∞ Vince ∞

I don't know what you want from this thread, Lawrence, but you have to take into consideration that there are a whole bunch of people posting here. It isn't just two or three people and everyone has something they want to say. Trying to separate Kieren Hawken and his various activities into two neatly stacked piles seems like a bit of a stretch to me. I personally don't like the 1 million and 1 quotes from his various twitter socks. I get it, he's a devious duplicitous cunt but I also appreciate others want to post that stuff as well... Good luck with squaring the circle.

Well... I personally can only speak of my own experiences and viewpoint. I have said enough about personal interactions. I have no insight into the Horacegate and other new stuff he has been up to, so I won't be talking about that. I made a point about this before, how it all comes down not to what he has done creatively but the way he reacts out of all proportion to those who have pointed these errors in the stuff he's produced, out to him. The way he then goes about bullying and actively stalking people over it. That is key. But it can't be untangled from the 'books' when his first reaction is to go nuclear when someone decides to give him anything less than a glowing review. A user here said very much what you have said, directly to me, but then promptly started posting about the very thing he had castigated me for posting about, dissecting the 'work'. Someone rightly pointed out at one point that everyone has an opinion and a different perspective and a right to say what they want to about Kieren.

I stand corrected, Galahad, but it still being another of Kieren's non existent non licenced games... Had he put 'Ocean were synonymous for games based on licences from Arcades, Film and Television' or something he might have a point, but I heard that myth a long time ago when I had a stack of Oceans that were highly original and much the better for it in some cases.

Yep. SB was indeed a game changer. I remember it well. It was night and day. Horrible blip blip blippy PC speaker to actual proper musical sound! Of course other systems had been doing better for years. Most notably the Amiga, but the Dos PC was so far behind. The IBM PC/Compatibles were well behind the curve and they took their time to come up to speed not only in sound but in graphics technology as well. For a good laugh you should watch the version comparison video of the original Monkey Island on YT. Made me all fuzzy and nostalgic.

Yeah. The thing with the original 'Famicom' though- which takes its name of course from 'Family Computer' is you could get a keyboard that could plug into the expansion port. The family aspect was built into the design from the start. Much like with the SNES and Mario Paint and Mario Paint Composer. You could also get a BASIC programming language cart as well to make your own programs and even games so it gave far more credence to this claim because BASIC programming gave you a whole world of education and family orientated possibilities. When it went across the water (to the US), they took away the expansion port and therefore began to refer to it as the NES. Nintendo Entertainment System. I think education titles on the 2600 were very much an after-thought.

Quite a strange thing to say as for one the Commodore 64 is a far more capable machine, Came out 5 years later and it had a good selection of educational software, most of which was quite sophisticated.

It was early days for games let alone educational software

I don't think it was until the late 80s before Education Titles became in any way fun. The Fun School and games featuring famous cartoon characters spring to mind. That was no game it was an 'educational product' It was one of the excuses computer users used 'Oh I want a computer, it can help with homework and study and home learning'. Feels a little unfair to include it.

Hello! I'm from the U.K I got my 2600 in 1988. It was from a Littlewoods catalogue. The games I remember having in the pack were : Joust and Missile Command. I think there was another game or maybe a couple of others. I can't for the life of me think what they were. Does anyone know? Did you get yours in 1988? I sort of think maybe Space invaders but I can't be sure. I only had the games that came with it. It was a Junior model, the modern one.

No, that is true but I'd compare educational games together and 'action' or non educational ones against each other. Can you think of a replacement that would fit ? Might make it a better discussion because I can't be the only one thinking this.

I'm not sure I am too qualified to specify any here. I think i played some of the best in my short stint with the machine, Missile Command, Joust and a couple of others that were good. I don't think bunging what looks to be an educational title for little kids into the mix makes much sense, for one thing it isn't a game and for another you're trying to compare apples with onions.

This seems fairly definitive. I took the list from the Ocean book by Chris Wilkins and Roger Kean (which had a lot missing) and added the ones I know specifically for the C64, Amiga and ones I have heard of for the Speccy that seemed to be missing ? A Fi$tful of Buck$ ('85) Android 2 ('83) Armageddon ('83) Army Moves ('87) A-Train ('92) Bangers and Mash ('84) Basket Master ('87 - Under 'Imagine') Battle Command('91) Beach Volley ('89) Billy The Kid ('91) Burning Rubber ('93) Caterpilla ('83 ?) Central Intelligence ('94) Chinese Juggler ('84) Combat School / Boot Camp ('87) Cosmic Cruiser: Galacto Honoris ('84, possibly a Imagine original?) Cosmic Wartoad ('85) Digger Dan ('83) Double Take ('87) Eco ('87) Elf ('91) EF2000 ('95) Epic ('92) Eskimo Eddie ('84) Flash Point ('87) Flyer Fox ('84) Frenzy ('83) G.U.T.Z. ('88) Galaxy Invaders ('83) Game Over ('87) Gift From The Gods ('84) Gilligan's Gold ('84) Head Over Heels (87 +) High Noon ('84) Hopper ('83) Ocean book? Hyper Active ('88) Inferno ('94) International Match Day ('85) Island of Death ('83 ?) Ivanhoe ('90) I-War (PC '97) Jonny and the Jumpies ('84) Jungle Strike ('94) Kid Chaos ('94) Kong ('83) Kong Strikes Back! ('85) Lost Patrol('90) Madballs ('87) Mailstrom ('86) Match Day ('84) Match Day 2 ('87) Mighty Max ('94) Moon Alert ('84) Movie ('87) Mr. Nuts ('93) Mr. Nutz: Hoppin' Mad ('94) Mutants ('87) Nightmare Rally ('86) N.o.m.a.d ('85) One Step Beyond ('93) Parallax ('86) Phantom Club ('88) Ping Pong ('86) Pogo ('83) Pud Pud ('85) Pushover ('92) Quondam ('89) RoboSport ('92) Rollerball ('83) Sea Legends ? Shut-It ? Simearth ('92) Simant ('92) Sleepwalker ('93) Starace ('87) Stunt Bike ('84) Super Bowl XX ('86) * unsure if this is an official licence, either way it isn't a Coin-Op. Super Soccer ('86) Transversion ('84) Voyager ('89) Where Time Stood Still ('88) Wild Wheels ('90) Wizkid ('92)

