A Closer Look at Going Home Again

[gamerz]

The best article so far, IMO, that Stan has written!

 

Going Home Again!

[gamerz]

Interesting take on an old saying.

[+Ransom]

He seems to be saying that, if you're used to playing a newer version of the same game, with improved graphics and controls, the older version will seem like a pale imitation. But if you go back to games that are totally unlike what are currently produced (2D instead of 3D, completely different game mechanics), those games still seem pretty good.

 

It's not exactly a brilliant insight, but yeah, he's right, in general.

[StanJr]

Never claimed to be brilliant. Just making some observations about whether or not you can go back and play older versions of games. As I said, it was painful to go back and try to play Mario Kart 64 after Mario Kart Wii came out. Got me to thinking if such a thing applied to all games, or just some and why that might be.

 

Thanks for taking a look, though!

[Hornpipe2]

Interesting. The idea of old games losing their charm is something I've been thinking about a lot lately. The author does seem to have some ideas and the examples are sound, but I don't think he has totally nailed it yet...

 

Danc over at Lost Garden sometimes breaks game design down into a series of skill-reward pairings. Players are led through the game and taught new skills (moving, jumping, shooting enemies, etc) and are thus rewarded (enemies dying, powerups, points, level up, satisfying sound effect, plot line advancement) or punished accordingly.

 

As a simple example - Mario jumping on an enemy. The reward is obvious: dead enemy, pleasing sound effect and graphical feedback. Punishment for failure is a lost life and having to restart the level. Players go through a process of mastering the skill, where the rewards become more and more commonplace, and the entire process of skill mastery is perceived as "fun" (up until it becomes second nature, and the thrill of the reward wears off). This is where game designers build on the basic skill to create complex ones, thus extending the fun: jumping on a turtle releases a turtleshell, some enemies are dangerous to land on, jumping on multiple enemies in a row gives further reward, etc.

 

Anyway! Take any game - again, Super Mario Bros. is a fair example. Once shipped, the game is a solid-state assembly of skill-reward pairings. You can only learn so many things, play through a set number of worlds, etc. before it runs out of things to teach you. Now, the sequel comes out (Mario 3), which does two important things which obsolete the sequel:

* it presents nearly the same skills (gameplay) as the original did, plus more

* the rewards for mastering the skills are "better" (more levels, new methods of exploration, more sound effects, better graphics, more potential skills to build upon the basics)

 

Given that the two important contributors to "fun" are improved in the sequel, why bother playing the original any more? It just psychologically doesn't feel complete any more, given the knowledge that a different game provides further extension of the original's ideas. As the article states, if you "go back" far enough in a series, the old games become fun again. The same reasoning here applies: over a series lifetime, the game mechanics evolve, to the point where the most recent game no longer closely resembles the one from N iterations ago. Again, different skills = fulfilling experience.

 

One more point to make is that of streamlining the skill-reward sequence, which helps explain one other way in which new games may obsolete the old. Learning skills is fun, but only when the method is straightforward/repeatable/reliable and the connection to the reward obvious. It isn't fun to learn to power-slide in a racing game if the move randomly fails 50% of the time, or sluggish controls impede the ability to do so. Thus a new game with faster processing or alternative control input (Wii Wheel?) or whatever may be able to let the player focus on learning the skill and not fighting the interface.

Edited January 4, 2010 by Hornpipe2

[carmel_andrews]

Nice to see you got your own site Mr Stan the man....interesting forums as well...KUTGW

[+Ransom]

Never claimed to be brilliant. Just making some observations about whether or not you can go back and play older versions of games. As I said, it was painful to go back and try to play Mario Kart 64 after Mario Kart Wii came out. Got me to thinking if such a thing applied to all games, or just some and why that might be.

 

Thanks for taking a look, though!

 

I guess I was a little harsh.

 

It's a good observation, and one I've found to be true in my own experience.

Edited January 4, 2010 by Ransom

[The_Laird]

And there was me thinking somebody had done an update of Bobbys Going Home

[StanJr]

Hornpipe2:

 

Very interesting analysis, I like where that goes, but I wonder how it applies to games that have infinite replayability. I'd love to spend a little more time pondering that and see how it play out. Thanks for the share!

