MyIDE ][ vs. SIC vs. ?

[Android8675]

Can someone give me a rundown of the differences between some of these multicarts for 8bits?

Looking for comparisons of features, pros, cons, and pricing.

 

Love to hear positive arguements why one may be better than another. Not really looking to start a pissing contest, just looking for a nice side-by-side.

[+Philsan]

... vs SIDE cart.

[Android8675]

Thanks, are there others? Maybe someone has a webpage of all these Atari Mods somewhere? I have Incognito on the way, a KarinDrive ready for install... at any rate.

[+Philsan]

In my topic for newbies you can find something, but it's aimed for newbies, so no advanced mods.

[+wood_jl]

... vs SIDE cart.

 

EXACTLY! Thanks for bringing that up, Philsan; was wondering myself.

[mimo]

Side cart is like having a HDD plugged in to your Atari. Fast. Built in real time clock.

Plus the side loader is just point and shoot for loading xex files.

[Android8675]

Side cart is like having a HDD plugged in to your Atari. Fast. Built in real time clock.

Plus the side loader is just point and shoot for loading xex files.

 

So.... availability? How's it compare vs other stuff? Price?

 

Edit: Found it... http://www.lotharek.pl/product.php?pid=68 47.27 euros = 61.3092 US dollars (+ shipping?)

Edited November 24, 2012 by Android8675

[Marius]

The MyIDE ][ can do the same, except for the RealTime clock. But the MyIDE ][ is a lot more. Better check Atarimax website for features. It is a very interesting device.

[+Philsan]

MyIDE II doesn't have an hardware button: therefore, if I'm not wrong, it's not possible to switch disks like with SIDE + Ultimate1MB.

[Marius]

That's right, but you can switch almost any disk using the MyIDE OS, with the keyboard.

[+Philsan]

That's right, but you can switch almost any disk using the MyIDE OS, with the keyboard.

Could you please explain me this feature?

I don't know anything about MyIDE OS.

[Marius]

It's quite cool...

 

Let's say you have the Summergames on your MyIDE 'harddisk' (cf card).

 

it contains two sides of the Disk. (During the game, the game asks for flip disk remember?)

 

Ok here you go on MyBIOS (MyIDE OS)

you have transferred A side of Summergames to let's say image slot 35

you have transferred B side of Summergames to let's say image slot 36

(of course you can use any other slot number)

 

You boot image 35..... during the game you will have to flip disk, you simply press on the keyboard Shift+Control+2... this means that the next image is put in D1:

If you need the A side again you press Shift+Control+1...

 

Every program that does not switches off OS or Keyboard IRQ works.

[+Larry]

Ohhh....

 

I feel the "C64 vs. Atari" coming on... (Hope I'm wrong.)

 

-Larry

[Roydea6]

Sic!Cart is great with the monentary switch installed, just press the switch and press RESET to get back to the cart menu.

No need to cycle the power switch to restart the cart.

 

[+Larry]

Well, here are a few screen shots and some things that I've learned from using the MyIDE-II. Note -- I don't have a SIDE cart, so I can't really compare. Also, I'm a MyDos user. I also do not have a SIC cart, but I believe that there is no hard drive provision on SIC, so it is likely more comparable to the original 1-Mb and 8-Mb flash carts from AtariMax.

 

Much more info is now available on the AtariMax web site. The MyIDE-II forum has also been opened.

 

This cartridge has a much richer feature set than the original cartridge. By necessity, it is has a little greater learning curve, but the nice use of selection menus makes the learning curve "shallow." If I've said something in error, please let me know so that I can correct it, and by all means if you are familiar with things I haven't covered, please add some info to this thread.

 

Note that the normal application of the MyIDE-II uses a (reset-proof) custom ram OS. But you can also use the available R2 eprom (image) to provide an additional degree of compatibility.

 

We start by powering up to to the Cart Boot menu. Gives you your basic choices as to load software from one of the "slots" shown. Your choice may or may not boot Dos, depending on what type of software is in the slot. Let's say I just want to boot MyDos, so I press RETURN from the first slot and I go to the MyBios menu. (Note the options for where you will boot to.) From here, I select RETURN which will boot MyDos.

