Homebrew release strategies (pros and cons)

[+Propane13]

Hi everyone,

 

There are different strategies for releasing homebrews, and I'm curious as to which is better/worse than others, specifically in volume of sales, and protection of the author's intellectual property.

 

Release strategy 1: Total secrecy

Carts: Atari Holiday carts, Revenge of the Ninja, N.E.R.D.S.

Pros:

- A lot of secret projects are well constructed, and have

- The bin isn't out there, so people have to buy to try (may increase sales)

- Piracy of bin file is not really possible, until someone dumps a sold copy

Cons:

- Not having the bin out there could mean that people don't get to try first, so the "try before buy" guys aren't going

- Unless the game is done by a respected member of the community, it might sell horribly.

- Developers could buy, and be upset with what they get, and write a bad review

My perspective:

- I guess the best way to do this is to make sure there's a small playtest community, for suggestions and bug fixes. Without that, you'll end up with a bad product. However, I can't speak as to if the product will sell well. In addition, a "teaser" or allowing playtesting at some conventions may help increase sales.

 

Release strategy 2: Fully public, many updates, new bins published often

Pros:

- The community can contribute, making a better game

- The community may get hyped up, encouraging people to buy. More publicity means more awareness. This might be especially good for people that don't frequent the message boards.

Cons:

- The community can potentially interfere, putting a programmer off, if the requests are too many, or if they keep saying "when will this be done?"

- Piracy issues-- people the community can make interim carts and sell them for profit before the final game is released, without the author making royalties (and against the author's wishes).

- With the early bins released, the "community" can "try before they buy".

My perspective:

- If the final bin is not released, and a demo bin with less gameplay/polish is the last one released, it may hinder piracy, allow people to play the game in advance, and encourage sales for the "polished" product.

 

Now, I want honest opinions here-- what's the best way to go?

I worry that most people will say "please release the ROM. It's always the best way to go", just because they want to play a new game.

So, perspective-wise, I'm asking specifically, what's best for the author?

 

Thanks!

-John

[mos6507]

In general I think most homebrews are (and should) be publically playtested. I like the sense of surprise of the Holiday carts and they are all good games but they would probably be even better games if they were playtested by everyone.

[vdub_bobby]

Playtesting is key. If you can get a small group of people to test your game a lot (and I mean a lot = hours of playtesting by at least 2+ people) then you're probably good. If you can't get that, then you really should go the public route.

 

A few responses to specifics:

- The bin isn't out there, so people have to buy to try (may increase sales)

- Piracy of bin file is not really possible, until someone dumps a sold copy

I think the lack of a public binary will hurt sales in almost all cases; the only exceptions AFAIK are the holiday carts. And some of those binaries have been released; RR's binary was released almost immediately (as soon as the sale ended). TT's binary hasn't been released, I think, since it uses an unsupported bankswitch scheme. Same for SS.

- Unless the game is done by a respected member of the community, it might sell horribly.

Ultimately, I think quality will sell, regardless of who developed the game or whether it is public or not. If there is no public binary it might take longer for word of mouth to get around that the game is good, but eventually it will and eventually it will sell.

 

- The community can potentially interfere, putting a programmer off, if the requests are too many, or if they keep saying "when will this be done?"

If you can't take the heat, you shouldn't release the game anyway, whether as a cart only or as a binary. You release something for the public, you've got to have at least somewhat thick skin.

Piracy issues-- people the community can make interim carts and sell them for profit before the final game is released, without the author making royalties (and against the author's wishes).

Is this really a big issue? Probably the most-popular unfinished game with a WIP binary available is Man Goes Down, and I haven't heard of any unauthorized carts for sale.

 

For 2600 games, the pros of releasing the final binary, and public development, easily outweigh the cons.

 

 

Bottom line:

Selling homebrew games is all about word-of-mouth. As far as selling games, everything you do should be with that in mind.

[+Nathan Strum]

I'm all for public testing. I think issues are brought up and resolved during public testing that may never have been caught otherwise. Even in the recent thread for Juno First, you see this happening. Or if not public testing, as Bob mentioned, lots of intense small group testing.

 

I think the greater issue with the Holiday Carts is time. They have to get out the door (reasonably close to) December. The problem is starting the development for the Holiday Carts too late. Other homebrews don't have this issue. They're done when the programmer decides the game is finished.

