NIAD Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 (edited) Just wanted to pass along to all the AtariAge members, who didn't have the opportunity to see the game demoed at CGE '99 by the Blue Sky Rangers, some pics as well as two short videos of this infamous game. From what little there is to see, it looks like it might be a very good game with some superb graphics and gameplay... in fact the flying ship portion of the game is reminiscient of Moon Patrol with it's parallax scrolling and multiple directions in which to fire. This is just another sampling of what the "Coleco Museum", that Retroillucid and I are assembling, will feature. Masters of the Universe - The Power of He-Man - Videos.zip Edited May 15, 2011 by NIAD 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcoleco Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Are you kidding me? I've tried more than once to get that kind of proof for the second part of my series of videos "Unreleased Coleco Stuff"... this and about other things like a proof about the "Coleco Voice" module. How did you get this? Anyway, Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 Are you kidding me? I've tried more than once to get that kind of proof for the second part of my series of videos "Unreleased Coleco Stuff"... this and about other things like a proof about the "Coleco Voice" module. How did you get this? Anyway, Thanks! Ah shucks! But seriously, it just took a little luck to stumble upon an old CGE web page covering the 1999 event. Since I've teamed up with J-F on the "Coleco Museum", I've been paying a lot closer attention to things for a change. I did have the title screen pic for sometime now, but never knew for sure if it was just a mock-up done by someone. Now if only Blue Sky Rangers could get the approval, by the holders of the He-Man franchise, to finally make a release on cart and/or just make the rom available as well as Master of the Universe II. Kind of hard o believe that a small release of around 100 carts for the ColecoVision would cause any harm to the He-Man franchise (that's what I've heard is the hold-up) especially since the game looks pretty dam good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcoleco Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Now if only Blue Sky Rangers could get the approval, by the holders of the He-Man franchise, to finally make a release on cart and/or just make the rom available as well as Master of the Universe II. Kind of hard o believe that a small release of around 100 carts for the ColecoVision would cause any harm to the He-Man franchise (that's what I've heard is the hold-up) especially since the game looks pretty dam good. Well, what I've heard... BSR already asked Mattel and the answer they got back then was something like $5000 (probably more) for the royalties per He-Man game... So, no way to release any CV He-Man as public domain. And making cartridges might be a too big risk considering that they will have to get a pre-order for about 100 copies from people that will pay about $110 each ($50 royalties + $30 cartridge + $15 fancy box + $10 shipping + $5 just in case)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Ah, that game... or should I say: That Damn Game! Seriously, If you ask me, what could Mattel could do with let's say 5K or 10K for this game!?? Anyway, I think Blue Sky Rangers could just spread the rom file around the net free, so people could at least play this forgotten gem Well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSchoolRetroGamer Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Maybe someone could "accidentally" leak a ROM for it, once it's out there........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youki Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Arrghh... why the video are so short?!!!!! :sad: :sad: That game looks awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 (edited) Maybe someone could "accidentally" leak a ROM for it, once it's out there........... This is one game/rom file that you won't see "accidentally" leaked. The VERY FEW people that do have the rom file have had it for over 10 years (at least) and obtained it with instructions not to give it to anyone else due to the whole situation with Mattel. I give them a lot of credit for staying true to their word even though it really is a shame for all the ColecoVision and He-Man enthuisiasts out there that will probably never be able to enjoy the game. Edited May 15, 2011 by NIAD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 Well, what I've heard... BSR already asked Mattel and the answer they got back then was something like $5000 (probably more) for the royalties per He-Man game... So, no way to release any CV He-Man as public domain. And making cartridges might be a too big risk considering that they will have to get a pre-order for about 100 copies from people that will pay about $110 each ($50 royalties + $30 cartridge + $15 fancy box + $10 shipping + $5 just in case)? When you break the pricing down like that, I think they could easily get 100 pre-orders for a professionally produced release like what was done with SteamRoller that should also include some kind of historical faq about the game and what it took to finally get it released. I would even be willing to pay even more than the $110 figure you guesstimated as I am sure many others would! