Atari 2600 Basic Programming cart

[Galactic Avenger]

Hi,

 

I saw a copy of "Basic Programming" for the 2600 at a flea market and was wondering if it is valuable at all, and what exactly the 2600 keyboard controllers looked like.

[Mirage]

The controllers look like this:

 

http://www.atariage.com/controller_page.ht...;ControllerID=4

 

As far as value... do you mean usefulness or monetary value? A loose cart is worth a couple bucks, maybe a few bucks if in great shape. It's not super rare or anything. The hardest part of the package to find apparently is the keyboard controller overlays. They were included in the inside front cover of the manual in a small envelope, and I guess many have been lost over the years. Also, later releases often don't have them, even though people buy new old stock and are the first to open them... but they're not there. I've seen quite a few people looking for them, though they are possible to find (I found some no problem), and I doubt even they're worth very much money.

 

If you mean value as in usefulness... barely worth messing with. I was even horribly disappointed when I got in new way back then, and there's no way I'd even consider messing with it now. The limitations are unsurprisingly extreme.

Edited February 1, 2009 by Mirage1972

[Impaler_26]

Basic Programming isn't rare so it ain't worth much...

 

http://www.atariage.com/software_page.html...twareLabelID=16

 

And here you can take a look at the Keyboard Controllers:

 

http://www.atariage.com/controller_page.ht...;ControllerID=4

[Galactic Avenger]

yeah, i didn't figure it held great monetary value, i was more wondering about the usefulness of it

 

 

i'll leave it in the bin

[HFK]

Basic Programming was a big disappointment when I got it as a kid. I was way into computers but couldn't afford one until the 800XL so I was very excited about getting this. It really doesn't do much or teach you anything. This is probably my biggest let down for the Atari when I was young.

[supercat]

yeah, i didn't figure it held great monetary value, i was more wondering about the usefulness of it

 

I would suggest buying it, reading the manual, and printing off a set of overlays to put near the controllers. Although the cartridge is severely hamstrung by the 2600's limited RAM (half of which is available to the user) and keypad controllers, it's interesting to see what the 2600 can 'almost' pull off. The cartridge allows the user to open up windows showing the interpreter stack, the values of all variables, the code being executed with the current token highlighted, etc. If this cartridge had been designed as a teaching tool for the Atari 400 (with more RAM and something resembling a keyboard) such features would have made it interesting. Even if it just had an extra 128 bytes of RAM and a 6x8 keyboard, that would have improved things a lot. Even as it is, though, I still think it's neat to see the 2600 put up a pretty-darned-reasonable-looking text display.

[Ransom]

Basic Programming was a big disappointment when I got it as a kid. I was way into computers but couldn't afford one until the 800XL so I was very excited about getting this. It really doesn't do much or teach you anything. This is probably my biggest let down for the Atari when I was young.

 

Same here! So very disappointed.

 

Then I got an Atari 400 and 'The Programmer,' and was so happy! Atari BASIC was in my hands, and I had the books I needed in order to learn it. I wanted to make my own game! But my little kid mind couldn't figure out some of the graphics stuff, so I called Atari and asked for help. They said they'd have someone call me.

 

Sure enough, I got a call early the next morning. The man said he was the one who had programmed the cartridge. I told him my trouble, and he said, "Well, it's not really powerful enough to make a game with. It's really just for learning." I was shocked. "But the books I got with it say you can do it!" My pre-teen mind was whirling. Had I been rooked again, as with the 2600 cart?

 

I talked to the guy a bit more, and he finally understood: the person I'd spoken to when I'd originally called had thought I was talking about the 2600 cart. So they'd asked him to call me. Why? Because he was the one who programmed it!

 

He apologized for the misunderstanding, and offered to send me some packets of information on doing graphics programming with Atari BASIC. When I received them a few days later, they were on P/M graphics and similar topics. They were enormously helpful, and I still have them.

 

To this day, it still blows me away that Atari had an actual programmer call a kid who wanted help learning to program, even if they did misunderstand what I needed.

