My Air Raid Auction Update

[Dino]

Those weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

 

First 5 words sum it up for me!!

They're just sour grapes that Atari is king of the heap again

[+MattelAquarius]

Those weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

 

First 5 words sum it up for me!!

They're just sour grapes that Atari is king of the heap again

 

In that case, the question of whether the box is real or not is moot.

 

What matters, is someone was willing to pay that much for a rare Atari game w/box.

[homerwannabee]

Those weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

Not only that, some of the ones that do believe this is a real games now have now come up with a new word to be dismissive of this game. It is called "Retail Release"

 

What is "Retail Release"? That means in order for something to be a "Retail Release" it has to be sold by a retail store. See since Tuesday Morning was a "Discount Store" it does not count as a "Retail Release". They also made mention that all mail order games are not counted as well. So games like Video Life, Magic Card, Tooth Protectors, Gamma Attack, and Birthday Mania all have a new term that new found collectors can now turn their noses up at these games.

 

Don't you just love video game snobs?

[Pioneer4x4]

I suspect many more craigs list posts to be like this one for awhile. I'm sure it will settle down when the hype dissipates.

 

http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/vgm/1690655983.html

 

I bet the 23 carts are all commons...

I saw that too. I "assumed" it was a typo.

[+FujiSkunk]

I'm a little leery of putting box scans in the database as that might prompt a deluge of fake boxes showing up on eBay.

 

Watermark the hell out of 'em!

[Albert]

I'm a little leery of putting box scans in the database as that might prompt a deluge of fake boxes showing up on eBay.

 

Watermark the hell out of 'em!

I may do that for this particular box. I've never watermarked images before on AtariAge as the intent has always been to freely share images without alterations. However, with a recent $31K auction for this particular title, I know damn well someone is going to try passing off a reproduction box as genuine.

 

..Al

[Pioneer4x4]

I'm a little leery of putting box scans in the database as that might prompt a deluge of fake boxes showing up on eBay.

 

Watermark the hell out of 'em!

I may do that for this particular box. I've never watermarked images before on AtariAge as the intent has always been to freely share images without alterations. However, with a recent $31K auction for this particular title, I know damn well someone is going to try passing off a reproduction box as genuine.

 

..Al

My suggestion would be to make an alteration or deletion, that hopefully only you would notice (Or tanman or Wonder) and if a new one pops up matching your "alteration", can you say "Busted!"

Maybe on a part of the box not previously posted well. I checked and the ebay auction seems to cover all sides pretty good. Maybe if you changed spacing or inverted something... Anyone duping the box would probably make a new design using scans as basline anyway, so watermarks won't really stop it, maybe only slow down someone.

[potatohead]

Are the images already online enough to make a good reproduction?

 

(if not)

 

I would hold the image for a while. People can wait, and this will die down. I too believe some clown will try it.

 

BTW: Al, thanks for your great image and site policy in general. Appreciated.

Edited April 15, 2010 by potatohead

[Chris Leach]

Those weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

 

First 5 words sum it up for me!!

 

 

I Love This Community!

[jahfish]

My suggestion would be to make an alteration or deletion, that hopefully only you would notice (Or tanman or Wonder) and if a new one pops up matching your "alteration", can you say "Busted!"

 

 

like this?

 

[Albert]

like this?

Clever.

 

..Al

[jahfish]

a "sunday morning" price tag could be fun too

Edited April 15, 2010 by jahfish

[Tanman]

Al, you could fix all the typos on the back. Hahaha

but I agree with doing something to protect against fakes.

[Dauber]

I say go ahead and post the box scans -- but with AtariAge watermarks so any fakes would be obvious...something like "Photo © AtariAge 2010"

[bojay1997]

Those weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

Not only that, some of the ones that do believe this is a real games now have now come up with a new word to be dismissive of this game. It is called "Retail Release"

 

What is "Retail Release"? That means in order for something to be a "Retail Release" it has to be sold by a retail store. See since Tuesday Morning was a "Discount Store" it does not count as a "Retail Release". They also made mention that all mail order games are not counted as well. So games like Video Life, Magic Card, Tooth Protectors, Gamma Attack, and Birthday Mania all have a new term that new found collectors can now turn their noses up at these games.

 

Don't you just love video game snobs?

 

I suspect you are making reference to my posts at Digital Press while completely misrepresenting what was in them. First let's address your last point. Isn't there an equal amount of snobbery going on here from collectors who all of a sudden believe that their collecting of Taiwanese pirates or Hong Kong knock-offs was justified all along despite the fact that most collectors could care less? Perhaps collecting means something different to you, but for some of us, there has to be nostalgia attached to make the purchase worthwhile. I don't believe the box or cartridge is fake. I just don't think it has any place in my collection. I collect US retail release or mail-order released games produced by established companies that did some marketing or had some connection to the mainstream video game industry and otherwise were part of my childhood. I call them "mainstream" games. That doesn't mean that items like Air Raid don't exist or are fake, just that they hold no interest or value for me and collectors like me. I'm sure there are plenty of people who would disagree. That doesn't make any of us right or wrong.

