Arkhan Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I see a lot of YouTube videos of people reviewing games... and when the person goes "YEAH, THIS GAME HAS SOME PRETTY NICE OLDSCHOOL MIDI TUNES", I immediately want to reach into the screen and punch them. Does anyone else get really annoyed about that? Its like they're trying to sound all super hip and technically informed, but end up sounding like morons when they do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raskar42 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 i know - this makes me so Midi at them.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 You're so MIDI... You probably think this song is about you You're so MIDI! The word MIDI has been so abused throughout the years that some consumer electronic manufacturers even called their mini-systems 'midi-systems'. No kidding. I sold 'em when I worked at Sears. <sigh> 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhan Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 It would be really awesome if the NES for example output MIDI natively. Imagine some of those games with an MT-32 hooked up, lol. but seriously, just because its not real instruments doesnt instantly = MIDI. People are so dumb, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 It would be really awesome if the NES for example output MIDI natively. Imagine some of those games with an MT-32 hooked up, lol. Closest thing you're going to come to that is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_Piano_Teaching_System ...although I wonder if you could hook other MIDI keyboards to it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhan Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 It would be really awesome if the NES for example output MIDI natively. Imagine some of those games with an MT-32 hooked up, lol. Closest thing you're going to come to that is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_Piano_Teaching_System ...although I wonder if you could hook other MIDI keyboards to it... Probably, not that it would really accomplish much. There are new MIDI carts for systems at least. But officially, not so much. If Contra output MIDI, man thatd rule...! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 People are so dumb, lol You answered your own question! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblenkle Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Ooohh!! I have one of those. You can hook it up via a regular midi connector or to your NES with provided cable and cartridge. It would be really awesome if the NES for example output MIDI natively. Imagine some of those games with an MT-32 hooked up, lol. Closest thing you're going to come to that is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_Piano_Teaching_System ...although I wonder if you could hook other MIDI keyboards to it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tr3vor Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 MIDI is like the music from sim city 2000, right? I hate thate fake instrqment sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatta Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 That's too bad. MIDI is awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 MIDI is like the music from sim city 2000, right? I hate thate fake instrqment sound. When it's done right (right programming, right hardware, etc.), it's awesome. Listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bO6Jappcl30&feature=player_embedded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psquare75 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Wow. My Ultima V NEVER sounded like that . stupid Tandy 1000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Wow. My Ultima V NEVER sounded like that . stupid Tandy 1000. To be fair, the Passport wavetable MIDI card used in that demonstration was probably out of reach for the pocket book of most people. Hell, it sounds far better than dual Mockingboards and those were impressive (and expensive) for the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Dart Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 To answer the question, it's probably because the method used in old games is so MIDI-like. This description of MIDI from wikipedia applies to actual MIDI and old games alike: MIDI does not transmit an audio signal — it sends event messages about pitch and intensity, control signals for parameters such as volume, vibrato and panning, cues, and clock signals to set the tempo. While old games aren't specifically MIDI-compliant, they're sure MIDI-like. Now please, tell me all about how wrong I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Video Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 What's wrong with Simcity's music on the SNES? At least it had some (the metropolis music I think was my favorite) I liked Populous them the most on that system though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhan Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 MIDI is like the music from sim city 2000, right? I hate thate fake instrqment sound. When it's done right (right programming, right hardware, etc.), it's awesome. Listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bO6Jappcl30&feature=player_embedded Yeah, I like using an MT-32 for old DOS games w/ MIDI support. MAN do they sound badass