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ianoid

eBay buyer feedback Anger

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I get more and more feedback anxiety from buyers. If I don't leave feedback for them, they start to harass me about it. I got this yesterday:

 

"This is a second reminder. Your item has been purchase close to month ago and received Purchase was paid within 15 minutes via PAYpAL. PLEASW ENTER YOUR FEEDBACK ABOUT THIS PURCHDEE.

THANKAS SOR HELP"

 

I get a message like this one above every month. It's one of the shortcomings of the severely broken feedback system. You'd think that a multi-billion dollar company would be replete with ideas to improve a system that is barely functional.

 

A year or two ago, I got a negative from a guy because of my policy to leave feedback once the buyer does. He said something about holding feedback for ransom. I posted about it here on AA.

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I still feel the same way that it is in some way holding feedback for randsom when a seller does not leave feedback after a buyer fulfills their obligation and pays promptly. A buyer bids then pays and a seller is responsible to ship carefully and promptly as well. Of course emergencies and bad things can happen but to be honest I don't know what more a buyer is responsible for or required to do in regards to that transaction. :?

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Agreed(with Chickybaby) - In my opinion, once a buyer has paid he/she is done and deserves +FB

 

A buyer can't be a bad buyer if they pay right away - right?

 

The rest of the transaction is on the seller...

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Agreed(with Chickybaby) - In my opinion, once a buyer has paid he/she is done and deserves +FB

 

A buyer can't be a bad buyer if they pay right away - right?

 

The rest of the transaction is on the seller...

Not always...a buyer can pay immediately via Pay Pal and you give them + feedback then receive the item and go on with some bullshit the game was not a describe, or it was damaged, or it never showed up, or it does not work... etc. Then they leave you a neg. It happens!

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But imo it's not a buyers fault if the item truly was damaged during shipping which would be on the post office/shipping service (or the seller if packaged improperly), not be as described which again would be on the seller, or not show up or not work, but imo none of that is the buyers fault. If the seller didn't use delivery confirmation or tracking of some sort and are dealing with an unknown buyer then it's their risk. I don't know why the buyer should be penalized or how withholding feedback as the seller in general would accomplish or resolve anything?

 

Though I'd like to add that I do understand if it's a high volume seller and they do everything themselves individually how things can get backed up quickly which is a different situation.

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But imo it's not a buyers fault if the item truly was damaged during shipping which would be on the post office/shipping service (or the seller if packaged improperly), not be as described which again would be on the seller, or not show up or not work, but imo none of that is the buyers fault. If the seller didn't use delivery confirmation or tracking of some sort and are dealing with an unknown buyer then it's their risk. I don't know why the buyer should be penalized or how withholding feedback as the seller in general would accomplish or resolve anything?

Oh , I agree it is not the buyers fault, but I was pointing out that there scam artists out there who actually make these false claims when there is nothing wrong with the product received :)

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Exactly. And for that reason I never leave feedback for buyers either until they leave feedback to show they are happy with the entire transaction...

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I get a feedback from a buyer and I leave a feedback for them positive on ebay. If no feedback is left for me after the package is confirmed delivered....I do not leave them feedback.. They have up to a month (I think) to pull a negative feedback on you just because they wanna be arses and thats crap. If the buyer waits til the last day to dispute the transaction and then you are not on line at the time...they can leave you negative and there is nothing you can do about it.

I have a feedback of only 50 but it's 100% positive. I like to keep in contact with the buyer and let them know I am there to fix and issues they may have, but I know if I am selling the item that is works and is in good shape....so there should be no hassles..but there will always be that one arsehole that wants to F everything up for ya....just cause they can at the last minute...

 

Don't even get me started on the Paypal funds being held garbage....(ship it fast with delivery cinfirmation and call paypal to have the holds removed for sure!)

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I always leave feedback first as a seller, it sucks ass and I am taking a huge risk but thats just the way it is. I have had to give an option of 100% refund (with return shipping included) a few times for stuff that wasn't my fault just so I don't get a negative, pretty lame but what can you do...

 

*Edit, I forgot sellers can't even leave a negative now so I guess it really doesn't matter anymore

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I always leave feedback first as a seller, it sucks ass and I am taking a huge risk but thats just the way it is. I have had to give an option of 100% refund (with return shipping included) a few times for stuff that wasn't my fault just so I don't get a negative, pretty lame but what can you do...