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelboy Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Well, what I've heard... BSR already asked Mattel and the answer they got back then was something like $5000 (probably more) for the royalties per He-Man game... So, no way to release any CV He-Man as public domain. And making cartridges might be a too big risk considering that they will have to get a pre-order for about 100 copies from people that will pay about $110 each ($50 royalties + $30 cartridge + $15 fancy box + $10 shipping + $5 just in case)? When you break the pricing down like that, I think they could easily get 100 pre-orders for a professionally produced release like what was done with SteamRoller that should also include some kind of historical faq about the game and what it took to finally get it released. I would even be willing to pay even more than the $110 figure you guesstimated as I am sure many others would! If I could manage to get a good image for the box art for free (can't be that hard with all the He-Man memorabilia out there) my rough breakdown for 100 copies would be as follows: 50.00$ for royalties 8.50$ for the cartridge (electronics + assembly + casing + label) 5.00$ for the manual (PDF preparation fees + printing on glossy paper) 10.00$ for the box (PDF preparation fees + printing on cardboard) TOTAL: 73.50$ More expensive than my usual releases, but not too bad for a "holy grail" game. However, at that price, the game would have to be playable and 100% complete, not just a demo or an unfinished prototype. Has the He-Man ROM been confirmed to be complete game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youki Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 If I could manage to get a good image for the box art for free (can't be that hard with all the He-Man memorabilia out there) my rough breakdown for 100 copies would be as follows: 50.00$ for royalties 8.50$ for the cartridge (electronics + assembly + casing + label) 5.00$ for the manual (PDF preparation fees + printing on glossy paper) 10.00$ for the box (PDF preparation fees + printing on cardboard) TOTAL: 73.50$ More expensive than my usual releases, but not too bad for a "holy grail" game. However, at that price, the game would have to be playable and 100% complete, not just a demo or an unfinished prototype. Has the He-Man ROM been confirmed to be complete game? For 50.00$ of royalties per cartridge , i can make the game for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Well, what I've heard... BSR already asked Mattel and the answer they got back then was something like $5000 (probably more) for the royalties per He-Man game... So, no way to release any CV He-Man as public domain. And making cartridges might be a too big risk considering that they will have to get a pre-order for about 100 copies from people that will pay about $110 each ($50 royalties + $30 cartridge + $15 fancy box + $10 shipping + $5 just in case)? When you break the pricing down like that, I think they could easily get 100 pre-orders for a professionally produced release like what was done with SteamRoller that should also include some kind of historical faq about the game and what it took to finally get it released. I would even be willing to pay even more than the $110 figure you guesstimated as I am sure many others would! If I could manage to get a good image for the box art for free (can't be that hard with all the He-Man memorabilia out there) my rough breakdown for 100 copies would be as follows: 50.00$ for royalties 8.50$ for the cartridge (electronics + assembly + casing + label) 5.00$ for the manual (PDF preparation fees + printing on glossy paper) 10.00$ for the box (PDF preparation fees + printing on cardboard) TOTAL: 73.50$ More expensive than my usual releases, but not too bad for a "holy grail" game. However, at that price, the game would have to be playable and 100% complete, not just a demo or an unfinished prototype. Has the He-Man ROM been confirmed to be complete game? Luc, I won't mind to pay 100$ for it I would also be up to help you "release" this game CIB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelboy Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Luc, I won't mind to pay 100$ for it I would also be up to help you "release" this game CIB Actually, Team Pixelboy is not a valid candidate for publishing He-Man. Paying the royalties and the other manufacturing fees is not really the problem, I could do that. I see two actual problems: 1) If I make contact with Mattel and try to get the ball rolling on a royalties deal, as a respected toy company, Mattel is going to ask me questions. More notably, when the Mattel representative takes a look at the Team Pixelboy web site, he/she is going to ask me what kind of licensing deal I got for such games as Pitfall II Arcade, Track & Field, Gulkave, etc. We all know what the answer to that question is, and I can't really lie to Mattel about it. This will put both me and Mattel in an awkward position, and the He-Man licensing discussion will likely fail as a result. 2) You think I can easely sell 100 copies of He-Man at 75$ a pop? Think again. For example, Pitfall II Arcade is only half that price, and it's an even higher-profile title than He-Man, and I still have over 20 copies in stock (out of a 100), not counting the small supply I recently sold to Good Deal Games. I don't know if I will ever sell them all within the next few years. The truth is, not all ColecoVision fans have deep pockets. Many are on a budget, and they won't touch a 75$ game with a ten-foot pole. At that price point, selling just 50 copies of He-Man would be surprisingly good. So He-Man is not in the cards for Team Pixelboy, but if it ever becomes available from another source, I will surely buy a copy, no question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 Luc, I won't mind to pay 100$ for it I would also be up to help you "release" this game CIB Actually, Team Pixelboy is not a valid candidate for publishing He-Man. Paying the royalties and the other manufacturing fees is not really the problem, I could do that. I see two actual problems: 1) If I make contact with Mattel and try to get the ball rolling on a royalties deal, as a respected toy company, Mattel is going to ask me questions. More notably, when the Mattel representative takes a look at the Team Pixelboy web site, he/she is going to ask me what kind of licensing deal I got for such games as Pitfall II Arcade, Track & Field, Gulkave, etc. We all know what the answer to that question is, and I can't really lie to Mattel about it. This will put both me and Mattel in an awkward position, and the He-Man licensing discussion will likely fail as a result. 