that way. Ultima VI w/o a MT-32 is laaaame. To answer the question, it's probably because the method used in old games is so MIDI-like. This description of MIDI from wikipedia applies to actual MIDI and old games alike: MIDI does not transmit an audio signal — it sends event messages about pitch and intensity, control signals for parameters such as volume, vibrato and panning, cues, and clock signals to set the tempo. While old games aren't specifically MIDI-compliant, they're sure MIDI-like. Now please, tell me all about how wrong I am The average youtube tard doesn't know HOW they are implementing sound. They just hear old beepybloops and farty FM music and go OH ITS MIDI CAUSE ITS LIKE WHAT .MIDS ARE WHEN I GET THEM FROM GOGGLE.COM. As far as being MIDI like, ANYTHING thats producing sound that isn't MIDI compliant can be said to be MIDI-like due to it using code to generate sound events. The point of MIDI is to unify how things are doing it so everything can talk to/control everything. Stuff like the NES games, yeah theyre using various bytecodes, etc, to do the music and sfx. There are volume/pitch/effect events, and all sorts of things. They can be said to be MIDI like in that regard, but.. they're developer specific. It's fairly likely that one developers music/sound code, won't really play nice if they give it to another developer.... that's where MIDI would be nice. The PC Engine uses a nice BIOS setup that has an entire sound library built it that expects various opcodes to go in and generate music/sfx. I like it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Because I am terrible at explaining things like this and to go hand-in-hand with the above post, here's an explanation of MIDI straight from the Wikipedia page: "MIDI (Musical Instrument Digital Interface), pronounced /ˈmɪdi/, is an industry-standard protocol that enables electronic musical instruments (synthesizers, drum machines), computers and other electronic equipment (MIDI controllers, sound cards, samplers) to communicate and synchronize with each other. Unlike analog devices, MIDI does not transmit an audio signal — it sends event messages about pitch and intensity, control signals for parameters such as volume, vibrato and panning, cues, and clock signals to set the tempo. As an electronic protocol, it is notable for its widespread adoption throughout the music industry. MIDI protocol was defined in 1982.[1] Note names and MIDI note numbers.All MIDI-compatible controllers, musical instruments, and MIDI-compatible software follow the same MIDI 1.0 specification, and thus interpret any given MIDI message the same way, and so can communicate with and understand each other. MIDI composition and arrangement takes advantage of MIDI 1.0 and General MIDI (GM) technology to allow musical data files to be shared among many different devices due to some incompatibility with various electronic instruments by using a standard, portable set of commands and parameters. Because the music is stored as instructions rather than recorded audio waveforms, the data size of the files is quite small by comparison. Individual MIDI files can be traced through their own individual key code[citation needed]. This key code was established in early 1994 to combat piracy within the sharing of .mid files[citation needed]." Read the rest here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psquare75 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I remember back in my AOL 3.0 days.. It was fun to download MIDI files from the AOL download directory. Even they took a minute or so. When I first learned what an MP3 was I said to myself "No one is going to wait 10 minutes to download a song". Man how times changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbd30 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 The Cinco MIDI Organizer is a must if you have a lot of midi files. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 (edited) I see a lot of YouTube videos of people reviewing games... and when the person goes "YEAH, THIS GAME HAS SOME PRETTY NICE OLDSCHOOL MIDI TUNES", I immediately want to reach into the screen and punch them. Does anyone else get really annoyed about that? Its like they're trying to sound all super hip and technically informed, but end up sounding like morons when they do it. Something to keep in mind is that some older video game systems (and computer systems) used the same sound chip as many synths back in the day. Like Austin stated, midi is nothing more than a protocol. What I don't like is when people refer to midi as if it isn't used anymore and that somehow it only sounds like the stuff from the 80's. Don't get me wrong, like love the 80's, but midi has come a long way since then. Just look at electronic drumming for instants (I happen to run an edrumming forum site DMdrummer.com). These aren't the old Simmons hexagon drums that some of you guys might remember from the 80's. All of these new drum sets work on a base of midi. Back to video gaming. I seem to remember an article back in the day about video game music being done with midi for the SEGA genesis. I don't know for sure but I believe most genesis game music was written in midi and just imported in to the game code. I'm not a hardware or software guy so I might be way off here. Edited January 7, 2011 by