Separate Antic/CPU access...?!?

[+Stephen]

Fast Chip = probably almost certainly the OS with Newell improved Floating-point ROM.

 

If I turn off the BASIC with the switch and then power up the machine with OPTION held down, I get BASIC. So it looks like there's new OS in that board. Perhaps, there's some documentation floating around for that somewhere?

I know some OSes reverse the BASIC option - i.e., hold down option to enable it since you more often want to boot w/o it.

 

Stephen Anderson

[atariksi]

Fast Chip = probably almost certainly the OS with Newell improved Floating-point ROM.

 

If I turn off the BASIC with the switch and then power up the machine with OPTION held down, I get BASIC. So it looks like there's new OS in that board. Perhaps, there's some documentation floating around for that somewhere?

I know some OSes reverse the BASIC option - i.e., hold down option to enable it since you more often want to boot w/o it.

 

Stephen Anderson

 

It also makes a funny sound when you do a warm reset. Different from the normal boot up sound.

[+rdemming]

The stock ATARI self-test is pretty useless.. One of the most useful applications I could think of for it would be to replace the code with a REAL memory tester program that could test ALL of your RAM.. in which case, you would need access to the extended banks with it enabled.. But why bother.. Its easy to load XRAM or some other memory checking app from disk.. Just eliminate the useless self-test..

 

Yes, no self-test is no big lost but I like it for nostalgic reasons .

The internal MyIDE OS rom replaces the self-test with the MyIDE F-Disk utility so you will loose that too as MyIDE user. But the F-Disk utility can be loaded from disk too so that is a mood point as well.

 

But indeed a modified self-test could not test all banks with this modification by default. But then, it could not test the RAM under the self-test rom too by default. So it should copy the test routines to RAM, disable the self-test ROM and then it can test all RAM including the extended RAM.

 

B.T.W. The self-test of the rev. 3 OS found in 800XE machines tests the 64KB extended XE memory as well. (and doesn't display the 1200XL function keys anymore in the keyboard test)

 

Robert

[MEtalGuy66]

The stock ATARI self-test is pretty useless.. One of the most useful applications I could think of for it would be to replace the code with a REAL memory tester program that could test ALL of your RAM.. in which case, you would need access to the extended banks with it enabled.. But why bother.. Its easy to load XRAM or some other memory checking app from disk.. Just eliminate the useless self-test..

 

Yes, no self-test is no big lost but I like it for nostalgic reasons .

The internal MyIDE OS rom replaces the self-test with the MyIDE F-Disk utility so you will loose that too as MyIDE user. But the F-Disk utility can be loaded from disk too so that is a mood point as well.

 

But indeed a modified self-test could not test all banks with this modification by default. But then, it could not test the RAM under the self-test rom too by default. So it should copy the test routines to RAM, disable the self-test ROM and then it can test all RAM including the extended RAM.

 

B.T.W. The self-test of the rev. 3 OS found in 800XE machines tests the 64KB extended XE memory as well. (and doesn't display the 1200XL function keys anymore in the keyboard test)

 

Robert

Yeah.. The self-test in the XEGS has that as well. You just never see it unless it finds extended RAM.. When I burn a "stock" OS EPROM for a 130xe, I usually copy it out of the upper 16k of an XEGS ROM, to make sure it gets that version of the self-test.. I can never remember what version numbers are which on the XL/XE OS rom images I have..

[Mathy]

Hello guys

 

As some of you might know, one of my XEGS has 1MB added. I can say from experience that the RAM-test built into the selftest only checks the first 64kB of extended memory.

 

greetings

 

Mathy

[+rdemming]

Hello guys

 

As some of you might know, one of my XEGS has 1MB added. I can say from experience that the RAM-test built into the selftest only checks the first 64kB of extended memory.

 

greetings

 

Mathy

 

I loaded the XEGS rom in Atari800Win and with 128KB it tests the 4 XE bank of memory. But if I select 320KB(compy) or 1088KB the emulator crashes when checking extended memory. So maybe that is why you don't see the extended memory test.

 

Robert

[Rybags]

Some expansion schemes reassign bit 7 when extended CPU or Antic access is specified which means the Self-Test ROM would get swapped out.

[jaybird3rd]

As some of you might know, one of my XEGS has 1MB added. I can say from experience that the RAM-test built into the selftest only checks the first 64kB of extended memory.

Interesting ... I installed the Innovative Concepts 128K upgrade in my XEGS, and it found and tested the extra memory.

[HiassofT]

Some expansion schemes reassign bit 7 when extended CPU or Antic access is specified which means the Self-Test ROM would get swapped out.

Yes, and this is OK so. It's the same with the 130XE: extended memory has priority over selftest. If both are enabled, selftest is disabled and $4000-$7FFF contains extended RAM.

 

BTW: while I agree with the previous posters that the built-in memory test is quite useless, I still like the self-test and use it quite often. Not the memory test, but the keyboard test, because these damned XL keyboard cables are really crap and after un- and re-plugging the cable often several keys didn't work. So a test (that also tests option/select/start/help) is really handy. Sometimes I also use the Audio-Visual test after connecting the Atari to a new monitor/TV to check if the connections and/or the tuning is right. I just used it yesterday to check if my Atari also works with my parents' new flat TV (an LH 32LH7000), and - yes - it worked fine :-)

 

so long,

 

Hias

[_The Doctor__]

It's not useless.. You use base ram for screen memory, and write your CPU code to run from 16k banks.. Leave ANTIC alwayse pointed to BASE RAM. Then put a service routine somewhere above $7FFF that brings the CPU into main ram, does whatever manipulation you need to screen data, and then returns the CPU to whatever extended bank was selected..