This boots MyDos from the D1: partition.

 

Okay, now suppose I want to do a cold start or re-boot the cartridge. Press Shift-Cntl-Tab which takes us to the RESET Menu:

Esc -- return to where you came from (do nothing)

Reset -- regular warm start

Cold -- simulated cold start

Pwr -- a simulated Power-down/power up which takes us to the (green) MyBios menu.

Basic -- reboots the system to internal Basic

Sio -- Toggles high-speed SIO on/off

Ide -- Disables the IDE drive

 

Well, I need to set up a hard drive, so I need to go to the MyIDE (Partition) menu by pressing HELP from an application screen (MyDos, for instance) -or- Option+Select+Start from the Mybios menu.

 

Simply put, I need to do the following to set up a hard drive partition:

Init the card

Make a partiton (A, B, C, etc.)

-Drive number

-Size in sectors

-Density Single, Double, "Quad" (for SDX)

-Name the partition

 

There is another feature that needs mention -- the MyIDE contains 512KB of SRAM, and much of it is available to the user (448K?). If you don't have a memory expansion in your Atari, then you can use this SRAM as a slightly faster "D8: ramdisk." But MyDos treats this as a regular hard drive (but in single density), so you must use MEM.SAV if you want to use it as the "swap drive" for programming.

 

Okay -- here's what I don't know, and maybe someone else can add info to address these and other features...

The MyIDE-II can use SDX, but I've not done it.

The MyIDE-II can have/use ATR image partiton(s).

There is a SIDE loader feature for the MyIDE-II, but I don't know anything about it.

 

Here's a link to the current version of the manual:

http://www.atarimax....php?f=17&t=1310

 

Sorry for the long post, but lots of features to cover.

-Larry

[a8isa1]

Can someone give me a rundown of the differences between some of these multicarts for 8bits?

Looking for comparisons of features, pros, cons, and pricing.

 

Love to hear positive arguements why one may be better than another. Not really looking to start a pissing contest, just looking for a nice side-by-side.

Basic features from my memory. (If I get anything wrong please don't complain just post the corrections/additions).

 

Banking Carts

 

Atarimax Flashcarts 1mbit and 8mbit (128Kbytes and 1MByte)

- flash memory based

- 8K address space

- banks controlled $D5xx address bits

- loads 8K ROM images, XEX files, disk images, Atari800 Save States (mentioned in the old software documentation), can include 800 Translator

- programmable directly from the Atari or via Atarimax Maxflash Studio software and USB programmer

 

SIC! cart 256KBytes or 512KBytes (or 1MByte ?)

- SRAM with a battery

- 8K or 16K address space

- load 8K and 16K ROM images and XEXes (disk images?)

- Banks on data bits. Introduced a propriety scheme.

- programmable from Atari.

 

Megamax

- flash memory, EPROMs, or SRAM with battery backup

- 512KBytes, 1MBytes, or 2MBytes. Capacity varies with memory type

- 8K or 16K address space

- Banks on address bits

- in 8K mode banking mimics Atarimax 8mbit cart

- in 16K mode banking mimics old Megacart carts (see Jindroush archive for details but I think it's address bits and 16K address space)

- programmable from Atari

 

S/XEGS RAMCART by C.P.U.

- 128KB SRAM with battery

- 16K address space (and 8K?)

- Switchable XEGS banking scheme

- can use unmodified S/XEGS, XEGs, 16K and 8K ROM images (disk images?)

- can be used as a RAMDISK

- programmable from Atari or Atarimax Maxflash Studio/USB programmer.

 

Carts with mass storage

 

MyIDE+Flashcart (MyIDE 1)

 

- flash memory (128KBytes?)

- IDE connector

- works with real ATA HDDs and also CF cards (via IDE/CF adapter)

- Moves/copies OS to RAM. This is the normal mode of operation.

- room on flash memory for a few 8K cartridge images and/or XEXs

 

MyIDE II

- flash memory and SRAM (no battery)

- programmable for Atari and Atarimax Maxflash Studio/USB programmer

- CF socket (Type 1? Type 2?)