 

(The only thing is, I now know Warren Robinett did BASIC Programming for the 2600, and I think he was gone by 1982, when this call occurred. So I'm not sure who I really talked to.)

Edited February 1, 2009 by Ransom

[Vectorman0]

That's a great story, thanks for sharing. It's too bad customer service like that is basically non-existent these days, with companies of that size.

[Atarifever]

That's a great story, thanks for sharing. It's too bad customer service like that is basically non-existent these days, with companies of that size.

With the depression on, that may change.

[Mirage]

That's a great story, thanks for sharing. It's too bad customer service like that is basically non-existent these days, with companies of that size.

With the depression on, that may change.

 

Pfft! Don't count on it from large companies! Corporations will automate as much as possible to save money, even moreso than they do now, and good customer service will become increasingly obscure, more likely than not. In other words, what you're saying is smart, but from what I've witnessed in the corporate world, intelligence is not guiding much decision making -- short-term profit is.

 

That was a nice story about Atari though. Wonder who really called you...

[Atarifever]

That was a nice story about Atari though. Wonder who really called you...

Well, apparently it was someone taking credit for work he didn't do. My guess is it was Nolan Bushnell. He programmed it somewhere between inventing Ralph Baer's Pong machine and programming Secret Quest

 

(although in the second case I know it wasn't theft so much as a marketing play, so no nitpickers correcting me please).

[Atarifever]

That's a great story, thanks for sharing. It's too bad customer service like that is basically non-existent these days, with companies of that size.

With the depression on, that may change.

 

Pfft! Don't count on it from large companies! Corporations will automate as much as possible to save money, even moreso than they do now, and good customer service will become increasingly obscure,

Well, I can dream that rational thought will one day find its way into the board room.

[Atarifever]

Anyone know how this compares to the Odyssey 2 one? The Odyssey 2 one has a lot of information in the book apparently, and has the keyboard on the system, so I always wondered if it was much more advanced.

[pinball22]

That's an awesome story, that you had a programmer from Atari actually call you and send you useful stuff, even if it wasn't really Warren Robinett.

[Ransom]

I can only guess the stuff he sent me was sent around to numerous people. I just dug the binder out, and it has a cover letter from "Atari Incorporated, Consumer Product Service" that reads in part:

 

"The enclosed information should answer your programming and/or technical questions as related to the Atari 400, 800 or 1200XL computers. The programming information contains sample programs illustrating various aspects of Atari BASIC and Microsoft BASIC (Data Files, Player Missile Graphics, Redefining Characters, etc.). Try the sample programs and modify them to become more familiar with how Atari BASIC functions."

 

"The technical information provides tips on how to use specific pieces of hardware or software with your Atari system. We suggest that you read all of the material thoroughly and then follow the steps outlined. If you need additional information on this same subject or would like assistance in another area, please contact Atari Customer Relations. Thank you for your interest in Atari."

 

What follows is labeled:

 

"Demopac #2 (Rev. 3, 10-83) Data File Processing: Storing data on the Atari 410 Program Recorder and the Atari 810 Disk Drive"

This includes topics on storing data on cassette, storing data on disk, and doing random access.

"Demopac #4 (Rev. 2 6-82) Atari Color Graphics: Examples and discussions of the use of Color Graphics on the Atari 400/800 Home Computer System"

This includes topics on four-color modes, five-color text modes, GTIA graphics modes, and numerous example programs.

"Demopac #5 (Rev. 1 6-82) Advanced Graphics: Examples and discussions of Player-Missile Graphics and features of Graphics Mode 8"

This includes topics on moving a player, setting priority, collision detection, using missiles, string-player, color artifacts, text in mode 8, and VBLANK player moves.

[based on the revision number for Demopac 2, it would appear that the call actually occurred in late 1983, rather than 1982 as I had thought!]

 

Does anyone have Demopacs 1 and 3?

 

If anyone's interested, I can scan this into three PDFs and post them if that's allowed here.

 

And, just as an aside, this is why I've always been puzzled when people have said Atari was tight-fisted with technical information. They offered the complete OS listing, these Demopacs, and the hardware info. What more could anyone want?