Atari 8bit in China and/or Japan

[Marius]

Hi!

 

Are there ever Atari 8bit computers sold in China and/or Japan? And if yes: did they come with a far-east Keyboard or just with QWERTY?

 

Thanks

Marius

[Rybags]

Don't know. Was the technology embargo of the time inclusive of China (kinda doubt it, since lots of computers were at least partially made there).

 

I don't think there were any foreign keyboard variants of the 8-bitters aside from the Arabic version that IIRC only made it to prototype status.

 

Fairly sure the ST had several keyboard layouts (US, UK, French, German, at the least).

[Tezz]

I've seen XL set ups in the background of some Chinese/Hong Kong movies in the eighties so I guess they were sold there.

[Rybags]

But Hong Kong was very much seperate from China back then.

[Tezz]

Ah that's true, it could just be HK they were available then.

Japan ? Were they ever on sale there or even imported?

[matosimi]

I saw 800 XL with Syncalc in one of Jackie Chan's movies

 

I remeber there were 3.5" diskdrive connected to atari, but that was probably fake..

[+CharlieChaplin]

I saw 800 XL with Syncalc in one of Jackie Chan's movies

 

I remeber there were 3.5" diskdrive connected to atari, but that was probably fake..

 

 

Afaik,

some (?all?) of the old Jackie Chan movies were made in Hong Kong and err, Hong Kong was british until 1997 (and Macao was portuguese until 1999), then HK became a part of China (also Macao)... -Andreas Koch.

[Tezz]

Yes the Jackie Chan Movies were produced in Hong Kong. The movie which had the 800XL/1050 & Syncalc is Police Story I.

[carlsson]

Sorry for the extreme necrobump, but while browsing Japanese computer magazines, I found an advertisement for the Atari 400 (198,000 yen) and Atari 800 (298,000 yen) going back to April 1980!! I haven't really seen any older reference than so, and given the computers were released in the US in November 1979, I wouldn't expect them to reach Japan much sooner as well.

https://archive.org/details/Io19804/page/n37/mode/2up

 

Perhaps this is old news? I didn't check any A8 FAQ for a detailed timeline when certain products appeared on each market.

[Marius]

30 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Sorry for the extreme necrobump, but while browsing Japanese computer magazines, I found an advertisement for the Atari 400 (198,000 yen) and Atari 800 (298,000 yen) going back to April 1980!! I haven't really seen any older reference than so, and given the computers were released in the US in November 1979, I wouldn't expect them to reach Japan much sooner as well.

https://archive.org/details/Io19804/page/n37/mode/2up

 

Perhaps this is old news? I didn't check any A8 FAQ for a detailed timeline when certain products appeared on each market.

This was funny.

 

I saw this thread, and the first thing I thought was: hey what an interesting thread. Lol, turned out, it was the thread I started in 2009 lol. Excellent find Carlsson!

[carlsson]

Of course this probably was a case of direct import, considering the Atari 400/800 not were seen in Europe until some time into 1981, perhaps spring/summer. There is a whole year's worth of difference if the computers were available in Japan before Europe.

[abbotkinneydude]

52 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Of course this probably was a case of direct import, considering the Atari 400/800 not were seen in Europe until some time into 1981, perhaps spring/summer. There is a whole year's worth of difference if the computers were available in Japan before Europe.

 

Plus Japan and the United States were both using the NTSC standard at the time.

 

These could have been direct imports with a power converter / adapter thrown in.

 

What I wonder is... was there an official importer of ATARI Inc. in Japan prior to the release of the ATARI 2800?

 

Addendum: https://mcurrent.name/atarihistory/wci_games.html

 

This is mostly coin-up territory.

 

