Strugglin' with Skeleton

[Spector]

I'm going nowhere with this one. I've got the radar switched on, but what exactly does it signify? It appears in each of the corners depending where you are, but even though I keep it at the top of the screen, I still get killed without seeing the skeleton guy, as he is attacking me from behind. How do I make sure he's in front of me?

[EricBall]

The "radar" indicates the direction the Skeleton is relative to your position. So, if the square is at the top center, the Skeleton is directly ahead of you. If the square is at the top left corner, then the Skeleton is somewhere ahead and left of you. What the radar doesn't indicate is the distance or the actual angle. The sound (especially if you have a VCS modified for stereo) does hint at distance & angle.

 

What may be happening to you is you are stepping into an intersection where the Skeleton is waiting in the corridor. The Skeleton has a real advantage in that case, since you have to turn & shoot before it can take a step.

My advice is to make use of the sound volume cues to figure out how close the Skeleton is, and be very, very careful when the Skeleton is close. The radar will help you keep the Skeleton in front of you. And if the radar shifts to the right or left of the screen, run rather than trying to turn. You can move as fast as you can wiggle the joystick.

[Spector]

I'm beginning to get the hang of this one now, thanks for the tips. By the way, the PAL version seems flawless. Those pesky Skeletons are gonna get what's comin' to them!

[LinkoVitch]

yeah got to have a go of my copy of skeleton, very impressed with it.

 

Radar feels a little like cheating but as I only have a mono 2600 I think it's justifiyable (or I end up running round the maze for ages! )

 

Are the mazes predetermined, or are they randomly generated when you start a new level?

[EricBall]

The eight mazes are all predetermined, though they were created semi-randomly. Not enough RAM in a 2600 to generate the maze.

[Xot]

The eight mazes are all predetermined, though they were created semi-randomly.  Not enough RAM in a 2600 to generate the maze.

 

I love this game, but I'm curious as to what causes the maze to change color? It seems to go from brown to yellow after I zap the first skel, then eventually it goes to red. I assume the red walls indicate I've entered the second maze, but I've never counted my kills to be sure.

[Rob Mitchell]

My .. How nice Skeleton is with the compass and the two channel audio out to help with direction.

 

Rob Mitchell, Atlanta, GA

[EricBall]

Xot wrote:

I love this game, but I'm curious as to what causes the maze to change color? It seems to go from brown to yellow after I zap the first skel, then eventually it goes to red. I assume the red walls indicate I've entered the second maze, but I've never counted my kills to be sure.

 

Correct. There should be a gradual colour shift as you eliminate each Skeleton, then a dramatic colour shift when you change mazes. When the maze changes, you will also be repositioned so your view will change.

[Xot]

Xot wrote:

I love this game, but I'm curious as to what causes the maze to change color? It seems to go from brown to yellow after I zap the first skel, then eventually it goes to red. I assume the red walls indicate I've entered the second maze, but I've never counted my kills to be sure.

 

Correct.  There should be a gradual colour shift as you eliminate each Skeleton, then a dramatic colour shift when you change mazes.  When the maze changes, you will also be repositioned so your view will change.

 

Thanks for the help - I really enjoy this game. Was the decision to leave out a counter simply to make it harder or was there some sort of coding reason?

[Spector]

It's one thing that the game needs, a score counter or a level counter so that you know how well you are doing and can compare it to previous high scores.

[EricBall]

The lack of a level counter (or any other feature) really comes down to two reasons: space & time. The code takes up almost the entire 4K cartridge (especially the PAL version, which required larger lookup tables). There isn't enough space left in the cartridge to put in a level counter, which would require some kind of lookup table for the numbers.

 

I also was ready to call the game finished. Creating the PAL version and adding in the direction indicator required more time and effort than I expected. Now that there are actual cartridges available (and a big thank you to all of you who have purchased one) the current version is the final version.

[Cybergoth]

The lack of a level counter (or any other feature) really comes down to two reasons: space & time.  The code takes up almost the entire 4K cartridge (especially the PAL version, which required larger lookup tables).  There isn't enough space left in the cartridge to put in a level counter, which would require some kind of lookup table for the numbers.

 

In the PAL version I see 130 free bytes from $0EE4-$0F66.

 

Greetings,

Manuel

[LinkoVitch]

In the PAL version I see 130 free bytes from $0EE4-$0F66.

 

Some people are never happy!

 

Give the man the credit he deserves (all hail! ) and stop whineing it's not that hard to count the number of skeletons and the level number in your head. Or a piece of paper.

 

But why not use that 130 bytes for something more fun like an MP3 for background music YEAH! I demand and MP3 in my copy of Skeleton

[EricBall]

In the PAL version I see 130 free bytes from $0EE4-$0F66.

 

For comparison, the title screen (no music either) is 110 bytes of code + 85 bytes of data = 195 bytes. 'twould be very tough to squeeze in the digit lookup table even. It's amazing how quickly the bytes get used. And don't ignore the fact that the 130 bytes cross a page boundary, so it's more like 28 bytes + 102 bytes.

 

In any case, the current version is the final version. And wouldn't you rather have me develop something new?

