"We are not

in a position for a formal merge of the shows, but are fine with

CGE sharing the weekend. When I last spoke with the SJCC, I

was told the Civic Auditorium, which is directly across the small

parking plaza from the Parkside Hall which we use, was available.

Use of the facility should be arranged with SJCC soon if it is

desired."

 

and a quote from a private email from me to John on January 27, 2004:

"We can probably offer something like a $10 discount for those with

a CGE badge after 6 PM on Saturday or something like that. If we

end up neighbors, we can check on details."

 

Again, it could be my lack of familiarity with the tone of the

web site communications, but I don't understand why John felt

it necessary to post such unfriendly words. Sellam of VCF

apparently objected to the posts as well, and felt compelled

to respond. For the record, Sellam and I are on good

speaking terms, and although the post clearly had the

potential to stir up a fight, we easily discussed the issues

over the phone and there is no problem between us.

The specific discussion of VCF with CGE had consisted of

examples of how difficulties arose in combining the shows

(over discounted combined admission, for example) and that

the experience had given us a lesson in caution, and that

combining shows would require careful detailed agreements

ahead of time. An example of the discussion comes from

email I sent John on January 23: (in the past when we)

" ... tried to closely partner with another group or

organization, the result has been much extra work, risk,

and loss to CA Extreme, with little to no actual benefit to

either the organization or our supporters or attendees."

The purpose was to make it clear to John that what he seemed

to want, a loose agreement on how to combine the shows, was

not possible. To be clear, the 2000 show combined

with VCF did have benefits for CA Extreme, but the inherent

difficulties make it undesirable to combine the two again.

I was shocked that such private conversations had been

turned into such an unfortunate public message.

 

I hope this message clears up a few things, and quiets down any

ill feelings rather than stirring up any new ones. I hope for

the success of all the shows - CGE, VCF, and CA Extreme make

up a solid group covering related, wonderful genres, but there

is no need for conflict among a natural complimentary set.

 

For the Extreme Team, Happy Gaming,

Ken Chaney