Playing to your strengths

[13matt]

Was playing a load of Activision titles the other day

 

Was really impressed about the amount of colour on the screen

 

All using DLI's, and similar for the "single" colour sprites

 

Wondering why more exploitation of this isn't evident in A8 games

 

Done a mock up on paint for a simple drivin game

 

would use 2 colour PM's

 

and only 3 colours per line are on the roadway atm

[Rybags]

There's a number of games like that - problem is they're usually lame 2600 ports.

 

Alternate Reality also does lots of colour changes - although IMO it's detrimental to many of the scenes (pub, smithy etc).

 

Have to admit though - the number of v-scrolling games that use DLIs to get more colour in the scrolling parts is probably pretty low.

[13matt]

Just thought that in the mid eighties, the A8 got kinda monochromatic cause a lot of games were ports from machines without the same features or difficulties

 

the use of recolouring on the PM's has never been so well used as in Activision titles though

 

I do agree it was where the original came from that affected the look

 

not a bad thing though

 

playing with a 3d piccy too

 

not finished

 

gonna stop using paint and get onto GF2 i think

Edited May 22, 2008 by 13matt

[+Philsan]

What a coincidence.

Yersterday I have played some VCS' games and I have found that in some respects are better than A8.

For example, Ghostbusters' players of VCS' version, like C64, are multicolored.

[Heaven/TQA]

as "Master of DLIs" Activision (Dave Crane & Co.) they made excellent and colourful 2600 games, so their A8 ports could use similar techniques as they (probably) switched off the sprite DMA and used "kernels" similar to the 2600 ones... maybe that is the reason for Keystone Kapers, Kaboom & co. look so colourfull or at least same like their 2600 counterparts.

[13matt]

as "Master of DLIs" Activision (Dave Crane & Co.) they made excellent and colourful 2600 games, so their A8 ports could use similar techniques as they (probably) switched off the sprite DMA and used "kernels" similar to the 2600 ones... maybe that is the reason for Keystone Kapers, Kaboom & co. look so colourfull or at least same like their 2600 counterparts.

 

there are other games which have the same effects though, Warhawk has a player which has many shades of grey and blue in it

 

just wondered if it could be used to greater effect by using two overlaid objects

[Rybags]

Well, with colour mixing and MC player mode, the combinations are enormous.

 

I guess with dynamic DLI assignment and some creative programming, the technique could be employed without killing the CPU.

 

Just have tables for the colour value dependant on scanline - although it then creates double the work when moving the player. Still, could be worth the effort for the results.

[13matt]

Well, with colour mixing and MC player mode, the combinations are enormous.

 

I guess with dynamic DLI assignment and some creative programming, the technique could be employed without killing the CPU.

 

Just have tables for the colour value dependant on scanline - although it then creates double the work when moving the player. Still, could be worth the effort for the results.

 

 

Well it was used in a number of budget shoot-em-ups as i remember

 

they seemed to fly along ok

 

You could get a really coulourful version of Defender going, or something similar

[vdub_bobby]

Yeah, I've never understood why more A8 games didn't use that technique - it's kind of a pain to set up the DLIs (well, it seems like a pain - I've never done it ), but it seems like it is really worth it. Since virtually every 2600 game uses that technique, many 2600 games look better than A8 games, which is just ridiculous.

 

And you don't need to turn off DMA to use a kernel, you just stuff registers.

[13matt]

Yeah, I've never understood why more A8 games didn't use that technique - it's kind of a pain to set up the DLIs (well, it seems like a pain - I've never done it ), but it seems like it is really worth it. Since virtually every 2600 game uses that technique, many 2600 games look better than A8 games, which is just ridiculous.

 

And you don't need to turn off DMA to use a kernel, you just stuff registers.

 

 

Well those were my thought's exactly in starting the thread. Given that this technique has been used before, its not like it a problem needing research

[Creature XL]

It is not that easy. The 2600 has no ANTIC DMA and no char mode which most of the XL games use. With the char mode come the bad lines. I made an example in the downfall-thread - note the color jumping?. It's possible but it is not so easy as it looked at first.

[Heaven/TQA]

and I still stand to my post dated back in 2008... and nowadays I would even say... they had not used that much because it looks "too 2600" like...

[José Pereira]

Just thought that in the mid eighties, the A8 got kinda monochromatic cause a lot of games were ports from machines without the same features or difficulties

 

the use of recolouring on the PM's has never been so well used as in Activision titles though

 

I do agree it was where the original came from that affected the look

 

not a bad thing though

 

playing with a 3d piccy too

 

not finished

 

gonna stop using paint and get onto GF2 i think

 

 

karol but this Road it's 3colour registers and the 4th could be Black (on the cars).

