ColleenLover Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Over the course of 20 years I have purchased/owned/resold Thirty Eight (38) 1200XLs. The purpose of my quest was to obtain a collection of 4 NEW (or as close as new) "perfect 1200XLs. Finished that project last year I have 1 "new" and three 9.8-9.9/10 others. All have 100% keyboards. Rev 11 OSs 28 PIN OS Sockets I can assure you, that the rev 11 OS is definitely more compatible, in fact I can't tell the difference between REV 11 OS and an 800XL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugarland Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, ColleenLover said: Over the course of 20 years I have purchased/owned/resold Thirty Eight (38) 1200XLs. The purpose of my quest was to obtain a collection of 4 NEW (or as close as new) "perfect 1200XLs. Finished that project last year I have 1 "new" and three 9.8-9.9/10 others. All have 100% keyboards. Rev 11 OSs 28 PIN OS Sockets I can assure you, that the rev 11 OS is definitely more compatible, in fact I can't tell the difference between REV 11 OS and an 800XL. Nice collection! Did they come with Rev 11 or did you upgrade them? Did you use a Best mylar or fix the exiting one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLover Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 (edited) 1 came with the rev 11 OS, the other 3, I upgraded myself. None have the BEST Mylar upgrade. Having so many, I had the - luxury of practice - on other ones with the more traditional method using conductive paint. Worked for me I also have a new spare 1200XL motherboard (also with rev 11 OS in reserve) I also have 4-mint 800s (2 with AXLON 128s) 2 New 800XLs 5 130XEs (2-new) 5- mint 810 drives (2-Happy rev 2 ROM) 1- mint ARCHIVER 810 7 MINT 1050 drives 4 happy 1 happy+controller 2 stock Edited May 24, 2020 by ColleenLover 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 1 hour ago, ColleenLover said: I can assure you, that the rev 11 OS is definitely more compatible, in fact I can't tell the difference between REV 11 OS and an 800XL. 2 differences I know about, the stock 1200XL uses an external BASIC cartridge, the OS/MMU don't support internal BASIC. Both versions of the 1200XL OS don't support PBI. Not much of an issue since they don't have the port, just that the OS must be replaced if the computer is modified to have a PBI port(whether internally or using a cartridge port adapter). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLover Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Aw yes! both good points! However, that very fact, is one of several reasons I prefer the 1200XL! We all know that the vast majority of the time we don't need BASIC anyways, and remembering the OPTION key gets old. If only Atari had done that feature correctly and "reverse BASIC" (Push OPTION FOR BASIC) was the normal right from the start... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACML Posted May 24, 2020 Author Share Posted May 24, 2020 (edited) I too have had many 1200XLs through my hands over the years. Also, like you, I retained five really nice specimens that all look new. Only on one occasion did I ever run across a Rev 11 OS 1200XL in the wilds of eBay, but I'm pretty sure it was done by the previous owner (not stock). I think, my theory, is that Atari had decided to use up the lot of Rev 10s with the expectation of using the Rev 11s in production once the Rev 10 chips ran out. Sadly, the 1200XL didn't stay in production long enough to exhaust the Rev 10 inventory. And yes, there are a few software titles that will work on a 800XL, but not on a Rev 11. I'd say Rev 11 has 97%+ compatibility with the 800XL OS. I mod all my 1200XLs with 28 pin sockets, using two 27128s, I burn the 800XL and Omniview OS on them. The 800XL OS retains all 1200XL keyboard and LED functionality. I re-purpose the the channel 3-4 channel selector switch as my OS selector. I also add the ClearPic2002 video mod and of course the R63 5VDC fix to R63. To me, these are the pinnacle of Atari 8-bit engineering achievement. There are memory mods and other upgrades you can do, but to me, my near stock 1200XL and a SIO2SD does everything I need. Also, I have yet to find a keyboard that needed a Best mylar as everyone has been serviceable and easily fixed with BARE conductive paint. The first one is the hardest, but I've gotten so proficient at it, I can fix a keyboard in under 20 minutes (minus the cure time). I've had so many because I enjoy fixing them, and I select the best of the best to keep. It's a fun hobby and it better be because I sure haven't made any money off my efforts (investment of time especially). I do it for enjoyment and part of the enjoyment is knowing there are nice Code 1 working 1200XLs out in the world that might otherwise be in a landfill. Edited May 24, 2020 by ACML 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLover Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 I feel very much the same way, however, I prefer the "simple 1200XL video fix" in my experience, it provides 90% of the improvement of the Clearpic upgrade, but it take only a few minutes. 