7800 games that should have existed?

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

 

 

For the curious, a developer did (start) one possible version/port of Tempest a while ago.

Is GroovyBee still making games? Between the Tempest port and the Boulder Dash clone, there appears to be some neat unfinished homebrews on his plate.

 

Wasp and Worm from the AA store are also fun, if a bit under appreciated.

Edited August 19, 2014 by stardust4ever

[Lynxpro]

Let's really pull the strings of the imagination...

 

The Atari 7800 gets released for it, not just Road Runner, but has the LaserDisc add-on for use via the Expansion Interface, and Road Runner: 'The LaserDisc Edition' (An Arcade prototype) is made available:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1BL_nkq64w

 

 

Yes folks, this can go on forever...

 

Yet another title that could've made it to the JagCD a decade later. That and Firefox!

[Trebor]

Is GroovyBee still making games? Between the Tempest port and the Boulder Dash clone, there appears to be some neat unfinished homebrews on his plate.

 

Entire WIP list is included here. GroovyBee has been active in the Intellivision scene the last couple of years.

Though Curt indicated he's back on board with helping to get the XM out as circumstances permit.

 

As far as making (completed) games for the 7800 (With or without requiring the XM module), only one person knows without doubt, but he has been silent in this forum for quite some time now.

 

Regardless, thankfully we have a crop of both familiar and relatively new faces taking an active interest in developing for the 7800.

[Prosystemsearch]

Double Dragon 3, space Dungeon(with POKEY), and YS: the vanished omen.

[Jet-X]

Yet another title that could've made it to the JagCD a decade later. That and Firefox!

 

Back at Sony Imagesoft, I went down the path to license Firefox for the SegaCD at the time. It became a cluster ****, because you had Atari Corp. who owned the home rights; Warner Bros. who owned the film rights; and Clint Eastwood who also owned the rights to the movie. Needless to say it never got beyond initial discussions with WB, they were less inclined due to all the rights involved.

 

Would have been slightly less of an issue had Atari done it on the Jaguar, but still having to deal with two licensees would have been a pain. On top of that, the arcade game wasn't very long. Would have been ideal to do it as a Java run game and included it on the Blu-Ray disc release of the movie.

[Andromeda Stardust]

That and Firefox!

[Lost Dragon]

Regarding the C64 port of Rastan as basis for 7800 conversion etc.I looked into the C64 version, coded by John Meegan who loathed the arcade original, just got stuck with the C64 version, coded in 8 months, graphics artist (Jane Lowe) was inexperienced and had never used a computer before, let alone worked on graphics for a C64 game and if he could re-do it, he'd get the rope sequence right, even if it meant graphics being comprimised.

 

So...good chance a 7800 version if given to right team would of been (could still be..) better than the C64 version

[Prosystemsearch]

NARC should have had a 7800 port. It would have made a good PAL only release along with Sentinel.

[Prosystemsearch]

NARC ande Skate or Die! Should have had 7800 ports? Both Would have been great with Pokey.

[Lynxpro]

NARC ande Skate or Die! Should have had 7800 ports? Both Would have been great with Pokey.

 

Skate or Die was a rip-off of Atari Games' 720 Degrees, IMHO.

[2600 Forever]

 

Skate or Die was a rip-off of Atari Games' 720 Degrees, IMHO.

 

Please, for the love of "insert your choice here", stop responding to this troll.

[Prosystemsearch]

 

Please, for the love of "insert your choice here", stop responding to this troll.

Stop assuming that I'm a troll, please? What did I ever do to you that was so bad?

[Jinks]

NARC ande Skate or Die! Should have had 7800 ports? Both Would have been great with Pokey.

Great with a gumby chips. They are next to the doritos.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Forget Doritos...

 

Pokey chips are on floor 3 by the craps tables and roulette wheels!

[Lynxpro]

 

Back at Sony Imagesoft, I went down the path to license Firefox for the SegaCD at the time. It became a cluster ****, because you had Atari Corp. who owned the home rights; Warner Bros. who owned the film rights; and Clint Eastwood who also owned the rights to the movie. Needless to say it never got beyond initial discussions with WB, they were less inclined due to all the rights involved.

 

Would have been slightly less of an issue had Atari done it on the Jaguar, but still having to deal with two licensees would have been a pain. On top of that, the arcade game wasn't very long. Would have been ideal to do it as a Java run game and included it on the Blu-Ray disc release of the movie.

 

Thanks for the info, Jet-X. Are you sure it was Atari Corp and not Atari Games that held the home video game rights to Firefox? If it was Atari Corp, it still could've been a pack-in title for the JagCD had they chosen to do so. Atari Corp was working with Time Warner quite a bit during the Jaguar's release so the only true obstacle would've been Clint Eastwood himself.

[Jet-X]

Yes because Atari Corp owns all the home rights for any Atari coinop pre-1985 (now Infogrames/Atari), and Atari Games (now Midway) owns all post 1985 rights.

 

Whether or not Time Warner would have wanted to deal with the Eastwood issue I cannot vouch for. Again it was also a short game.