 

The Ebivision games could all have benefitted from public testing (admittedly, there may not have been such a forum available at the time for it). They're generally "pretty-good" games, but they're each missing one or two things which would have made them a lot better. N.E.R.D.S and The Last Ninja may or may not have been helped, since those were games written for-hire, specifically for sale at CGExpo. They had a deadline, and likely would have been released regardless of what testing turned up. Certainly, the games needed a lot more feedback, but whether there would have been the time to implement any of it is the big question.

 

As for distributing ROMs - I think it can only help sales for good games. I'm much less likely to buy something sight-unseen. If a game (and this applies to any game - not just homebrews) is good, I'll buy it. If it isn't, I won't. If I can't find out whether it's good or not, I won't. I think that people who just want the ROMs to play the games for free, aren't going to buy the games anyway, so for that group it doesn't matter if the ROMs get released or not, sales-wise. Where poor games are concerned, a ROM release will certainly hurt sales, because people will see it for what it is, and steer clear of it. But if a game gets enough honest feedback and constructive criticism, and the programmer chooses to/is able to build on those suggestions, then hopefully truly bad games would be very few and far-between.

[Cybergoth]

So, perspective-wise, I'm asking specifically, what's best for the author?

 

All games in the "Bestsellers" Top 10 of the AA store have the binaries available.

[joeybastard]

Public testing. There will be some suggestions the author may not want to use but in general it works well for improving the quality of a game.

[+Propane13]

Piracy issues-- people the community can make interim carts and sell them for profit before the final game is released, without the author making royalties (and against the author's wishes).

Is this really a big issue? Probably the most-popular unfinished game with a WIP binary available is Man Goes Down, and I haven't heard of any unauthorized carts for sale.

 

I guess I can think of 1 instance off the bat-- Hunt the Wumpus.

I believe that unauthorized copies were being made somewhere, and distributed.

But, maybe I'm mistaken about that. Anyone know what I'm talking about, or is my memory starting to go?

 

-John

[mos6507]

The Ebivision games could all have benefitted from public testing (admittedly, there may not have been such a forum available at the time for it).

 

Stellalist was around. They chose not to participate there.

 

I think the poster children for the need for playtesting are games like Yars' Return and Space Duel on Flashback 2. It seems like the more mercenary the project is, the less chance the game will be any good.

Edited May 13, 2008 by mos6507

[vdub_bobby]

Piracy issues-- people the community can make interim carts and sell them for profit before the final game is released, without the author making royalties (and against the author's wishes).

Is this really a big issue? Probably the most-popular unfinished game with a WIP binary available is Man Goes Down, and I haven't heard of any unauthorized carts for sale.

 

I guess I can think of 1 instance off the bat-- Hunt the Wumpus.

I believe that unauthorized copies were being made somewhere, and distributed.

But, maybe I'm mistaken about that. Anyone know what I'm talking about, or is my memory starting to go?

 

-John

I hadn't heard that. I did write a bBasic Hunt The Wumpus game which I posted in the forums; batari, me, and someone else (cd-w?) later cleaned up the code and made a cart of it which we gave away as a prize, but I haven't heard of anyone making any other carts of any version of my HtW game.

 

TROGDOR also wrote a (much better) HtW game, which is not finished. He also posted WIP binaries in his blog, but I hadn't heard that anyone made any carts of that either.

 

The Ebivision games could all have benefitted from public testing (admittedly, there may not have been such a forum available at the time for it).

 

Stellalist was around. They chose not to participate there.

 

I think the poster children for the need for playtesting are games like Yars' Return and Space Duel on Flashback 2. It seems like the more mercenary the project is, the less chance the game will be any good.

The problem is that there just isn't a lot of money to be made in 2600 homebrew sales, so if you are doing it for money *only* you have to cut a LOT of corners to make it financially worth your while. And in software sales the easiest, maybe only, place to cut corners is in development time. With predictable results.

Edited May 13, 2008 by vdub_bobby

[s0c7]

My suggestion - start a blog and post your development bins there. Generally the people checking the blogs give really good feedback, suggestions, etc. Once you get it close to a release candidate, move it over to the homebrew forum and let as many people as possible test it.