 

Ransom, not harsh! We're all friends here! I appreciate the criticism!

 

carmel, not my site, I am just a lucky contributor.

[gamerz]

Nice to see you got your own site Mr Stan the man....interesting forums as well...KUTGW

 

 

My site, sir, why didnt you sign up in the forums and visit.

[carmel_andrews]

Just did...sorry,late night...waiting for confirmation email

 

edit: just received it, thankyou...obviously some earlybirds work there then

Edited January 5, 2010 by carmel_andrews

[gamerz]

Just did...sorry,late night...waiting for confirmation email

 

edit: just received it, thankyou...obviously some earlybirds work there then

 

 

All automatic, may change that since a spammer hit over night...grr. Thanks CA

[gamerz]

Hornpipe2,

I also like that take on it, very interesting.

[Hornpipe2]

Hornpipe2,

I also like that take on it, very interesting.

 

Well it's nothing I came up with, mostly just an application of some game design topics I read over the years on Lost Garden. I probably got much of it wrong... anyway, here's a link with a better description of what I'm trying to say:

http://lostgarden.com/2006/01/creating-system-of-game-play-notation.html

[+HatNJ]

Nice to see you got your own site Mr Stan the man....interesting forums as well...KUTGW

 

 

My site, sir, why didnt you sign up in the forums and visit.

 

Just registered nice site And Stan Loved the article I can relate

[carmel_andrews]

Interesting that the article mainly concentrates on the 16bit area, skips the jaguar/lynx and dives right into the n64 etc (only briefly mentioning one or two examples of 2600 games)

 

Surely the second generation gaming systems (the programmable consoles like vcs, coleco, inty, 7800, nes, sms etc) had their equivalent to 2d gaming technology

 

btw...who's 'Jeff'

[StanJr]

yeah, carmel, I was looking at games in a series or games in a family, and most game series really took hold during the 16 bit era, although some do date back to 8 bit (Pitfall I cite). Plus, I'm writing from my own experience, and I did not have a Jag, etc. Some do come along later, but they are just now taking hold (Grand Theft Auto for example) and haven't evolved too far past their initial conception. If I had any interest in GTA, I would love to take a look at the evolution of that series, it looks fascinating.

[carmel_andrews]

I think i have sussed out who jeff is...but mum's the word

[Vic George 2K3]

I still have yet to see someone do a full-out 3D Smurfs videogame in the manner of Super Mario 64, and not just being a copy of that game, but also being able to use various characters of that universe for solving certain puzzles and stuff.

[gamerz]

I think i have sussed out who jeff is...but mum's the word

 

 

Where did you come up with that name?

Edited January 7, 2010 by gamerz

[gamerz]

I still have yet to see someone do a full-out 3D Smurfs videogame in the manner of Super Mario 64, and not just being a copy of that game, but also being able to use various characters of that universe for solving certain puzzles and stuff.

 

 

I think I would like to see a 3-D Smurfs game.

Edited January 7, 2010 by gamerz

[carmel_andrews]

I think i have sussed out who jeff is...but mum's the word

 

 

Where did you come up with that name?

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the confirmation email (I was looking at the email addy...or do you call you pc/mac etc JEFF)

 

I think that stan the man's next essay should be about the different genre's of VG's and how they came about and where they are leading to

[gamerz]

I think i have sussed out who jeff is...but mum's the word

 

 

Where did you come up with that name?

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the confirmation email (I was looking at the email addy...or do you call you pc/mac etc JEFF)

 

I think that stan the man's next essay should be about the different genre's of VG's and how they came about and where they are leading to

 

 

I dont have a problem with people knowing my first name.

 

I like your suggestion for an article, also.

[carmel_andrews]

Failing that...why there are no original games anymore...not like the olden days

[gamerz]

Failing that...why there are no original games anymore...not like the olden days

 

 

Most games, I agree, are just re-hashes. Worse than the lack of original games, IMO, is the horrible "movie" adaption games...seldom are any of those good.