Considering purchasing a HD-DVD add-on player - need opinions!

[tiggerthehun]

Hello all - and thanks for any thoughts... I've got a few questions and thought I'd come here for some honest answers... (Many of the home theater forums have what appears to be shills on them.)

 

My current DVD player is on its last legs, so I'm considering getting something new. I like the idea of upscaling, and that would save me the HD expense, but does the HD-DVD add-on upscale? Do all HD-DVD players upscale automatically?

 

One other question - how is the picture quality of the HD-DVD add-on versus other players in the same price range?

 

Thanks much!

Andrew

[moycon]

I don't think there are any player on the add-ons price range...new anyways.

You can snag one for $179.99 and it comes with a mail-in rebate for 5 movies which are roughly $20 apiece. When I got my second one Amazon was throwing in 2 movies and the player I got was one that still included King Kong so I got 8 movies and the player for $179.99. Not sure if the players are still including King Kong. It should be noted it took about 8 weeks for the free HD DVDs to arrive.

 

The picture is significantly better than a standard DVD player, but keep in mind what type of HDTV and which model of the 360 supposedly will make a difference. Personally I keep my settings at 780p and have both versions of the 360 (HDMI port and not) and a HD Player hooked up to each. The picture is very very nice. My girlfriend and I were just commenting on how nice the picture was on our 40 inch HDTV. The Players do upscale standard DVDs, but they still don't hold a candle to the HD DVDs picture.

[IronMongeR]

The picture quality from the HD-DVD drive is superb, but the noise generated from the 360 + the drive puts me off watching movies on it. Instead I watch the majority of my films on an upscaling dvd player. Perhaps newer 360's aren't as noisey?

[Hyper_Eye]

The HD-DVD drive provides a great picture.

 

For your question about upscaling... the 360 will upscale (whether you use the internal or external drive) DVD's if you use the right cables. VGA and HDMI both allow upscaling and it will be done automatically. If you use Component the 360 will switch to 480p when a DVD is started. This is because FCC regulations state that DVD's cannot be sent over component cables in any resolution higher then 480p. HD-DVD will be in HD resolution no matter what cables you use (component, vga, hdmi.) The only stipulation there is that you have to use HDMI to watch HD-DVD in 1080p.

Edited November 28, 2007 by Hyper_Eye

[ckrtech]

I would actually recommend going a different direction. HD-DVD isn't doing so hot right now compared to blu-ray. You might be purchasing something that won't last too much longer. Blu-ray might be an option, but then rolling the dice that way would mean having to pay a little bit more for the player.

 

Would you consider getting a cheap DVD player and waiting on your HD upgrade?

 

btw - does your current DVD player upscale? What kind is it?

[moycon]

I would actually recommend going a different direction. HD-DVD isn't doing so hot right now compared to blu-ray. You might be purchasing something that won't last too much longer.

 

This is complete nonsense. They both are doing dismal as far as sales go friend. The recent Amazon deals where you would bid on prices for products included an HD DVD player a Tivo and a Blu-Ray player. The Blu-Ray player came in last place, clearly consumers aren't ga-ga over Blu-Ray LOL If you're looking for an alternative HD option, Blu-Ray isn't a guarantee by any means. HD DVD is the best value right now, altho I doubt either format takes off in the long run, I expect HD downloads will donimate eventually and the HD DVD and Blu Ray will go the way of Betamax. It's still nice to watch HD flicks on either player if you have a nice HD TV and/or some extra disposal cash and I'm sure both will be around for years.

Edited November 29, 2007 by moycon

[godslabrat]

\HD-DVD will be in HD resolution no matter what cables you use (component, vga, hdmi.)

 

Of course, you certainly wouldn't want to use anything BUT Component, VGA, or HDMI. Forget about S-video or composite. I know that's what Hyper_Eye meant, but I thought it was worth clarifying, just in case.

 

I've heard fairly good things about using the Xbox HD-DVD add-on. The only real complaints were that it sometimes has a muted black level, but for an entry-level player that's a reasonable compromise. Someone had mentioned that you couldn't get a standalone HD-DVD deck for anywhere near that price. That is false. The Toshiba A2 regularly sells for $199, and I believe that's the intended price point for its replacement, the A3.