[Impaler_26]

I prefer to try out a game in emulation before i buy it so i'm all for releasing the final bin of a game.

If i like a game in emulation i will buy it on cart - nothing beats playing on a real 2600!

 

I guess I can think of 1 instance off the bat-- Hunt the Wumpus.

I believe that unauthorized copies were being made somewhere, and distributed.

But, maybe I'm mistaken about that. Anyone know what I'm talking about, or is my memory starting to go?

 

-John

Yep, a guy sold some unauthorized copies of games made by "hoser" on eBay, here's a thread about it. IIRC there were more threads about that but i could only find this one at the moment.

This guy also sold a Hunt the Wumpus game, here's a pic...

[cosmosiss]

This is a hobby, so I'm all for public developement and testing, binary and source released. This way, both the creator and the programmers helping can learn a trick or two.

 

But I'm no programmer, so what do I know. As a potential buyer, I don't purchase without trying first. Not anymore.

 

For a good example, look at the Ladybug thread. What was thought almost impossible, ended in one of the best arcade conversions out there.

Edited May 13, 2008 by cosmosiss

[+Propane13]

I'm looking over the Hunt the Wumpus thread again, and I have a different feeling about it now.

I guess the neat thing re: Hunt the Wumpus is that the community actually backed the homebrewer. And, really hardcore, I must say.

I never thought of things going that way. So, I guess, even if something illegitimate gets out there, people may rise up to first alert the rest of the community, and second, shut it down.

That's kinda cool. I guess if you contribute to the community, the community will contribute to you.

 

-John

Edited May 13, 2008 by Propane13

[MrBeefy]

This holiday sale was the first time that I have bought any homebrews. I got....

 

Toyshop Trouble, Stella's Stocking, Pac-Man Collection, Beef Drop, and QB.

 

Now the only game that I had a rom for the play is QB which was the big selling point for me. I didn't think it looked good but when I played it I really enjoyed it. I got the other games because this community held them up as some of the best homebrews. However, I do have other homebrew roms and I honestly don't like playing atari games on the computer. So what I will do is use it to find games that I find interesting and like, and when I get the money buy in the store. For me the roms are a good way for me to find possible purchases, because I would rarely buy something that I can't try unless the games just get that rave of reviews. But thats just me.

[ls650]

IMHO, the public testing helps improve the game. Take a look at the Juno First thread: the initial beta was great, but the feedback is leading to an even better games.

 

I think that the public release of ROMs helps sales, as folks can try before they buy. I just bought two carts from the AA store, and I tried the ROMs out before making a decision as to which games to buy. (They were Ladybug and Seawolf.)

[+intvnut]

Throwing my $0.02 in, since I've released a couple homebrews myself...

 

I think a big part of it depends on what the total homebrew package is itself. With exception to my very first release (the original 4-Tris and directly related PhillyClassic 4-Tris), the homebrew releases I've participated in (either directly or indirectly as in the case of IntelligentVision) have been high quality releases with nice boxes, overlays, labels, manuals and so on. The entire package is something quite beyond the game itself, and having a release that aspires to high production values is worth quite a bit more than the game itself.

 

The original 4-Tris release fell short on the box front, but then at the time I didn't even know if I'd sell a single cart. :-) I was already on the hook for over $1500, and that release broke even. Since then, others have made more than that in the collector market on my work. I don't get to see any of that money, but I don't really do this to make profit.

 

I'm a big fan of play testing, but not so much for full public development. This could be in part because I'm a fairly good programmer myself, I take strong ownership of my code during its development and tweaking, and there isn't as large a development community for Intellivision. My most recent release, Space Patrol, saw significant contributions from both David Harley (level development) and Arnauld Chevallier (music engine). It also saw extensive playtesting from a private set of playtesters including myself. My rule was that if *I* didn't enjoy playing it, I wouldn't ship it. I still pop it in just for the fun of blowing up a few aliens. :-) If *I* am not sick of it yet, that's a good sign. If I find the game to be a bore, then I won't ship it.