2) You think I can easely sell 100 copies of He-Man at 75$ a pop? Think again. For example, Pitfall II Arcade is only half that price, and it's an even higher-profile title than He-Man, and I still have over 20 copies in stock (out of a 100), not counting the small supply I recently sold to Good Deal Games. I don't know if I will ever sell them all within the next few years. The truth is, not all ColecoVision fans have deep pockets. Many are on a budget, and they won't touch a 75$ game with a ten-foot pole. At that price point, selling just 50 copies of He-Man would be surprisingly good. So He-Man is not in the cards for Team Pixelboy, but if it ever becomes available from another source, I will surely buy a copy, no question. You've good points here Luc We can always use "a new" publishing label to release it though As said, I won't mind to "try" to publish it (under another *new* publishing label) The main obstacle for me is being in contact with Mattel, since my english is clearly not enough good to have discussions with Mattel and even Blue Sky Rangers But, yeah, I would be up for the challenge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted May 16, 2011 Author Share Posted May 16, 2011 [2) You think I can easely sell 100 copies of He-Man at 75$ a pop? Think again. For example, Pitfall II Arcade is only half that price, and it's an even higher-profile title than He-Man, and I still have over 20 copies in stock (out of a 100), not counting the small supply I recently sold to Good Deal Games. I don't know if I will ever sell them all within the next few years. The truth is, not all ColecoVision fans have deep pockets. Many are on a budget, and they won't touch a 75$ game with a ten-foot pole. At that price point, selling just 50 copies of He-Man would be surprisingly good. So He-Man is not in the cards for Team Pixelboy, but if it ever becomes available from another source, I will surely buy a copy, no question. First off, let me state how thoroughly impressed I am with Pitfall II Arcade as well as all your other releases. From the boxes, to the manuals, to the cart labels and finally the programming effort that went into each of your released games. I do not want what I am about to say to sound like I am deminishing these titles and the effort made by all involved in the least bit. They are all top shelf and I am very glad to be the proud owner of all of them and anxiously await news of further releases coming from Team Pixelboy. So now onto the gist of my post. Four of your titles (Girl's Garden, Gulkave, Track & Field and Pitfall II Arcade) are ports from the MSX or SG-1000 and while they may not be easily had in their original form to play on those systems, they are readily available in rom image format to play thru emulators. In my mind, this seriously impacts the number of possile sales no matter how good the game is. Destructor S.C.E., a great hack of the controls and the way Coleco should have released it (along with some other improvements ), is just that... only a hack of a game a lot of people already have in cart or rom image form. Peek-A-Boo, the one original game release in your library, will prove my point to follow later in this post. Seeing that I only got a copy due to someone else backing out, I would assume that you are now completely sold out. How many copies were produced... 50, 75, 100? Anyhow, we are talking about a game here that is geared to very young children and those collectors of all things ColecoVision... so there would be very limited sales appeal when all things are considered. Your point concerning ColecoVision fans and owners who could possibly be potential puchasers not having deep pockets is very valid. Lord knows, just about everyone has to think twice about what they spend their hard earned money on now-a-days. BUT... A release of "Masters of the Universe - The Power of He-Man" in my mind is indeed "A" HOLY GRAIL release for the ColecoVision that would not only interest the usual suspects on this very Forum, but many other ColecoVision owners that are rarely heard from. As you also mentioned, at a price point of $75 on up to $125, it would have to be a near complete to fully complete game. Another factor that should/could play into better sales figures for a He-Man release is simply that the game is not available and never has been available to the masses in rom image format (maybe 5-10 people have it)... a big factor in my mind that would aid in the total sales figures. Now a CIB release of the Caterpillar S.O.S. game would have a lot less appeal in my mind and therefore a production run of 50 copies would be justified. On the other end of this spectrum, Lord of the Dungeon has been released by CGE (around 2000) and CollectorVision (earlier this year) and in both instances, all copies produced were quickly sold out. I'm not sure how many copies were produced by CGE and CollectorVision, but I would guess around 25 by CGE and 50 by CollectorVision, and there are still people looking to land a copy. The CollectorVision release even came after the rom image of the game became available and later playable thru BlueMSX and the AtariMax SD Cart. So roughly 75 copies sold of a very involved RPG game... a genre of games that isn't the most sought