Atari 260ST, what markets

[Trooper]

I just wondered, on what markets were the Atari 260ST released? Was it just in Germany or also in the US?

 

/T

[BuzzTron451]

Pretty sure it was just Europe-only. Atari Inc. quickly caught on to phase out the two models that were below 520ST, specs-wise, due to TOS taking up too much space in the RAM with the weaker units once it loaded.

[tjlazer]

Pretty sure it was just Europe-only. Atari Inc. quickly caught on to phase out the two models that were below 520ST, specs-wise, due to TOS taking up too much space in the RAM with the weaker units once it loaded.

 

So did all the 260ST's have 512k and loaded TOS in RAM?

[Math You]

The 260ST had 256k and (I think?) TOS on a floppy disk.

 

http://www.atarimuseum.com/computers/16bits/atari260st.html

Edited May 25, 2007 by MRB

[Womble76]

Hmm - not sure thats true. I had heard that there were no STs released to the public that had less than 512K. There was a 130ST and a 260ST with 128K and 256K respectively but these were demo models that were never sold. The 130ST was only able to run a prototype TOS due to RAM constraints and the 256K had only about 35K left after loading TOS that it was next to useless anyway. The RAM prices were falling so rapidly that by the time they came to actually manufacture the 1st STs they could put in 512K for the same price as 256K when it was on the drawing board.

 

There were STs with the model name "260STs" sold but they came with 512K base. They were released to market at the point that Atari started making the STFM with the larger case. The 260ST was a cheaper limited line to use up the back stock of old style ST cases that couldnt fit the internal PSU or floppy. It was aimed at the home user, at a time when Atari were still chasing the business markets for their new machine. They used the 260ST name to avoid confusion with their newly launched 520STF and 520STFM. An ST with 256KB would let you run GEM and virtually nothing else - seems rather pointless, unless its just for autobooting games I suppose.

 

The only 260ST I have seen had 512K onboard with no signs of it ever having been upgraded at all.

 

The TOS on floppy is a separate issue. Having TOS on floppy doesnt mean you need less ram, and 256K leaves so little RAM free if TOS is loaded that the machine could only run very very small apps anyway - something in the region of 30KB free for programs to use. The very 1st machines were released with the TOS on floppy as there was some delay to getting the ROMs manufactured. These were quickly upgraded once the ROMs were released.

Edited May 23, 2007 by Womble76

[tjlazer]

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

[ggn]

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

 

Hmm, I think that early versions of TOS occupy something like ~100kb. Maybe you're confusing it with the amiga?

[tjlazer]

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

 

Hmm, I think that early versions of TOS occupy something like ~100kb. Maybe you're confusing it with the amiga?

 

Nope AFAIK the Beta TOS was around 192kb. I know TOS 1.0 is that much. Even at 100k that would leave 156k left of RAM... I highly doubt the buggy beta TOS was 100k!

[ggn]

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

 

Hmm, I think that early versions of TOS occupy something like ~100kb. Maybe you're confusing it with the amiga?

 

Nope AFAIK the Beta TOS was around 192kb. I know TOS 1.0 is that much. Even at 100k that would leave 156k left of RAM... I highly doubt the buggy beta TOS was 100k!

 

...which loaded from disk (I forgot about that!). See? I thought that the amiga was involved in all this! (workbench loading form disk anyone? )

[tjlazer]

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

 

Hmm, I think that early versions of TOS occupy something like ~100kb. Maybe you're confusing it with the amiga?

 

Nope AFAIK the Beta TOS was around 192kb. I know TOS 1.0 is that much. Even at 100k that would leave 156k left of RAM... I highly doubt the buggy beta TOS was 100k!