 

As for releasing a ROM, I go back and forth on this. For 4-Tris, there was a ROM out there before it was clear I could even make carts. I don't think it hurt sales, and I think it probably helped. 4-Tris is perhaps a special case: It was the *first* complete homebrew release for Intellivision. For Space Patrol, I released a teaser edition for people to try-before-buying. Since it doesn't have the complete levels, there's still something left to be discovered in the final cart. I will be releasing the full levels at some point. The main reason I haven't yet is that I've been too busy to make the release. It's not as simple as putting the ROM out there, because when I release it, I will be releasing the full code under the GNU GPL, and will remove the "LTO splash" and any easter egg that might be in there... *hint*

 

I think this approach is attractive, because it gives the best of all worlds: A thoroughly playtested game with high code quality, an available ROM with source for hacking, and a cartridge release that's still unique and special. Combine this with high production values on the cart release and I think it's a winning formula.

 

Arnauld's last homebrew release, Stonix, did something similar. There was a public beta that demonstrated most of the gameplay and functionality. Separately, there was the full cartridge release. Behind the scenes, the game was extensively playtested by a core group feeding back to Arnauld. Development consisted of a core team (Arnauld and David) dedicated to a high quality release. I don't know offhand if Arnauld ever published a full game ROM. I have the full ROM, but that's because I programmed the EPROM chips that went on the boards. I kinda sorta needed it.

 

I'm not sure what the release strategy will be for Arnauld's next title. That's up to him really. I personally would like to release a teaser that has part of the game available to play while carts are still on sale, and then release the full ROM afterwards. That's ultimately his decision.

 

Now, if you're just programming EPROMs and slapping them on boards to sell a homebrew title, I think the situation changes dramatically. There's a lot of work that goes into a full homebrew release, but anyone with an EPROM burner can burn an EPROM and shove it onto a board. Whether you do that yourself or you pay someone a few $ to do it, I see it as worlds apart from what I do when I make a full release. I also don't see the point when we have products like the Cuttle Cart if you just want to play on the real hardware.

 

If someone wants to take one of my GPLed games and go through the headache, heartache, sweat and tears of putting together a full release with artwork, manuals, boxes, etc. and make a couple $ of it, I can't and won't stop them. It's a time consuming process that doesn't have very high returns. What meager profits result don't even come close to minimum wage for the time and effort involved with the shipping, coordination, etc. It's a labor of love bringing these games out. There are some that will profit-take on eBay making a few hundred dollars here or there, but even then, it's not that much money compared to the time and effort.

 

As for my own Left Turn Only label? What "profits" I got there from Space Patrol and 4-Tris (and I do put "profit" in quotes) go into paying for the next titles, so it doesn't go on my credit card again. It's how I make my hobby cost neutral. The SP and 4T release had me on the hook for far, far more than $1500 this time.

Edited May 14, 2008 by intvnut

[PkK]

I always went with strategy 2 and don't intend to change that.

 

Hi everyone,

 

There are different strategies for releasing homebrews, and I'm curious as to which is better/worse than others, specifically in volume of sales, and protection of the author's intellectual property.

 

Release strategy 1: Total secrecy

Carts: Atari Holiday carts, Revenge of the Ninja, N.E.R.D.S.

Pros:

- A lot of secret projects are well constructed, and have

I don't see a reason non-secret projects can be well-constructed.

- The bin isn't out there, so people have to buy to try (may increase sales)

I don't think people are willing to do this (unless there are good reviews about the game, but this could become a chicken-egg problem: Few carts sold => no reviews => sales won't go up).

- Piracy of bin file is not really possible, until someone dumps a sold copy

When the final bin isn't released the situation is nearly the same with startegy 2 (see there for interim carts).

Cons:

- Not having the bin out there could mean that people don't get to try first, so the "try before buy" guys aren't going

- Unless the game is done by a respected member of the community, it might sell horribly.

- Developers could buy, and be upset with what they get, and write a bad review

My perspective:

- I guess the best way to do this is to make sure there's a small playtest community, for suggestions and bug fixes. Without that, you'll end up with a bad product. However, I can't speak as to if the product will sell well. In addition, a "teaser" or allowing playtesting at some conventions may help increase sales.

 

Release strategy 2: Fully public, many updates, new bins published often

Pros:

- The community can contribute, making a better game

- The community may get hyped up, encouraging people to buy. More publicity means more awareness. This might be especially good for people that don't frequent the message boards.