 

The backstory of how the game ended up at Tuesday Morning has relevance to me. Tuesday Morning at least in its current incarnation is a weird blend of Big Lots and a thrift store. I don't know what it was like 20 years ago, but something tells me it wasn't much different. How the item ended up at Tuesday Morning sheds no light on whether the item is real or not, but it does help collectors make a decision about whether or not it has a place in their collection. That's my only point and that's why I am personally curious about it and hopeful that someday the full story of how the game got to the United States will come out.

 

On a somewhat related note, I think the $31K sale price is actually not a good thing in the long run for this community. While it might provide some temporary justification for people who paid too much for items in the late-90s before the more recent price collapse of VCS stuff, it may have the impact of encouraging people to hold onto items longer or attempt to price gouge in the short term. Neither outcome benefits collectors whose presumed goal is to keep growing their collection in the most economical way possible.

[Cebus Capucinis]

Yep, selling things to collectors is always a bad thing. We need to keep everything hoarded in one gigantic nuclear-safe bunker where only those who are arbitrarily deemed "WORTHY" can look at or touch them.

 

 

...and GOD HELP YOU if you didn't buy that game upmarket from a dealer of at least Toys 'R Us recognition or else it's not good enough either.

[Shantai]

I'm a little leery of putting box scans in the database as that might prompt a deluge of fake boxes showing up on eBay.

 

Watermark the hell out of 'em!

I may do that for this particular box. I've never watermarked images before on AtariAge as the intent has always been to freely share images without alterations. However, with a recent $31K auction for this particular title, I know damn well someone is going to try passing off a reproduction box as genuine.

 

..Al

 

 

Simple, Put Atari Age logos on the box image and the words "For educational/informational purposes only" as well

Edited April 15, 2010 by Shantai

[Fr0st]

Yep, selling things to collectors is always a bad thing. We need to keep everything hoarded in one gigantic nuclear-safe bunker where only those who are arbitrarily deemed "WORTHY" can look at or touch them.

 

 

...and GOD HELP YOU if you didn't buy that game upmarket from a dealer of at least Toys 'R Us recognition or else it's not good enough either.

 

True, God help somebody paying a certain amount for something they want. Regardless of the amount. Wonder rules and I hope to some day make the trip over to his (eventual) Atari Museum. Bigger picture people, bigger picture!!

[Shantai]

My suggestion would be to make an alteration or deletion, that hopefully only you would notice (Or tanman or Wonder) and if a new one pops up matching your "alteration", can you say "Busted!"

 

 

like this?

 

 

 

ROFL!!!

 

 

 

[bojay1997]

Yep, selling things to collectors is always a bad thing. We need to keep everything hoarded in one gigantic nuclear-safe bunker where only those who are arbitrarily deemed "WORTHY" can look at or touch them.

 

 

...and GOD HELP YOU if you didn't buy that game upmarket from a dealer of at least Toys 'R Us recognition or else it's not good enough either.

 

Please explain to me what is good about this one game being sold for $31K? How is that going to help you or other collectors build your collections? I have no issue with a collector paying for and getting what they want, but I have a problem with people arguing that this is somehow good for collectors or anyone other than the seller and perhaps the buyer. Is it your belief that now your collection is somehow more valuable as a result of the publicity? The only potential upside I can see is that more copies pop up, but again, I'm not really sure who that benefits and I'm guessing the winning bidder of this auction is hoping that this doesn't happen.

 

Please explain to me what's wrong with expecting some kind of retailer chain of custody to help determine what an item is worth and whether or not it belongs in my collection? The fact is, unless you have unlimited financial resources and unlimited space, you simply can't collect everything. For me, collecting items that are in pristine shape which have nostalgia value to me makes sense. To others, it may not, but one of the criteria I use to determine what goes into my collection is that it has to be sold at retail or distributed by an established company (i.e. a company that has done some marketing, has ties to the professional video game industry, etc...). Air Raid fails that test and so it doesn't go into my collection. A number of other VCS games and games on other platforms don't go in either as a result of that requirement.

 

Let me be clear with you, there have been other items throughout the years that have sold for a premium where I think envy or jealousy has been a factor in the resulting discussion. I don't get the sense that this is the case here. I think people are just legitimately confused by the value of this item and don't really know how to square it with other rarer items which have sold for far less money over time. Sure, people arguing the box was a fake are just being ridiculous, but the rest of us who have some legitimate questions about the origin of this particular game are just trying to build a cohesive narrative for how we make decisions about the value of items we decide to purchase for our collections.

