Dino Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Unlikely. Most likely a C&D would be issued and put an end to the repros. Of course if the C&D were not followed, then damages would follow. Nagn really shot himself in the foot with this one. No way either of these are going to go for as much as if only one was in known existence, no matter how much these sell for now .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari181 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Wow! I thought for sure that after almost thirty years he(Steve Shustack) had no legal rights to it anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Nope. his rights are still VERY real... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homerwannabee Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) Well shouldn't the copyright laws be in effect for all the prototypes that have repros as well? Also if you say "It was released!" Well so was Gammaattack, and that had repros of that cart as well. Edited September 7, 2012 by homerwannabee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari181 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Nope. his rights are still VERY real... Glad I'm not in this anymore. That could become a pretty hairy deal for someone who shells out bunch for it. Especially given Steve's attitude towards reproing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Well shouldn't the copyright laws be in effect for all the prototypes that have repros as well? Also if you say "It was released!" Well so was Gammaattack, and that had repros of that cart as well. Correct. It does. Typically, all the old games you can legally distribute the ROMs which constitute "public domain" are only allowed to be shared as the owner has relinqiushed their copyright rights. Bob was well within his rights to stop the Gamma Attack repros. He chose not to do so, presumably because of the high costs of defending one's rights through the court system. That's how I would imagine this would play out. Its unlikely Steve would get wind that these are being sold through AA and even if he did, the cost of defending his rights would be enormous when compared to the damages he could claim. You wouldn't sue someone for stealing your ice-cream would you, even though you had the legal right to do so? He would probably take it as far as a C&D, but I highly doubt he would take it any further. Depends on how deep his pockets and his principles are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Climber Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! I agree, unless as mentioned somebody buys both of them. Sounds like nagn2 got cart blocked. lol I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! Actually, in order to reproduce the cartridges, you will need the authors permission to do it. I am sure that he is aware of these auctions and realizes that he has the opportunity to profit from his game. Currently in the United States the term for software copyright is the life of the author plus 70 years. He can file suit against anyone who infringes on his copyright. Given the auction values that might be realized on these games, he would likely recover substantial damages (up to $150,000.00 per instance!). I'm sure your joking but if not I would be absolutely amazed if something actually happened. The legal fees that Steve would have to pay just explaining the situation to an attorney would probably be $1000. I can just picture the lawyer now.. "so...whats an Atari?" lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bojay1997 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! I agree, unless as mentioned somebody buys both of them. Sounds like nagn2 got cart blocked. lol I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! Actually, in order to reproduce the cartridges, you will need the authors permission to do it. I am sure that he is aware of these auctions and realizes that he has the opportunity to profit from his game. Currently in the United States the term for software copyright is the life of the author plus 70 years. He can file suit against anyone who infringes on his copyright. Given the auction values that might be realized on these games, he would likely recover substantial damages (up to $150,000.00 per instance!). I'm sure your joking but if not I would be absolutely amazed if something actually happened. The legal fees that Steve would have to pay just explaining the situation to an attorney would probably be $1000. I can just picture the lawyer now.. "so...whats an Atari?" lol Actually, under Federal law, the prevailing party in a copyright infringement lawsuit can recover not only their costs, but also attorney's fees. As such, it would be pretty easy to find a lawyer that would take it under contingency assuming they could be convinced that the person doing the infringement has some assets they can go after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zwackery Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Thank you, Dino, for taking the time to articulate all of this. While I appreciate the efforts of historical preservation, the fact is that - under our current system of copyright law - making reproductions of many of these games is a violation of law. With that, there is the letter of the law and the spirit of the law, and what the overall sense of ethics there is about all this. It would be ethical, as well as just polite, to get permission from Mr. Stacks and possibly even go so far as to give him a cut of any reproductions made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangasinan Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 But what if the buyer was an overseas buyer and making repros was NOT against the law in their country then the American copyright law would have no effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 LOL what about this scenario. Soon as buyer talks about making repros, Steve releases the stash of a few hundred he didn't want to go dig out. That would kill the repros as well as a quick jab at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeusExMachina Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! I agree, unless as mentioned somebody buys both of them. Sounds like nagn2 got cart blocked. lol I think the interesting thing is going to be the race to make reproduction carts! Actually, in order to reproduce the cartridges, you will need the authors permission to do it. I am sure that he is aware of these auctions and realizes that he has the opportunity to profit from his game. Currently in the United States the term for software copyright is the life of the author plus 70 years. He can file suit against anyone who infringes on his copyright. Given the auction values that might be realized on these games, he would likely recover substantial damages (up to $150,000.00 per instance!). I'm sure your joking