Cons:

- The community can potentially interfere, putting a programmer off, if the requests are too many, or if they keep saying "when will this be done?"

You can't implement all requests, even if the programmer ahs a lot of time with those old consoles there's always technical limitations. At some point you have to decide that the game is mostly feature-complete; you can tell people about that, so they know only minor requests have a chance of making it into the game.

- Piracy issues-- people the community can make interim carts and sell them for profit before the final game is released, without the author making royalties (and against the author's wishes).

I don't think that's a real problem. I don't think such carts would sell when the homebrew author is working on the project and people can see the final release just a few months away. If the author has abandoned the project then why care (as long as those that release iterim carts don't pretend it's a full game damaging the author's reputation)?

- With the early bins released, the "community" can "try before they buy".

My perspective:

- If the final bin is not released, and a demo bin with less gameplay/polish is the last one released, it may hinder piracy, allow people to play the game in advance, and encourage sales for the "polished" product.

 

Now, I want honest opinions here-- what's the best way to go?

I worry that most people will say "please release the ROM. It's always the best way to go", just because they want to play a new game.

So, perspective-wise, I'm asking specifically, what's best for the author?

 

Thanks!

-John

 

So to me it seems there's no advantages strategy 1 has over 2. I think 2 can have advatages over 1. So 2 seems the logical choice.

 

Philipp

[cd-w]

For my Juno First game, developing in public has been invaluable as a way to improve the game and tease out all the bugs. However, it isn't always easy to develop this way as you will often get feature requests that can't be done or that don't fit with your vision, and it's very difficult to declare the game "done". Incidentally, your Steam Tunnels game is looking great so far!

 

Chris

Edited May 19, 2008 by cd-w

[+Propane13]

For my Juno First game, developing in public has been invaluable as a way to improve the game and tease out all the bugs. However, it isn't always easy to develop this way as you will often get feature requests that can't be done or that don't fit with your vision, and it's very difficult to declare the game "done". Incidentally, your Steam Tunnels game is looking great so far!

 

Chris

 

Chris, this post actually inspired me to put some time into your game. And, all I can say is wow!

Your game has such an amazing level of gameplay and polish that it is truly amazing!

It's very evident that a lot of love has gone into Juno First. If I ever get even halfway to where your game is, I will have accomplished quite a lot.

Thank you for the compliment, and seeing your game where it's at will only inspire me to keep going to get as polished as I can before release.

Good luck, and I look forward to buying a copy of your game once complete.

 

-John

[+Propane13]

To return to the thread at hand, I came up with a certain... situation that may make a public release not the best idea.

Say you've got the community game-testing. And, you want an end-screen for people who make it through all of the levels, as a reward for their dedication.

If you open things up publicly, then everyone *could* see the end game screen before it's implemented for all, if you have a shortcut key to have people get there to see if it's working ok. In this case, it's something that probably shouldn't be publicly tested. Easter eggs obviously shouldn't be shared for the same reason.

 

So, even if going public, are certain areas taboo for testing (such as the 2 I mentioned)? If so, how does one test them (just themselves, or a smaller audience to make sure the end screen/easter eggs are worth it for the end user who needs to "work" to get that far)? Curious as to how other Homebrewers have dealt with this.

 

Thanks!

-John

[cd-w]

If you open things up publicly, then everyone *could* see the end game screen before it's implemented for all, if you have a shortcut key to have people get there to see if it's working ok. In this case, it's something that probably shouldn't be publicly tested. Easter eggs obviously shouldn't be shared for the same reason.

 

I don't think this is much of a problem. I developed Hunchy 2 publicly and I'm not aware of anyone cheating to see then end sequence. Most people will probably just play the binary releases and won't look too closely at the code. However, you could simply put place-holders for the end sequence into the code and only include the real sequence in the final release?

 

Chris

[+batari]

To return to the thread at hand, I came up with a certain... situation that may make a public release not the best idea.

Say you've got the community game-testing. And, you want an end-screen for people who make it through all of the levels, as a reward for their dedication.

If you open things up publicly, then everyone *could* see the end game screen before it's implemented for all, if you have a shortcut key to have people get there to see if it's working ok. In this case, it's something that probably shouldn't be publicly tested. Easter eggs obviously shouldn't be shared for the same reason.

