"New" 5200 joystick from Best?

[Jinks]

the trs80 used anolog stiicks thought they made one that self centred. You could always glue one of those to your old telephone to make a 5200 stick.

Edited November 20, 2012 by Jinks

[yell0w_lantern]

Tandy also uses 100k ohm potentiometers just like the PC sticks but the wiring of the pots is different. Even to use it on a PC or a PC stick on the Tandy or CoCo requires some modification.

[tripletopper]

These are new "Tactile Golds". They ae thikcer gold dots where the bottom buttons have a spring on and off funtcion, which the human finger an tactilly sense when the button is pressed and released. The topp botom has less of that effect, and that'sbecause of the design of the 5200 contolle plastic casing whihc doesn't make it work well It doesn't matter if you reverse the buttons or not.

 

Yes their new 5200 product/service is new.

[shadow460]

Honestly,cost is what's been keeping me from repairing my 5200 controllers. Three of them have bad flex circuits. The fourth has a Rev 9 flex circuit and aluminum dots. I'm going to see how that works for a while. $40 plus shipping and insurance per controller could buy a whole ton of used controllers, glue, and tinfoil. Sooner or later, I'm gonna find more good Rev 9 flex circuits in those used controllers. Once I've found three more of 'em, I'll build my own controllers and then consider what to do with the remaining parts.

 

I'm not doubting the gold internals at all, it' just that $50 or more per controller is pretty steep. I can think of only one first party controller that cost that much by itself, and that was with shipping from Japan.

[82atari5200]

the trs80 used anolog stiicks thought they made one that self centred. You could always glue one of those to your old telephone to make a 5200 stick.

I have some NOS PCjr joysticks that are similar that I've been wanting to see if I could wire them up to work with the 5200 using wico sticks that no longer work. So I'll have PCjr sticks with wico keypads. Sweetness for my weakness.

[toptenmaterial]

The 5200 is such a f+cking pain in the ass. It's a great system that produces gorgeous graphics and sound, but you really need to be technically inclined to keep one up and running, and the controllers are only one aspect of it. I'd like to see a new 5200 altogether. If the hardware is prohibitively expensive to reproduce, then have an NES-on-a-chip setup. Simplify the power supply and include better controllers altogether. And for God's sake, make a good Start button!

[AtariBrian]

The 5200 is such a f+cking pain in the ass. It's a great system that produces gorgeous graphics and sound, but you really need to be technically inclined to keep one up and running, and the controllers are only one aspect of it. I'd like to see a new 5200 altogether. If the hardware is prohibitively expensive to reproduce, then have an NES-on-a-chip setup. Simplify the power supply and include better controllers altogether. And for God's sake, make a good Start button!

I take my controllers apart and either put in the gold kit or use the tinfoil . start works everytime now

[Ransom]

The 5200 is such a f+cking pain in the ass. It's a great system that produces gorgeous graphics and sound, but you really need to be technically inclined to keep one up and running, and the controllers are only one aspect of it. I'd like to see a new 5200 altogether. If the hardware is prohibitively expensive to reproduce, then have an NES-on-a-chip setup. Simplify the power supply and include better controllers altogether. And for God's sake, make a good Start button!

 

You're right, owning a 5200 requires fairly regular tinkering. The controllers themselves are pretty much a solved problem, though, IMO. You can get the ones from BEST that work really well. Or you can modify an old PC joystick like some have done if you'd prefer self-centering. Or get one of the interfaces. Or a Wico and Y-adapter. Lots of choices.

 

The only remaining problem, to me, is that so many games are a little off, as far as the potentiometer values go. If I get it adjusted for one game, it'll need a different adjustment in another game. Right now, for example, it works great for all my games..except for Tempest. I can only get to the "go really fast" speed going counter-clockwise. Clockwise, no matter how far I push the stick, it just goes moderately fast. But for any other analog game (including some finicky ones, such as Blueprint), it works perfectly. If I adjust it to get Tempest working, I'm pretty sure I'll lose some functionality in one of the other games, since it took me a lot of adjusting and testing to get it working with all of them. But I'll have to take the system apart and give it a go when I get some time...

[Charlie_]

You're right, owning a 5200 requires fairly regular tinkering. The controllers themselves are pretty much a solved problem, though, IMO. You can get the ones from BEST that work really well. Or you can modify an old PC joystick like some have done if you'd prefer self-centering. Or get one of the interfaces. Or a Wico and Y-adapter. Lots of choices.

 

The only remaining problem, to me, is that so many games are a little off, as far as the potentiometer values go. If I get it adjusted for one game, it'll need a different adjustment in another game. Right now, for example, it works great for all my games..except for Tempest. I can only get to the "go really fast" speed going counter-clockwise. Clockwise, no matter how far I push the stick, it just goes moderately fast. But for any other analog game (including some finicky ones, such as Blueprint), it works perfectly. If I adjust it to get Tempest working, I'm pretty sure I'll lose some functionality in one of the other games, since it took me a lot of adjusting and testing to get it working with all of them. But I'll have to take the system apart and give it a go when I get some time...

 

 

Hi Ransom. If you have calibrated the pokey adjustment properly the problem could be the controller itself. Could be the nub on top of the potentiometer might need to be tweaked to the right position.

 

 

Sent from my Windows Phone 8X by HTC using Board Express

Edited December 14, 2012 by Official Ninja

[Ransom]

Hi Ransom. If you have calibrated the pokey adjustment properly the problem could be the controller itself. Could be the nub on top of the potentiometer might need to be tweaked to the right position.

 

That's true, that could be the case. I have calibrated it using the diagnostic cart, but the problem occurs no matter which of my controllers I use. It could be that they're all out of spec in the same way, though. I'll take a look at it.

