Guess who is never getting my money again?

[Hyper_Eye]

I love whats going on in Steam, GOG, 360 indie's and the IOS/Droid platforms. Affordable and it seems...a lot better.

 

Go Kickstarter!

 

And Desura.

[Mord]

Gamestop and the like of stores are doing a lot of damage to the game industry IMO. You buy a game for $60 and a week later you're lucky if you get maybe $20 for it, then they turn around and sell it for $50.

 

Stop.

 

Any damage being done in that situation is being caused by GAMERS. You know, the ones that are buying the games at 50+. If they didn't, then Gamestop and others would not be selling them for that price. And remember that most of the people buying used games at that price at Gamestop aren't actually buying games at that price. They're almost assuredly using their member cards to get 10-20% off that at the very least. Devs love to leave that part out since it helps make the situation look even worse for them.

 

Bottom line is that if gamers didn't pay out that much money for used games, they wouldn't be sold at that price.

[iswitt]

^^ Yes, Mord. I agree. "Vote with your wallet" has always been a phrase I took to heart. There are certain companies and products I simply will not support, even if they occasionally come out with decent stuff. EA is a good example. I will never give them my money even though they will sometimes publish a decent 360 game. But I can't tolerate their practices. If you don't like something, don't support it monetarily and hopefully it will change or go away like I'm hoping Crytek will.

[Arkhan]

I still don't think second hand gaming hurts the market. If it did, the 90s would have killed off gaming.

 

I don't think I ever bought a brand new SNES game except the ones my parents got my for xmas. Everything I personally bought, was used. Same for playstation 1.

 

This guy is the director of creative whatnot.

 

and hes more worried about money than creativity.

 

I vote we hit him.

[Kid Ice]

""From a business perspective that would be absolutely awesome," he told the publication. 'It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well.'"

 

Yeah gaming should run like the PC software industry. Pretty much everyone pays full price for their PC software firsthand. Well 4 or 5 people do I guess.

Edited April 29, 2012 by Kid Ice

[Emehr]

"It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well."

 

There's nothing in the rules that says software can't be resold. That's a limitation created by software developers and has no basis in any undistorted reality. Software should be no different than any other digitized media: movies, music, books, etc. If it exists on a production disk, that disk should be trade-able goods like any other product. No exceptions. Software shouldn't get a special pass and there's no legitimate reason why it should.

[BillyHW]

Gamestop is no more hurting the gaming industry by trading in used games than Blockbuster did in the 80's in 90's with game rentals. Remember Nintendo's war with Blockbuster? They eventually pulled a 180 and came to embrace rentals.

[Arkhan]

video games aren't software.

[davepesc]

""From a business perspective that would be absolutely awesome," he told the publication. 'It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well.'"

 

 

Also: what a douchebag.

 

Sure, video games are the only software that gets resold. I've NEVER bought a used album, cassette, VHS, DVD, CD, or Blu-Ray.

[SoulBlazer]

Gamestop and the like of stores are doing a lot of damage to the game industry IMO. You buy a game for $60 and a week later you're lucky if you get maybe $20 for it, then they turn around and sell it for $50.

 

Stop.

 

Any damage being done in that situation is being caused by GAMERS. You know, the ones that are buying the games at 50+. If they didn't, then Gamestop and others would not be selling them for that price. And remember that most of the people buying used games at that price at Gamestop aren't actually buying games at that price. They're almost assuredly using their member cards to get 10-20% off that at the very least. Devs love to leave that part out since it helps make the situation look even worse for them.

 

Bottom line is that if gamers didn't pay out that much money for used games, they wouldn't be sold at that price.

 

Are you saying that it's bad for me to buy a new copy of Mass Effect 3 on Amazon for $40 cause I really liked the series and want the game?

 

I realize most ganers are stupid teens and young adults who are more then happy to pay $60 for a new game and then trade it into GameStop for $20 a few weeks later, but please don't lump all of us into that catagory. I decided to wait a bit for ME 3's price to drop, but I still plan to buy it new and think $40 is a good price.

[Mord]

Gamestop and the like of stores are doing a lot of damage to the game industry IMO. You buy a game for $60 and a week later you're lucky if you get maybe $20 for it, then they turn around and sell it for $50.

 

Stop.

