Longevity of disc based consoles?

[SlowCoder]

Cart systems often suffer from dust in the switches, or worn cart contacts, and the periodic bad ROM chip.

 

Disc systems suffer from dying lasers, motors and the little rubber bands some of them use for the motor drive to spin the disc. Let's not even discuss the newest consoles with hard drives.

 

How long do you think these consoles will survive, as far as finding functional ones? What about parts for them, such as motors and lasers?

[desiv]

Well, it's not CD based so no lasers, but my Apple II's with floppy drives are still spinning and reading disks.

That's 25+ years old with it's moving parts...

 

My guess is that some of the better built and cared for CD systems will last quite a while..

My 3D0 (FZ1) is still spinning along (knocking on wood) fine...

 

But they are more delicate, so fewer will survive for that reason...

 

desiv

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

As cool as SegaCD and 3DO, CDi front load systems are I tend to pickup the top loading versions. May not be as cool or fancy but in my experience they last longer without the more complicated mechanisms opening a tray.

[desiv]

As cool as SegaCD and 3DO, CDi front load systems are I tend to pickup the top loading versions. May not be as cool or fancy but in my experience they last longer without the more complicated mechanisms opening a tray.

I don't think that's always the case..

When I was looking into a 3DO, one of the reasons I got an FZ1 was that they are supposedly built better than the FZ10 (which was the lower cost model, so it makes sense).

And while I agree that less complicated usually means more stable; better built can play a role as well..

 

desiv

[The Dord]

Seems that the discs from newer consoles will last longer than the console itself, but one or two of my 3do discs have some rot on them and I think the older consoles will outlast their respective game discs.

Edited September 4, 2011 by The Dord

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

As cool as SegaCD and 3DO, CDi front load systems are I tend to pickup the top loading versions. May not be as cool or fancy but in my experience they last longer without the more complicated mechanisms opening a tray.

I don't think that's always the case..

When I was looking into a 3DO, one of the reasons I got an FZ1 was that they are supposedly built better than the FZ10 (which was the lower cost model, so it makes sense).

And while I agree that less complicated usually means more stable; better built can play a role as well..

 

desiv

 

No like anything it is the luck of the draw, but this has been my experience and so I tend to gravitate to top loaders or flip-tops, in my view it increases my odds.

[theredlineboss]

With older CD based systems, I have been pleasantly surprised at how many work even today. Out of the 4 Model 2 Sega CD's I've owned, one had a bad laser. Considering the age of the systems, I'm not going to complain about that. One did have a bad motherboard though (Wasn't the fuse; stopped working after it had been dropped by the prior owner). Same for the PS1's I've run across; most work fine. The 2 Saturns and 4 Dreamcast's I've had all worked perfectly.

 

On the other hand, of the 8 Phat PS2 systems, all have had disk read problems. It was mostly bad lasers (1 had a dying motor), but three could play PS2 games, but not PS1 or CD's. Highly annoying. 3 original Xbox systems, 1 has a bad laser, one is starting to have issues with the tray sticking. And we shall not speak of the my first 360...

 

Of course, this is just my experience. I got many of these systems a decade or more after they were produced, so I have no way of knowing how they were treated. But it seems that the quality of the components has gone down over time, expecially in the case of the PS2 lasers.

 

-Rob

[desiv]

No like anything it is the luck of the draw..

You don't think some models can be built better than others?

 

Interesting.

 

Well, we just disagree there.

 

desiv

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

No like anything it is the luck of the draw..

You don't think some models can be built better than others?

 

Interesting.

 

Well, we just disagree there.

 

desiv

 

I am not saying I don't think that, regardless of model though when buying such old hardware you can still get a dud regardless. So I could buy whatever is considered the "better model" only to have it break down a week later where as a lesser regarded model may last me for years. That is what I mean. I have had bad luck personally with motorized disc tray loading units and zero issues with top loading/flip top versions, as I say luck of the draw. I am not disagreeing with anything you say.

[desiv]

My bad.

Gotcha. True.

 

desiv

[IntellivisionII]

I had one of the "slim" PS2 with a top loading tray, took a couple of years of normal abuse and the motor died. My friend has a PS1 still running strong. It is just luck of the draw with mechanical parts but I'll say the older systems are probably built to last longer.

[The Dord]

I had one of the "slim" PS2 with a top loading tray, took a couple of years of normal abuse and the motor died. My friend has a PS1 still running strong. It is just luck of the draw with mechanical parts but I'll say the older systems are probably built to last longer.

 

Oddly I had the opposite happen to me. My ps1 I had to turn upside down for the games to even play but my slim ps2 is still going strong.

 

Go figure!

[TheGameCollector]

I'm sure in the future, someone will figure out how to wire up an external PC drive to a game system and just use that to load games to the console's board. There are so many hacks out there nothing seems unfeasable.

[HatefulGravey]

I'm hoping that in the future people will figure out ways to repair these consoles so they can be played properly. If that isn't going to happen maybe PC hardware will get to a place where you can emulate the 360 or PS3 on your PC without having $3000 in your PC and just play from the disc that way.

 

As long as people are interested there will be a way to play these games. I'm worried about the life span on my modern systems too, but I'm just that sure that it will be figured out when the price is right. We have to wait for the costs to come down on the systems and them people will get it right.