after for a retro videogame console. One last thought concerning sales, I would have to think that Good Deal Games as well as AtariAge would be interested in purchasing some copies of a He-Man release for sale in their respective stores. I would also have to up the ante by thinking that retro videogames stores such as VideoGames Then & Now (Sean Kelly), Digital Press and some others would be interested in purchasing a number of copies for sale in their walk-in stores. Then you have the entrepreneurs out there that would buy multiple copies to hold onto until all copies are sold and then put them up on eBay to make a nice profit. Anyhow, if a release is ever made, I'm in for a copy at whatever the price point is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcoleco Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 (edited) The last messages I'm reading here are informative and kinda funny because I have the impression that you ignore the fact that none of us are the owners of the Coleco He-Man game(s). Anyway... Pixelboy made a good point about being already in a situation where he can't even consider publishing He-Man game(s) under TeamPixelboy label because of the liberty he took to publish many new ColecoVision games without the approbation of the original owners of these games and characters (like Elmo). Using another label seems a good idea but there is always a way to make the connection. ColecoVision is not in the market anymore but it's not important while talking about copyrights, and companies like Nintendo and Mattel will remind it to you anytime. So far, we are lucky, but it's like playing with fire... that's one of the reasons why I try to stay far away of arcade ports and make my own games, but that's another subject. To me, asking to any of the guys who do have the rom file(s) is useless because I don't feel they have the rights to tell us what we can and can't do with the game(s) if they just have the binary file. I presume there is at least 1 actual owner of the prototype(s), and I consider it logic to let this (or these) person(s) decide to go ahead or not about publishing the game considering the royalties and a few other things that we mention in this thread. But talking about making boxes already... it's really too soon. In this situation, none of us are the actual owner of the game(s), so we may make suggestions but it will not lead us anywere without the game(s). Considering that B.S.R. was able to publish Steam Roller, and they probably had the He-Man games to present them in a gaming event (video), then there is certainly a good reason why they didn't publish the games back then. Their label, which I think was RetroTopia for Steam Roller is still an option if they want to use it again... but do they still have the prototypes or do they are in another private collection? Edited May 16, 2011 by newcoleco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 The last messages I'm reading here are informative and kinda funny because I have the impression that you ignore the fact that none of us are the owners of the Coleco He-Man game(s). Anyway... Sure, but if I were the owner of this prototype, you'll already played this game since a bunch of time and this discussion will not even exist Otherwise, you got good points too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 Another thing... Last year, a colecovision fan contacted me about dumping his eprom containing He-Man Master of Universe we had several discussion about this, but in the end he sent the eprom to a guy in California, that guy never diumped it and send it back to the owner Months later, he did finally received his eprom but I lost contact with him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Yurkie Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 I don't buy into the BS about Mattel coming after the BSRs if the rom is leaked. There would be absolutely no way to prove who uploaded the rom file to the Internet. The truth in my mind is they want to be elitists that have something that only a handful of people in the world have, and it is their right to keep it to themselves if they wish. I would bet that there are others that have the rom file other than the BSRs and that they are just private collectors that don't come on AtariAge or wish to be hassled about distributing the rom file. It is also likely that not having the He-Man rom and the mystery behind it might be a good thing. The game might not be very good, or have bugs, be incomplete...ect. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelboy Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 Peek-A-Boo, the one original game release in your library, will prove my point to follow later in this post. Seeing that I only got a copy due to someone else backing out, I would assume that you are now completely sold out. How many copies were produced... 50, 75, 100? 50, and the last remaining copies are found at Good Deal Games, just for the record. I'm all sold out, and as of yesterday morning, the same can be said of Destructor SCE, and I only have one copy left of Track & Field (Good Deal Games has three T&Fs in stock). One last thought concerning sales, I would have to think that Good Deal Games as well as AtariAge would be interested in purchasing some copies of a He-Man release for sale in their respective stores. I would also have to up the ante by thinking that retro videogames stores such as VideoGames Then & Now (Sean Kelly), Digital Press and some others would be interested in purchasing a number of copies for sale in their walk-in stores. Then you have the entrepreneurs out there that would buy multiple copies to hold onto until all copies are sold and then put them up on eBay to make a nice profit. Anyhow, if a release is ever made, I'm in for a copy at whatever the price point is. I hear what you're saying, Jim, and you know, it can't be that hard to get it done. We just need two things, really: 1) We need to get the ROM image somehow, and validate that it's a complete game. 2) We need someone who can strike a limited licensing deal with Mattel. For #2, I wonder if the guy behind Atari2600.com would be interested. He's already published one ColecoVision game, namely "The Void - Centaury Conflict", so he can claim to have ColecoVision publishing experience, plus he doesn't need to put up any money, guys like me could take care of that, standing behind the curtain. He would just act as middle man between Mattel and the CV homebrew community... