Is the game of 'GO' possible on the 2600?

[lhfreak]

I'm no programmer, but was wondering if were possible? Even if it didn't use the whole board in the actual game....Maybe an abbreviated version?

[jaybird3rd]

I would imagine so, although the game board would probably have to be made out of playfield. For reference, here is a screenshot from the Atari 8-bit version of Go (from Hayden Software):

 

Edited September 27, 2009 by jaybird3rd

[MS-DOS]

I'd say so. Chess and Checkers were pulled off. Since there will be multiple pieces on the same scan line, you'd need to venetian blind the hell out of it. The flicker is going to be an eyesore.

[Rom Hunter]

I'm no programmer, but was wondering if were possible? Even if it didn't use the whole board in the actual game....Maybe an abbreviated version?

Perhaps a small version could be done.

 

But as far as the AI for the original board goes: no way.

 

Go is many, many times more complex then Chess.

 

[cd-w]

Zach wrote a nice go kernel a few years ago.

 

Chris

[Godzilla]

wow, that's a pretty impressive kernel. wonder what could be done with it to make a proper game (if there is even room for it to be...)

[chrisbid]

go was made for the famicom early in its lifespan (small rom sizes), so with the larger sized carts being made now for homebrewers, size shouldnt be an issue.

[128bytes]

Zach wrote a nice go kernel a few years ago.

 

Chris

 

...a screenshot of which is in my avatar...

 

@lhfreak - yes, that's an "atari"

Edited September 29, 2009 by 128bytes

[Zach]

As stated above, the graphics are already done, and AI is far too complicated for the VCS. The best AI I could do would only challenge beginners. However, I've been thinking about turning my Go kernel into a full-fledged two player game. I would keep it at 4K to minimize costs. How much interest is there in such a cart?

[BigO]

I haven't followed the capabilities in great detail so this might be a dumb question, but is this something that the Harmony cartridge could assist with by providing some additional processing power?

[cd-w]

I haven't followed the capabilities in great detail so this might be a dumb question, but is this something that the Harmony cartridge could assist with by providing some additional processing power?

 

It might be possible, but then it wouldn't really be an Atari 2600 game anymore. I think 2-player is the way to go here...

 

Chris

[jhd]

Pardon my ignorance, but how different is GO from Othello?

 

Could the existing Othello game code be hacked/modified into something more like GO?

[Zach]

Nice thought, but Go is too different for the Othello code to be useful. For one thing, Go is played on a 19x19 board. It can be played on smaller boards, but the dimensions are almost always odd numbers.

[BigO]

I haven't followed the capabilities in great detail so this might be a dumb question, but is this something that the Harmony cartridge could assist with by providing some additional processing power?

 

It might be possible, but then it wouldn't really be an Atari 2600 game anymore. I think 2-player is the way to go here...

 

Chris

I understand and relate to the sentiment. At the same time, I debate with myself about where the dividing line is. Can that same characterization apply to cartridges with additional hardware such as added RAM or even bankswitching circuitry?

[+batari]

I haven't followed the capabilities in great detail so this might be a dumb question, but is this something that the Harmony cartridge could assist with by providing some additional processing power?

 

It might be possible, but then it wouldn't really be an Atari 2600 game anymore. I think 2-player is the way to go here...

 

Chris

I understand and relate to the sentiment. At the same time, I debate with myself about where the dividing line is. Can that same characterization apply to cartridges with additional hardware such as added RAM or even bankswitching circuitry?

Writing Go game logic for the Harmony is possible, and you could write it with C instead of assembly. You would, however, need to stall the 2600 while calculating. This might be considered cheating since the 2600 would mostly just be used for the display while all the hard work is done by the ARM.

 

While a 70 MHz, 32-bit coprocessor wasn't available for a reasonable price in the 80s, not all Harmony assistance should be considered cheating. Anything possible and practical in the 80s seems acceptable, which includes RAM, complex schemes like Supercharger, and to some degree, coprocessing (as the Pitfall II DPC is.) There have been other ideas suggested that could also have been possible in 1984.

[Bruce Tomlin]

Pardon my ignorance, but how different is GO from Othello?

Completely different.

 

Go (game) - Wikipedia

Computer Go - Wikipedia

Partially solved games - Wikipedia

 

The way I describe it is: Chess is like a battle, but Go is like a war. You basically end up with multiple battle sites all over the board, and have to pick the most important one in which to make a move. Of note is that while there are very few primary rules, they result in a second set of derived "rules", such as "two eyes lives".

 

It is very hard to get a computer to play beyond the level of an above-average amateur player. And that's a modern computer, not a 6502 with few hundred bytes of RAM.

 

It can be played on smaller boards, but usually only 9x9 and 13x13. 9x9 is good for fast games (15 mins vs the 2 hrs or so of the full board), and 13x13 has elements of play from both 9x9 and 19x19. Also of note is that 19x19 is the largest board in which the inside area is smaller than the edge area, when you line up opposing stones on the 3rd and 4th lines, so anything larger than 19 has yet another play style.

Edited October 11, 2009 by Bruce Tomlin

[Schmudde]

As stated above, the graphics are already done, and AI is far too complicated for the VCS. The best AI I could do would only challenge beginners. However, I've been thinking about turning my Go kernel into a full-fledged two player game. I would keep it at 4K to minimize costs. How much interest is there in such a cart?

 

Sorry for the necro-bump, but I'm looking for such a cart. Did anything ever come of it? I'm a total beginner but have many Go friends that would be charmed and impressed by such an implementation of the game.