 

This allows you to have almost 30k just for screen data if you want it, as many 16k banks as you need for your CPU code.. And you don't have to run anything in the VBI interval..

 

Separate Antic/CPU access is one of the kewlest things atari EVER did.. and to delete this feature in favor of a single aditional bit of extended ram adressing is completely ASSANINE.. Take the useless self-test bit instead.. Or better yet, just build a small circuit to decode an entire additional 8-bit register in the PIA shadowed adress space.. Then you can go up to 16megs without changing ANY of the stock 130xe PORTB bit assignments..Your machine will remain 100% 130XE compatable, and have the ability to use 1024 16k banks for software that "knows" about the extra register..

 

 

AMEN Brother! and an old school w00t!

 

That squarely said it debate over!

[JamesD]

It's not useless.. You use base ram for screen memory, and write your CPU code to run from 16k banks.. Leave ANTIC alwayse pointed to BASE RAM. Then put a service routine somewhere above $7FFF that brings the CPU into main ram, does whatever manipulation you need to screen data, and then returns the CPU to whatever extended bank was selected..

 

This allows you to have almost 30k just for screen data if you want it, as many 16k banks as you need for your CPU code.. And you don't have to run anything in the VBI interval..

 

Separate Antic/CPU access is one of the kewlest things atari EVER did.. and to delete this feature in favor of a single aditional bit of extended ram adressing is completely ASSANINE.. Take the useless self-test bit instead.. Or better yet, just build a small circuit to decode an entire additional 8-bit register in the PIA shadowed adress space.. Then you can go up to 16megs without changing ANY of the stock 130xe PORTB bit assignments..Your machine will remain 100% 130XE compatable, and have the ability to use 1024 16k banks for software that "knows" about the extra register..

It's too bad they didn't introduce that feature sooner.

It's why I bought the 130XE when I bought an Atari 8 bit.

 

What about page 0 and stack accesses? Did Atari isolate lower RAM from the Antic?

With the 6502's heavy use of page zero and the fixed stack location I would think that would be very desirable.

If not I would think that would make a great upgrade for any Atari 8 bit.

[Rybags]

Nothing else is isolated - it can read Page 0, even hardware registers (even it's own, I think).

 

With VBXE you can have multiple occurrences of lower RAM - something I want to try - it'll make for easy multitasking.

[+Roydea6]

Some expansion schemes reassign bit 7 when extended CPU or Antic access is specified which means the Self-Test ROM would get swapped out.

Yes, and this is OK so. It's the same with the 130XE: extended memory has priority over selftest. If both are enabled, selftest is disabled and $4000-$7FFF contains extended RAM.

 

BTW: while I agree with the previous posters that the built-in memory test is quite useless, I still like the self-test and use it quite often. Not the memory test, but the keyboard test, because these damned XL keyboard cables are really crap and after un- and re-plugging the cable often several keys didn't work. So a test (that also tests option/select/start/help) is really handy. Sometimes I also use the Audio-Visual test after connecting the Atari to a new monitor/TV to check if the connections and/or the tuning is right. I just used it yesterday to check if my Atari also works with my parents' new flat TV (an LH 32LH7000), and - yes - it worked fine :-)

 

so long,

Hias

 

Keyboard test :

 

 

Tester v3.2 MacQyver.xex

[HiassofT]

Keyboard test :

 

 

Tester v3.2 MacQyver.xex

Thanks for the info! I didn't know this program before. Looks quite nice, but the selftest has one big advantage: It's built into every XL/XE computer, so there's no need to connect a floppy/SIO2PC/cart/... to run the test. Well, I just wanted to point out that the builtin selftest is not completely useless, at least for me :-)

 

so long,

 

Hias

[flashjazzcat]

I was pondering on the bus today: probably a very simple and useful upgrade would be some banked RAM (maybe 4 x 16K banks) accessible by ANTIC/CPU but controlled by a register other than PORTB. This would have all the advantages of VBXE's ANTIC banked mode for applications aware of it, but without the rest of the features. Any RAM-hungry graphics application would benefit from keeping the DLs and screen data outside main memory.

[+rdemming]

 

Thanks for the info! I didn't know this program before. Looks quite nice, but the selftest has one big advantage: It's built into every XL/XE computer, so there's no need to connect a floppy/SIO2PC/cart/... to run the test. Well, I just wanted to point out that the builtin selftest is not completely useless, at least for me :-)

 

You are not the only one. I like the self-test too to quickly test the video and audio when I'm reconnecting the computer.

It would be nice replace the internal self-test with something that combines X-Ram test & MacGuiver tester & stereo sound test (plus Covox & VBXE tester) in one

 

Robert

[_The Doctor__]

I was pondering on the bus today: probably a very simple and useful upgrade would be some banked RAM (maybe 4 x 16K banks) accessible by ANTIC/CPU but controlled by a register other than PORTB. This would have all the advantages of VBXE's ANTIC banked mode for applications aware of it, but without the rest of the features. Any RAM-hungry graphics application would benefit from keeping the DLs and screen data outside main memory.