1976

November 12-14: At the MOA International Exposition of Music and Games at the Conrad Hilton Hotel in Chicago (booths 16-20, 29-33, Namco/Atari 97A-100A, 100B), Namco/Atari released F-1 (De Luxe or custom models), designed by Nakamura Seisakusho Co., Ltd. ("Namco", the parent company of Atari Japan), and Atari released Sprint 2 by Kee Games. (source)  Atari held a roundtable discussion on solid state pinball games that included 12 operators and Atari representatives Carol Kantor (Manager of Marketing Services), Al Alcorn (VP research and development), and Eddie Boasberg (Pinball Marketing Coordinator), where Atari announced (but did not show --Vending Times 4/77p59) The Atarians, to be the first Atari pinball machine. (CC 1/77; Vending Times 2/77p50)  Also announced to attend from Atari: national sales manager Frank Ballouz, VP marketing Eugene J. Lipkin, western regional sales manager Terry Speizer, president Joe Keenan, chairman Nolan Bushnell, VP engineering (coin operated games) Stephen D. Bristow, coin-op engineering manager Bob Skyles, customer service manager Don Smith, VP finance William L. White, and VP manufacturing Gilbert J. Williams. (Vending Times 10/76p83)  Atari introduced the first edition of its new Coin Connection newsletter,"Atari's official monthly newsletter," edited by Atari manager of marketing services Carol Kantor, at the show. (Cash box 11/6 p51; 11/13 p7)  Atari announced Compugraph Foto (previously: Computer Portrait; never shipped) and again promoted the Theatre Kiosk (never shipped).

 

1977

March 12-15: Atari's fourth annual distributor meeting, held at the Del Monte lodge, Pebble Beach CA.  The Breakout Consolette wall box game concept developed at the former Atari-Europe was displayed at the event. (International Atari personnel in attendance included Serge Lievoux and Jean-François Gaillard from Socodimex and the former Atari-Europe in France, and M. Nakamura and Hideyuki Nakajima from Namco/Atari Japan). (CC 4/78)  Presenters from Atari included: national sales manager Frank Ballouz, field service manager Don Smith, seminars manager Fred McCord, customer service representative Dave Tucker, engineer Noah Anglin, Eastern regional sales manager Howard Rubin, Western regional sales manager Don Osborne, marketing services manager Carol Kantor, marketing research analyst Colette Weil, VP marketing Gene Lipkin, president Joe Keenan, and chairman Nolan Bushnell. (CashBox 4/8/78 p39)

 

July 2: In Japan, the name of Nakamura Seisakusho Co., Ltd. (the parent company of Atari Japan) had been changed to Namco Ltd.  (Cash Box 7/2/77 pt.III p10)

 

July 2: Atari (Coin-Op) international distributors included: Canada: Dale Distributing Ltd. (Rexdale, Ontario; Richmond, B.C. (Vancouver)), Laniel Automatic (Mt. Royal, Quebec), New Way Sales (Toronto, Ontario), Rowe International of Canada Ltd. (Dorval, Quebec; Malton, Ontario; Burnaby, B.C. (Vancouver)); Argentina: Jorge Mochkovsky (Sarmiento); Austria: Env-Vertrieb (Frankfurt); Australia: Leisure & Allied Industries (Perth); Belgium: Brabo Corporation (Antwerp); Brazil: Taito do Brazil (Sao Paulo); Panama: Isthmian Amusement Corporation (Albrook Field AFB); Central America: Alegrias S.A. de C.V. (San Salvador, El Salvador), Plazalegre (San Salvador, El Salvador); England: Cherry Group (London); France: Socodimex (Paris); Germany: Löwen Automaten (Bingen/Rhine), Seevend Automaten (Hamburg); Holland: Vale Automaten Imports (Veldhoven); Hong Kong: Coin & Vending Ltd.; Italy: Fratelli I. Berolino (Torino); Japan: Atari Japan (Ohta-ku, Tokyo); Mexico: Operado Nacional Espectaculos (Avila Camacho); New Zealand: Brian Dowlie (Auckland); Philippines: Bhagwan Ramnani (Palm Village, Makati, Rizal); Puerto Rico: Raymond Amusements (Guaynabo); South Africa: Plankomat (Pty) Limited (Johannesburg), Space Age TV Games Ltd. (Transvaal); Spain: Sega S.A. (Madrid); Scandinavia: Cherryforetagen; Mondial Commercial Corp. (New York); R.H. Belam Companuy, Inc. (New York); Pan American Amusements (Hillside NJ)  (Cash Box 7/2/77 pt.III p13)

 

1978

June 8: Namco Ltd. (of Tokyo, Japan) established Namco-America, Inc.  Namco EVP for Atari Japan Hideyuki Nakajima would additionally be president of Namco-America.  As of June 1, Nakajima had hired Satish Bhutani, previously VP marketing for Project Support Engineering (and formerly with Atari/Kee Games from 1973-1975), to establish and directly manage the new U.S. operations. (source; source)

 

