Archon

[+grips03]

Would it be possible to port C64 Archon to CV? Perhaps even Archon 2?

[youki]

Archon is one of my all time favorite game.

 

Doing the game on the C.V is perfectly doable.

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Sure it's possible.....now get on it!

[+grips03]

Archon is one of my all time favorite game.

 

Doing the game on the C.V is perfectly doable.

 

 

 

I played on the Commodore 64, did you play on the same system?

 

It looks like there are versions Amstrad, PC-88, ZX-Spectrum (other Z80 based systems). The Amstrad has a AY-3-8912 sound chip, perhaps that is similar to the SGM's AY-3-8910? <-- Wikipedia seems to think they are pretty similar

 

I wonder if these other version as good as the Commodore 64?

Edited December 10, 2012 by grips03

[youki]

I played on the Commodore 64, did you play on the same system?

 

It looks like there are versions Amstrad, PC-88, ZX-Spectrum (other Z80 based systems). The Amstrad has a AY-3-8912 sound chip, perhaps that is similar to the SGM's AY-3-8910? <-- Wikipedia seems to think they are pretty similar

 

I wonder if these other version as good as the Commodore 64?

 

I'm a huge fan of Commodore 64. I played it a lot on that Machine of course!

 

but i also played the Atari XL version , that is quite good too. Also tried the Amstrad CPC version but i found it less responsive.

 

That is funny is , that i have friend that also loves Archon , and we played a lot together. Each time we play on the C64 version He wins , if we play on the Atari XL version i win!!

[+grips03]

Devs - any hope in porting this game to CV?

[JamesD]

I played on the Commodore 64, did you play on the same system?

 

It looks like there are versions Amstrad, PC-88, ZX-Spectrum (other Z80 based systems). The Amstrad has a AY-3-8912 sound chip, perhaps that is similar to the SGM's AY-3-8910? <-- Wikipedia seems to think they are pretty similar

 

I wonder if these other version as good as the Commodore 64?

I believe the only difference between those chips was the built in I/O ports. The sound hardware itself is the same.

 

 

I'm a huge fan of Commodore 64. I played it a lot on that Machine of course!

 

but i also played the Atari XL version , that is quite good too. Also tried the Amstrad CPC version but i found it less responsive.

 

That is funny is , that i have friend that also loves Archon , and we played a lot together. Each time we play on the C64 version He wins , if we play on the Atari XL version i win!!

I'm pretty sure one of the pages dedicated to Archon said that the game A/I was a little different between the two versions.

[+Gemintronic]

A cursory search doesn't turn up an MSX or Adam version which I hear would be the easiest to port. What makes peeps think a C64 version would be an easy conversion?

[youki]

I'm pretty sure one of the pages dedicated to Archon said that the game A/I was a little different between the two versions.

 

May be , but in our case we were playing Human vs Human not AI involved!

[youki]

A cursory search doesn't turn up an MSX or Adam version which I hear would be the easiest to port. What makes peeps think a C64 version would be an easy conversion?

 

The easiest conversion , if you want reuse existing code, would be to start from the ZX Spectrum version.

[Pixelboy]

I've never played with Archon, on any platform, so just out of curiosity, I had a look at the game on YouTube. It's a nice take on chess, but I don't like the combat screen, which I find too primitive.

 

But I do like the idea of having actual confrontations between board pieces, where the little guys can win against the bigger guys with some careful strategy and some luck. If I were to code a game like this on the CV, I would design the combat screen to look more like this:

 

 

Just my two cents.

[JamesD]

May be , but in our case we were playing Human vs Human not AI involved!

Ah, but if the AI is different, a few other things might be different giving someone used to playing the AI the advantage.

That or you just tried harder on your own turf.

[JamesD]

There is a disassembly of the Atari version on the web. I realize it's 6502 but it may help you identify the sections in the Z80 code.

The Spectrum code will probably be easiest to reverse engineer but it doesn't support the AY sound chip which was only in later Spectrums.

[+grips03]

I've never played with Archon, on any platform, so just out of curiosity, I had a look at the game on YouTube. It's a nice take on chess, but I don't like the combat screen, which I find too primitive.

 

But I do like the idea of having actual confrontations between board pieces, where the little guys can win against the bigger guys with some careful strategy and some luck. If I were to code a game like this on the CV, I would design the combat screen to look more like this:

 

 

Just my two cents.

 

 

Archon 2 has better graphics and stuff. Archon 1 and 2 are both mega fun. I'm 39 and my brothers 41 and we even play these games to this day on C64. It would be so much nicer to play on CV if this was possible as you could just plug in the cart and go. Kind of like M.U.L.E and Druid, just some of these C64 games are so good and so much fun. Simple is better, as each guy has its own strengths and weaknesses during the battle. They key is perfect control and speed of guys in the battle, as slow or bad control would make this game poor. Intro music is another thing that makes this game cool, while "Freefall" is on the screen. Freefall are the people who made the game.

 

Luc,

The game you posted looks kind of like Gundam Battle for PS1. Good game, but not nearly as good as Archon 1 or 2. If the chartecter where large, how would the Genie hide out on the screen or how would one hide behind the fire, walls, and other objects just to come out and kill the enemy. Large guys kind of defeat the idea behind Archon battles IMO.

