I got my atari to drive 3D glasses!

[Pioneer4x4]

Thanks to some help from GroovyBee, RevEng, and SeaGtGruff and of course everyone that helps with anything batari basic (Batari obviously, and Random Terrain for the nice web site-o-documentation) getting me past a hurdle, I was able to send signals to the joystick port to trigger my 3D glasses in sync with the atari's screen updates.

 

All I have so far is, an alternating static screen that one frame is visible via one eye and the other is visibly via the other eye.

I was originally working with my SegaScope 3D glasses, but after I cracked the arm off one side, I bought a pair of ASUS VR100G glasses ($20 eBay). They are basically the same thing, but with larger view area, and fit my noggin a bit better as well!

 

Programming should be no big deal, I do the frame switching in vblank, so every screen draw is switched form one eye to the other.

 

I am mainly doing it as another proof of concept of 1980s tech.

 

The biggest problem seems to be similar to the actual Sega implementation. There is ghosting/bleed through of the image, you can partially see the opposite frame which pretty much ruins the effect. I will test it on a couple of other TV's in my house to see if newer stuff works better or worse then CRT.

 

I am still testing with polarity/brightness levels. And I may lower the frame rate to reduce image bleedthrough, but increase flicker.

[+thegoldenband]

Very cool stuff! A question, though:

 

The biggest problem seems to be similar to the actual Sega implementation. There is ghosting/bleed through of the image, you can partially see the opposite frame which pretty much ruins the effect.

 

Jeez, I don't have this problem with the SMS 3D glasses I recently acquired -- certainly not to the extent that it "ruins the effect". Space Harrier 3D looks awesome. And it's not the placebo effect, since my expectations were very low and I was shocked by how good it looked.

 

Do you think something might be going awry with your timing? When I tried using the SMS to drive the 3D glasses while using my Genesis to play a 3D SMS game via the Everdrive, I saw the effect you describe with ghosting, because the two weren't properly in sync.

[Pioneer4x4]

Very cool stuff! A question, though:

 

The biggest problem seems to be similar to the actual Sega implementation. There is ghosting/bleed through of the image, you can partially see the opposite frame which pretty much ruins the effect.

 

Jeez, I don't have this problem with the SMS 3D glasses I recently acquired -- certainly not to the extent that it "ruins the effect". Space Harrier 3D looks awesome. And it's not the placebo effect, since my expectations were very low and I was shocked by how good it looked.

 

Do you think something might be going awry with your timing? When I tried using the SMS to drive the 3D glasses while using my Genesis to play a 3D SMS game via the Everdrive, I saw the effect you describe with ghosting, because the two weren't properly in sync.

Thanks!

It has been a goal of mine since I got the Sega 3D stuff a while ago. as for the ghosting, it could be multiple causes.

1 - my TV (I don't think so though)

2 - the glasses (I don't think so either, the ASUS glasses have bigger viewports, but the effect is very similar to the Sega ones)

3 - me (I have near superman vision and can see through LCD) (that was a joke...)

4 - timing (highly likely, if I slow it down I may be able to tell better)

5 - the atari hardware itself (it may not have good enough display hardware to provide clean enough signal. I will also try it on multiple consoles)

 

My next step is to hook up the Sega and see what it looks like with the ASUS glasses on the 9" TV I am using for comparison.

I don't have 3-D Space Harrier yet, I have

Maze Hunter 3-D

Missile Defense 3-D

Zaxxon 3-D

Poseidon Wars 3-D (Haven't tried it yet)

Edited December 19, 2011 by Pioneer4x4

[+RevEng]

A couple of thoughts regarding the bleed-through...

• According to this site the vr-100g glasses need 10v in each shutter. 5v may not be enough to dark out the display. If you set one lens to dark continuously, does it completely black out the display?
  
• You may want to try changing the switchover time from vblank to overscan. (i.e. anywhere in the regular bB code area) It may take the LCD glasses some time to switch states, and vblank may be too close to the actual frame.
  

[Pioneer4x4]

A couple of thoughts regarding the bleed-through...

