youxia

Back then, in my area (behind Iron Curtain) there were only three realistic options: Atari 800, ZX Spectrum and C64. I was a teen with a practically non-existent income, plus the perception of micros at the time for the grown ups was that they're all about games, so nobody wanted to spend a substantial chunk of cash to get me one. Spectrum was the cheapest one, by sizeable margin, so it made it the first choice for my years-long campaign of saving/earning/borrowing/cajoling/etc. But the other factor was also rather important. Me and my circle of friends were all about Sinclair and looked down on A8 because of its chunky gfx and weak games library (which nowadays I actually appreciate much more). C64 was a bit more upmarket and much less popular. So I eventually ended up with Timex 2048. No regrets at all, even from today's point of view, since it's an amazing machine, and despite its limitations. Or perhaps because of them - they were a direct cause of the very innovative software library which that micro has built up. I guess C64 (which I got a few years later) would be better, but without the super-expensive FDD it wasn't that much fun, and I would struggle getting soft for it because it wasn't so popular.

To be honest, most of the Amico line-up already looks like "mobile games" to me.

This constant whining about "bugs & glitches" is a bane of modern PC gaming. Many decent titles have been review bombed because of something that is completely normal and pretty harmless. Big modern games are really complex, and will always have some bugs, even with extensive beta testing. But these bugs are hardly ever game breaking, usually just some performance issues which get patched up pronto. You'd think pcmasterrace could grasp such a simple concept, alas... I've always liked the AO games. I haven't played them all, just a few, and never finished one, but they were good fun nonetheless. The first title was quite groundbreaking. My favourite is Black Flag, and the one with Da Vinci. I have a gaming PC again and was thinking about checking out Unity (apparently it's quite gorgeous) and the one set in Egypt, which is supposed to be a full blown RPG now. The upcoming Valhalla is a bit silly though: does it even have anything to do with the Asssasins? Seems just like they are shoehorning Vikings (who are the new zombies) into that universe, and they should've just started a new franchise.

The "pay to win" model is not really present in the majority of non-casual titles on consoles and PCs. Sure, they're full of assorted microtransactions but these are mostly for vanity items. I aslo don't share the view that the videogame (or media entertainment in general) industry is in any way endangered. To the contrary: it's never been worth as much as it is now. That of course won't stop various figures decrying how piracy and economy crunch are killing them, but that's the same old hogwash we've been hearing since the beginning of it all. Even in tough times like 2020's has been serving up, escapism is a prime market. It's enough to look at crazy Switch prices (driven by demand!), PS5 preorders insta-selling out and so on. Sure, for some folks buying a full price game is an impossible task, but there are countless others who still can afford that, and also other ways of legally obtaining them such as sales or subscription models. That's not to say I'm happy with the current status quo, my biggest ire being the near-complete eradication of the second hand market (at least on PC), and the general lack of ownership and right to resell, things that used to help folks with limited media budget. So the entire industry gets zero sympathy from me for any of their actual woes.

I don't have A1200 myself but I do follow Amiga scene closely and have never heard some excessive complaints about "cheap memory" problems. Perhaps you were just unlucky. Sure, you should buy from trusted manufacturers and they aren't cheap. Adfs are okay for one disk games, but can become a major chore even with some 2-disk games, never mind bigger titles. Imo WHDLoad or hd installs are the only way to have some sort of hassle-free Amiga experience. I initially thought I'd be ok with just Gotek for my A500, but after a few weeks quickly upgraded to ACA500+ because the constant faffing with disk swapping was just unbearable.

Probably because a bot is thinking you're making two accounts. But the real question is, why would you need to login into any sort of online account to use a piece of hardware? This pathetic trend is of course tied to further expansion of datamining and it's sad that it's just being accepted.