 

As for the whole Blu Ray Vs. HD DVD thing... don't lose sleep over it. ANY investment in HD media is a gamble right now. Yes, HD-DVD players got good ratings on Amazon, but in terms of software sales (which is what more industry leaders watch) Blu-Ray has been doing much better. Since neither format has all the major studios on board, neither is a slam-dunk.

 

Personally, I did buy into Blu-Ray. I felt it had a better chance of becoming the dominant format over the long haul. However, that's nothing more than an educated guess, and I could be wrong. HD-DVD could pull a rabbit out of its hat and start spanking Blu-Ray. both formats could tank (I doubt this, but...), and both formats could wallow in mediocrity for the next 10 years. It's anybody's guess.

 

Now, since like I said, it's a gamble no matter what you do, why not get in at $179 or $199, which is only a little more than a good DVD player, and take some free movies while you're at it? You'll have to live with the risk that HD-DVD will go belly-up, but us Blu-Ray fans are living with that same risk (don't let anyone kid you!). And honestly, in an Atari forum, I think we're a little more inclined to appreciate orphaned formats anyway. :-)

Edited November 29, 2007 by godslabrat

[ckrtech]

I would actually recommend going a different direction. HD-DVD isn't doing so hot right now compared to blu-ray. You might be purchasing something that won't last too much longer.

 

This is complete nonsense. They both are doing dismal as far as sales go friend. The recent Amazon deals where you would bid on prices for products included an HD DVD player a Vivo and a Blu-Ray player. The Blu-Ray player came in last place. LOL If you're looking for an alternative HD option, Blu-Ray ain't it. HD DVD is the best value right now, altho I doubt either format takes off.

 

Check your facts and go a little easier on your words next time. http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/

 

If you have to pick between the two based on the current market regardless of if they are doing "dismal" as you say, blu-ray is the more logical choice. If you're a 360 owner with an HD-DVD add-on, I can see how you might be defensive. Regardless, I don't appreciate someone replying with a "complete nonsense" with nothing to back it up.

 

As for the topic of this thread -

 

Your situation is a bit of a seesaw. Would you consider getting a used, up-converting DVD player instead? There are a decent number of people out there selling used, up-converting players because they have made a move to one of the new formats. I saw a Panasonic S97 (upconversion 480p, 720p, 1080i + HDMI output) go for under $30 on ebay just recently. There are plenty of others to choose from out there.

 

The used DVD player is your call as it is somewhat of a gamble, but you can good some really nice "standard def" stuff out there for a fair price.

[godslabrat]

Would you consider getting a used, up-converting DVD player instead?

 

I can see where you'd make that suggestion, but when you consider the price of the X-Box drive, or the Toshiba A2/A3, does it really make sense to get an upconverting player instead of those? I mean, they'll still upconvert (how well is a matter for debate) and then the OP would at least have the option of using a true HD disc should he consider it worth the expense. I agree with you that BluRay is (currently) holding an edge over HD-DVD, but at this point in the game, it just seems a waste not to get a player with SOME kind of HD capability.

 

If nothing else, he can rent HD-DVDs until the format war is settled. That, to me, would be worth the ~$30 difference.

[godslabrat]

\HD-DVD will be in HD resolution no matter what cables you use (component, vga, hdmi.)

 

Of course, you certainly wouldn't want to use anything BUT Component, VGA, or HDMI. Forget about S-video or composite. I know that's what Hyper_Eye meant, but I thought it was worth clarifying, just in case.

 

I've heard fairly good things about using the Xbox HD-DVD add-on. The only real complaints were that it sometimes has a muted black level, but for an entry-level player that's a reasonable compromise. Someone had mentioned that you couldn't get a standalone HD-DVD deck for anywhere near that price. That is false. The Toshiba A2 regularly sells for $199, and I believe that's the intended price point for its replacement, the A3.

 

As for the whole Blu Ray Vs. HD DVD thing... don't lose sleep over it. ANY investment in HD media is a gamble right now. Yes, HD-DVD players got good ratings on Amazon, but in terms of software sales (which is what more industry leaders watch) Blu-Ray has been doing much better. Since neither format has all the major studios on board, neither is a slam-dunk.

 

Personally, I did buy into Blu-Ray. I felt it had a better chance of becoming the dominant format over the long haul. However, that's nothing more than an educated guess, and I could be wrong. HD-DVD could pull a rabbit out of its hat and start spanking Blu-Ray. both formats could tank (I doubt this, but...), and both formats could wallow in mediocrity for the next 10 years. It's anybody's guess.

