7800 crashes on certain games

[ApolloBoy]

I seem to be having this weird issue with my 7800 where a couple of games (Food Fight and Pole Position II) crash in the middle of the game. Both of these games have been cleaned and they work fine on my brother's 7800, so that isn't really an issue. I'm aware that certain 7800s have this issue, and I'd like to know what I can do to fix this.

[HammR25]

Does your brother have a copy of either of those games you can test?

[ApolloBoy]

Does your brother have a copy of either of those games you can test?

He doesn't, but I'm not sure if that would be the issue considering my copies worked perfectly fine on his 7800. I know this is a known issue with certain 7800s, I just didn't think mine would be one of them.

[gdement]

Just a shot in the dark, but I wonder if replacing the capacitors would do any good. The 2200uF cap is on the 9-10v input from the PSU, and the 220uF caps stabilize the 5v output all the chips run from.

I've had a bad cap in 2 out of 3 7800's, though 1 of them was not visibly obvious, it tested open after I removed it.

[ApolloBoy]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

[AtariLeaf]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

 

I don't know about PP II but Food Fight is known to crash on certain revisions of the 7800 board. See the 7800 FAQ

[ApolloBoy]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

 

I don't know about PP II but Food Fight is known to crash on certain revisions of the 7800 board. See the 7800 FAQ

I seem to have a bizarre system then as Decathlon and Food Fight don't work but Robot Tank does. PP II is working fine for some reason though.

Edited August 15, 2011 by ApolloBoy

[AtariLeaf]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

 

I don't know about PP II but Food Fight is known to crash on certain revisions of the 7800 board. See the 7800 FAQ

I seem to have a bizarre system then as Decathlon and Food Fight don't work but Robot Tank does. PP II is working fine for some reason though.

 

From a cursory look at the FAQ, you may have deck 3 which is - 3 A1 77 5951337 Taiwan Hole/no pins 002 REV A 87-17

 

It lists Food Fight as locking and Decathalon a no go at all.

[ApolloBoy]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

 

I don't know about PP II but Food Fight is known to crash on certain revisions of the 7800 board. See the 7800 FAQ

I seem to have a bizarre system then as Decathlon and Food Fight don't work but Robot Tank does. PP II is working fine for some reason though.

 

From a cursory look at the FAQ, you may have deck 3 which is - 3 A1 77 5951337 Taiwan Hole/no pins 002 REV A 87-17

 

It lists Food Fight as locking and Decathalon a no go at all.

I have a Chinese-made 7800 that was manufactured around mid-1990, so it doesn't correspond with the list. Also, console 3 on the list doesn't work with Robot Tank but mine does.

[gdement]

Thought I'd bump this since I managed to replace at least a couple of caps when I modded my 7800 last week. I replaced the 2200uF cap near the power supply jack and the 220uF cap in the center of the motherboard. Food Fight still crashes and I'm pretty sure PP II will still crash even though I haven't tested it yet. Would replacing the remaining original cap help or is there something else afoot?

If the remaining 220uF happens to be open then it might help, but at this point it looks increasingly unlikely that this is the problem. The 220uF caps are in parallel so they can cover for each other to some extent.

Most likely something else is wrong.

[ApolloBoy]

Just wanted to bump this as I never really found a solution for this problem. I'm also having an issue with Ballblazer as it'll sometimes work and sometimes it'll crash at random. I also had this problem with my brother's 7800 after it was AV modded (which was my original 7800) and this just has me flabbergasted. My system has since been totally recapped and all of my games are squeaky clean.

Edited May 2, 2013 by ApolloBoy

[Classic Pac]

A few years back when I got a copy of Kung Fu Master and 2 7800s it would work on but not the other.

[the.golden.ax]

Time it or record it. I may narrow this down if it's at the same point each time, or variable.

[ApolloBoy]

I've been playing my 7800 recently and I noticed that the random crashes seem to have stopped. However, I still can't fix the problem with Ballblazer on my brother's system, I've reflowed the solder joints for the cart slot, recapped the system and even redid the AV mod on it. Still nothing.

[ApolloBoy]

I wanted to bump this as I've been having issues with my 7800 again, this time with Alien Brigade. It starts glitching up after I use the radio on the first stage, and then the game crashes after 10 seconds or so. The game is clean as can be as is the cartridge slot, and what's really strange is that it works perfectly fine on my brother's 7800. Really don't know what to think now aside from getting a replacement 7800.

[Lynxpro]

I wanted to bump this as I've been having issues with my 7800 again, this time with Alien Brigade. It starts glitching up after I use the radio on the first stage, and then the game crashes after 10 seconds or so. The game is clean as can be as is the cartridge slot, and what's really strange is that it works perfectly fine on my brother's 7800. Really don't know what to think now aside from getting a replacement 7800.

 

Since you are in San Jose, ApolloBoy, I hope you'll be attending the Sunnyvale Atari Party on 6/14. Impressive hardware list you have!