[Cybergoth]

Hi Eric,

 

In any case, the current version is the final version.  And wouldn't you rather have me develop something new?

 

Well, sorry, but the answer is a clear no. I'd prefer if you'd add some more gameplay to Skeleton and would polish it some more. I was very sad when after the first promising version you just declared it finished, since the engine you created had so much potential for a really excellent game.

 

I'm not complaining though, since I didn't buy it yet and never will as is.

 

Greetings,

Manuel

[Thomas Jentzsch]

I 100% have to agree with Cybergoth.

 

IMO the final 5% polishing make the difference between a good and an outstanding game.

 

BTW: All those great 4K games (Pitfall!, Starmaster, River Raid, Cosmic Arc) I have disassembled had virtually no space left.

[LinkoVitch]

just because they used every bit of space doesn't mean every game has to use every bit of space to be good.

[Inky]

 

All I know about Skeleton is that it's incredibly fun to play, and a good representation of what the 2600 can do

[Thomas Jentzsch]

just because they used every bit of space doesn't mean every game has to use every bit of space to be good.

Don't get me wrong! IMO Skeleton definitely is a good game.

 

But I (and probalby Cybergoth too) think, that the basic idea has a bit more potential left and we would love to see that used. Especially when there still is some usable space left.

[Spector]

The reason why people are giving their 10 cents on how to improve it is because it's worth it- Skeleton is unlike any other game on the 2600 (except perhaps "Escape From The Mindmaster") and has a feel of it's own. It holds up as it is, but with a score counter, we are closer to a late-in-the-game classic for the machine.

[StanJr]

Actually its a LOT like a stripped down Tunnel Runner, especially the part about zipping around the corner and having a skeleton right in your face! I think a Kill Counter would be nice, and I see where people are coming from (although a bit of it comes off like programmer snobbery), but I also like the game as it stands.

 

Great! Now I'm confused!

 

[Paul Slocum]

I think a counter is a really good idea. You could even just put a mark at the bottom or top of the screen for each skeleton killed. Have red marks for the number of levels completed and white marks for the number of skeletons killed on the current level. That would be really easy to program and would easily fit into the remaining space.

 

Then of course there's my favorite option of using bankswitching get more space. Then you could add a fancier score display and maybe a little... oh I don't know... music?

 

-Paul

[Cybergoth]

Hi there!

 

(although a bit of it comes off like programmer snobbery)

 

*lol* ...well...

 

Hm... I don't know. It's like, with the old classics, you never had a chance to just tell the programmer something like "It's great, but why didn't you just...".

 

And, though it's the programmers decission as to "when" he declares a game finished, I don't like to hear bad excuses afterwards like "space" and "time", when it's actually either "laziness" or "lost interest" or "I can't wait a day longer to see my own name finally associated with an Atari game box" or something like that.

 

Yes, it might be the programmer in me. I - and probably another three dozen of people (including Eric himself) could probably add a thing like a level counter easily over night - so no "technical" excuse for that, please.

 

There's the gamer in me speaking too, saying that the gameplay could've been expanded here and there.

 

There's the homebrewer in me speaking too, being proud of my craft. I've a certain idea of a level of quality a game should reach before demanding 25+ $/€ for it.

 

Again, Skeleton had all the potetial to be an outstanding game, but right now it's just average.

 

All my own opinion certainly. Feel free to let yours differ

 

Greetings,

Manuel

[Rob Mitchell]

Make it better! Make it better! Make it better! Add music from "The Adams Family."

 

Rob Mitchell, Atlanta, GA

[EricBall]

Wow, bunch of negative comments here. And some of them hit close to home. Yes, I admit, part of the reason I finalized Skeleton is I was losing interest. Adding the radar feature was much more difficult than I had estimated and required more time & effort.

 

That being said, I don't think that simply adding a level counter would push Skeleton from being a good game to being a great game because it wouldn't address the problem with Skeleton - the game doesn't significantly change level to level.

 

Sure, there's a challenge in hunting down and eliminating each Skeleton; but that's all there is. Yes, it will get more difficult over time as the Skeleton gets tougher to kill; and yes, the different mazes will add variety; but that's all there is. And that just isn't enough to keep people playing.

 

I'd also like to address some of Manuel's other comments.

 

First, I have posted the full source code for Skeleton to the Stellalist. Manuel (or any other programmer) is free to delve into it, and maybe add that missing level counter, or even use the display kernel as the basis of a full FPS RPG. (Just give credit where credit is due.)

 

Second, the binary image of the cartridge ROM is available from AtariAge and the Stellalist for all to use for free. Some people (at least 20) were willing to buy an actual cartridge from AtariAge or HozerVideo. I sincerely hope that these people played the game via emulation and thought it was worth the money.

 

Finally, those of us who have programmed the 2600 understand that the platform has certain limitations and challenges. One of those challenges is the size of the ROM. And although bankswitching is possible, it brings with it additional difficulties. Skeleton, as it is, fits in a standard 4K cartridge, which makes it possible to play using a SuperCharger or a normal EPROM.

 

PS Paul - I really, really wanted to have Edvard Grieg's _March of the Trolls_ as title screen music, but the title & end screen code & lookup tables ate the page needed to store the music. Sigh!