 

Now, since like I said, it's a gamble no matter what you do, why not get in at $179 or $199, which is only a little more than a good DVD player, and take some free movies while you're at it? You'll have to live with the risk that HD-DVD will go belly-up, but us Blu-Ray fans are living with that same risk (don't let anyone kid you!). And honestly, in an Atari forum, I think we're a little more inclined to appreciate orphaned formats anyway. :-)

[moycon]

Regardless, I don't appreciate someone replying with a "complete nonsense" with nothing to back it up.

 

Making it sound like HD DVD wont be around for much longer is nonsense...Sorry.

I don't need anything to back that up, you have no idea how long HD DVD will be around unless...maybe you are an all knowing god? I don't appreciate people playing god.

 

BTW I have both formats. They both look great, and yes the sales suck on both...I have no interest in your lame HD wars links. Personally I think both formats will eventually peter out before "taking off" and no data telling me Blu-Ray outsold HD DVD disk will change that. Maybe if you have some Blu-Ray outselling DVD links I'll look, otherwise, not interested.

 

BTW, This is thread about the HD-DVD add-on player... Not Blu-Ray players, just check the topic title.

Edited November 29, 2007 by moycon

[ckrtech]

I did read the thread title. It says, "need opinions."

 

godslabrat - That is true. My 360 is kinda loud, unfortunately. That's one of the major things for me. I guess I am in the same boat as IronMongeR. I agree it is kinda tough to not put your feet into the HD pool, though. Hmm.

[godslabrat]

Sorry about the above post. Was supposed to be an edit, not a repost. Oops.

[JB]

If you use Component the 360 will switch to 480p when a DVD is started. This is because FCC regulations state that DVD's cannot be sent over component cables in any resolution higher then 480p.

You're half-right.

 

It's actually the DVD Forum's licensing restrictions, not FCC regulation.

They don't allow analog upsampled video signals, with a special exemption for VGA due to the fact that it would make PC DVD players almost useless if the exemption wasn't there.

 

 

No one's really sure WHY that restriction exists, but it does.

 

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the thread topic:

You seem to be confused.

The HD-DVD player is for playing HD-DVDs. Not upsampling standard DVDs.

The 360's built-in DVD player upsamples DVD nicely, provided you use the proper cable(see above).

 

As far as comitting to HD-DVD or BluRay... I'd wait until the format war settles down.

I personally think one format WILL emerge as the victor, once people realize that their nice shiny new HDTV needs HD material to be of any use. Right now, most consumers don't realize that more than a new TV is needed to view HD material, or that DVD ISN'T HD. Many of them are returning their TVs, stunned because the picture on the sharper better TV looks WORSE.

Of course, they don't understand that what they're seeing is crap that was hidden by their blurry old SDTV, and if they fed their new HDTV a proper diet, it'd look lightyears better..

 

 

....

 

Damn. I used to have a picture of upsampled DVD next to a true HD source, but I seem to have deleted it.

Edited November 29, 2007 by JB

[Mendon]

Won't get into DVD format wars.... had enough of that with consoles!!

 

My opinion:

I have a PS3 so I'm able to experience Blu-ray and its nice. I bought Planet Earth and it still blows me away when I watch it. But I only rent Blu-ray movies from Netflix because the additional cost of buying the Blu-ray version of movies isn't worth it to ME. If I can buy "Live Free or Die Hard" on regular DVD for $15 or the same movie on Blu-ray for $30 - $35, I'll take the regular DVD version just about everytime. Since my PS3 does upscaling of regular DVD's, I've been quite happy with those results and see no reason to spend additional money on Blu-ray versions.

 

Maybe I'm just cheap but I'd rather save $15 per movie that I buy and after buying 4 movies, I've saved enough to afford a new PS3/360 game.

 

 

My recomendation:

If you have extra cash floating around that you don't know what to spend it on, go ahead and buy the Xbox HD-DVD unit. Or buy a stand alone HD system since they are almost the same price at several stores as the 360 version right now (Walmart sold a Toshiba HD-DVD unit at $99 a couple weeks ago).

 

But unless you are really into high definition and prepared to spend $15+ extra per HD movie, I'd stick with your regular DVD system and wait for the price of HD-DVD systems AND HD movies to fall in price. And maybe by that time, a format will be determined also.