[BigO]

Grasping at straws, but:

 

Does Alien Brigade consistently fail in the described pattern? If so, you might try changing things like temperature to see what, if anything, makes the behavior change. Open up the case and point a running fan at the circuit board and play the same pattern again. If it's a heat failure, it might change under these conditions.

 

Until it started sounding so inconsistent, I was wondering if it might be a problem with memory that only manifested when a certain address was hit. Some utility cart with a memory test would prove that out.

 

Might need to reflow some solder joint you didn't hit yet.

Edited May 24, 2014 by BigO

[ApolloBoy]

Since you are in San Jose, ApolloBoy, I hope you'll be attending the Sunnyvale Atari Party on 6/14. Impressive hardware list you have!

Didn't know about that, I just went and signed up as a volunteer.

 

Anyway, for whatever reason Alien Brigade seems to be working fine now *shrugs*

[Lynxpro]

Didn't know about that, I just went and signed up as a volunteer.

 

Anyway, for whatever reason Alien Brigade seems to be working fine now *shrugs*

 

Thanks, ApolloBoy. By chance, are you one of the people who paid for an XM?

[ApolloBoy]

Thanks, ApolloBoy. By chance, are you one of the people who paid for an XM?

I did (or rather my dad did since it was supposed to be an Xmas gift) but obviously I'm still waiting on that.

[Lynxpro]

I did (or rather my dad did since it was supposed to be an Xmas gift) but obviously I'm still waiting on that.

 

The reason why I mentioned it is because it's supposed to ship in early June [2014].

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Just wanted to mention that I have 3 different model 7800s. My original 7800 that was purchased new back in '88 is a factory rework or (Refurbished) model that was sold new at K-Bee for 59.99. It is 100% compatible with everything I've thrown at it with the exception of CPUwiz's Multicart #1 where the menu is visibly glitched like crazy and Xevious and Choplifter are both not playable. However, I wonder if the fact that 7800 is modded with the DevOS 1.0 mod is the cause of the menu glitching?

 

My second 7800 I install the LHE av mod on is also 100% compatible but is a later model 7800 and show the menu from the multicart just fine but again Xevious and Choplifter don't work.

 

The third one is odd. I haven't tested it fully but it must be a late revision 7800. I had to replace the 201 on it to fix the power on/off issue it had when I picked it up. It seems to play all my 7800 games fine but doesn't play 7800 Ballblazer. I get the atari rainbow bios screen and then it just goes black, yet the ballblazer cart plays fine on the other 2. So who knows. It really seems to be a crap shoot on 7800s on whether you will get a truly problem free deck or not that can play everything.

[Trebor]

However, I wonder if the fact that 7800 is modded with the DevOS 1.0 mod is the cause of the menu glitching?

 

Same results with an NTSC console modded with a EuroOS...The menu glitch was addressed and ensured fixed for future multi-cart volumes Some of Vol. 1 Multi-carts having a couple of issues was primarily the result of bad/faulty batch of EPROMs. A hotter commodity if you ask me.

 

Speaking of hot, I think someone must have been holding a hairdryer or something against those EPROMs that went faulty. Think of it as the 7800 version of Domino Pizza's Noid.

 

We could even be seeing the work of a ShatNoid (...Oh, Benny...)

 

 

It really seems to be a crap shoot on 7800s on whether you will get a truly problem free deck or not that can play everything.

 

Indeed. However, older models (EP, AT84, AT85, some A1's) seem to have less issues than newer ones (Other A1's, A3, X) usually.

 

An easier to remember 'general rule of thumb' is having an Expansion Interface increases the odds of less problems (This (may) include variances with video related/mod results) from what I've read and experienced; but no guarantees.

 

Regardless, truth is the majority of 7800's will play and perform just fine with the entire 7800 library. A handful of 2600 games may have issues. Granted though, these consoles do have 25-30+ years components where some things might just be failing due to time, or have worse/better wear than others depending upon the condition the console was under and treated through the years.

[CPUWIZ]

Speaking of hot, I think someone must have been holding a hairdryer or something against those EPROMs that went faulty. Think of it as the 7800 version of Domino Pizza's Noid.

 

 

And yes, bad EPROM's and the menu glitch has since been fixed. I bought high quality EPROM's for Bob's multicart, those will not have a random ebay seller issue. I got them from a distributor in Silicon Valley, they do this for a living. I programmed all of Bob's EPROM's already and I had zero failures, every single EPROM is from the same manufacturer, which is a plus. Cost a little more, but I don't want any more issues, so it's worth it.

[Trebor]

I bought high quality EPROM's for Bob's multicart, those will not have a random ebay seller issue. I got them from a distributor in Silicon Valley, they do this for a living. I programmed all of Bob's EPROM's already and I had zero failures, every single EPROM is from the same manufacturer, which is a plus. Cost a little more, but I don't want any more issues, so it's worth it.

 

And the labors of love continues...Can't thank you enough, WIZ!