 

Side note I was working on an Atari classics (vector mostly) for Playstation. We had a deal along with Lucasfilm to include Star Wars, Empire, Major Havoc, Quantum, Red Baron, and many others.

 

It was killed off at the 11th hour when Atari started suing Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and 3DO for patent infringement.

 

Would have been great and would have made full use of all the third party controllers like the track ball, NegCon, and more. I still have the memos from Atari and the PowerPoint I did for the game. Oh, Cloak and Dagger would have also been included

[Lynxpro]

Yes because Atari Corp owns all the home rights for any Atari coinop pre-1985 (now Infogrames/Atari), and Atari Games (now Midway) owns all post 1985 rights.

 

Whether or not Time Warner would have wanted to deal with the Eastwood issue I cannot vouch for. Again it was also a short game.

 

Side note I was working on an Atari classics (vector mostly) for Playstation. We had a deal along with Lucasfilm to include Star Wars, Empire, Major Havoc, Quantum, Red Baron, and many others.

 

It was killed off at the 11th hour when Atari started suing Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and 3DO for patent infringement.

 

Would have been great and would have made full use of all the third party controllers like the track ball, NegCon, and more. I still have the memos from Atari and the PowerPoint I did for the game. Oh, Cloak and Dagger would have also been included

 

Well, Atari was successful in forcing Nintendo and Sega to settle for their patent infringement. I don't recall any settlements with 3DO [did they get 2 nickels out of them?] or Sony.

 

I'd say the line of delineation of Atari arcade game rights starts and ends at July 1984 when Atari Inc was split up. Because Paperboy and Marble Madness were both released in 1984 and Atari Games [the IP WB Games owns today] clearly owned them. Firefox must've been released in late 1983/early 1984 for Atari Corp to have rights to it. I'm sure it was planned that that would be one of the first titles available for the 7800 LaserDisc Player which of course was never released.

 

Great info. How were you going to get Atari Trak-Balls to work with the Playstation? Were you aiming for the 2600/A8 Trak-Balls or the 5200 Trak-Ball? I'll have to let Dan Kramer know about that.

 

Also, how far along with the coding did you get? If that's floating around, perhaps it could still be done via PSN for the PS3 or PS4. Although I guess an Atari DB9-to-USB cable adapter would be needed. Not sure if there's a DB15-to-USB out there for the 5200 Trak-Ball.

[Prosystemsearch]

 

Please, for the love of "insert your choice here", stop responding to this troll.

Why do you think I'm a a troll here?

[Jet-X]

 

 

I'd say the line of delineation of Atari arcade game rights starts and ends at July 1984 when Atari Inc was split up. Because Paperboy and Marble Madness were both released in 1984 and Atari Games [the IP WB Games owns today] clearly owned them. Firefox must've been released in late 1983/early 1984 for Atari Corp to have rights to it. I'm sure it was planned that that would be one of the first titles available for the 7800 LaserDisc Player which of course was never released.

 

​Semantics really. July 1984 is half way through the year, hence why I said pre-1985. As for being a 7800 LD game, I don't know, Curt or someone else would have to answer for that.

Firefox was 1983.

 

 

 

 

Great info. How were you going to get Atari Trak-Balls to work with the Playstation? Were you aiming for the 2600/A8 Trak-Balls or the 5200 Trak-Ball? I'll have to let Dan Kramer know about that.

 

We weren't. Third party development. In fact, Dan Kramer was doing IIRC the trackball design for Nyko that was eventually released. That's what we would have used along with the Playstation Mouse (and the dual shock controllers). No hybrid adapters were planned.

 

 

lso, how far along with the coding did you get? If that's floating around, perhaps it could still be done via PSN for the PS3 or PS4. Although I guess an Atari DB9-to-USB cable adapter would be needed. Not sure if there's a DB15-to-USB out there for the 5200 Trak-Ball.

 

Coding never started. It all fell apart pretty quickly with the lawsuits. We had a deal memo accepted by Atari, and ready for signature by Sony Interactive Studios head of development along with Kaz Hirai and Andrew House. The lawsuit killed off the game.

 

 

 

 

 

[Lost Dragon]

@Jet-X:Re: 'Side note I was working on an Atari classics (vector mostly) for Playstation. We had a deal along with Lucasfilm to include Star Wars, Empire, Major Havoc, Quantum, Red Baron, and many others.

 

It was killed off at the 11th hour when Atari started suing Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and 3DO for patent infringement.'

 

 

Huge thanks for posting this, jaw dropped when i started reading (what could of been).

 

Gutted to here it fell at the 1st hurdle and reasons why.

 

 

Lawsuits, always the damn lawsuits...i know they've been part and parcel of the industry for so long, but..bloody hell!!!.

 

Would they have been released as 'stand-alone' titles do you know? or on a Retro-type compilation or volumes of....?

[Lynxpro]

 

​Semantics really. July 1984 is half way through the year, hence why I said pre-1985. As for being a 7800 LD game, I don't know, Curt or someone else would have to answer for that.

Firefox was 1983.

 

 

 

 

 

We weren't. Third party development. In fact, Dan Kramer was doing IIRC the trackball design for Nyko that was eventually released. That's what we would have used along with the Playstation Mouse (and the dual shock controllers). No hybrid adapters were planned.

