Cheap cartridges for developers and gamers

[goatdan]

Would it be a problem to release the names of banned games ? That way, people would know if they shouldn't expect the game to work, or if it's a problem that should be reported.

 

I'll do just a quick reply to this, from the standpoint of GOAT Store Publishing since we're working on this next bunch...

 

I don't want to release the official list ever because we, both GSP and HarmlessLion, do not want to make it appear as if we are encouraging piracy in any way with these devices. In other words, if it was released commercially and legally, do not expect it to work on a SkunkBoard. The goal of this device (as well as any similar device) is not and / or should not be to allow Jaguar users to get a complete Jaguar collection for the cost of the device, it should be to help develop and play new software created by the amazing developers within the community on a stock Jaguar system.

 

If you want to make an assumption of what won't work, assume everything released won't work, and then if it magically does for you:

 

1) We're not encouraging it or happy that you chose to use your SkunkBoard in that way.

2) You got lucky with that choice.

 

Both Tursi and I have produced (hell, we worked together on Cool Herders) titles in the past and we know how important it is for intellectual copyright to be respected.

[coyo5050]

Two surprises that's what I get for not paying attention lately!

[busterm]

Two surprises that's what I get for not paying attention lately!

 

 

Shame on you... It cant be very comfortable under that rock

[Stone]

If you want to make an assumption of what won't work, assume everything released won't work, and then if it magically does for you:

 

1) We're not encouraging it or happy that you chose to use your SkunkBoard in that way.

2) You got lucky with that choice.

Can you define 'released'? I'm not trying to be argumentative here, just to understand how it works - I'm currently confused as one unreleased beta of a released game (Ultra Vortek) worked, while another unreleased beta of a released game (Fight For Life) didn't.

 

I haven't seen any of the promotional material for the Skunkboard beyond knowing it existed, but I'm sure I can't be alone in making the assumption that any form of programmable cartridge is just that, some rewritable memory in cartspace. As the Skunkboard is a programmable cartridge that accepts an upload of valid cart data, then inspects it and decides (based on a hidden list) whether or not to allow it to execute, for me it violated the principle of least surprise. That's my only point - please don't take it as a personal attack (I think I've spent enough money in the GOAT store to prove I'm not an 'orrible pirate! )

 

Out of curiosity, what will you do if a new game is developed and released for/on a Skunkboard, but then people share the binary without paying? Unless you have a way to individually update the revocation list of one specific cart based on what that user's paid for I can't think of an obvious way to allow legitimate users to play without allowing the same right to pirates...

 

Like I said, it doesn't affect me as I have a 4MB Alpine and a flashcart anyway, but I seriously considered buying a Skunkboard for the convenience of USB uploads, and if I hadn't known about this feature in advance I would have been very disappointed when I found out.

 

Stone

[sh3-rg]

This thread is for the Jagware flash cart really. The skunkboard is great but it has its own thread right next to this one I think the differences between the hardware have been fully explored so let's just keep this topic for news/discussion of the Jagware cart, cheers!Sorry if that read a bit xunty, it wasn't meant to be!

 

EDIT: xuntiness clarification

[mimo]

Sorry for mentioning the Skunk again, but what are the pros of buying a skunk apart from USB over buying one of these carts? (using it as a flash cart for gaming, not developing)

I ask as money is limited and I don't think I can afford both

[sh3-rg]

Sorry for mentioning the Skunk again, but what are the pros of buying a skunk apart from USB over buying one of these carts? (using it as a flash cart for gaming, not developing)

I ask as money is limited and I don't think I can afford both

 

I think that's a question for the skunk thread, not this one.

[Stone]

Oops, sorry It does look like a great idea though!

 

Stone

Edited September 29, 2010 by Stone

[viMaster]

If you want to make an assumption of what won't work, assume everything released won't work, and then if it magically does for you:

 

1) We're not encouraging it or happy that you chose to use your SkunkBoard in that way.

2) You got lucky with that choice.

Can you define 'released'? I'm not trying to be argumentative here, just to understand how it works - I'm currently confused as one unreleased beta of a released game (Ultra Vortek) worked, while another unreleased beta of a released game (Fight For Life) didn't.

 

I haven't seen any of the promotional material for the Skunkboard beyond knowing it existed, but I'm sure I can't be alone in making the assumption that any form of programmable cartridge is just that, some rewritable memory in cartspace. As the Skunkboard is a programmable cartridge that accepts an upload of valid cart data, then inspects it and decides (based on a hidden list) whether or not to allow it to execute, for me it violated the principle of least surprise. That's my only point - please don't take it as a personal attack (I think I've spent enough money in the GOAT store to prove I'm not an 'orrible pirate! )

 

Out of curiosity, what will you do if a new game is developed and released for/on a Skunkboard, but then people share the binary without paying? Unless you have a way to individually update the revocation list of one specific cart based on what that user's paid for I can't think of an obvious way to allow legitimate users to play without allowing the same right to pirates...

 

Like I said, it doesn't affect me as I have a 4MB Alpine and a flashcart anyway, but I seriously considered buying a Skunkboard for the convenience of USB uploads, and if I hadn't known about this feature in advance I would have been very disappointed when I found out.

 

Stone

Tursi pretty much answered your questions in his last post. Have a look there.