 

...which loaded from disk (I forgot about that!). See? I thought that the amiga was involved in all this! (workbench loading form disk anyone? )

 

Yes Atari and Commodore first released the machines with disk loading OS, as the bugs were not worked out yet. I have a early 520ST with TOS boot roms, when I load TOS, it has around 256k left, which is not enough to load most software. The Amiga 1000 was smililar but Commodore included 256k of additional special ram for just holding the Kickstart, so the machine had the full 512k after it loaded!

[sonnenhexer]

I have a 260 ST.

When I bought it in May 1987, It has 512K RAM and TOS 1.0 on disc, so when you loaded it in RAM, you have 512-192K RAM for programs.

A few weks later I bought TOS-ROMS and then it was easier, the ST had more RAM.

As far as I know it was only released in europe.

 

Greets

 

Michael

[Math You]

It mentions on the Atari History website that the 260ST had 256k and went into full production during summer 1985. Perhaps Atari thought that programmers would have written some programs (games etc) without using TOS so they could use all 256k.

[tjlazer]

It mentions on the Atari History website that the 260ST had 256k and went into full production during summer 1985. Perhaps Atari thought that programmers would have written some programs (games etc) without using TOS so they could use all 256k.

 

 

If it had 256K then it would have very little memory after TOS loaded, so that cannot be right. Unless the proto had 256K and a TOS in ROM... The Amiga had 256k called the Writable Control Store, which was used to retain the Kickstart. It was pretty slick, I knew of only 1 game that made use of that extra memory, Dragon's Lair!

[Curt Vendel]

Correct - the original TOS was 192K, the 260st was slated as a lower cost unit for Europe, but Atari soon found that the limited memory would preclude the system from many of the upcoming titles which would require far more memory, so the 260ST didn't last very long.

 

I still have the original 130ST and 260ST units that Atari had shown in 1985.

 

 

 

Curt

 

Yes that does not make sense, a 260ST with 256k would not be able to load TOS from disk! There would be no RAM left!!!

 

Hmm, I think that early versions of TOS occupy something like ~100kb. Maybe you're confusing it with the amiga?

 

Nope AFAIK the Beta TOS was around 192kb. I know TOS 1.0 is that much. Even at 100k that would leave 156k left of RAM... I highly doubt the buggy beta TOS was 100k!

[tjlazer]

I still have the original 130ST and 260ST units that Atari had shown in 1985.

 

 

Cool! Tell us about these two machines! Does the 130ST actually have 128k? Or more for TOS to load? You got pics?

[Trooper]

Thanks for all the answers!

 

/T

[Retro Rogue]

Correct - the original TOS was 192K, the 260st was slated as a lower cost unit for Europe, but Atari soon found that the limited memory would preclude the system from many of the upcoming titles which would require far more memory, so the 260ST didn't last very long.

 

I still have the original 130ST and 260ST units that Atari had shown in 1985.

 

 

 

Curt

 

Just resurrecting this thread, since my 260ST just arrived and I'm in the mood.

 

 

My understanding is there's three different 260ST's. The 260STd that you have (has a floppy disk built in on the left side?), an early production 260STfm (the one you mentioned was on the market briefly in Europe, and should have a floppy built in on the right side) and a later (1986) 260ST that is just a re badged 520ST and has its TOS in rom (which is the model I just picked up) done to use up the back stock of 520st's when the 520ST+ and 520STm's came out.

 

Quick question for anyone who knows: since the 260ST I just got used an external power supply (not included), should I be able to plug in a US ST power supply in to it?

[ijor]

Quick question for anyone who knows: since the 260ST I just got used an external power supply (not included), should I be able to plug in a US ST power supply in to it?

 

The computer doesn't care about the input to the PSU, only about its output. And the output, disregarding the country, is always the same.

[Retro Rogue]

Quick question for anyone who knows: since the 260ST I just got used an external power supply (not included), should I be able to plug in a US ST power supply in to it?

 

The computer doesn't care about the input to the PSU, only about its output. And the output, disregarding the country, is always the same.

 

 

So that's saying yes, I can plug in a US ST power supply?