• According to this site the vr-100g glasses need 10v in each shutter. 5v may not be enough to dark out the display. If you set one lens to dark continuously, does it completely black out the display?
  
• You may want to try changing the switchover time from vblank to overscan. (i.e. anywhere in the regular bB code area) It may take the LCD glasses some time to switch states, and vblank may be too close to the actual frame.
  

 

I'll try a 9v on them to see if they get darker.

 

And I'll 1st try doubling the frames, that should mask any sync issues, or at least show an improvement if it is a sync issue.

[rockman_x_2002]

This sounds like quite an interesting project to me. It had never dawned on me that someone might take shutter glasses and cobble them to work on an Atari 2600. Even better if the idea can be taken full-tilt into a game.

 

I'd love to keep updated on this one.

[Pioneer4x4]

I need to do 3 things to see if they can be functional. The ghosting needs reduced a lot.

Before that, I need to make a wiring adapter instead of holding wires from a keypad controller directly to the contacts on the phono jack of the headset...

 

1 - Timing. I only need some spare time to putz and should be able to confirm/eliminate this.

2 - I am sure a lot of fiddling with brightness/contrast would improve it, probably by reducing contrast, and making the picture look crappy, it would help the effect.

3 - Voltage. I read the page RevEng linked to, as well as others, and they all seem to say 10-12v (or 9, or 11...) The circuit would be cheap, prolly only $2-$3.

 

Then I need a decent sample image to test the effect with. I need to figure out spacing for the 2 images to see how far in the screen or out in front you want it to be.

 

One test image I did was only changing the playfield color between 2 opposite colors. Without glasses, it looked like slighly flickering white, but one eye saw reddish orange, and other eye saw teal.

Hell, I just thought of something! With 2 glasses, and wiring set to 2 phono jacks so Glasses #1 sees all EVEN frames on BOTH lenses, and Glasses #2 sees all ODD frames on BOTH lenses, you can have 2 people seeing different images AT THE SAME TIME!

 

Think of a combat game where you only see YOUR tank, unless the other is actually in line of sight, then you can see it as well. Or you can place mines that only YOU can see!

 

I really need to get this working, I am sure there are other cool ideas that could be done. The hardware part is not too bad, and should be affordable as well. I got brand new glasses for $20 shipped, and worst case, call it $40 total for everything if I need to up the voltage.

[Goochman]

.....Missile Command 3D.................

[SlowCoder]

Man, Pioneer4x4, you're on a bit of a roll, aren't you? First the ROB, then 3D glasses. I think it's spectacular you're getting stuff that was never intended for the Atari 2600 to interface with it! Excellent job!

[Pioneer4x4]

You should have seen what my old Dodge Rampage had in it. All 1980s Chrysler tech...

[+iesposta]

Have you done any more work on this 3D shutter glasses?

I had "Nexar" as a kid, that would be great to remake as 3D.

"Challenge of.... Nexar, The" how is that for a title?

Spectravision / or is it Spectravideo.

[Pioneer4x4]

I blew about $20 on some components to wire it up correctly and make the voltage amplifier. I also tested the glasses with a 9v battery and no visible difference from 5v, so that is not good news. I also tried extending/slowing the framerate with no visible difference.

 

I now plan to try isolating the frames by color, not brightness. Keep a gray background with a pale colored image of the same brightness. maybe even have the object darker than the background, so the bleed through/ghosting image will be the background, not the object you shouldn't see.

 

I still need to make a couple more R.O.B. carts, but Christmas has won out over spare time. Been playing Lego Pirates of the Carribean with my kids :-)

[+iesposta]

Darn the bleed-through. I hate when something should work, but doesn't.

I ordered some red/blue clip on glasses because I have an iPhone app at you can take 3D Shots... Same problem.

The blue blocks out the red, but the red does not block out all the blue and you get ghosting.

(or vice-versa)

There were some red/blue 3D unfinished prototypes for the 2600, but the roms aren't released yet.

The videos on YouTube bleed thru also.