 

Any damage being done in that situation is being caused by GAMERS. You know, the ones that are buying the games at 50+. If they didn't, then Gamestop and others would not be selling them for that price. And remember that most of the people buying used games at that price at Gamestop aren't actually buying games at that price. They're almost assuredly using their member cards to get 10-20% off that at the very least. Devs love to leave that part out since it helps make the situation look even worse for them.

 

Bottom line is that if gamers didn't pay out that much money for used games, they wouldn't be sold at that price.

 

Are you saying that it's bad for me to buy a new copy of Mass Effect 3 on Amazon for $40 cause I really liked the series and want the game?

 

I realize most ganers are stupid teens and young adults who are more then happy to pay $60 for a new game and then trade it into GameStop for $20 a few weeks later, but please don't lump all of us into that catagory. I decided to wait a bit for ME 3's price to drop, but I still plan to buy it new and think $40 is a good price.

 

What the heck does new game prices have to do with used game prices?

 

I don't even think used games sales hurt anybody - only that gamers fueling an inflated used price tag market is fueling the greed of developers who start wanting a cut. Badly.

 

On the other hand, getting new games cheaper than the launch price will become the next strawman the industry will go after once legal used game sales are demonized more completely. (They're only half way there with that.)

 

Case in point: There are people already trying to fuel that argument by complaining about how steam sale events are hurting the developers.

[madmax2069]

video games aren't software.

yes it is software, it sure the hell not hardware nor is it made out of nothing. Its a computer program used for entertainment, a computer program is software.

[Arkhan]

video games aren't software.

yes it is software, it sure the hell not hardware nor is it made out of nothing. Its a computer program used for entertainment, a computer program is software.

 

In the literal sense, sure, it's software.

 

 

You missed the point though. It's ok.

[iswitt]

Apparently this guy has backtracked on his original statements. He looks even dumber now.

 

http://www.gamepolitics.com/2012/05/01/crytek-says-comments-about-next-gen-consoles-blocking-used-games-werent-serious

[godslabrat]

Apparently this guy has backtracked on his original statements. He looks even dumber now.

 

http://www.gamepolit...-werent-serious

 

"Certainly people apparently really want to play our games, they just don't wanna buy them."

 

Oh, so we've gone from 'Used games are harming the industry and we should stop that' to 'Unless you're buying a new game at full price, you're a pirate, and YOU'RE harming the industry.'

 

Seriously, I'm offended that this guy is actually paid to be this stupid. He probably makes double my salary, and he has no idea how his own customers think.

[Mord]

Apparently this guy has backtracked on his original statements. He looks even dumber now.

 

http://www.gamepolit...-werent-serious

 

"Certainly people apparently really want to play our games, they just don't wanna buy them."

 

Oh, so we've gone from 'Used games are harming the industry and we should stop that' to 'Unless you're buying a new game at full price, you're a pirate, and YOU'RE harming the industry.'

 

 

I agree with you, although his comment does show one reason why I don't like seeing people downloading current games on torrents just to get around the DRM issues they have with the game.

 

If you don't like what they're doing, don't buy the game. Period. Don't download it. Don't play it. Don't advertise it to your friends. Downloading it only gives jerks like this a reason to whine and cry without even trying to look at whether or not the people downloading it even paid for it anyway. Why bother? Looks better to just assume everyone was a dirty rotten freeloading pirate.

 

But if everyone simply didn't buy it or play it, and made a ruckus about why they weren't, maybe there'd be a re-release without the offensive crap tacked on within a year. (As most non-suicidal companies would likely choose DRM-less releases over bankruptcy.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Mord

[Lord Helmet]

I still don't think second hand gaming hurts the market.

 

I don't think it does either. I think it's pure greed that these companies want to do away with used games.

[doubleminor]

The games industry is killing itself from within. There was this article today from the makers of Time Splitters: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/346234/timesplitters-4-nobody-was-interested-in-signing-us-says-dev/

 

Also, the creator of Minecraft said a while back the demise of GAME stores in the UK was "fun to watch". He also said the reason for GAME's demise was digital distribution. Not long after he said that, GAME came out of administration (I think that's the term) and looks to be recovering. Wonder if Minecraft guy is eating his words?

[Mord]

The games industry is killing itself from within. There was this article today from the makers of Time Splitters: http://www.computera...ng-us-says-dev/

 

Also, the creator of Minecraft said a while back the demise of GAME stores in the UK was "fun to watch". He also said the reason for GAME's demise was digital distribution. Not long after he said that, GAME came out of administration (I think that's the term) and looks to be recovering. Wonder if Minecraft guy is eating his words?