pboland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 Something to keep in mind is that some older video game systems (and computer systems) used the same sound chip as many synths back in the day. No they dont...the only case that this is true that I can think of is FM chips like in the MSX, Genesis, etc... Similar, or the same FM chips were used in Yamaha synths. The NES, Master system, PC Engine, MSX w/o FM, Coleco, Atari, and all of that, they have their own sound chips that aren't in synths and are all very unique.... the C64 too, but it is the most sophisticated synth chip of the era, and has been built into an actual synth. The leads and bass of the SID are standard analog synth caliber stuff. Moogs and Rolands can bust those sounds out no problem. They're unique to the retrogaming area, but commonplace in the land of synths. Some of these chips were developed before MIDI was a standard, and came into being about the same time, making it basically impossible for them to be using MIDI. Back to video gaming. I seem to remember an article back in the day about video game music being done with midi for the SEGA genesis. I don't know for sure but I believe most genesis game music was written in midi and just imported in to the game code. I'm not a hardware or software guy so I might be way off here. I generate MIDI files and convert them to MML (Music Macro Language) for PC Engine music. I use MIDI every day with my musical equipment. MIDI can even be used to control lighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Something to keep in mind is that some older video game systems (and computer systems) used the same sound chip as many synths back in the day. No they dont...the only case that this is true that I can think of is FM chips like in the MSX, Genesis, etc... Similar, or the same FM chips were used in Yamaha synths. The NES, Master system, PC Engine, MSX w/o FM, Coleco, Atari, and all of that, they have their own sound chips that aren't in synths and are all very unique.... the C64 too, but it is the most sophisticated synth chip of the era, and has been built into an actual synth. The leads and bass of the SID are standard analog synth caliber stuff. Moogs and Rolands can bust those sounds out no problem. They're unique to the retrogaming area, but commonplace in the land of synths. Some of these chips were developed before MIDI was a standard, and came into being about the same time, making it basically impossible for them to be using MIDI. I was referring to the Genesis and to a lesser extent the SNES and Amiga computers (honesty however I don't know for sure with the SNES and Amiga) Hence my reference later to the Genesis. Sorry about that. I should have been clearer about the word "older". Back to video gaming. I seem to remember an article back in the day about video game music being done with midi for the SEGA genesis. I don't know for sure but I believe most genesis game music was written in midi and just imported in to the game code. I'm not a hardware or software guy so I might be way off here. I generate MIDI files and convert them to MML (Music Macro Language) for PC Engine music. I use MIDI every day with my musical equipment. MIDI can even be used to control lighting. I use MIDI everyday as well (mostly channel 10 stuff ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 I was referring to the Genesis and to a lesser extent the SNES and Amiga computers (honesty however I don't know for sure with the SNES and Amiga) Hence my reference later to the Genesis. Sorry about that. I should have been clearer about the word "older". Ah, yeah the SNES and Amiga both use sample based synthesis, and thankfully Paula (Amiga) was never in a synth because that chip sucks. Its 4 channel sampled, with hard L/R panning. Total crap. I don't know why everyones all ooo-ahhh over that nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Ah, yeah the SNES and Amiga both use sample based synthesis, and thankfully Paula (Amiga) was never in a synth because that chip sucks. Its 4 channel sampled, with hard L/R panning. Total crap. I don't know why everyones all ooo-ahhh over that nonsense. For onboard sound, the Amiga chipset was superb. Perhaps you need to listen again to what was done with sound on the Amiga, say with something like the Blood Money intro or any of the dozens of other top notch examples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_1 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 For whatever reason, I just can't get much into any MIDI music. I'm a sucker for FM Synthesis, which is what many old PC sound cards(early SoundBlasters, for instance), the Genesis, numerous arcade games and Yamaha keyboards use. I really don't get why people always say music not made with real instruments is MIDI. You can get synthesized music not just with MIDI, but also with PSG(used by the NES, in particular), FM Synthesis and WSG(stands for Waveform Sound Generator, commonly used on some Namco arcade boards). By the way, isn't the Super NES' sound chip ADPCM-based? Does it work like MIDI on PC sound cards with predefined instrument sets or are the samples made by the game's developer and stored in the game's ROM? That's one thing I've always wondered about with the Super NES' sound chip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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