Does Nostalgia Last 20 Minutes?

[donjn]

I have read a while back that nostaligia lasts about 15 to 20 minutes.

 

One day back in 1998 I hit the jackpot. For cheap I managed to get my hands on a couple Commodore 64 computers, and a Commodore 128 with several drives, disks, and a monitor. I was so happy to get back to 1985 with my Commodore 128! I fired it up, played some games, and generally had some fun, all in my garage, all set up with lights, a desk, and a comfy recliner. The more I played however I started to get annoyed at the loading times. I kept telling myslef i could easily play all of these classic games on an emulator that could fire these things up in mere seconds.

 

However, after about a week I stopped playing, and eventually sold the lot. I also sold a TRS-80 back then as well.

 

There is a good novel called "You Can't Go Home Again". It has a lot do with nostalgia, and how a man wants to visit his old hometown and get back all those memories, but nothing is the same.

 

http://en.wikipedia....t_Go_Home_Again

 

I live in the LA area and go to Disneyland often. I constantly try to re-live that special moment when I was 8 and my Dad took me on Peter Pan for the first time. The miniature London city below me was so magical. Now? Not so much. I can tell they are all cardboard cutouts nomatter how hard I try. It feels false.

 

I wonder if this collecting we do is more of an attempt to not play around with these old systems but to try to get back to that "time" in our lives. I have tried and failed, but so many of you seem to be happy collectors. How do you do it:? And more importantly, if I am right, then won't we someday long for those good old days in 2013?

Edited January 22, 2013 by donjn

[Tempest]

The eight hours I spent playing Bards Tale III on my Apple IIe yesterday would indicate otherwise.

[donjn]

Maybe it depends on the person? Maybe for me, I get dissapointed because I am not back in 1985?

[the.golden.ax]

The eight hours I spent playing Bards Tale III on my Apple IIe yesterday would indicate otherwise.

 

You and I certainly fall in to the category of individuals that never get sick of classic games.

 

The funny part is how attention deficit I can be with real life, but how focused I can be with a game.

[RickR]

For me, it's more about the hunt, and the ability to get things I always wanted as a kid, but could never have. Some of these systems are really cool, and playing the real thing surely beats out playing on an emulator. That said, I agree with you on the C64. Load times ARE way too long, That system annoys me, and i rarely play it. May be time to sell that lot.

[donjn]

Can anyone recommend a classic computer system with a good selection of games that can be found for cheaper than the Commodore?

I was thinking of going along the Atari route, but not sure which one.

 

Maybe Atari 800?

I have some interest in that.

Edited January 22, 2013 by donjn

[DesertJets]

I think it depends. I go through phases where I play my old stuff a lot, and other times (like right now) where I haven't played with my old systems in quite some time. I think it ends up being a real personal thing, some people love and can play their classic stuff all the time and never get bored. For others, and I think I am in that category, after 20 minutes you get bored. (Unless you are drinking, nothing like trying to play Pac-Man after a few Maker's and Ginger Ale's with an overly competitive girlfriend).

 

Can anyone recommend a classic computer system with a good selection of games that can be found for cheaper than the Commodore?

I was thinking of going along the Atari route, but not sure which one.

 

Maybe Atari 800?

I have some interest in that.

 

I'll vouch for the Atari 8-bit line -- I have the XEGS myself. I think getting one helped to solidify my interest in this hobby. A good chunk of the popular titles are on cartridge so loading times are not an issue. There is a huge knowledge base and a helpful/friendly community out there. Plus there are now a few workable multicart solutions out there if you don't want to invest in getting tape and floppy drives.

[Tempest]

I think it depends. I go through phases where I play my old stuff a lot, and other times (like right now) where I haven't played with my old systems in quite some time.

This happens to me all the time. For the last 6 months I was doing nothing but PS2, Xbox 360, and Wii games, but now I'm all about the classic computer RPGs. Everything comes and goes in phases. I tend to drift from one system to the next and then come back to them again and again.