[Snider-man]

Some weirdos on Digital Press are still going on about it being a 'fake' box. Really.

 

Fixed that for ya. You were painting with a wide brush there, and you got a couple of folks to jump on your dogpile. The AA/DP rhetoric has ended, you know.

 

I now return you to your discussion of all things cardboard.

 

[Cebus Capucinis]

Please explain to me what is good about this one game being sold for $31K? How is that going to help you or other collectors build your collections? I have no issue with a collector paying for and getting what they want, but I have a problem with people arguing that this is somehow good for collectors or anyone other than the seller and perhaps the buyer. Is it your belief that now your collection is somehow more valuable as a result of the publicity? The only potential upside I can see is that more copies pop up, but again, I'm not really sure who that benefits and I'm guessing the winning bidder of this auction is hoping that this doesn't happen.

 

Please explain to me what's wrong with expecting some kind of retailer chain of custody to help determine what an item is worth and whether or not it belongs in my collection? The fact is, unless you have unlimited financial resources and unlimited space, you simply can't collect everything. For me, collecting items that are in pristine shape which have nostalgia value to me makes sense. To others, it may not, but one of the criteria I use to determine what goes into my collection is that it has to be sold at retail or distributed by an established company (i.e. a company that has done some marketing, has ties to the professional video game industry, etc...). Air Raid fails that test and so it doesn't go into my collection. A number of other VCS games and games on other platforms don't go in either as a result of that requirement.

 

Let me be clear with you, there have been other items throughout the years that have sold for a premium where I think envy or jealousy has been a factor in the resulting discussion. I don't get the sense that this is the case here. I think people are just legitimately confused by the value of this item and don't really know how to square it with other rarer items which have sold for far less money over time. Sure, people arguing the box was a fake are just being ridiculous, but the rest of us who have some legitimate questions about the origin of this particular game are just trying to build a cohesive narrative for how we make decisions about the value of items we decide to purchase for our collections.

 

Your problem is that you're implying that your system is somehow superior or better to someone else's, and as proven in this thread, you're arguing that point. You have a different system, that's great, but everyone has a different system. I only collect major cart label variations and box variations. That's my system. But you don't hear me crapping on a thread by arguing about how my system is somehow inherently better, more logical, etc.

 

The good thing about this game being sold is that it went to the most amazing, caring, and wonderful collector we have here. It is guaranteed to be taken good care of and may eventually end up in a museum. If someone wasn't willing to sell to others due to some arbitrary notion of what does or does not qualify as a "serious" collection, then this would never have happened. We as a community would never have a box. Tanman wouldn't have been willing to put it up for fear of "lesser quality".

 

That's the problem with attributing qualifiers to sales you're not involved in. That's great that you don't think that it's worth YOUR personal time, but you don't need to tell everyone else it isn't worth THEIR time, either. That's just egomaniacal and petty. With that I'm done pressing a point, because now it's turned into me questioning your system and this will just turn into Ouruburos eating its own tail.

[CPUWIZ]

Let's not get this thread derailed please, especially not turned into a big argument.

 

Thanks.

[high voltage]

 

 

Please explain to me what's wrong with expecting some kind of retailer chain of custody to help determine what an item is worth and whether or not it belongs in my collection? The fact is, unless you have unlimited financial resources and unlimited space, you simply can't collect everything. For me, collecting items that are in pristine shape which have nostalgia value to me makes sense. To others, it may not, but one of the criteria I use to determine what goes into my collection is that it has to be sold at retail or distributed by an established company (i.e. a company that has done some marketing, has ties to the professional video game industry, etc...). Air Raid fails that test and so it doesn't go into my collection. A number of other VCS games and games on other platforms don't go in either as a result of that requirement.

 

 

 

Now that is just silly talk, how do you know they wouldn't have done more marketing, become established, or had ties to the video game industry, or had games selling in retail? Have you not heard of the video game crash in 83? Those requirements, which can take some time, just didn't happen for them. Little sales obviously contributed to this fact.

 

Even Richard Garriott sold his first 20 or so games from his bedroom/garage/mail-order, and many other companies started off the same way. That's just the way it was. I bet you'll love to own an original Akalabeth: World of Doom in ziploc-bag. I know I would.

Edited April 15, 2010 by high voltage

[+Nathan Strum]

Let's not get this thread derailed please, especially not turned into a big argument.

 

Yeah... I just lost interest in this whole thing. It was fun while it lasted though.

Edited April 15, 2010 by Nathan Strum