How to tell Atari 810 Drive Is OK ?

[AtariSociety]

Acquired some old Atari 8 bit equipment today. Included 2 Atari 810 drives. Both show power light, then busy light for a bit, then busy light goes off. I do hear some noise inside but not like my Atari 1050 sound like a motor turning or anything like that. I just here a couple sounds and then that sound goes away. Sticking a floppy inside I hear nothing turning or anything like that. Connect to a Atari 800 and sticking a Dos 2.5 diskette that I boot my 1050 with does not boot the Atari and I just get boot errors.

 

So, odd both do the same thing but maybe old 810s are mostly like this after sitting years and years.

 

Anyway, any recommendations of things to look for and what sounds I should be getting?

 

Where are the screws to remove so I can look inside these, blow off any dust, and see if the belts are OK.

 

Also, is there someone online here that repairs these Atari 810s? Please point me in their direction.

 

Let me know and thanks.

 

tj

Edited October 13, 2010 by macsociety

[Rybags]

A Boot Error is at least a sign that the logic board is working.

 

Just remember, it'll only work with 88K Single-Density formatted disks - put an ED or DD floppy in and it can't read it.

 

Best bet would be to boot up with 1050 as D1: and 810 as D2: then try doing some stuff like formatting, writing DOS files etc.

 

Screws are accessable from the top - 4 of them and they might have little plastic covers that you can just lever off with a small screwdriver.

Edited October 13, 2010 by Rybags

[sloopy]

the disk you are using is probly duel density (aka ED) which the 810 doesnt read (or write), in your 1050 boot DOS 2.5 and there is an option for Format Single, use that to format a disk, then write DOS files to it and then try booting that disk...

 

what you describe sound normal functioning, but to open it, thewre are screws under the 4 rubber feet in the four corners...

 

 

sloopy.

[AtariSociety]

the disk you are using is probly duel density (aka ED) which the 810 doesnt read (or write), in your 1050 boot DOS 2.5 and there is an option for Format Single, use that to format a disk, then write DOS files to it and then try booting that disk...

 

what you describe sound normal functioning, but to open it, thewre are screws under the 4 rubber feet in the four corners...

 

 

sloopy.

 

Should I here a disk turn inside when I insert a disk and shut the door?

 

With the 1050, when I turn it on with a disk inside, I hear some spinning at least from it. With the 810, just some "ggggrunnccchhhh", "grunchhhhh", like something and then nothing after that. For sure not the same type sound as the 1050.

 

As for formatting, I have not done any 8 bit Atari since early 1980s. hehehe. So, this will be a first for me. I will see if their are any booklets that show me how to format a disk and all that fun stuff.

 

tj

 

tj

[Rybags]

Memory a bit fuzzy here... my 810 doesn't work, but I don't think the 810 actually turns the disk like the 1050 does when inserted.

 

The main reason the 1050 needs to do that is so it can work out what density it's dealing with.

 

When using DOS 2.5, I'm fairly sure you just use the Format command as normal with the 810. Format Single is actually a seperate command that is specific to the 1050 drive.

[svenski]

Memory a bit fuzzy here... my 810 doesn't work, but I don't think the 810 actually turns the disk like the 1050 does when inserted.

 

The main reason the 1050 needs to do that is so it can work out what density it's dealing with.

 

When using DOS 2.5, I'm fairly sure you just use the Format command as normal with the 810. Format Single is actually a seperate command that is specific to the 1050 drive.

 

Well you got that slightly wrong. The format command in Dos 2.5 will check the type of drive you have connected so will, as you say, format correctly and automatically a single density disk if you are running an Atari 810. The Format Single command is not specific to the Atari 1050 - it is just an option to format in single density as using the format command, if you have a 1050 connected, will format the disk in enhanced density.

[sloopy]

the disk you are using is probly duel density (aka ED) which the 810 doesnt read (or write), in your 1050 boot DOS 2.5 and there is an option for Format Single, use that to format a disk, then write DOS files to it and then try booting that disk...