July 1: Atari (Coin-Op) international distributors included: Canada: Dale Distributing Ltd. (Rexdale Ontario; Richmond, B.C. (Vancouver)), Laniel Automatic (Mt. Royal, Quebec), New Way Sales (Toronto, Ontario), Rowe Int'l of Canada, Ltd. (Dorval, Quebec; Mississauga, Ontario; Burnaby, B.C. (Vancouver)), J.E. Weatherhead Dist. Ltd. (Burnaby, B.C. (Vancouver)); Central & South America: R.H. Belam Company (New York); Australia & S.E. Asia: Leisure & Allied Industries (Perth, West Australia); Belgium: Brabo Corporation (Antwerp); Brazil: Taito do Brazil (Sao Paulo); England: Cherry Leisure (U.K.) Ltd. (London); France: Socodimex (Paris); Germany: Löwen Automaten (Bingen/Rhine), Seevend Automaten (Hamburg); Holland: Vale Automaten Imports (Veldhoven); Italy: Fratelli Bertolino (Torino); Japan: Atari Japan (Ohta-ku, Tokyo); South Africa: Plankomat (Pty) Limited (Johannesburg); Spain: Sega S.A. (Madrid); Scandinavia: Cherryforetagen (Solna, Sweden)   (Cash Box 7/1/78 pt.III p5)

 

September 1:  Namco-America, Inc. opened a 10,000 ft² facility at 343 Gibraltar Dr., Sunnyvale CA.  Satish Bhutani was VP operations; Hideyuki Nakajima, based in Japan, was president (and also remained Namco Ltd. EVP for Atari Japan). (Cash Box 9/23/78 p53-55)

 

1979

July 7: Atari (Coin-Op) international distributors included: Canada: Dale Distributing Ltd. (Rexdale, Ontario; Richmond, B.C.), Laniel Automatic (Mt. Royal Quebec), New Way Sales (Toronto, Ontario), Rowe Int'l of Canada, Ltd. (Dorval, Quebec; Mississauga, Ontario), J.E. Weatherhead Dist. Ltd. (Burnaby, B.C.); Central & South America: R.H. Belam Company (New York NY); Australia: Leisure & Allied Industries (Perth); Belgium: Brabo Corporation (Antwerp); Brazil: Taito do Brazil (Sao Paulo); England: Cherry Leisure (U.K.) Ltd. (London); France: Socodimex (Paris); Germany: Löwen Automaten (Bingen/Rhine); Holland: Vale Automaten Imports (Veldhoven); Italy: Fratelli Bertolino (Torino); Japan: Atari Japan (Ohta-Ku, Tokyo); Republic of Ireland: Quintin Flynn Ltd. (Dublin); Scandinavia: Cherryforetagen (Solna, Sweden)   (Cash Box 7/7/79 ptIII p7)

 

1980

June: Namco-America, Inc. VP operations Satish Bhutani departed the company (to Data East).  (Hideyuki Nakajima remained president of Namco-America.)  In Japan, Sega Enterprises and Taito Corporation would both become Atari (Coin-Op) distributors, replacing Atari Japan in the role, and the Atari Japan division of Namco would be operationally shut down.

Edited October 5, 2020 by abbotkinneydude
Added link to ATARI History Timeline (mccurrent.name)

[carlsson]

Good question. Just the other day I learned that Epoch at first bought chips from Atari to build their own version of Video Pinball, and in October 1979 imported the Atari 2600 renamed as Cassette TV Game (not to be confused with the later Epoch Cassette Vision). Epoch supposedly bundled their imported 2600's with the new Space Invaders (1980), and claims it was their idea that Atari should make a licensed version of the game. Epoch then moved on to make a dedicated Space Invaders console, the TV Vader and was looking to release their own programmable console, far cheaper than they were able to sell the 2600.

 

Exactly how official the relations between Atari and Epoch were around 1979-81 is not for me to speculate, but if Atari listened to their suggestions, it may have been fairly official.

[gilsaluki]

Wow.  Never heard of Epoch Cassette Vision until now.  Interesting. 

[BillC]

On 10/5/2020 at 8:53 AM, carlsson said:

Of course this probably was a case of direct import, considering the Atari 400/800 not were seen in Europe until some time into 1981, perhaps spring/summer. There is a whole year's worth of difference if the computers were available in Japan before Europe.