MiSTer has already tackled it

What a bizarre mix. Eggs is super cute but a bit too clever for me...plus it's a maze game...sigh). Still, the chicks are lovely. Especially that little white chicken which runs around helping out. Moonwalker is a load of WTH. Michael Jackson was an icon when I was growing up, but I haven't really thought about him for more than a decade so it's a huge nostalgia blast. I like the gfx/sfx & gameplay a lot, even if the whole game is just a one big ego-trip, and the kids shouting "Thank you, Michael!" might seem a bit odd these days. EDIT: MJ - 35,790 Eggs - 19,770

A Mini (or even Maxi) will never be an FPGA, it's a completely different target audience and price range. Besides, you can get a MiSTer for less than 200USD now, and run A500-1200 with HDMI on it. And for 300USD you can get 2 x tested A500s with Goteks, ad accessories (at least here in Europe). It will most likely be another Mini, because full size Amiga is a lot of plastic. Seeing as you can get decent emulation on RPi 3-level SoC that shouldn't be a problem. More interesting will be seeing where will the emulator come from and how convoluted the deal with Cloanto was. This being Amiga, the poor ol' Cursed Lady, I can't help but think this won't go down without at least some sort of shenanigans

For me "homebrew" will always represent the non-commercially oriented content from the console hacking/coding scene which arose somewhere around PSP era and continues since then. It has started earlier, perhaps with SNES, or maybe even some earlier consoles, but I suppose PSP was its peak time (see this interesting poll on GBAtemp.). Wikipedia has a definition, and I largerly agree with it - as they say amateur programs written for micro- and "normal" computers have other names, be it "hobbyist" as they say, my favourite "bedroom coded', or modern "indie". I know of course there are commercial homebrew programs as well, but for me this term associates best with the free ones.

If by "regular RGB connector" you mean SCART socket then there are cables for that. You'd need to check if that monitor will work with Amiga first though: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=85693

Question is, what do you want to connect your Amiga to?

So says the article you guys are quoting. The fact that cleaning works for some people does not mean there is no bigger problem. I have used heaps of gamepads from various makers over the years and had never something like that occuring. It's rather obvious that it's Nintendo's design flaw, and a rather serious one. Which is why they're fixing it outside of the warranty (bit of a comedy "90 days" this one, btw) and only after stink was raised in the press about it, because previously they used to charge for it. And did not bother changing the design for the new Switch editions. https://www.theverge.com/21504741/nintendo-switch-joy-con-drift-problem-explained Perhaps this particular lawsuit is frivolous, but on the other hand pretending there is no problem at is a rather curious stance. And how are you supposed to call these companies to task if not by lawsuits?

Colony 7 - 30,725 DoDonpachi - 4,377,570 DD is absolutely amazing, I just wish I had the ability to sustain the 100% level of concentration required to play it properly.

I must admit, it looks rather cute in Lo Res. Though, as the author admits himself it can be tricky to figure out what's going on in some screens (even if you played it before). But we can treat it as another puzzle layer... http://www.deater.net/weave/vmwprod/monkey/

Indeed. One minute Amiga's "crap" composite is a stumbling block, but in the next C64's questionable Basic is no problem at all. And when this odd logic is pointed out, you bristle up. Can't really argue with that - literally. It's an interesting instance of a "religious flame war", in which all participants actually agree on one choice. However, when those who want to discuss flaws in that choice are patronized, it indeed starts resembling a cultist narrative, perhaps not in the way you meant it though. Those who claim "objectivity" in this thread can't really pretend they do not realise the C64 as #1 only works in this hypothetical scenario, because we don't know anything about the target audience. In reality, questions would be asked, because some people might be interested in making quality music, dislike 8-bit gfx, concentrate on writing programs in BASIC, or have some other specific angles. In these instances C64 is not automatically the first choice and trying to stiffle the discussion about it is rather lame. In fact, these jibes wore me out as well, so I'll leave you guys to it - just hoping that any actual prospective first timer who may be perusing this thread will not take these opinions at face value. Especially ones not regarding the C64 itself (it is a fine machine after all), but the heavy clangers dropped about the other micros.

It is, but the gameplay is so impossibly frantic that there is no time to look at all the eye candy. At least my brain has only enough oomph to try and process the bullet patterns (and is not too good at it either ) To some extent it was always my problem with shoot'em ups, but the bullet hell ones really take it to the next level.