 

what you describe sound normal functioning, but to open it, thewre are screws under the 4 rubber feet in the four corners...

 

 

sloopy.

 

Should I here a disk turn inside when I insert a disk and shut the door?

 

With the 1050, when I turn it on with a disk inside, I hear some spinning at least from it. With the 810, just some "ggggrunnccchhhh", "grunchhhhh", like something and then nothing after that. For sure not the same type sound as the 1050.

 

As for formatting, I have not done any 8 bit Atari since early 1980s. hehehe. So, this will be a first for me. I will see if their are any booklets that show me how to format a disk and all that fun stuff.

 

tj

 

tj

 

 

there in the DOS 2.5 menu is 'Format Single' choice P, after it formats the disk use choice H to write DOS.SYS and DUP.SYS (DOS itself) to the disk...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/ca/Ataridos-2.5.PNG

 

and the format single command is there to format single density disks as the generic format command will format in ED, unless the drive cant handle ED then it will fall back to SD... (and no AtariDOS 2.5 does not support DD at all so it wont format DD even if the drive is capable of it...)

 

rybags, you da man, very knowledgable in the ways of the A8, but you dropped the ball on this one ;')

 

sloopy.

[Rybags]

Trust me - they are two distinctly seperate SIO commands.

 

It might be that DOS has the smarts to check the drive type first... like I said, my 810 doesn't work so I haven't used one of them in decades.

[+wood_jl]

To restate what [i believe] these guys are saying:

 

Hook up your 1050 that you know works. Go to DOS menu, insert a blank (or whatever you don't care about) disk. Use "FORMAT SINGLE" with the Atari DOS 2.5 - which I'm assuming you're using. Just "FORMAT" if you're using Atari DOS 2.0S. Then, "WRITE DOS FILES" to that disk. Then you have a formatted, single-density disk that the 810 can read, with DOS files that the Atari computer itself will be looking for to avoid the "boot error." Then swap the 1050 for the 810. You can even use the same power supply. Then put in that new single-density DOS disk you created with your 1050, and see if it boots up.

Edited October 13, 2010 by wood_jl

[AtariSociety]

To restate what [i believe] these guys are saying:

 

Hook up your 1050 that you know works. Go to DOS menu, insert a blank (or whatever you don't care about) disk. Use "FORMAT SINGLE" with the Atari DOS 2.5 - which I'm assuming you're using. Just "FORMAT" if you're using Atari DOS 2.0S. Then, "WRITE DOS FILES" to that disk. Then you have a formatted, single-density disk that the 810 can read, with DOS files that the Atari computer itself will be looking for to avoid the "boot error." Then swap the 1050 for the 810. You can even use the same power supply. Then put in that new single-density DOS disk you created with your 1050, and see if it boots up.

 

Nope, no luck on either. I get the 2 grunch noises and that is it. I formatted a DD disk to Single Density (I take it that is OK) and then it boots fine, the new single density DOS 2.5 disk that is on the 1050, remove the 1050 and replace with the 810 and she will not boot. Just 2 grunch noises and boot errors on the screen with periodid beep noises from the monitor, the type beeps I normally here on the monitor when the 1050 is booting to floppy, but just one beep on the 810, then boot error on screen, and keeps doing that.

 

I have a feeling the 810 motors are not spinning the disk at all?

 

Anyone repair these old 810s?

 

tj

[Rybags]

Good idea to take the top off, then you can see if stuff is moving.

 

While you're in there, it's probably overdue for a head-clean.

[AtariSociety]

Good idea to take the top off, then you can see if stuff is moving.

 

While you're in there, it's probably overdue for a head-clean.

 

I will do that but I think I need to send them off for service is my bet, if someone even repairs them anymore. I hate to throw stuff away. They are fairly clean units.