 

Not ebay, but my wife have jumped through hoops for a customer to get the neg FB removed. They changed the 1 of 5 star to 2 of 5. I have always advised her and everyone here. Never to respond to feedback extortion. The type of people that want something for the negative removed are not the people you would want to deal with. She had to learn the hard way.

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I don't see what the big deal is. I generally leave feedback for buyers when I ship the item. I am sure there are a few bad apples out there, but most buyers are just reasonable people looking complete a deal. I have not been burned yet, may happen but that is the chance you take selling stuff on eBay.

 

If you are that concerned about it, just look at the feedback that the buyer has left others and that the buyer has received, this will generally give you an idea of what to expect.

 

The real problem is eBay, but then there is not a really good alternative to it.

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Sellers can't even leave negative feedback anymore, so there's no point in trying to hold a buyer's feedback hostage anymore.

 

 

So let me buy yer spit...receive it..swap it with my broken spit..leave you negative feedspit...then get my money back and cost you to either (A) ship me another one or (B) give me back my money???

 

Not fair....just be a good seller and life should be good..stay away from Espit!

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I have been burnt one time too many by leaving + feedback for a buyer and then having them leave me a litany of paranoia-fueled negative commentary regarding my failure to fully disclose a scratch on the back of a Pitfall cartridge. I kid you not; this $1.99 sale cost me more time then it could ever possibly be worth and since that time I have never left feedback for a seller until I receive + feedback. So far, so good and I fully explain this on my about me page on eBay so it's out there from the beginning.

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My very first neg on eBay was in 1998. It was the 2nd feedback I ever got. I was from a wondrous eBay time when anyone could leave as many feedbacks as they liked for anyone for any reason. So Mr. Professional bidder, johnbutler, gave me a neg for out bidding him. eBay refused to remove it because it was against their policy to remove negatives and it is still there to this day. "Last minute bidder without guts." I leave it there as a badge of honor. ;) (not that I have a choice).

 

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?ff3=4&pub=5574883395&toolid=10001&campid=5336500554&customid=&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Ffeedback.ebay.com%2Fws%2FeBayISAPI.dll%3FViewFeedback2%26ftab%3DAllFeedback%26userid%3Darcadecollecting%26iid%3D-1%26de%3Doff%26items%3D200%26page%3D7

 

At least now he "no" is the way of eBay as professed in my 3rd feedback received on eBay. You're welcome for the tip, John. :D

 

Let's bring back the glory days!! :cool: :thumbsup:

Edited by djpubba

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As buyer and seller I understand BOTH sides of this. Since Ians post was more on the seller side I'm going to tilt that direction with this post.

 

Simply put if eBay were to do one thing that would improve everyones experience, it would be to REQUIRE mediation before any feedback other than positive can be left. In other words, even if it is automated, the buyer has to try and work issues out with the seller before hauling off and leaving a zinger. If you could trust that a buyer was willing to work with you, if an unforeseen mistake came up, then you wouldn't have to worry about leaving feedback first. eBay could automate the fact that a buyer paid, rather than feedback. It would just automatically state the item number, and time of payment.

 

Guys like myself, and Ian have been on eBay a long time. The mentality of sellers leaving it second comes from the old mindset brought on by the old feedback system (at least for me). The only thing keeping buyers honest back in the day was the concept of keeping their rating good. eBay assumes now, with the current protocol being "no negs for buyers," that all sellers who get a neg deserve it. Buyers would try and work problems out before, because if they left a bad feedback they knew it would result in an EXCHANGE of negatives. If they were not willing to try and communicate through the issue first there was a record of it. If someone asks me for feedback do I give it first? Yes... because of the situations Ian describes here. If they are crazy enough to neg you for not giving it, best to bend since the outcome will likely be better... rather than worse (improves odds). Otherwise, typically when + feedback is given to me, I use the mass feature to + everyone back, just because it saves time. It is time consuming on mass sales... not because I am just being withholding. As I said though, honestly the idea is in the back of my mind, BECAUSE it was the way it used to be. Feedback is useless for buyers anyway, they don't need it. After all, buyers all have 100% feedback from the first (this is eBay saying the buyer is always perfect). The only thing a score of less than 100% does, is prove that the person sells stuff.