It seems that you are now in the so called DRH (Display Rabbit Hole). Try not to dig it any deeper My advice would be to forget everything else (the "most colorful ways" and the like) and use the simplest solutions which will get your gaming systems to display on your Wega's Component>S-Video>Composite. If you really like a system which has only composite then you can consider modding it up to S-Vid or component. Then enjoy playing some games instead of worrying about what people say on DRH-dedicated sites and videos

If it's really about appealing to beginners, then why do you insist the C64 Basic is also stellar in this category, when it clearly isn't, as demonstrated in JamesD's example? I mean, anybody can claim they enjoyed it back in the day on their favourite machine and found it simple & easy but it's clearly showing bias. I've enjoyed gaming on my ZX Spectrum very much too, but I'm not going to claim its fx capabilities are so great. And wasn't getting extensions and whatnots to improve it supposed to be "gotchas"? No, it does not change the overall ranking (or at least its #1 position) but I would've thought this thread is about a bit more than just a simple list. We've all already agreed on C64, but it does not have to be accompanied by heaps of factually incorrect statements this thread is full of.

I agree, and as I said on the first page I'd also recommend C64. It's just, if I was new to the subject, reading some of the exaggerated remarks here could scare me off from other micros, hence my "corrections".

Amiga to VGA adapter costs ~12 USD. You don't also don't need GBS, handling of which is hardcore-level, but can get one of RetroTinks. C64's composite is no less (or more) awful than Amiga's - it's just composite. Luckily it also has S-Video. Again, I'm not saying 1st time buyer should do these things, it's just we shouldn't exaggerate these alleged difficulties. Many of the people who just get into retro computing are already quite experienced with electronic devices in general and don't need to be completely sheltered. The PAL/NTSC divide should also be mentioned in these musings. For example, somebody who gets NTSC C64 in the States might then wonder why so many games and demos don't work well.

Just saw this, and a little correction is needed: -cost: around here (Europe) you can get tested A500 with Gotek for 150-200 USD. That's more than C64 but not by much and defintely less than the likes of Apple. -display: you absolutely do not need 1084 for it, which is a very costly option, prone to failure. You can simply output RGB to any SCART-capable TV, there are also options for VGA monitors, going to component, etc.. And it's not like C64 has HDMI socket either... About C64's Basic: it's a common knowledge it was the worst amongst the competition, at least when it comes to the ease of use, which is what this topic is about after all. About Atari/CPC/ZX having lots of models and different configurations: not exactly true, at least in context of this thread. Getting an Atari 800XL-65XE, Spectrum 48/128K or CPC 464/6128 will also give you access to 98% of software. That's not to say I don't agree with Bill's "ranking", it's just that we shouldn't demonize other machines and paint C64 as a 100% plug'n play, no fuss unit.

Interesting take, @English Invader, I wouldn't agree 100% though. I'm not sure every user has to learn how to code, even on simple - Basic - level, and you definitely don't need it to be "in control" of a system. Secondly, Amiga extension market is not at all such a bewildering mess as you paint it. Well, it kind of is, but on the more modern level, 030 and up, and that's a whole different kettle of fish. It has little to do with the retro Amiga experience, which is basically A500/A1200. For a starter A500 kit you really don't need anything but a Gotek (most come with 512k extension memory included). This will let you enjoy a huge amount of software without going the more complex CF Flash/accelerators/extra memory route needed for WHDload and proper WB. And it's definitely not any more complicated than Apple/Coco options mentioned above. Overall, I agree that something like C64 is better for a complete beginner, but only slightly (the only thing more complex could be Gotek installation) and not exactly for the reasons you mention. It also depends on the person heavily, some people don't really dig the 8-bit aesthetics finding them too simplistic. Amiga is more on the VGA PC/16 bit console level in regard to that.

All the OP wrote was "let's talk about exclusive games for 8-bit computers". He did not set any ground rules and for that reason I will continue mentioning any notable exclusives which pop into my head, old or new, derivative or not, rare or common. Yes, listing every single exclusive is pointless, there are dedicated lists and websites for that, but so is spending most of the thread bickering about what we should talk about.