We would have 4Players for the cars colour.

And even a 5th one if 4Missiles=4cars other colour...

 

Remember that 'Road Texture'

Edited August 15, 2011 by José Pereira

[José Pereira]

Atari VCS2600 Solaris:

 

And that something based on the 2600 version of Battlezone could work/look very good on A8:

For sure if was Activision doing the a8 version it would certainly look something like the 2600 one...

 

Strande is that Activision made a kind of/clone of Battlezone but it didn't use nor abuse of the DLIs.:

[13matt]

and I still stand to my post dated back in 2008... and nowadays I would even say... they had not used that much because it looks "too 2600" like...

 

 

I know what you mean,

 

But all the games where DLI's are used, they are the most attractive and colourful, without resorting to less asthertically pleasing methods of increasing the on screen pallette

 

Like all things, a blend of techniques produces the best results.

 

I was just looking for more opportunities for the A8 to show its true colours, as in the eighties the XL and XE range suffered by an abundance of games which only used 4 coulours on screen at once!

 

Silly for a machine with a pallette of 256

[13matt]

Atari VCS2600 Solaris:

 

And that something based on the 2600 version of Battlezone could work/look very good on A8:

For sure if was Activision doing the a8 version it would certainly look something like the 2600 one...

 

Agree with both of these

 

Especially Solaris

[13matt]

Just thought that in the mid eighties, the A8 got kinda monochromatic cause a lot of games were ports from machines without the same features or difficulties

 

the use of recolouring on the PM's has never been so well used as in Activision titles though

 

I do agree it was where the original came from that affected the look

 

not a bad thing though

 

playing with a 3d piccy too

 

not finished

 

gonna stop using paint and get onto GF2 i think

 

 

karol but this Road it's 3colour registers and the 4th could be Black (on the cars).

We would have 4Players for the cars colour.

And even a 5th one if 4Missiles=4cars other colour...

 

Remember that 'Road Texture'

 

 

Exactly what I was getting at!

 

Thankyou!!!!

[José Pereira]

Just thought that in the mid eighties, the A8 got kinda monochromatic cause a lot of games were ports from machines without the same features or difficulties

 

the use of recolouring on the PM's has never been so well used as in Activision titles though

 

I do agree it was where the original came from that affected the look

 

not a bad thing though

 

playing with a 3d piccy too

 

not finished

 

gonna stop using paint and get onto GF2 i think

 

 

karol but this Road it's 3colour registers and the 4th could be Black (on the cars).

We would have 4Players for the cars colour.

And even a 5th one if 4Missiles=4cars other colour...

 

Remember that 'Road Texture'

 

 

Exactly what I was getting at!

 

Thankyou!!!!

 

 

Stay tunned, I think I may get some time today to show something.

 

Don't promise an Out Run but, at least, a sort of a Pole Position with some enhancements.

Have to go out now but I'll return soon.

 

This late 2011 Post was almost at the same time I was 'designing' a Road Texture to someone here

From that one I have at G2F and your cars I think I know how to...

José Pereira.

[José Pereira]

Just a start (colours of the Grass a bit darker...):

( Hey Emkay, GR.7 On the Road )

[José Pereira]

We have a car and just waste one Player(P1) and 2Missiles (5th Player PF3: M2&M3):

[+Philsan]

We have a car and just waste one Player(P1) and 2Missiles (5th Player PF3: M2&M3):

Excellent!

[José Pereira]

We have our car now, also:

 

Our car seems a little bit VCS2600 but I am not very good at car design, and it doesn't also need to be P0 quadruple width.

 

-> Enemy car: P1 and (M2&M3)

-> Our Car: P0 and (M0&M1)

[andym00]

and I still stand to my post dated back in 2008... and nowadays I would even say... they had not used that much because it looks "too 2600" like...

 

Too 2600 like is something you say far too often.. It's sad the A8 doesn't try to use it's PMs more instead of just opting for software sprites..

 

I mean, look what the little VCS is banging out now

 

http://www.atariage....picewares-blog/

[José Pereira]

Not tottaly freely design but many sizes and many Gfxs. coloured can be on the Road sides at different scanlines and in different colours/luminances by using P2 on one side and P3 on the other side:

[José Pereira]

You can also have a River:

Edited August 16, 2011 by José Pereira