[ApolloBoy]

If all your controllers are having issues it's definitely the adjustment pot on the console itself.

[yell0w_lantern]

Here is the general theory and procedure I followed:

http://hackaday.com/...-your-retro-pc/

 

Here is the 5200 pinout:

http://www.atarihq.c...0faq/04_05.html

 

Parts:

 

2 trimmers

http://www.digikey.c...1318-ND/2408895

 

1 keypad

http://www.digikey.c...H5010-ND/213504

 

1 case

http://www.digikey.c...M916-ND/1090728

 

1 cable (a Neo Geo extension cable)

http://www.ebay.com/...=item1c2826bf82

 

1 joystick

http://www.digikey.c...B60NA-ND/303392

 

2 buttons

http://www.digikey.c...W637-ND/2235509

 

2 Capacitors

http://www.digikey.c...4251-ND/1021486

 

1 Header

http://www.digikey.c...S4008-ND/560040

 

1 joystick cap (hard to mount and use; mine is very loose and is basically stays in because the hole is too small for it to slip out)

http://www.dealextre...ir-72284?item=4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The junk you see around the thumb-stick is the remains of a rubber grommet. I had to remove the grommet because it restricted the thumb pad's motion too severely. You might be able to compensate for it with more capacitance but you would have to measure that out with a multimeter.

 

Also be careful when you lay out the button placement that you don't get too near a screw post or you'll have to mount the button with glue instead of the hex nut.

 

I ran the wires for the number pad into the header then attached that to the pins from the number pad. Work out your matrix carefully. I also used a small project board from radio shack to mount the joystick and organize my wires.

 

If you have an old pad to cannibalize the joystick and cap from like in the article then you may need different caps but you may also save yourself some headaches for mounting the cap too.

 

I had considered not cutting open the extension cable and simply mounting a male DB-15 socket on the front of the pad where the wire now enters.

Noticed I left out the knobs for the potentiometers.

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/PK50B1%2F4/450-1719-ND/1201442

[BigO]

Cool.

 

When I was playing with 5200 controllers, I found the 100K pots to be right on the ragged edge of supporting every game. Based on my unproven assumption about why some games didn't like it, I'd recommend trying the 150k ohm version of that joystick if you find the same thing. I didn't happen upon the 150k version when I was searching.

http://www.ctscorp.com/components/Datasheets/252.pdf

 

Also, I think you'll always have to tweak the centering from game to game. I believe we unknowingly compensate for that slight off-centeredness with the OEM non-centering controllers (which may be why they weren't self-centering in the first place).

[yell0w_lantern]

Cool.

 

When I was playing with 5200 controllers, I found the 100K pots to be right on the ragged edge of supporting every game. Based on my unproven assumption about why some games didn't like it, I'd recommend trying the 150k ohm version of that joystick if you find the same thing. I didn't happen upon the 150k version when I was searching.

http://www.ctscorp.com/components/Datasheets/252.pdf

 

Also, I think you'll always have to tweak the centering from game to game. I believe we unknowingly compensate for that slight off-centeredness with the OEM non-centering controllers (which may be why they weren't self-centering in the first place).

I haven't found any incompatible games yet. I also haven't found any 150k Ohm joysticks at either Digikey or Mouser - seem to be pretty rare items.

[BigO]

I haven't found any incompatible games yet. I also haven't found any 150k Ohm joysticks at either Digikey or Mouser - seem to be pretty rare items.

That link I provided was to a 150K joystick. Ideally, they'd be more like 500K. I checked around and found out I could have them manufactured, but the price was sky high.

 

I seem to remember Popeye being one that didn't respond well to my 100K joystick controller. But, it's been so long that I don't know for sure. I have a multi-cart that I tested with so I covered quite a bit of territory.

[Edit] - I just looked at that datasheet closer. Thought I got to it from a Digi-Key listing for a150K part, the spec sheet says up to 200K.

Edited November 14, 2013 by BigO

[yell0w_lantern]

That link I provided was to a 150K joystick. Ideally, they'd be more like 500K. I checked around and found out I could have them manufactured, but the price was sky high.

 

I seem to remember Popeye being one that didn't respond well to my 100K joystick controller. But, it's been so long that I don't know for sure. I have a multi-cart that I tested with so I covered quite a bit of territory.

[Edit] - I just looked at that datasheet closer. Thought I got to it from a Digi-Key listing for a150K part, the spec sheet says up to 200K.

Nah, 150k are non-stocked with a 1,000 unit minimum. Haven't seen higher than 100k for sale; on data sheets, yes, but not in stock.

 

Not sure if I tried Popeye yet. But then there are a lot of games I haven't tried yet. I should start keeping a list.

 

[EDIT]

I heard there is an adjustment pot in the console. I wonder if that may effect compatibility as well?

Edited November 14, 2013 by yell0w_lantern

[Brian R.]

I got a rebuilt controller from Best a while back. It failed pretty quickly.

 

I'm happy to have my Wico set and not have to bother with or worry about the stock ones, of any type or rebuild scheme.

[Charlie_]

 

 

I'm happy to have my Wico set and not have to bother with or worry about the stock ones, of any type or rebuild scheme.

That's cool. I used to not like the Wico sticks at all. Lately though I have been using them more and more.

Not for any reason really, I still prefer the stock sticks for the games that I enjoy playing on the 5200....

But sometimes the Wicos are good.. like 5200 Space Invaders or Demon Attack.

 

My biggest problem with the Wico stick is that the pot in the controller has a smaller range of motion. (than the stock)

This makes them hard to have a happy center position and time needs to be spent adjusting the slider for each game you play.

Edited November 14, 2013 by Official Ninja