1200XL Simple Video MOD Remove L15 and replace with a wire. Remove C60 and replace with *nothing* Connect the missing chroma line at R45 to Pin #4 of Video Jack. (counting from LEFT on TOP of board) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 Is it simpler to burn the Rev 11 OS and plop it in? Or just get the Atari Max 32 in 1? I was going to order one, but then someone convinced me to just got the U1MB route... but for my 1200xl that already has the 256kb rambo, why not upgrade the OS? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 simpler yes, but the 32in1 is a very nice upgrade when the 1200XL already has memory added. and it will make future upgrades like pbi mods easier in the future as some of the changes and os swap are already done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLover Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 Yes is fact you are on my path!.. the rev 11OS is a simple drop in upgrade and with it already having 256K.. and no BASIC unless you want it? Well, you are all set... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 12 hours ago, leech said: Is it simpler to burn the Rev 11 OS and plop it in? Or just get the Atari Max 32 in 1? The 32-in-1 is nice, but are relatively pricey and a little convoluted to reprogram with your own selection of OS's. 4 or less is probably sufficient for most people, and you can use a simple adapter and a larger EPROM for 2 or 4 OS's: https://atariage.com/forums/topic/287179-diy-4xos-switch/ https://www.bitsofthepast.com/?product=4in1-os-adapter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 Use the latest XE OS ROM in this if you want full PBI functionality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bandit Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 I have picked up another 1200xl about 2 months ago and was reading this thread. One thing I can tell you is the Star Raiders II would not work on my main 1200XL until BOB found a fix with a wire from CPU to Cartridge Port which worked. This 1200xl I just got has the c060616B os and Star raiders II works fine so I wonder if and other things were done to it or just the OS ? no sign of any work on motherboard. US Made. 193 date code 83S DA 75094 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 On 5/24/2020 at 12:02 PM, ColleenLover said: Over the course of 20 years I have purchased/owned/resold Thirty Eight (38) 1200XLs. The purpose of my quest was to obtain a collection of 4 NEW (or as close as new) "perfect 1200XLs. Finished that project last year I have 1 "new" and three 9.8-9.9/10 others. All have 100% keyboards. Rev 11 OSs 28 PIN OS Sockets I can assure you, that the rev 11 OS is definitely more compatible, in fact I can't tell the difference between REV 11 OS and an 800XL. Hi, my name is Leech, and I too am a 1200xl addict.... 2 minutes ago, bandit said: I have picked up another 1200xl about 2 months ago and was reading this thread. One thing I can tell you is the Star Raiders II would not work on my main 1200XL until BOB found a fix with a wire from CPU to Cartridge Port which worked. This 1200xl I just got has the c060616B os and Star raiders II works fine so I wonder if and other things were done to it or just the OS ? no sign of any work on motherboard. US Made. 193 date code 83S DA 75094 So this just leaves me with the question... I have a completely stock (but for some reason missing all the screws and missing all but two of the pieces that hold the metal shield together... I mean this 1200 still lacks the voltage fix for the SIO port too) and one that has the SuperVideo mod (I did myself) and 256kb of RAM. It did have a toggle switch connected up for some reason, wonder if it was a compatibility thing like this? Though it was not hooked up to the cart at all, and just seemed to connect to pins on a chip. I am probably going to be putting a U1MB in the stock one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 I have three 1200XLs - one I repaired and restored in a 6 week marathon in the summer of 2017. That one has an Ultimate 1MB in it, along with a UAV and the SIO +5V fix. My second machine is mostly-stock but also has a UAV in it, plus the +5V SIO fix. My third one is completely stock and looks fantastic but is missing one key on the keyboard. I have a replacement keyboard for it, but I just have never gotten around to doing the replacement. I recently received a batch of blank 8K EPROMs - I plan to mod my second 1200XL this weekend to accept EPROMs in place of the stock mask ROMs and install the rev 11 OS