 

 

 

Mendon

[Bilnick]

By the time a "winner" is sorted out in the HD-DVD/BlueRay war, the players will be so cheap that it will not matter if you bought the wrong format. All you will have to do is spend ~$50 to get the dominant format player.

 

Maybe the hi def discs will be more reasonable prices by then too. $30 for a disc seems kind of steep to me.

[Shannon]

A DVD disc isn't "crappy and blurry" looking. It's the difference between pixel/aspect ratio on an HDTV and SDTV that makes it look crappy. Most people do not even understand the difference between widescreen and the SDTV aspect ratio. It just drives me nuts. My church does this (displays SDTV video with the picture stretched) and frankly it look terrible.

 

By the time a "winner" is sorted out in the HD-DVD/BlueRay war, the players will be so cheap that it will not matter if you bought the wrong format. All you will have to do is spend ~$50 to get the dominant format player.

 

Maybe the hi def discs will be more reasonable prices by then too. $30 for a disc seems kind of steep to me.

 

You forget about all the money wasted on purchasing the losing format discs.

 

As for the HDVD war. I'm staying out. Already got bit by the beta/VHS wars. Saw the results of the hi-def CD (music) wars. The memory stick wars (seriously, does any non-Sony media device use a memstic?)

[moycon]

You forget about all the money wasted on purchasing the losing format discs.

 

I don't understand this train of thought really.

 

So if 10 years from now. One of the HD formats is done with and not releasing movies anymore, the disks I buy now will cease to play at that time? If so, that sucks.

 

As it stands I have close to 1000's VHS tapes I bought throughout the years. I did spend a lot of cash on them for sure. As far as I know....They still play. Granted I rarely watch them these days. Tonight I will plug a couple in and make sure they still play, I've seen many statement similar to this, and now I'm worried that when a format becomes obsolete, the existing stock quits working. I may have wasted all that $$ on VHS tape, that I don't watch anymore. Man I would be bummed.

Edited November 29, 2007 by moycon

[Lord Helmet]

I'm going to pick the DVD ad-on up after x-mas. I don't plan on buying may movies though. I'm just going to switch to HD-DVD with Netflix for movies that are available in that format.

[tiggerthehun]

Wow! I asked for opinions - and I got em! Thanks for all your imput and thoughts. This has been most informative... and, unfortunately, now a moot point. I wasn't aware of the inability of the players to upscale without the use of a hdmi cable - and I just took a look at my t.v.... Guess what? Nothing but composite imputs - no hdmi to be found.

So, for now, I'll continue to sit on the sidelines, watch and wait...

But thanks again for all your thoughts and ideas. I wish I would have checked my t.v. for an hdmi imput first, but at least it's more information to make an informed purchase later!

Blessings,

Andrew

Edited November 29, 2007 by tiggerthehun

[+FujiSkunk]

So if 10 years from now. One of the HD formats is done with and not releasing movies anymore, the disks I buy now will cease to play at that time? If so, that sucks.

 

That will be the case if we ever end up with another DivX (the media format, not the video codec). Pray that never happens.

[moycon]

So if 10 years from now. One of the HD formats is done with and not releasing movies anymore, the disks I buy now will cease to play at that time? If so, that sucks.

 

That will be the case if we ever end up with another DivX (the media format, not the video codec). Pray that never happens.

 

Haha That was doomed from the start.

I was under the impression that folks figured out a way to play the disks now though.

 

tigger, does your TV have VGA connectors? If so you could snag one of these....

 

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360vgahdcable/

 

That will solve the upscale issue.

Otherwise I think the component cables can only upscale to 480p. I think it's due to some copyright issues or something and for no other reason.

[Shannon]

You forget about all the money wasted on purchasing the losing format discs.

 

I don't understand this train of thought really.

 

So if 10 years from now. One of the HD formats is done with and not releasing movies anymore, the disks I buy now will cease to play at that time? If so, that sucks.

 

As it stands I have close to 1000's VHS tapes I bought throughout the years. I did spend a lot of cash on them for sure. As far as I know....They still play.

Money wasted on a format where you have to keep an extra unit around in order to play them. Either that or spend MORE money replacing them with the format that won.

[Bilnick]

I keep plenty of extinct formats myself.

 

NES, Atari 2600, Genesis, PS1, Saturn, VHS, etc.

 

I still have players for all those old formats and use them on many occasions.

 

I don't consider the money I spent on those wasted. Ok... Total Recall for the NES was a waste.

[StormSurge]

What Bilnick said.