 

So, even if going public, are certain areas taboo for testing (such as the 2 I mentioned)? If so, how does one test them (just themselves, or a smaller audience to make sure the end screen/easter eggs are worth it for the end user who needs to "work" to get that far)? Curious as to how other Homebrewers have dealt with this.

 

Thanks!

-John

In some homebrew releases that I've had a hand in, the eggs or end screens were known just to a small group. You could get such a group together for playtesting these things and communicate privately.

 

It's possible that people will pick through your binary to find these secrets. Most likely, it will be a personal thing and they aren't going to publicly reveal the secrets, so I wouldn't worry about it.

[newcoleco]

I think I tried all the different ways to publish my coleco games.

 

It's easy to publish a first game, it's more difficult to release many games.

 

The good answer is visiblity. Once you have visibility, you have potential sellings. And more you sell good quality games, more you have a good reputation and more potential sellings in the future.

 

Well, you need at least to tell people about the game project being release soon, it's not necessary to talk about the project during the development phase, and it's not necessary to release a rom file in public domain, but if you decide to release a rom file, you should then prepare 2 versions of your game, one for cartridge and one for emulator.

 

To release widely your games, you need ressources you may not have. two solutions : one is to deal with a publisher, the other is to take time to find the ressources and publish it by yourself. Even if the publisher solution seems the way to go, you will have this feelling that you give your game, that you lose control of your work. And sometimes, you may have a lack of ressources because you release too much cartridges of your previous game.

 

Something difficult is keeping developing games because now they expect more games from you. So, after your 5th game, you may want to play games and relax, but no, they expect a release from you. That pressure is difficult to support, it's a big stress and not easy to deal with.

 

Take care and good luck in your projects.

[TROGDOR]

I prefer to try out a game in emulation before i buy it so i'm all for releasing the final bin of a game.

If i like a game in emulation i will buy it on cart - nothing beats playing on a real 2600!

 

I guess I can think of 1 instance off the bat-- Hunt the Wumpus.

I believe that unauthorized copies were being made somewhere, and distributed.

But, maybe I'm mistaken about that. Anyone know what I'm talking about, or is my memory starting to go?

 

-John

Yep, a guy sold some unauthorized copies of games made by "hoser" on eBay, here's a thread about it. IIRC there were more threads about that but i could only find this one at the moment.

This guy also sold a Hunt the Wumpus game, here's a pic...

Well that's what I get for not logging into Atariage for 3 months. I hope that wasn't my binary in that Hunt the Wumpus game. Then again, I'm also hoping most Atari collectors will be smart enough to research Ebay sales before buying, especially for rare or unknown game titles. It looks like that tool still managed to sell two copies.

 

For what it's worth, my source code and binary distributions aren't open source. I've got this copyright notice in all my blog releases:

 

; Copyright 2008 by Bill Collins

; This code and the corresponding binary game may not be distributed commercially

; without the expressed written consent of the author.

 

I don't mind people looking at the source code to get ideas, but I put that copyright notice in there to prevent exactly what hoser is doing.

Edited May 23, 2008 by TROGDOR

[+batari]

Well that's what I get for not logging into Atariage for 3 months. I hope that wasn't my binary in that Hunt the Wumpus game. Then again, I'm also hoping most Atari collectors will be smart enough to research Ebay sales before buying, especially for rare or unknown game titles. It looks like that tool managed to sell two copies.

 

For what it's worth, my source code and binary distributions aren't open source. I've got this copyright notice in all my blog releases:

 

; Copyright 2008 by Bill Collins

; This code and the corresponding binary game may not be distributed commercially

; without the expressed written consent of the author.

 

I don't mind people looking at the source code to get ideas, but I put that copyright notice in there to prevent exactly what hoser is doing.

I didn't realize he was still selling the Wumpus game.

 

There is also the Wumpus game that vdub_bobby and I released for a contest. I vehemently disapprove of that one being sold, as the original was supposed to be a one-off, unique title, and if there are many more floating around, it really takes away from that.

 

To find out for sure, I'd suppose someone would have to buy one of those carts, unless someone here who already owns the cart is bold enough to tell one of us which version it is (PM is fine.)