Edited December 13, 2012 by grips03

[youki]

I've never played with Archon, on any platform, so just out of curiosity, I had a look at the game on YouTube. It's a nice take on chess, but I don't like the combat screen, which I find too primitive.

 

But I do like the idea of having actual confrontations between board pieces, where the little guys can win against the bigger guys with some careful strategy and some luck. If I were to code a game like this on the CV, I would design the combat screen to look more like this:

 

 

Just my two cents.

 

I have to disagree! If you put this kind of combat you denature totally Archon. It could do a good game but it won't be Archon!!. Archon is just 'PERFECT' as it is!

 

I was so in love with Archon, that in 1986 or 87 , i made my own version on Atari ST , i had introduced better graphism, better sound , additionnal spells , new environments (like snow, mountain, rivers where some creature was more agile under certain environment).... but at the end...it was no more realty Archon. It was good game , but not as good as the original , the soul of archon was lost.

[+grips03]

I have to disagree! If you put this kind of combat you denature totally Archon. It could do a good game but it won't be Archon!!. Archon is just 'PERFECT' as it is!

 

I was so in love with Archon, that in 1986 or 87 , i made my own version on Atari ST , i had introduced better graphism, better sound , additionnal spells , new environments (like snow, mountain, rivers where some creature was more agile under certain environment).... but at the end...it was no more realty Archon. It was good game , but not as good as the original , the soul of archon was lost.

 

Youki - excellent post and I bet your kind of right. If I could get 100% same as Commodore 64 I would buy 10 copies easy, it just that good. But I'm afraid you might be right, it might not be Archon that we all know and love. Perhaps I might need to hack a C64 with a SD reader and use my XRGB2 (RGB to VGA adapter) for the video.

[Pixelboy]

I have to disagree! If you put this kind of combat you denature totally Archon. It could do a good game but it won't be Archon!!. Archon is just 'PERFECT' as it is!

 

I was so in love with Archon, that in 1986 or 87 , i made my own version on Atari ST , i had introduced better graphism, better sound , additionnal spells , new environments (like snow, mountain, rivers where some creature was more agile under certain environment).... but at the end...it was no more realty Archon. It was good game , but not as good as the original , the soul of archon was lost.

 

Your definition of perfection is squarely different from mine, it seems.

 

And I never said I wanted to rewrite Archon. What I would do (theoretically) is a clone of the game with my own ideas and vision, and the end result would probably look rather different, like Sonic the Hedgehog is different from Super Mario Bros.

[+grips03]

how much does it cost to fund a project to make it exactly like C64?

[Pixelboy]

how much does it cost to fund a project to make it exactly like C64?

 

The price of developing a game from scratch varies from one homebrewer to the next. If you find someone who accepts programming your game at a certain price, chances are you won't find anybody else who will do it (regardless of price). So you either pay the homebrewer the price he asks for, or you forget about it. (You can also try to program the game yourself, but I'm going to assume you are not interested in exploring that option.)

[+grips03]

I was think more like a Kickstarter in which the people who would like a copy of the game help to fund it. I'm not sure how this works exactly, but something like if 50 people want the game and the dev, charges say 2,500, then we each fund the Kickstarter with $50. But perhaps only a couple would want this game. Also I think the SGM would need to be used in order to make the music sound good. Then if people want carts, manual, box it might cost ~$20-30 more, again this is a guess as I have no idea on the real costs involved.

[Pixelboy]

Your numbers are not too far off, but keep in mind that homebrewers are rarely good musicians, so you'd need to pay another guy to do the music and sound effects, someone who the main programmer is confortable working with. I assume Kickstarter can manage registration goals, so assuming a 2500$ dev cost, a goal of 100 people paying 50$ each should cover all expenses (dev, cart, box, manual), if you're willing to pay out of your own pocket for any small extra expenses that may make it go a little above 50$ per copy.

 

If you add the SGM to the equation (not a bad idea, as a chess-type game can require a lot of RAM to function) then the Kickstarter program will need to be aimed specifically at the 200+ SGM owners. You better hope that at least 100 people in that group would like to see Archon on the CV, and that's not necessarily self-evident.

 

By the way, isn't Archon still owned by Activision or some other company? Using Kickstarter for this could make some copyright holders raise an eyebrow...

[+grips03]

hopefully an existing publisher would like to port / make this game or Archon 2 Adept and do all the hard stuff

 

One day I might try coding for CV. Its been 20 years since I did assember in school. I never learned C, but did basic and Unix scripting so perhaps its possible to still learn

Edited December 13, 2012 by grips03

[youki]

(not a bad idea, as a chess-type game can require a lot of RAM to function)

 

You need only 1K for a chess game.

 

here the source in Z80 :

 

http://users.ox.ac.uk/~uzdm0006/scans/1kchess/

 

[ColecoDan]

If archon is just a chess game then we just got a chess game from collectorvision so I doubt many people are going to care about having a second chess game.

[+grips03]

its not a chess game, nor is Archon 2.

 

more like a 1:1 battle game that takes place on a chess type board, or in case of Archon 2 takes place in certain elements - fire, water, earth, air or the void. Archon 2 allows one to summon certain guys to do battle like demons, etc. To win you defeat other team or hold the flashing squares. It combines real time battles with turn based playing.