Ocean titles that were not licences that I can think of: (Might be some overlap of Landstalker's list) A Fi$tful of Buck$ ('85) Android 2 ('83) Bangers and Mash ('84) Basket Master ('87 - Under 'Imagine') Battle Command('91) Beach Volleyball ('89) Chinese Juggler ('84) Combat School / Boot Camp ('87) Double Take ('87) Gilligan's Gold ('84) Highnoon ('84) Hyper Active ('88) I-War (PC '97) Jonny and the Jumpies ('84) Kid Chaos ('94) Kong ('83) Kong Strikes Back! ('85) Madballs ('87) Mailstrom ('86) Match Day ('84) Match Day 2 ('87) Mr. Nuts ('93) Mr. Nutz: Hoppin' Mad ('94) Rollerball ('83) Sleepwalker ('93) Starace ('87) Stunt Bike ('84) Super Bowl XX ('86) * unsure if this is an official licence, either way it isn't a Coin-Op. Super Soccer ('86) as well as Spectrum Games Games like Frenzy, Catapilla and others. I am sure there are a whole bunch more as well ! + - Parasol Stars, Target Renegade, Renegade 3 (Original game sequels) * I have included pre-post 89 titles because his assertion that in 89 it was very rare is not born out because both before, after and indeed during 1989 Ocean released a whole chunk of originals.

I think maybe it was because a lot of the conversions were done in the UK? And the A8 range wasn't that popular here. Nothing technically holding it back. I'm very happy to see this and I wish you all the best!

I was very disappointed with Poltergeist. Look at the cover artwork! I thought it would be a Ghostbusters style action game, but it turned out to be a middle-of-the-road shooter. Every game he made for the c64 had a misleading Movie title... Back to the Wonderboy conversion... I don't know what people think is wrong with the 'ice palace' type level. It looks good to me in both original and your version.

I've just come here. I have always been a massive fan of Wonderboy Arcade and people seem to write it off for no reason. The sequels get a lot of credit and the original seems to just be thought of as the 'poor cousin' but I was very much of the mind that I prefer the simplicity and the addicitive nature of Wonderboy. For me, Wonderboy is where all these infinite runners come from! I thought the two c64 versions, the official one and the alternative version on the Beau Jolly Big 30 box set were both very good (there were some slight variations and a sprite issue), They were pretty close to the Arcade. I am also very happy to see this project, because, I have recently got myself a nice refurbished Atari 800XL.

Well, no, that's all I needed 👍 Thanks. I'm always impressed by the ingenuity of coders and the way you can 'think around a problem'. The first time I heard about someone creating a cable to effectively let you 'inject' code into a target computer, I was knocked out! The time saver it must be!

I've got Mapping the Atari , it's the expanded version which features the XL/XE machines. It's a good 90 maybe 100 pages more than the first edition and although I've not had chance to have a good read of it yet, that does sound pretty comprehensive additional coverage. I've also got Mapping the Commodore 64 so they sound like a good fit. I'll find De Re Atari, thanks for the recommendations. Maybe you could do a new version and then port it back to the 64? 🙏

>Removed<

Sorry to question bomb you and this thread, but do you have any intention of converting Legend of the Knucker-Hole to A8, Jon?

That is absolutely awesome! Thank you so much Jon, as I only had a 2600 of all the Atari machines I can experience these and the originals 'fresh' (just recently got a lovely refurbished 800XL) I did have a Commodore plus 4 but I never saw this at the time. There wasn't much choice in the way of C16 software and I would have got this for sure. _ Do you have any recommendations for books or tips for someone who codes on the 64 but would like to convert one of his games to the A8? What's a hybrid 800 ?

Take this one for Ghost Hunters. You've got a guy with a gun taking out ghosts. I quite like the artwork, but is it right for a game about hunting ghosts? I get a more vampire hunter vibe from it.

I don't know just what is going on here ? For one thing the boys look like they've had a few beers together. There's no-one at the train station. One of those we're having a laugh, someone's said something, now it's gone sour moments? They're both dressed in army gear? Whys the guy on the receiving end looking at us for ? Why does he look like he's been hit already, when he hasn't even been touched ? Code Masters artwork could be a hit and miss affair. For every favourite of mine (some of the dizzies) there are a good number of rough and readies like this one. Usually the cuter end was well catered for and the more realistic and action packed the less it made sense

Wow ! So, let me get this... a lifelong fan of the system who has been in the industry doing other things? bought the company and is now in the process of releasing a new system, I am assuming to be based on the old hardware specs and perhaps some backward compatibility ? with modern tweaks and conveniences ? I can't wade through 500 pages. I was just wondering because as a coder / game designer I like to know the hardware of new systems just in the case I get an opportunity to write a game for it at some point.

In times when prosthetics were far less sophisticated than they are now, Let us take a trip back to the 1980s... If you had lost your arm, you had to make do with a Bowling Pin.