[Ian Primus]

Can anyone recommend a classic computer system with a good selection of games that can be found for cheaper than the Commodore?

 

Well, the Commodore is already pretty darn dirt cheap. They sold more C64's than any other model of computer. Seriously - it's a world record that's not likely to be broken, since modern machines change models every month or so. Most of us that collect old computers have them stacked up like cord-wood. It's a bit of a joke, actually - the C64 is the Combat cartridge of computer collecting.

 

I would point you in the direction of the Apple II line - the Apple IIe, specifically. It's cheap, available, reliable, and very, very well documented. The disk drives are very fast, and it's super easy to connect it to a modern computer through the Super Serial Card and transfer disk images - no need to buy expensive modern peripherals with flash cards (although they are available). There are a lot of classic games - they're different though, the graphics and sound you're used to from the Commodore aren't there, but the platform has lots of original titles that are fun to play. It's also a hacker's dream, because it's so expandable and flexible. With 80 column text on a monochrome monitor, you can use it as a terminal and do pretty much anything from it's fantastic keyboard.

 

The Apple IIe is such an improvement over the C64 in terms of loading times, clear text, build quality, expandability and rock solid reliability, that it's rather hard to go back to the C64 after using the Apple II for a while.

 

But, then again, it's a holy war that's been going on for years - Apple vs. Commodore. I like both platforms, but... I love the Apple II.

 

-Ian

[Pixelboy]

In my opinion, a true retro-gamer is not fueled by nostalgia. Nostalgia may motivate a person to revisit the games library of an old game console or home computer from his/her youth, but to stick to retro-gaming as a hobby, you have to prefer the older games over the newer ones.

 

For example, as a ColecoVision fanboy, I'll take Gateway to Apshai over Diablo III any day of the week. I'm sure Diablo III is a great PC game (I've never played it, but I've seen my best friend play for about an hour) but I can get my dungeon crawler fix with Gateway to Apshai (or perhaps Alcazar if I'm in the mood for something slightly more Zelda-ish) so more modern takes on the genre simply don't interest me.

 

Another example: Mega Man. I loved the 8-bit and 16-bit platformers, but after Mega Man X4, I just lost all interest, especially with the unpalatable EXE series. But I was all over Mega Man 9 and 10 when they came out on the Wii.

 

As for Super Mario Bros, I played the heck out of the NES, Game Boy and Super-NES incarnations, but I got bored with Super Mario 64 about halfway through, and I could never get into any other Mario game after that. 3D Mario just doesn't do it for me. I would never say that modern games suck, because they definately don't, but I'd rather revisit an older 8-bit incarnation of a game rather than learn how to use a 26-button controller to get the most out of a newer 3D incarnation.

 

For that reason first and foremost, I consider myself a retro-gamer. I don't get any rush from beautiful graphics, just give me good gameplay and I'm happy.

[+Cafeman]

Ugh - Thomas Wolfe's You Can't Go Home Again. I was assigned to read and review that as a 12th grade English project. I didn't enjoy it at all. Too whiny for me! Although I might enjoy it at this age, perhaps I will reread it.

 

To me, nostalgia also comes from just seeing your original Atari or Commodore equipment, just as much as actually playing it. Lots of those old games aren't really that playable anymore - so just play for a short while , don't torture yourself trying to recapture the enjoyment. On the other hand, lots of those old games haven't lost a bit o' fun.

 

Anyway ... at times I also really get sick & tired of the Atari era stuff, or the 90's 16-bit stuff, and put it away, and I play modern stuff like X360 , or don't play anything. But eventually the nostalgic mood comes back. I'm actually starting to get nostalgic moods for SEGA Dreamcast recently!

[Hatta]

Yes, nostalgia lasts only about 20 minutes. The reason you see so many happy collectors, is that good games have an innate appeal beyond nostalgia.