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 I don't buy into the BS about Mattel coming after the BSRs if the rom is leaked. There would be absolutely no way to prove who uploaded the rom file to the Internet. The truth in my mind is they want to be elitists that have something that only a handful of people in the world have, and it is their right to keep it to themselves if they wish. I would bet that there are others that have the rom file other than the BSRs and that they are just private collectors that don't come on AtariAge or wish to be hassled about distributing the rom file. It is also likely that not having the He-Man rom and the mystery behind it might be a good thing. The game might not be very good, or have bugs, be incomplete...ect. Totally agreed!! A well earned +1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted May 16, 2011 Author Share Posted May 16, 2011 (edited) A follow up to how much ColecoVision enthuisiasts are willing to pay for something they really want: Ghosts & Zombies by CollectorVision just sold for $325 on eBay with 9 different bidders. The 5 Sunrise titles in Silver Boxes that Luc very gratitously worked with Ozma Wars on just sold for $262 with 14 different bidders. As was mentioned by NewColeco, all this banter is probably moot since a mass produced release is unlikely... but it sure is fun to shoot the shit about a "what if" scenario. Edited May 16, 2011 by NIAD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 A follow up to how much ColecoVision enthuisiasts are willing to pay for something they really want: Ghosts & Zombies by CollectorVision just sold for $325 on eBay with 9 different bidders. I wonder how much this one could get Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcoleco Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 I keep thinking that only the person who do have the game (prototype or not) should consider what to do with it, not the ones who have only an image file of it. Consider this hypothetic situation. Imagine that Pixelboy here pay for an unknow CV pcb on eBay... let's say something like $300. Then he finds out that the seller wasn't lying, it's a working unreleased ColecoVision game. Immediately, he wants to dump the rom and starts working on boxart and everything to release the game. Finaly, after a month or so, he is ready to release the game, but someone else is already taking pre-order for the same game, someone who do have the binary file of it. Even if in this hypothetic situation no one do own the copyrights, I find it more legit that it's the one who do have the prototype that should make a move, not the one who only got an image file. It's in this perspective that I consider not correct the "only two things needed to release the game" while talking about getting the rom file. I know, it's kinda frustrating for those who want the game, but as a Coleco fan and collector myself I will not be happy to see the rom file spreading or a release being made because enthusiasts want to do so. I prefer to respect the decision(s) of the actual owner(s) of the prototype(s)... trying to convince these people first should be a better way to go than thinking of getting the rom file whatever the source. It's the way I feel about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 (edited) I keep thinking that only the person who do have the game (prototype or not) should consider what to do with it, not the ones who have only an image file of it. Consider this hypothetic situation. Imagine that Pixelboy here pay for an unknow CV pcb on eBay... let's say something like $300. Then he finds out that the seller wasn't lying, it's a working unreleased ColecoVision game. Immediately, he wants to dump the rom and starts working on boxart and everything to release the game. Finaly, after a month or so, he is ready to release the game, but someone else is already taking pre-order for the same game, someone who do have the binary file of it. Even if in this hypothetic situation no one do own the copyrights, I find it more legit that it's the one who do have the prototype that should make a move, not the one who only got an image file. It's in this perspective that I consider not correct the "only two things needed to release the game" while talking about getting the rom file. I know, it's kinda frustrating for those who want the game, but as a Coleco fan and collector myself I will not be happy to see the rom file spreading or a release being made because enthusiasts want to do so. I prefer to respect the decision(s) of the actual owner(s) of the prototype(s)... trying to convince these people first should be a better way to go than thinking of getting the rom file whatever the source. It's the way I feel about that. Yep, that's certainly the right way to go Although, I would be HAPPY to sign a NDA for getting the rom file, and this to preserve it in the upcomming museum I'm making with NIAD and the help of others Edited May 16, 2011 by retroillucid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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