- SRAM can be set Read/Write or Read-only

- SRAM is available directly via a cartridge bank or via a window (see tech docs available in Atarimax forums)

- RAMDISK support

- backwardly compatible with MyIDE 1 (I think)

 

SIDE

- Flash memory (capacity ?)

- RTC

- CF socket, type I

- Shipped with SDX and SIDE Fat32 loader

- can have one or possibly more cartridge imagess. (I don't recal the details)

 

I don't own enough of the items above to make any direct comparisons but these are some of the things of interest to me

 

Atarimax carts have been around a long time. Many nice compilations, images and or Studio workbooks, already exist. I personally love the one with multiple programming languages, DOS and disk tools.

 

Turbo BASIC images are available for SIC! and S/XEGs RAMCART

 

Recent developments added some nice abilities to many interfaces

 

Flashjazzcat's SDX MyIDE driver made a new DOS available for an old piece of hardware. So MyIDE owners are no longer limited to MyDOS or patched SpartaDOS 3.2. SDX plus MyIDE driver is very fast (assuming your MyIDE is stable). Speed is roughly 62KB/sec (based only on my own testing with an internal MyIDE).

 

An image for MyIDE + Flashcart is available.

 

Flashjazzcat's work was primarily intended for SIDE and IDE+ 2.0 but in the end MyIDE owners get new abilities and owners all three devices (plus Incognito) get APT (see Flashjazzcat's homepage) which unify all with a common CF partitioning scheme.

 

Independently, Mr.Atari began patching his MyIDE OS (beginning with ver. 4.6?) to come up with his own solution for SDX compatibility. Speed varies from (17KB/sec to 25KB/sec depending version or beta version you choose.

 

Candle released SIDE FAT32 Loader. This lets one load games directly from a FAT32 partition on a CF card using SIDE or MyIDE interface. (No more fumbling with ATRs or proprietary partitions!)

 

(off topic)

MyIDE owners were left to their own devices as to how to go about loading the SIDE FAT32 loader. Having only a classic, internal MyIDE (4.2i) I decided to patch version 1 of the loader to access at a slave CF card. This way I can leave the old MyIDE untouched and use a slave CF (via an IDE to dual CF adapter) for games. Similarly I patched a version for cartridge owners. AFAIK only one person has tried it.

 

(Patched files are available somewhere in the Atarimax forums)

 

Both Flashjazzcat's SDX plus APT and Mr.Atari's newer OS updates (now called MyBIOS) make my idea of two seperate CF cards obsolete. Now one can have APT and one FAT32 partition on a single CF card (for all interfaces that support APT) or MyBIOS partitions and a FAT32 partition (for MyIDE only).

 

(Back on topic)

Of course, this includes the cartridge based interfaces.

 

Sorry, my intent of supplying a basic outline of features devolved into one of my usual ramblings

 

-SteveS

Edited November 25, 2012 by a8isa1

[mimo]

Sic! Cart is indeed just a flash cart like the Atarimax carts. You have to make an atr image using tools on the pc, then flash the cart using sio2pc

[a8isa1]

Sic! Cart is indeed just a flash cart like the Atarimax carts. You have to make an atr image using tools on the pc, then flash the cart using sio2pc

thanks. correcting now.

 

hmm, guess I've exceeded the time to edit.

Edited November 25, 2012 by a8isa1

[flashjazzcat]

Note when visiting my homepage: you'll find APT pages and downloads in disarray since I'm still waiting for clarification / ratification of one last SIO call (requested by Candle) relating to all APT drivers and tools before uploading everything. MyIDE (II) for SDX, SIDE, IDEa, Ultimate 1MB PBI and Incognito drivers are all affected, and the SIO call isn't something which can be conveniently retro-fitted later on as a fix. So therefore I'm completely held up until the APT steering group responds to my suggestions (i.e. my emails) or comes up with something better.