 

 

 

Coding never started. It all fell apart pretty quickly with the lawsuits. We had a deal memo accepted by Atari, and ready for signature by Sony Interactive Studios head of development along with Kaz Hirai and Andrew House. The lawsuit killed off the game.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wow. Just wow. Great info!

 

I knew Dan Kramer did a lot of accessories for the likes of Nyko but I didn't know he was working on a Trak-Ball for them.

 

Great info. Speaking of Sony and ex-Atari people, Jerry Jessop still works for them.

[Lynxpro]

@Jet-X:Re: 'Side note I was working on an Atari classics (vector mostly) for Playstation. We had a deal along with Lucasfilm to include Star Wars, Empire, Major Havoc, Quantum, Red Baron, and many others.

 

It was killed off at the 11th hour when Atari started suing Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and 3DO for patent infringement.'

 

 

Huge thanks for posting this, jaw dropped when i started reading (what could of been).

 

Gutted to here it fell at the 1st hurdle and reasons why.

 

 

Lawsuits, always the damn lawsuits...i know they've been part and parcel of the industry for so long, but..bloody hell!!!.

 

Would they have been released as 'stand-alone' titles do you know? or on a Retro-type compilation or volumes of....?

 

 

Well, Sony did do some underhanded things to Atari Corp. Selling the Playstation [allegedly] below cost, [allegedly] paying off Ubisoft not to release Rayman for the Jaguar until after it was released for the Playstation, etc.

[Jet-X]

 

Would they have been released as 'stand-alone' titles do you know? or on a Retro-type compilation or volumes of....?

 

It would have been a compilation disc, with a virtual arcade featuring all of the arcade cabinets in 3-D (including the variations/conversions). It would have contained (dug up the documents): Cloak & Dagger (as Agent-X to avoid paying license fee); Major Havoc (first time released on any console); Space Duel (first time released on any console); Gravitar; Red Baron (first time released on any console); Black Widow (first time released on any console); Lunar Lander (I could argue this too first time released on any console), Quantum (first time released on any console); and Star Raiders (yes, the Atari Computer version as a hidden title). From Lucasfilm/Atari, it would have been Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back.

 

11 games in total.

 

And it would have also included the prototype versions of Major Havoc (Alpha 1); Gravitar (Lunar Battle); I also planned a library with photos, advertisements, sell sheets/flyers, operators manuals, and more. So the owners of the actual coin-ops also would have a resource if needed.

 

 

 

Speaking of Sony and ex-Atari people, Jerry Jessop still works for them.

 

...and I talk to Jerry almost daily.

[Jet-X]

 

 

[allegedly] paying off Ubisoft not to release Rayman for the Jaguar until after it was released for the Playstation, etc.

 

That's not illegal. That's called "exclusivity" and it's been around since the Atari days.

[Shaggy the Atarian]

@ Shaggy the Atarian:I love your idea for a 7800 Star Raiders type game, but with added bonus of side scrolling sections, features like thjis i feel would really of helped 7800 titles stand out from what the NES etc were offering.

 

Also great to see Crime Busters mentioned, often over-looked on A8 range.

 

Now, would something like C64 Project Firestart of been 'do-able' on 7800 cartridge? if not, i'd have settled for a 7800 conversion of Electric Dreams Aliens game, if the C16 could handle it, would assume 7800 could do it justice?.

 

Thanks! If I ever get around to dabbling in 7800 Basic, its the kind of game I would like to make, along with something kind of like River Raid. That might be all too ambitious for a beginner though.

 

Project Firestart would have been an amazing game to have on the 7800, I don't know how large that game was though. I imagine now it would be doable with a 1M cart?

 

 

Yes to everything you said, but I think the name "Combat" probably would not have excited people. It was old and a relic of another gaming era that really pre-dated the 2600. I look at Countermeasure as a sort of single player successor to Combat with a new name. Thankfully Bob gave us Failsafe which is fun, but I somehow doubt it would have really taken attention away from similar NES arcade ports like Commando, Ikari Warriors, or 1942. I know 2 of those are on the 7800, but they didn't get much praise either.

 

Combat of course has the 2 player competitive aspect which would have offered some variety in the gaming landscape. That may have actually stood out. A Combat game that played more like the computer game Beach Head could have also been very interesting.

 

To clarify why I picked that, back in the mid-80s kids still seemed to have a lot of fun with Combat in circles where I played games. I just imagine that if Atari had given it new paint along with some extras they could have had people stay interested in the concept overall. Much like Nintendo has done with Mario - they have been able to milk that franchise beyond death by adding new features, characters, game modes and so on. Or Adventure II - the concept is still a lot of fun, you give it the right extras handled in an honorable way and it works.

 

I like to imagine a 7800 Combat doing that with the Combat idea, taking it to the next level. Granted this was Tramiel-era so if Combat did happen it probably would have been just a graphics upgrade. In my mind though a Combat update would be a love song to arena type games, to compare to a modern era game, let's say Nintendoland. Various mini-games but all based around competitive arena combat. I think the game done in that manner would have spoke for itself and not needed just the name to make sales.