 

Looking at the Wiki entry for GAME, I can't say the company looks all that healthy regardless. I don't think it's entirely due to digital distribution however, so that part Notch can feel free to eat. "Administration" appears to be the UK's equivalent to bankruptcy/etc. The only reason they came out of it is because someone bought them. The same company that offered to buy them prior to them going into administration actually - but was refused.

 

From their practices listed on the wiki, they're not much different from Gamestop (And the references of electronic boutique, which was bought out by gamestop probably shows why...). So that part I'd have to admit he's right about. It would be fun to watch it's demise. As much fun as watching gamestop go bankrupt.

[xg4bx]

Apparently this guy has backtracked on his original statements. He looks even dumber now.

 

http://www.gamepolit...-werent-serious

 

"Certainly people apparently really want to play our games, they just don't wanna buy them."

 

Oh, so we've gone from 'Used games are harming the industry and we should stop that' to 'Unless you're buying a new game at full price, you're a pirate, and YOU'RE harming the industry.'

 

 

I agree with you, although his comment does show one reason why I don't like seeing people downloading current games on torrents just to get around the DRM issues they have with the game.

 

If you don't like what they're doing, don't buy the game. Period. Don't download it. Don't play it. Don't advertise it to your friends. Downloading it only gives jerks like this a reason to whine and cry without even trying to look at whether or not the people downloading it even paid for it anyway. Why bother? Looks better to just assume everyone was a dirty rotten freeloading pirate.

 

But if everyone simply didn't buy it or play it, and made a ruckus about why they weren't, maybe there'd be a re-release without the offensive crap tacked on within a year. (As most non-suicidal companies would likely choose DRM-less releases over bankruptcy.

 

i never got that either. 'i'll show them, i'm just gonna pirate it!'. if something offended me to that point i'm not going to waste a second of my life on it. theres plenty of things in entertainment i don't like, i simply ignore them and focus on what gives me what i'm looking for. the worst thing one can do is give them more ammo for their inane arguments.

[xg4bx]

double post. do people actually think gamestop going out of business would be good for the industry? where are the developers of smaller, niche games supposed to peddle their wares, direct marketing? stick it up on amazon and pray people learn it exists? do you seriously think best buy would carry niche games? i dare say that the industry is only in its relative state of health because of gamestop. several games only exist in this country because gamestop picked them up i.e. some of the recent wii rpgs.

 

don't like their trade in values or whatever? then don't trade your stuff in. i go in, buy my game and leave. i don't know how it became this intense, pitched-battle filled experience for people. 'well their used games are only x cheaper than new....' so don't buy games used from there. people act like gamestop has a gun held against their head and forces them to participate in their business practices. 'well used games hurt the industry' yea well having an easy, convienent marketplace for publishers to peddle their wares helps the industry. many new game purchases only occur because people have the 'currency' of a trade-in.

 

publishers know this. if they really hated their practices so much they'd cease doing business with them instead of providing them incentive after incentive and gamestop-only bonuses. lets see a pub put their money where their mouth is and refuse to sell or advertise through gamestop. it'll never happen.

[Mord]

double post. do people actually think gamestop going out of business would be good for the industry? where are the developers of smaller, niche games supposed to peddle their wares, direct marketing? stick it up on amazon and pray people learn it exists? do you seriously think best buy would carry niche games? i dare say that the industry is only in its relative state of health because of gamestop. several games only exist in this country because gamestop picked them up i.e. some of the recent wii rpgs.

 

don't like their trade in values or whatever? then don't trade your stuff in. i go in, buy my game and leave. i don't know how it became this intense, pitched-battle filled experience for people. 'well their used games are only x cheaper than new....' so don't buy games used from there. people act like gamestop has a gun held against their head and forces them to participate in their business practices. 'well used games hurt the industry' yea well having an easy, convienent marketplace for publishers to peddle their wares helps the industry. many new game purchases only occur because people have the 'currency' of a trade-in.

 

publishers know this. if they really hated their practices so much they'd cease doing business with them instead of providing them incentive after incentive and gamestop-only bonuses. lets see a pub put their money where their mouth is and refuse to sell or advertise through gamestop. it'll never happen.

 

Gamestop going out of business would leave a void behind it. Without Gamestop around, it would be far easier for another startup to build a replacement video game store chain. One would hope that the new store would have learned from the failures of the ones they're replacing and NOT REPEAT IT. Although greed would eventually settle in and we'd just see a cycle form.