The delay for Europe was most likely because of the different(PAL/SECAM) video standards, which even require different ANTIC/GTIA chips. Japan uses a slightly modified NTSC(NTSC-J) standard, the brightness level is a little different and the audio is on a different frequency sub-carrier for the RF output but these wouldn't require significant modifications from the Canada/USA NTSC-M version.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTSC-J

Edited October 10, 2020 by BillC

[Schnurrikowski]

On 10/5/2020 at 5:00 PM, carlsson said:

Sorry for the extreme necrobump, but while browsing Japanese computer magazines, I found an advertisement for the Atari 400 (198,000 yen) and Atari 800 (298,000 yen) going back to April 1980!! I haven't really seen any older reference than so, and given the computers were released in the US in November 1979, I wouldn't expect them to reach Japan much sooner as well.

https://archive.org/details/Io19804/page/n37/mode/2up

That's indeed interesting news. Thanks for sharing!

[Rebeep]

im Japanese and i know some about A8 computers in those days.

 

firstly, most seller of A8 computers in Japan which could be seen in early to mid 80's are of direct import. the price 200,000 yen was $800 in exchange rates of the day.
 
and in that period, Namco was close business partner of ATARI.
so their arcade hits of 80's use ATARI font as default.
especially, legendary creator Masanobu Endo (father of most of popular titles in early 80's. except for Pacman.) preferred to use ATARI's 8bit computer as dev machine even after arcade mobo became 16bit system.

 

as personal/home computer of overseas in Japan, Apple ][ was most renown and taken as "western standard" for being primal platform which holds tons of advanced games over wide variety of serious genres.

Adventure, War, and especially CRPG including original Wizardry AND Ultima.

 

so, in most case, those small import company/shop had been selling Apple ][ computers along with ATARI or Commodore machines. (active shops were Pineapple 6502, Robin Denshi, Akiduki Densho, Ike Shop and so on.)
but price of Apple ][+ was around 450,000 Yen to 600,000 Yen ($1,800 to $2,500 !!) which could have seen in magazine ads. (of course there were several cheap knock-off compatible mobos/kits sold only for one tenth of the price, like 39,800 Yen.)

 

later in 1983, Apple had made partnership with Cannon and Cannon became official seller.

thereafter the price had been going down but Apple //c still should have been 198,000 Yen in 1986 if my memory was correct.

 

Commodore as well had tried to entering Japanese home/hobby computer market, but retreated after the failure to promote MAX Machine in 1982. even though it's retail price was reasonably cheap 34.800 Yen = $139.

(Max Machine is known as Ultimax in western nations. code name was VIC-10, an enhanced VIC-20 with sprite and hardware scroll which are compatible with C64. but was literally Toy Computer of Rom cartridge driven due to much smaller RAM size.)

 

in early 90's, when i had been checking AMIGA, i found several shops still selling ATARI 8bit computers. but price kept ridiculously high. 'twas like 120,000 to 168,000 Yen ($480 for 600XL/65XE to $672 for 800XL/130XE)... again, only for stock machine.
while shop price of Japanese personal/hobby computers were... X68000 XIV was 258,000 yen (= $1032), each of older 8bit Big 3 (PC-88FA/X1-TurboZ III/FM-77AV 40EX) was like 128,000 yen (= $512), ALL for full set. (Machine with internal 2 floppy drives and FM+PSG sounds, RGB monitor, joystick/pad, a couple of bonus games, and even some accessories.)
 
 
so, from the beginning to the end, ATARI had no chance in Japanese market.
but for me, A8 computer had revealed totally another dimension of charm since when i happened to see original "Ball Blazer" running. that was a moment of shivering and unforgettable.

Edited October 23, 2020 by Rebeep
some typo and eratta

[carlsson]

I think the Atari 800 sold for $1050 in the beginning, so a price corresponding to $800 was good to begin with. However as it was discussed elsewhere, Japan barely seems to have had any inflation or other mechanisms that affects the internal currency over a period of 30-40 years so it explains why Atari 8-bit computers still were as expensive in the early 90's as those were ten years earlier. I agree that with domestic competition from far more powerful machines, Western systems with the possibly stale exchange rate had little chance.