but if not I would be absolutely amazed if something actually happened. The legal fees that Steve would have to pay just explaining the situation to an attorney would probably be $1000. I can just picture the lawyer now.. "so...whats an Atari?" lol No, I am not joking. I'm sure he could find an attorney who would take his case on contingency. If not, he would recover his legal fees as part of the judgement. The owner has clearly stated that he did not want repros made and it would be easy to prove that we all know his wishes. He can show that his software has value based on the two auction results. A good attorney can take those auction values and extrapolate them into significant actual damages. Add in some punitive damages and court costs and it's game over for the defendant. Spending money on the cartridges gets you a rare item. If you want to sell repros on this one, the better money is spent coming to an agreement with the owner of the copyright. Unfortunately, that may be both difficult and costly due to the attention that this item has received and the prices that will be realized by these auctions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberArcade Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 It seems like a bad idea to me to put a second cart up for sale at the same time. They will probably both sell for less than they would have if spaced out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeusExMachina Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 It seems like a bad idea to me to put a second cart up for sale at the same time. They will probably both sell for less than they would have if spaced out. It is only bad for the seller of the cartridge with the inferior label. He would have done better if the auction ended before the second one started. He would have done much better if he had sold it before the other one was found. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss 2600 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Only just noticed that, stupendous $73.98 for shipping. After seeing $33 for shipping I was like OMG. The I did a bit of research on usps and if this gets insured for the maximum $5,000 it's more like $60 shipped, then add in signature confirmation w/return receipt and it's even higher. edit: those prices are for 1 state away too lol. After seeing $33 for shipping I was like OMG. The I did a bit of research on usps and if this gets insured for the maximum $5,000 it's more like $60 shipped, then add in signature confirmation w/return receipt and it's even higher. edit: those prices are for 1 state away too lol. When cart sells for this much the shipping should be for free. I contacted them via Facebook and they didn't realize shipping prices were coming out so high for different places. Here's what they posted: "I put in 3 day delivery, maybe I input the info wrong. Hopefully $25 will not dissuade the potential winner. wink" I pointed out that it was coming out $62.89 in Austin, TX. They thought that was weird and were going to look into it. After looking into it they posted: "So, I just got off the phone with ebay. They said because there are bids I can not edit the listing without cancelling it. Therefore I will adjust the price in checkout. Sorry, my brain isn't too smart when it comes to computers and such." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2600 Forever Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 WTF is it with this nagn2 and mediumbob character? Over $5K and reserve not met, I hope neither sells, that is greedy as shit. Thanks to some of you, it is very likely that nobody will get to play this now. Stupid lawyer talk over a fucking 30 year old homebrew. Thanks a lot, chumps! 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari181 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 WTF is it with this nagn2 and mediumbob character? Over $5K and reserve not met, I hope neither sells, that is greedy as shit. Thanks to some of you, it is very likely that nobody will get to play this now. Stupid lawyer talk over a fucking 30 year old homebrew. Thanks a lot, chumps! I for one am glad about the lawyer talk, I may have actually bid higher. Not informing someone about potential legal action against them so you can play a game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nopaybob Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) WTF is it with this nagn2 and mediumbob character? Over $5K and reserve not met, I hope neither sells, that is greedy as shit. Thanks to some of you, it is very likely that nobody will get to play this now. Stupid lawyer talk over a fucking 30 year old homebrew. Thanks a lot, chumps! Maybe their related?...Its just the same ole run of the mill elaborate setup and scam anyway, They both will be paid for before either can be proven bs. Edited September 7, 2012 by nopaybob 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari181 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 "nopaybob", "mediumbob" ? You both have the same last name. I think you are part of this whole thing, aren't you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangasinan Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 "nopaybob", "mediumbob" ? You both have the same last name. I think you are part of this whole thing, aren't you! He could also be Sideshow Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nopaybob Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 "nopaybob", "mediumbob" ? You both have the same last name. I think you are part of this whole thing, aren't you! Omg! Please let us not be related please please please not be related.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+5-11under Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I don't mind paying 10K for a game, but close to $100 for shipping!! I'm out. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop2 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) Am I the only one who finds it interesting that we are debating the ethics/legal rammifications of making repro carts of a Biblically themed game which the creator has said he did not want reproduced? Someone is goin to Hell for a Red Sea Crossing cart! Edited September 7, 2012 by Robocop2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2600 Forever Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Someone is goin to Hell for a Red Sea Crossing cart! For sure, the author, for ripping off Moses with his homebrew. Gods lawyers are already in contact with Steve, but I don't think he'll stand a chance. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss 2600 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 All the bidders so far on Medium Bob's cartridge have excellent feedback. The bottom one with the 1002 feedback is me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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