[BydoEmpire]

Maybe, but while I still enjoy my 8-bit games, I think there's a lot more to it than notsalgia. Demon Attack is fun. I don't play it because of nostalgia, I play it because it's a good game. It's the same reason the only PC games I play are from GOG.com. The design of older games appeals to me more than modern ones. It's separate from nostalgia.

 

Yeah, I haven't plugged in my c64 in a couple years - the load times can be a bit painful. It wouldn't be that much of a problem, except I have such little free time every minute counts. Fortunately, there are a lot of good emulation options for c64. I don't mind playing classic computer games emulated, it feels pretty close to the real thing.

[Cynicaster]

Ultimately, I think it comes down to what it is about video games that you hold dear. If you feel the progression/improvement of technology over the decades has brought with it a commensurate progression/improvement in the games themselves, then I think that viewpoint is hindering your ability to enjoy retro games, because playing them is like going back to the stone age. You pop in an Atari game, and suddenly all that "awesomeness" that has accumulated in the last 20-30 years is stripped away. At that point, the only thing the old games are good for is a quick nostalgia fix, almost like leafing through an old photo album for a few minutes.

 

If, on the other hand, you're like me and see no correlation whatsoever between the progression of hardware capability and the progression of game quality, then there is a good chance that retro games will provide you with a bottomless well of entertainment potential that has little to nothing to do with nostalgia--at least not necessarily. The moment you shed the mentality that "more powerful technology = better video game" then your position effectively becomes "once a good game, always a good game", because, at that point, the fact that the graphics are basic presents no hindrance whatsoever to your ability to enjoy the experience.

 

One of my best friends is in the former camp--he cannot for the life of him understand why I still enjoy games that are 20-30 years old, even though he grew up with them just the same as I did. On the other hand, show him a game with the latest cutting edge graphics and 5.1 surround, and you'd better buy him some diapers because he ain't leaving that couch until he sees it all.

[donjn]

I am strongly considering this now. But this time I might take more care of it. Clean my system, set it up nice, etc.

I have about a $1,000 budget so I really want to consider this. I want multiple drives and lots of software and a monitor. Also I will be buying the classic Ultima games, and this may lead me to my decision.

 

Commodore 64

Easy to get and cheap. Load times are long. However the C64 version of Ultima V does not play music

 

Commodore 128

My all time favorite computer. Load times still long. But you cna play Ultima V in C128 mode for the music.

 

Atari 800

Always wanted this. Love the look and durability. Love the cartirdges. Just not sure if I can get the same games as Commodore 64. For example, no Ultima V and I couldn't find any Bard's Tale games.

 

Atari ST

Minor intrest. I put this in the same catergory as an Amiga. Not classic enough for me.

 

Apple IIe

I am not an Apple guy at all. I have tried emulators and the colors and sound are weird to me.

[Cynicaster]

In my opinion, a true retro-gamer is not fueled by nostalgia. Nostalgia may motivate a person to revisit the games library of an old game console or home computer from his/her youth, but to stick to retro-gaming as a hobby, you have to prefer the older games over the newer ones.

 

For example, as a ColecoVision fanboy, I'll take Gateway to Apshai over Diablo III any day of the week. I'm sure Diablo III is a great PC game (I've never played it, but I've seen my best friend play for about an hour) but I can get my dungeon crawler fix with Gateway to Apshai (or perhaps Alcazar if I'm in the mood for something slightly more Zelda-ish) so more modern takes on the genre simply don't interest me.

 

Another example: Mega Man. I loved the 8-bit and 16-bit platformers, but after Mega Man X4, I just lost all interest, especially with the unpalatable EXE series. But I was all over Mega Man 9 and 10 when they came out on the Wii.

 

As for Super Mario Bros, I played the heck out of the NES, Game Boy and Super-NES incarnations, but I got bored with Super Mario 64 about halfway through, and I could never get into any other Mario game after that. 3D Mario just doesn't do it for me. I would never say that modern games suck, because they definately don't, but I'd rather revisit an older 8-bit incarnation of a game rather than learn how to use a 26-button controller to get the most out of a newer 3D incarnation.