 

And you'll have to remember that Gamestop is where it is because it bought out all of the competition and merged it into themselves. If they hadn't done that we'd still have half a dozen or more different chains of video game stores. And if Gamestop did fall, with no immediate alternative, publishers would likely spend a bit of money advertising their games and how to get it off of Amazon.

 

I guess what I'm saying is that regardless of whether or not it's good for the industry if Gamestop were to go under, it won't be the end of the industry either. Not by a long shot.

[doubleminor]

The games industry is killing itself from within. There was this article today from the makers of Time Splitters: http://www.computera...ng-us-says-dev/

 

Also, the creator of Minecraft said a while back the demise of GAME stores in the UK was "fun to watch". He also said the reason for GAME's demise was digital distribution. Not long after he said that, GAME came out of administration (I think that's the term) and looks to be recovering. Wonder if Minecraft guy is eating his words?

 

Looking at the Wiki entry for GAME, I can't say the company looks all that healthy regardless. I don't think it's entirely due to digital distribution however, so that part Notch can feel free to eat. "Administration" appears to be the UK's equivalent to bankruptcy/etc. The only reason they came out of it is because someone bought them. The same company that offered to buy them prior to them going into administration actually - but was refused.

 

From their practices listed on the wiki, they're not much different from Gamestop (And the references of electronic boutique, which was bought out by gamestop probably shows why...). So that part I'd have to admit he's right about. It would be fun to watch it's demise. As much fun as watching gamestop go bankrupt.

 

I'm more concerned with the loss of jobs rather than someone's opinion on a company that probably has no real effect on his industry. It's easy for Minecraft guy to say he's having "fun" watching the demise because he's made around $8 billion on his little game so far. I've been unemployed before and it's not "fun".

 

Devs have really got into pissypants mode the past couple of years, hiding behind the piracy and gamestop is bad labels. There have been a lot of good games out this gen, but some quality of games have gone down while the amount to make them have gone up. Gamers are just as much to blame as we can vote with our wallets, but most won't because they like their CoD every year.

[Mord]

The games industry is killing itself from within. There was this article today from the makers of Time Splitters: http://www.computera...ng-us-says-dev/

 

Also, the creator of Minecraft said a while back the demise of GAME stores in the UK was "fun to watch". He also said the reason for GAME's demise was digital distribution. Not long after he said that, GAME came out of administration (I think that's the term) and looks to be recovering. Wonder if Minecraft guy is eating his words?

 

Looking at the Wiki entry for GAME, I can't say the company looks all that healthy regardless. I don't think it's entirely due to digital distribution however, so that part Notch can feel free to eat. "Administration" appears to be the UK's equivalent to bankruptcy/etc. The only reason they came out of it is because someone bought them. The same company that offered to buy them prior to them going into administration actually - but was refused.

 

From their practices listed on the wiki, they're not much different from Gamestop (And the references of electronic boutique, which was bought out by gamestop probably shows why...). So that part I'd have to admit he's right about. It would be fun to watch it's demise. As much fun as watching gamestop go bankrupt.

 

I'm more concerned with the loss of jobs rather than someone's opinion on a company that probably has no real effect on his industry. It's easy for Minecraft guy to say he's having "fun" watching the demise because he's made around $8 billion on his little game so far. I've been unemployed before and it's not "fun".

 

Devs have really got into pissypants mode the past couple of years, hiding behind the piracy and gamestop is bad labels. There have been a lot of good games out this gen, but some quality of games have gone down while the amount to make them have gone up. Gamers are just as much to blame as we can vote with our wallets, but most won't because they like their CoD every year.

 

Another thing you shouldn't worry about imo. If the company cared about it's employees it wouldn't do things that upset, harrass, and rip off their customers. It's not our job to think of the employees. Anyone smart would jump ship well before it hit rock bottom anyway. I've been unemployed before as well but if the company I was working for went out of business for it's own faults I wouldn't hold that against the lack of customers avoiding the store.

[mbd30]

""From a business perspective that would be absolutely awesome," he told the publication. 'It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well.'"

 

Yeah gaming should run like the PC software industry. Pretty much everyone pays full price for their PC software firsthand. Well 4 or 5 people do I guess.

 

A lot of PC software is freeware/shareware or has freeware alternatives, and the OS comes with the computer. Even without pirating, except for games, the average computer user rarely has to pay for software.