 

So, I will end with, anyone still service these old drives for a fair price?

 

tj

[+orpheuswaking]

Good idea to take the top off, then you can see if stuff is moving.

 

While you're in there, it's probably overdue for a head-clean.

 

I will do that but I think I need to send them off for service is my bet, if someone even repairs them anymore. I hate to throw stuff away. They are fairly clean units.

 

So, I will end with, anyone still service these old drives for a fair price?

 

tj

 

Try Sloopy here on the Forums

[sloopy]

open it up and see if the motor is atleast trying to turn the disk, the belt is probly toast, if the motor is turning and the belt has turned to goo or even crumbled to dust, it would be a problem... best bet would be to find a belt first, then see if that fixes the problem...

 

 

i live in NJ, and have the technical ability to fix them, its a matter of parts... i have two 810's in my spare parts bin, but i wont even consider testing the belts let alone give them away... but if you can find the belts (best or B&C maybe?) the rest i can fix... but considering shipping, may want to see if someone closer can look at them... (also i wouldnt consider looking at them until i have a working oscilloscope)

 

sloopy.

[AtariSociety]

open it up and see if the motor is atleast trying to turn the disk, the belt is probly toast, if the motor is turning and the belt has turned to goo or even crumbled to dust, it would be a problem... best bet would be to find a belt first, then see if that fixes the problem...

 

 

i live in NJ, and have the technical ability to fix them, its a matter of parts... i have two 810's in my spare parts bin, but i wont even consider testing the belts let alone give them away... but if you can find the belts (best or B&C maybe?) the rest i can fix... but considering shipping, may want to see if someone closer can look at them... (also i wouldnt consider looking at them until i have a working oscilloscope)

 

sloopy.

 

OK, will open them and see if the belts are still there or gone.

 

tj

[tep392]

open it up and see if the motor is atleast trying to turn the disk, the belt is probly toast, if the motor is turning and the belt has turned to goo or even crumbled to dust, it would be a problem... best bet would be to find a belt first, then see if that fixes the problem...

 

 

i live in NJ, and have the technical ability to fix them, its a matter of parts... i have two 810's in my spare parts bin, but i wont even consider testing the belts let alone give them away... but if you can find the belts (best or B&C maybe?) the rest i can fix... but considering shipping, may want to see if someone closer can look at them... (also i wouldnt consider looking at them until i have a working oscilloscope)

 

sloopy.

 

OK, will open them and see if the belts are still there or gone.

 

tj

 

I bought a belt from Best Electronics earlier in the year. Good change you can get one from them.

[+orpheuswaking]

One fix I would mention that worked for me (and this may have been a fluke)... After you check the belts, if they are good remove the screws holding on the logic board (the upright board) carefully ease it off of it's header and then firmly reseat it again. This fixed errors I was having with two out of four 810's

[+bob1200xl]

Where are you in Northern California? I am in Alameda and I have lots and lots of 810s - some of them even work.

 

Don't really have time to do a lot of fixing (in the middle of a massive inventory project) but I can get you a couple of drives, fix yours later.

 

Bob

 

 

Good idea to take the top off, then you can see if stuff is moving.

 

While you're in there, it's probably overdue for a head-clean.

 

I will do that but I think I need to send them off for service is my bet, if someone even repairs them anymore. I hate to throw stuff away. They are fairly clean units.

 

So, I will end with, anyone still service these old drives for a fair price?

 

tj

[+orpheuswaking]

Hey bob, I have only a miniscule fraction of what you must have and my inventory took me six months

[OldAtarian]

The head might be dirty. You'd be surprised the gunk that can accumulate on them. Some people might tell you not to do this, but I dip a q-tip (Johnson's baby bud for those outside the US) in some rubbing alcohol and wipe the head clean. The cotton will turn dark brown if it's really dirty, light brown if it's just a little bit dirty. That usually clears up any read errors that I get from my drives.