[SlowCoder]

I'm hoping that in the future people will figure out ways to repair these consoles so they can be played properly. If that isn't going to happen maybe PC hardware will get to a place where you can emulate the 360 or PS3 on your PC without having $3000 in your PC and just play from the disc that way.

 

As long as people are interested there will be a way to play these games. I'm worried about the life span on my modern systems too, but I'm just that sure that it will be figured out when the price is right. We have to wait for the costs to come down on the systems and them people will get it right.

 

Oh, yeah. It will happen. encryption has been broken on most, if not all modern consoles. ROMs will need to be cracked to allow them to play offline (so they won't "call home"), etc. But people will eventually figure it all out. By the time that's widely available, a PC necessary to run it will be readily available at economy prices.

[desiv]

By the time that's widely available, a PC necessary to run it will be readily available at economy prices.

 

Except, optical is going away. I'm playing games on 20+ year old systems now..

Think there will be optical drives on new systems 20 years from now?

 

Much more likely people are trying to keep their older opticals working, as they won't be selling new optical drives..

 

desiv

[SRGilbert]

As cool as SegaCD and 3DO, CDi front load systems are I tend to pickup the top loading versions. May not be as cool or fancy but in my experience they last longer without the more complicated mechanisms opening a tray.

 

Plus, it's WAY easier to clean the laser lens with a flip top.

[the.golden.ax]

Even though the parts will cost the same or more than a used console, this is the time to buy and stock away whatever you need. In 20 or 30 years when you are the only person with a GD-ROM drive, or certain hop, you will thank me for this idea.

 

AX

[Hatta]

I'm hoping that in the future people will figure out ways to repair these consoles so they can be played properly.

 

People are already building flash/FPGA based optical drive emulators for some consoles. Check out this GD-ROM emulator for the dreamcast. Or the WODE for the Wii. Our optical based consoles should be safe into the future, at least as safe as our floppy based PCs have been.

[the.golden.ax]

I'm hoping that in the future people will figure out ways to repair these consoles so they can be played properly.

 

People are already building flash/FPGA based optical drive emulators for some consoles. Check out this GD-ROM emulator for the dreamcast. Or the WODE for the Wii. Our optical based consoles should be safe into the future, at least as safe as our floppy based PCs have been.

 

 

 

Great for daily use, but think about people who restore classic cars or other mechanical items. They want the real parts if they can find them. You don't want a classic with a 2011 engine. You want the original stuff "working" either put away or on display. Not for the car you drive every day, for you baby.

 

AX

[desiv]

... Check out this GD-ROM emulator for the dreamcast. Or the WODE for the Wii. Our optical based consoles should be safe into the future..

 

If by "safe," you mean "able to be replaced by non-optical equipment"..

Then, I suppose yes..

 

But if I saw someone with a floppy emulator, I wouldn't say "Hey, you've saved that floppy drive!"..

I'd think it's too bad that the original isn't working, but at least there's something to simulate it..

 

Then I'd go home and play some games off of floppies on my working floppy drive..

 

I think emulators are great, but they are emulators.. Even hardware based...

 

desiv

[Rex Dart]

If by "safe," you mean "able to be replaced by non-optical equipment"..

Then, I suppose yes..

 

I think emulators are great, but they are emulators.. Even hardware based...

 

Hey, it's no different than a Harmony cart or other flash cart. Just a modern way to feed data into your old system.

[desiv]

Hey, it's no different than a Harmony cart or other flash cart. Just a modern way to feed data into your old system.

 

Exactly.

 

I love my CC2...

 

But that isn't stopping me from buying/owning real carts...

 

I'm not saying hardrware emulators/simulators aren't great..

They just aren't the same as original... I didn't save any hardware by owning a CC2..

 

IMHO..

 

desiv

[jferio]

In the case of the disk/disc drive emulators, they do have a specific purpose, even more so than a Harmony or Cuttle Cart... and that's to enable the "primary" hardware to continue to be used as "intended", even when the mechanical pieces it replaces are hard to find in functional condition.

 

There are a lot of, as an example, 1541 disk drives for Commodore out there that require an alignment procedure that's outside the scope of most collectors' skillsets, and then there's the issue with the media itself "rotting" out from under you. Some of those floppies are over 30 years old, and were never meant to last that long. Optical media will be the same way. They've done testing to try to determine the longevity of the media, but it involves artificially forcing the aging process, and I've heard of indications that the process is not entirely accurate. And this doesn't count issues with the manufacturing itself, given the examples of "disc rot" with laserdisc media, and worse, the problem that's developed with some PS1 media developing holes in the mylar layer.

 

While it would be nice to continue to use hardware in the original state, the combination of spare parts availability, calibration requirements, media reliability, and even just convenience of not having to deal with the whole thing, means that solid state emulation of mechanically actuated storage media is going to be a part of our hobby going forward.

[desiv]

Agreed..

And I use some of those technologies..

But if I'm not using a floppy, it's not the same.

Better? Possibly, but not the same..

 

Same with optical..

 

Now, these emulators/simulators are great, but so is emulation...

 

How many steps do you take away from the original hardware (RF to composite to svideo to LCD flat panel; optical to simulator to huge storage device with LOTS of optical images) before you are just as good emulating the whole thing???

 

Just wondering...

 

desiv