To answer your question about releasing a new game for the skunkboard, each skunk is serialized, so you can lock your game out to only that serial. That's how people wouldn't be able to pass it around without paying

[JagChris]

I assume you're talking about the Skunkboard ? It's a bit surprising ; the "ban list" has not been released, but I was under the impression that the only banned game was Battlesphere. It could be a false positive.

Yes, it was a Skunkboard. I didn't try Battlesphere on it but betas of AvP, Tiny Toons, Virtual VCS, Rayman etc all worked, and the pre-release, faster build of Fight For Life didn't. I didn't know about the ban list at all so I was very surprised! To me any amount of false positives is unacceptable because you have no way of knowing what it will allow and what it won't - so they lost themselves a customer in me. Luckily I can fall back to my Alpine but using USB would be much more convenient...

 

Stone

 

What was it, pre-release FFL? I'll try to track that down and run it on the Skunk for you and give you some step by step instructions.

 

Did you try Boz's GUI?

[sh3-rg]

I think that's a question for the skunk thread, not this one.

[Havok69]

OK, I'll be the stupid one - if I understand it correctly, a JBL cable is a parallel to Jag cable. Where would I get one, or better yet, is there a schematic to build one? And lastly, what does it stand for?

[GroovyBee]

OK, I'll be the stupid one - if I understand it correctly, a JBL cable is a parallel to Jag cable. Where would I get one, or better yet, is there a schematic to build one? And lastly, what does it stand for?

 

Everything you need to know about BJL and more here.

[Havok69]

Thanks - now I know it's a BJL...

 

(See I told you I was stupid!)

 

[Stone]

I wrote a BJL FAQ once (it was on Starcat's old site before it died). I'll dig a copy off my old PC later

 

Stone

[busterm]

Its not hard to build one. I actually built one using Wire solder glue when I ran out of solder doing my BJL Mod. Like this one:

 

No Solder Wire Solder:

eBay Auction -- Item Number: 230526917612

 

its worked so well Ive not remade it with real solder

[Stone]

For a real blast from the past you can now read it here, courtesy of a 2001 cache from the Wayback Machine

 

busterm: My first BJL cable was made of 30cm of bare wire with a shield made of tinfoil (earthed to the shell at one end using a blob of solder attached to a wire, with the other end soldered to the shell. The blob was stuck to the tinfoil with electrical tape.). I only made a proper one when I got fed up with the crinkling noises whenever I swapped carts

 

Stone

[busterm]

For a real blast from the past you can now read it here, courtesy of a 2001 cache from the Wayback Machine

 

busterm: My first BJL cable was made of 30cm of bare wire with a shield made of tinfoil (earthed to the shell at one end using a blob of solder attached to a wire, with the other end soldered to the shell. The blob was stuck to the tinfoil with electrical tape.). I only made a proper one when I got fed up with the crinkling noises whenever I swapped carts

 

Stone

 

 

HAHA thats pretty resourceful, the kind only a true Atari addict would achieve

[mimo]

Any updates on this project?

[carmel_andrews]

Quick Q...

 

Are there any upcoming games/demo's or programs that will be wriiten specifically for these devices like skunkboard/JagCF and the device mentioned in this thread

[Fadest]

Basically, Skunkboard and this flashcard are just cartridges that can be reflashed (like... existing Flash Card from Atari era - in fact, Skunkboard can be considered as successor to old flashcard for developers and this cartridge as a modern PCB for distribution, but both can achieve these tasks)...

 

Skunkboard has some differences, like ability to flash a 6mb game IIRC, and also USB ports, but as no driver exist for them right now (apart communication with host PC), they are useless until someone has skills and time to code a driver. On the other side, Skunkboard does not have EEprom for saves (correct me if I'm wrong).

 

For Jag CF, there should be specific games or demos, using extended features (more storage memory, more RAM, new specific DSP, new network...).

[Zerosquare]

carmel : it doesn't have any extra features that could be used by games compared to a standard cartridge.

 

Preppie : we've demoed a preliminary version of the cartridge at the RGC convention (in France) on Sunday. We're going to post a video soon

[Tursi]

Skunkboard has some differences, like ability to flash a 6mb game IIRC, and also USB ports, but as no driver exist for them right now (apart communication with host PC), they are useless until someone has skills and time to code a driver. On the other side, Skunkboard does not have EEprom for saves (correct me if I'm wrong).

 

Correct, also has the ability to run an 8MB game if written to take advantage of the bank switching (ie: would be Skunkboard specific, the 6MB size is standard however), has the ability to communicate with the PC over the USB connection at runtime (ie: not only to flash the cartridge). Skunkboard doesn't have an EEPROM but there are no known titles that fail to run due to this, and Skunkboard-specific software has 8MB of flash available to it, so doesn't really need 128 bytes of EEPROM. Of course, there is no Skunkboard-specific software that I am aware of. If someone wants to add support for it, the hardware is capable and, like the USB, just needs some software work. They can let me know if they want to work on it. Otherwise there's been no demand over the last few years.

[Fadest]

bank switching

My bad, I forgot about this ability

 

Concerning EEprom save, this was mainly in case of new software, but you are right, with bank switching, there is no need for an EEPROM. And USB to PC while running a game works well, as SebRMV demonstrated with his librairies and debugging features he added (of course, this could be used for other purposes)

[overridex]

Any updates on this?

 

-Dan