[BillC]

The head might be dirty. You'd be surprised the gunk that can accumulate on them. Some people might tell you not to do this, but I dip a q-tip (Johnson's baby bud for those outside the US) in some rubbing alcohol and wipe the head clean. The cotton will turn dark brown if it's really dirty, light brown if it's just a little bit dirty. That usually clears up any read errors that I get from my drives.

You shouldn't use rubbing alcohol, it contains 70% alcohol + oil and other additives which could damage floppy disks. You should use isopropyl alcohol(90 to 95%) instead, which is the primary ingredient in rubbing alcohol without most of the additives.

 

Bill

[AtariSociety]

Hi Bob, I am in Grass Valley. If the price is right, I get decent fuel mileage in my diesel Beetle so could drive there to make a swap. PM price for 1 or 2 drives please.

 

What I am finding folks, is I think both are missing the belt. Opened one this morning being careful, and to my amazement, I see no belt of any kind inside. I am not 100% sure where it should be but I would think it goes to that white spindle collar thing that locks over the big hole in the disk. I see no belt of any kind in that area.

 

So, my guess, is a belt would fix it but I am not sure how easy of a fix that would be plus I just want one that works, so Bob, if you have 1 or 2 clean ones that are not scratched up or yellowed, I am game to take a trip to Alameda on the weekend to buy 1 or 2 from you and exchange my 2 as cores.

 

I think Alameda is over near Concord area or Hercules or something? Been a while since I been there but you sound close enough for me to make a trip to do the deed.

 

Thanks

 

Thomas

 

Where are you in Northern California? I am in Alameda and I have lots and lots of 810s - some of them even work.

 

Don't really have time to do a lot of fixing (in the middle of a massive inventory project) but I can get you a couple of drives, fix yours later.

 

Bob

 

 

Good idea to take the top off, then you can see if stuff is moving.

 

While you're in there, it's probably overdue for a head-clean.

 

I will do that but I think I need to send them off for service is my bet, if someone even repairs them anymore. I hate to throw stuff away. They are fairly clean units.

 

So, I will end with, anyone still service these old drives for a fair price?

 

tj

[Rybags]

The belt goes around a small spindle on the drive motor, and the flywheel which is attached at to the drive spindle by a shaft.

 

The motor is towards the back corner of the drive mech, obscured by a circuit board.

 

The belt is barely visible, you'd probably need to move the head backwards a bit to see it (the belt is actually right down the bottom of the drive mech.

 

You might hear the motor turn if you turn the shiny spindle below the plastic one that holds the disk. Turning the plastic spindle that holds the disk shouldn't do anything, it seems to run on a freewheel mechanism.

Edited October 13, 2010 by Rybags

[OldAtarian]

The head might be dirty. You'd be surprised the gunk that can accumulate on them. Some people might tell you not to do this, but I dip a q-tip (Johnson's baby bud for those outside the US) in some rubbing alcohol and wipe the head clean. The cotton will turn dark brown if it's really dirty, light brown if it's just a little bit dirty. That usually clears up any read errors that I get from my drives.

You shouldn't use rubbing alcohol, it contains 70% alcohol + oil and other additives which could damage floppy disks. You should use isopropyl alcohol(90 to 95%) instead, which is the primary ingredient in rubbing alcohol without most of the additives.

 

Bill

 

I thought they were the same thing. Anyway, the bottles in my medicine chest are all isopropyl alcohol and always have been to my recollection, so use that instead.

 

Is surgical spirit (for those in the UK) the same thing as isopropyl alcohol? Would acetone be safe for cleaning the head?

Edited October 14, 2010 by OldAtarian

[BillC]

 

Is surgical spirit (for those in the UK) the same thing as isopropyl alcohol? Would acetone be safe for cleaning the head?

 

DO NOT USE ACETONE, it will damage any plastic parts it comes in contact with, and the heads are normally mounted on a plastic assembly.

 

Bill