on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, DrVenkman said: I have three 1200XLs - one I repaired and restored in a 6 week marathon in the summer of 2017. That one has an Ultimate 1MB in it, along with a UAV and the SIO +5V fix. My second machine is mostly-stock but also has a UAV in it, plus the +5V SIO fix. My third one is completely stock and looks fantastic but is missing one key on the keyboard. I have a replacement keyboard for it, but I just have never gotten around to doing the replacement. I recently received a batch of blank 8K EPROMs - I plan to mod my second 1200XL this weekend to accept EPROMs in place of the stock mask ROMs and install the rev 11 OS on it. I think I would like to just put in the rev 11 in the one that has the memory upgrade in it, what mod needs to be done for it to accept EPROMS? Always like putting my prigrammer to good use! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 22 minutes ago, leech said: I think I would like to just put in the rev 11 in the one that has the memory upgrade in it, what mod needs to be done for it to accept EPROMS? Always like putting my prigrammer to good use! There is another thread around here somewhere that discusses this from about a month ago. Basically, there are couple of jumpers on the motherboard that need to be rearranged and/or removed. If your machine has 24-pin sockets, you’ll have to replace them with 28-pin sockets or “cheat” with a set of female header pins to enlarge the existing sockets. 24-pin socketed machines have vias available for this. EDIT: Here is the post where Bob shows the mods necessary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Odd, I see this tidbit on Best's site. Quote Atari US 1200XL Operating System back to Atari 400 / 800 US OS Upgrade. Atari users have always loved the Atari 1200XL Keyboard feel, but have always had to deal with the slightly different 1200XL OS that was not always compatiable with the larger volume of Atari 400 / 800 software. That's a different upgrade than the Rev11 from what I can tell. Part number is CB103139 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bandit Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, leech said: Odd, I see this tidbit on Best's site. That's a different upgrade than the Rev11 from what I can tell. Part number is CB103139 Been testing more, The REV11 OS much better, BOB1200XL did a wire Tap Years ago to fix Star Raiders 2, this new os runs it fine and also eagles nest , both cartridges run fine, been play testing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACML Posted July 3, 2020 Author Share Posted July 3, 2020 Here is another approach.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, ACML said: Here is another approach.... Worth pointing out that your version with switchable OS ROMs requires 16K EPROMS (27128’s or 27C128’s I guess?) rather than the usual 8K 2764/27C64’s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 1 minute ago, DrVenkman said: Worth pointing out that your version with switchable OS ROMs requires 16K EPROMS (27128’s or 27C128’s I guess?) rather than the usual 8K 2764/27C64’s. Guess the real question is, what are easier to get? I know I had to order the EPROMS I burned the Amiga Kickstart 3.1.4 to from China. Sure that's where most of them originate from still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Just now, leech said: Guess the real question is, what are easier to get? I know I had to order the EPROMS I burned the Amiga Kickstart 3.1.4 to from China. Sure that's where most of them originate from still. They’re all available on eBay from various sellers. Some ship from the US (which is handy for US buyers) some don’t. I bought some 27C256 32K EPROMs a month or so ago from a US seller and had them in 5 days. I bought some other 27C64s from a Chinese seller, and they took about a month to arrive. Your mileage may vary (as will the cost). And there’s always a risk of a counterfeit or defective chip. *shrug* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Side note, having an active thread on AtariAge opened in 4 different tabs causes a lot of noise on one's computer... Maybe if I'm going to mess around with the one, I'll probably end up just throwing in the 32 in 1 (also because I don't have a system with that in there, gotta catch 'em all, as they say!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StickJock Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 (edited) EDIT: This got posted in the wrong thread! Leaving it here since it got quoted already. Man, tough crowd. I'm glad I didn't make a joke about DrVenkman's 800's power light looking like it was sitting a little higher than OEM.... ? Edited July 3, 2020 by StickJock Somehow got posted in the wrong thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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