 

You mention the MAX Machine with is a pet peeve of mine. Everyone reference it being released in 1982, but did it ever hit the markets back then? I've found the references to a large order of membrane keyboards to be shipped to Japan. The order was made in May 1982 but it wasn't delivered until December, and a big chunk of those membranes turned up to be faulty so Commodore had to scrap a number of systems and Jack Tramiel intended to sue the keyboard manufacturer for loss. It would suggest that any serious volume of MAX didn't reach the market until January 1983, but perhaps there was a smaller batch manufactured earlier in the fall (but clearly after the US release of the C64).

[www.atarimania.com]

Thanks for your insight!

 

Are you aware of any software developed in Japan for the A8, even small programs or PD software?

[Rebeep]

MAX Machine should have been officially announced in the end of the year of 1982.

so there might have been kids found it in the new year of 83.

(one of famous dev of SEGA was the user, if my memory serves right.)

 

it might have shone as budget computer along with SEGA SC-3000 but holds only short span of life cuz MSX has come in 1983.

and you know, shop price of cheapest MSX (8KB RAM model from Casio's) was 9,800 Yen ($39) and even decent model with 16KB RAM (de-fact standard for early MSX) could be cheaper than those toy computers.

 

as for Japanese software for A8, there might have been some amateur made programs which were submitted to "Basic Magazine" (at least i saw some program lists for Commodore PET and Apple][) or to some books from Kogakusya or ASCII.

Edited October 23, 2020 by Rebeep

[www.atarimania.com]

I actually forgot about the Programmers 3, Inc. and Star Craft, Inc. development teams responsible for AE and Sky Blazer respectively.

 

Is it confirmed the A8 ports were also converted by the original Japanese programmers?

[ivop]

2 hours ago, Rebeep said:

X68000

 

A few years ago, somebody did a presentation in Maarssen (The Netherlands) about the Sharp X68000. Very interesting! But not many were sold IIRC. Not even in Japan. It had a nice FM sound chip. And the graphics was arcade quality. But it was very expensive. And for the collectors, it still is

Edited October 23, 2020 by ivop

[Rebeep]

i remember that name seen in some topics of Japanese magazine those days.

 

A.E. is implying and sounding Japanese name of Manta, "Ei". so that enemy's shape looks like manta.

Star Blazer (Sky Blazer for A8) as well should have been related to Sea Bass (player fighter) but this might be wrong.

 

about ports for A8, A.E. and Sky Blazer seems to have been ported by original staff or in-house programmer of Broderbund.

original version of Star/Sky Blazer had been released in 1981, and it shows the name of author (Tony Suzuki) and dev company's (Star Craft).

the same author made "Alien Typhoon" (Galaxian Clone) as well for Apple ][.

 

btw, that company "Star Craft" is not newer Canadian (of Diablo and WoW) but old Japanese one which once was there in Tokyo.

they have actively ported many popular Adventure games and RPGs from Apple][ (and some from other western platforms) to PC-88/98/FM-7/X-1.

also, ASCII, Comptiq (Kadokawa shoten), Compac (Kogakusya) and Pony Canyon (former Fuji-Sankei Group) were all racing each others in porting western games. 

 

other than that, Tsukumo Denki (computer shop. still exists) had dev team in 80's and released some not-that-impressive games for Apple ][.

Edited October 23, 2020 by Rebeep

[R0ger]

@Rebeep So how about you ? You are not old times Atari user then, right ? How did you find us ? ?

[Rebeep]

there were some chances for me to know and experience how A8 is like in the past.

im very instinctive to see things and as i wrote, had been already quite impressed by original Lucasarts games those days.

besides, one of my timeless fav, maybe top of my list in action-puzzle genre is Boulder Dash which is originated in A8 platform and the quality being best.

furthermore, i did know the fact that a series of ATARI's 8bit machines are Jay Miner's design when i played on AMIGA.

 

these are enough to be killer element in me. when killer element is there, that platform becomes my thing. 

 

though i couldn't have reached to A8 computers in my youth (had only Apple][+, IIe, C64 and C128),

but thanks to highest quality emulator like Altirra and active community of ATARI's, i can explore A8 world now. ?

 

Apple][ and C64 then A8 as well at last. this is beyond luxury but best since each classic game has born on specific platform.

 

so, i can see newer "US Big 3" of 8bit computers, naturally the next is older one.

i have started to dig into TRS-80 though have not enough time or orientation. (i mean, one or two killer games as index)

Edited October 24, 2020 by Rebeep
to cut unnecessary spaces