 

A note to sellers: Check the feedback left on your bidders before dealing with them. Especially preventable sales on auctions and best offers that have not ended, where you can stop the bidder before they win your item. If they neg everyone under the sun there is a history. Also watch for those who say things like "came broken but got a refund" over and over. It may be best to block them rather than deal with them.

 

 

AX

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"This is a second reminder. Your item has been purchase close to month ago and received Purchase was paid within 15 minutes via PAYpAL. PLEASW ENTER YOUR FEEDBACK ABOUT THIS PURCHDEE.

THANKAS SOR HELP"

I can't blame the user for getting upset. If the tranaction was completed four weeks ago, why is there a hold-up with leavng feedback..? When I buy or sell, I leave feedback promptly (like two or three days). Making people wait needlessly for weeks strikes me as discourteous.

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A note to sellers: Check the feedback left on your bidders before dealing with them.

Seconded. This has got to be the single best advice one can give when dealing with nuts on eBay.

 

 

 

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Sorry Ian, you're a great seller and fine member of this community, but the "I'll only thank YOU once you've thanked ME" crap is one of the many reasons why Ebay changed the feedback system in favor of buyers. Once a buyer pays their part of the transaction is complete. If he paid within 15 minutes he should have gotten a positive within a few days but instead you chose to hold it as a bargaining chip.

Really if you think you're winning over customers with such a policy you're sadly mistaken. Many buyers pass right over sellers who do this (I do...always have, always will). If fact, you're losing customers and even admitted to getting negged over it. This one you mention will almost definitely not give you a positive, certainly will not be a repeat buyer.

You may have the second to last laugh thinking you're going to protect yourself from the once in a blue moon guy who scams you, (and having held his positive hostage would do nothing to stop that anyway) but in the end you're shooting yourself in the foot, and before long you'll have too few customers to stay afloat, and you'll have only yourself to blame. Not the customers. Not Ebay. You.

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Leaving feedback first kinda backfires if there's a problem. EBay sucks monkey balls anyways.

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Ive found most of the powersellers dont leave feedback - so Ive stopped as a buyer. When I pay promptly the seller should provide positive feedback. Too many times Ive given positive feedback and gotten nothing in return, so IMHO the ball is in the sellers court the start the process.

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Leaving feedback first kinda backfires if there's a problem.

 

How so? If a buyer is going to scam someone, do you really think they're going to change their mind if they don't have a pos. feedback? My guess is no.

Imagine if all for profit companies treated their customes like they're ALL scam artists, and they only thanked them for their business once the customer thanked them first for the awesome privilage of being THIER customer...

 

EBay sucks monkey balls anyways.

 

Agreed. But a good part of the reason it does it the users, not ebay itself imho.

If buyers (and sellers) didn't scam, sellers were courteous and remembered that buyers are customers, and people overall were more honest, it wouldn't be half as bad.

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Sellers can't even leave negative feedback anymore, so there's no point in trying to hold a buyer's feedback hostage anymore.

 

 

So let me buy yer spit...receive it..swap it with my broken spit..leave you negative feedspit...then get my money back and cost you to either (A) ship me another one or (B) give me back my money???

 

Not fair....just be a good seller and life should be good..stay away from Espit!

I don't accept once-in-a-blue-moon scenarios and paranoia as the justifications for playing feedback games. Not leaving feedback first wouldn't make any difference in that situation anyway.

 

Like I said, now that seller's have been stripped of their ability to extort feedback, this whole debate is moot. I really don't care what sellers do with their feedback anymore. Sellers lost their feedback privileges because they were abusing the system by engaging in precisely these sorts of shenanigans. Whatever their feelings about their current position, they have no one to blame for being there, but themselves.

 

EBay sucks monkey balls anyways.

 

Agreed. But a good part of the reason it does it the users, not ebay itself imho.

If buyers (and sellers) didn't scam, sellers were courteous and remembered that buyers are customers, and people overall were more honest, it wouldn't be half as bad.

I completely, yet respectfully, disagree. Ever since the changes to the feedback system were implemented, ebay has become a vastly better place to do business. What has it been, two years since the changes were made? And in that time I haven't experienced anything but positive buying and selling experiences.

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