[candle]

saying that SIDE loader works with myide and making it its feature is just bad marketing example for me

i might simply stop caring about any other releases of futher versions than these for side and incognito interfaces, so please do not try to advertise myide here or anywhere else using side loader

 

from my point of view:

myide/myide ii interface vs side:

myide:

-unstable in general, you have to work out a pair of interface and atari computer and disk/cf card that actually works

+has patched os rom that will load into atari RAM right after power up and let you load any game/program right off cf card's propertially partition

 

myide ii:

+has patched os rom that will load into atari RAM right after power up and let you load any game/program right off cf card's propertially partition

-has patched os rom that will load into atari RAM right after power up - keyword here is RAM BASED, meaning that any game that will want to utilize this part of RAM WILL CRASH.

workaround here is to use loader that will load xex file directly off propertially partition to where it should be, leaving out RAM covered normally by OS ROM intact, but then you won't be able to change disks (if there were some disks that is) or make use of any of these mybios features spoken above, because they won't be available at that time, or use SIDE loader to load games right off FAT32, but what kind of advantage would be that, sinice it is not related to myide(ii) at all

 

side:

+simple to use loader that loads games right off FAT32 partition - no need to go through any intermediate steps while preparing a CF card for use on atari machine

+SDX mode of operation for "power users"

+ with Ultimate1MB becames a PBI device, just like IDE+, MIO or BlackBox, enabling to load any ATR file right off FAT32 partition, you can swap the disks mounted using SIDE menu button, without invoking any menu at all - and this is not because it is not possible to do that, but to avoid any incompatibility problems it might add - relaying on hacked system keyboard handler is always a poor choice, especially if it can be disabled or simply overwritten with anything that loads "under" OS ROM

-no support for ATR files at all without additional hardware installed (Ultimate1MB)

[greblus]

+ with Ultimate1MB becames a PBI device,

-no support for ATR files at all without additional hardware installed (Ultimate1MB)

 

Candle, I've two questions (as my U1MB is hopefully just being manufactured):

1. Does it require some specific Side firmware version? Or the ATR support works thanks to SDX's Side driver and MATR.EXE without any modifications of the firmware?

2. Do you have a plan to support ATR in the Side loader?

Edited November 25, 2012 by greblus

[candle]

1) it needs specific SDX's SIDE driver version if working without U1MB, no modifications to the hardware are requred

2) there is already support for mounting ATR files (and booting them) in SIDE loader, but only for U1MB users - perhaps i should hack myide bios and call it a side feature? ok, i'm being sarcastic here, no need for that

[greblus]

1) it needs specific SDX's SIDE driver version if working without U1MB, no modifications to the hardware are requred

2) there is already support for mounting ATR files (and booting them) in SIDE loader, but only for U1MB users - perhaps i should hack myide bios and call it a side feature? ok, i'm being sarcastic here, no need for that

 

Great. Can't wait for my U1MB then. Thanks Candle.

 

Cheers,

W.

[Marius]

Imo opinion myide I or II is having the best cards when used with the OS replacement called mybios.

 

Of course it would be preferable to have the best experience on a standard Atari but, but since SIDE is promoted in combination with ultimate 1mb I say: myide with ultimate1mb has the ease of using one of the OS SLOTS in u1mb for mybios and you have a VERY powerful beast.

 

@candle

Instability issues with myide I are completely fixed almost a year ago. The need of finding a working combination is no longer needed and no longer a valid negative argument against myide.

[+Larry]

"Instability issues with myide I are completely fixed almost a year ago. The need of finding a working combination is no longer needed..."

 

That certainly has been my experience during beta testing of the MyIDE-II -- I never had any CF or SD card (with the CF-adapter) that had any issues with "the deuce." (My nickname for it.) But Candle is right, there is software that wants to use that ram-under-rom, which is why it's been pointed out several times that the accompanying rom image is available (for MyIDE-I and MyIDE-II).

 

So here's a question: Can the Ultimate 1-MB OS slots be re-flashed easily? (So that a user could add the MyIDE-II R2 OS image?) I have quite a few 3-in-1 and 4-in-1 OS, but those are eprom. So many folks bought the Ultimate 1-MB, that would be a logical addition.

 

And another (I really don't know)): If I wanted to use MyDos or disk-based Sparta, is it easy to do with the SIDE cart -- i.e. not tied to SDX?

 

-Larry