 

For that reason first and foremost, I consider myself a retro-gamer. I don't get any rush from beautiful graphics, just give me good gameplay and I'm happy.

 

This post came up while I was typing mine, and pretty much contains the exact same message. Well said sir.

[donjn]

This post came up while I was typing mine, and pretty much contains the exact same message. Well said sir.

 

Yes but he did not take into consideration the emulators. The trend in this topic has suddenly switched to the games. Games you can easily play on an emulator. I prefer the old games no question over the new ones. Its just that why should I use slower hardware over fast emulation? Or more importantly, why do some of you do it?

[the.golden.ax]

Why do I still do it? I guess you can still go home. Some games and systems are just like comfort food. Other stuff constantly being acquired and enjoyed are things I wanted for a long time but couldn't have as a kid. My inner geek, geeks out when I get to play with something I considered unobtainable at any point in my life. It never wears off.

[JamesD]

When it comes to games, it's not just nostalgia for me, it depends on the replay factor.

How much fun is it to play a game for the 20th time... or the hundredth.

Whether a game is old or new it can feel too repetitive.

I will always love games like Galaxians, Space Invaders, and Donkey Kong. I probably own at least 5 versions of each.

But unless I'm doing really well on a game, I move from one to the next within a half hour.

It's just like how I played in the arcade. Try a couple games and move on to the next machine.

 

As for new games, many have a fixed path, their AI cheats in order to be a challenge, they are too short, or they have a poor ending.

That doesn't exactly make me want to play through them again.

Things like multi-player dungeon crawlers, civilization building games, etc... all have replayability and draw me in over and over.

Nostalgia has nothing to do with it.

 

As for nostalgia in general... my brother is a nostalgia freak. Old books, old trucks, old tractors... whatever.

He has totally romanticized everything old and it drives me nuts.

 

Me... I love classic cars and some other things old but it's just certain things that appeal to me.

The rumble of a big block V8 and a motor you can actually repair yourself appeals to me.

The thing I like most about old computers is programming. The old machines feel more like embedded systems and that's the type of work I enjoy.

I love assembly language and programming small systems that don't have gigantic bloated API's like I have to deal with at work.

But nostalgia has little to do with that.

[Cynicaster]

Yes but he did not take into consideration the emulators. The trend in this topic has suddenly switched to the games. Games you can easily play on an emulator. I prefer the old games no question over the new ones. Its just that why should I use slower hardware over fast emulation? Or more importantly, why do some of you do it?

 

For me personally, assuming the emulation is accurate, the only problem I have with it is when I can't get the right feel from the controller. For example, I don't have one of those Stelladaptor things, so I can't derive any enjoyment out of playing Atari 2600 on a PC emulator. D-pads just don't cut it for me, I want to use what I'm used to for those games. It's less of a problem for games I have never played before, because in that case I'm not used to anything in particular.

 

Other times, it can be about environment. Sitting on a couch with your feet up playing an old console on a 32" CRT is better than sitting in a stiff desk chair next to your PC, glaring up at a blocky 16:9 LCD monitor.

 

Other than issues like these, I'm fine with emulation in principle, and in fact, I don't collect old hardware just to have it--I only buy stuff that I will play and enjoy.

 

Some people are a bit more picky and need to hear that disk drive turning or see that cartridge poking out of the console for the experience to be complete. Even if that's not necessarily me, I can totally understand that.

[donjn]

Yes I just ordered an Atari 2600 style usb controller for my Atari 2600 and Commodore emulator needs.

 

But I still have this itch to create this awesome area in my garage. A desk, lamp, a strip of carpet, and a classic gaming computer.

[Pixelboy]

Yes but he did not take into consideration the emulators. The trend in this topic has suddenly switched to the games. Games you can easily play on an emulator. I prefer the old games no question over the new ones. Its just that why should I use slower hardware over fast emulation? Or more importantly, why do some of you do it?

 

I see emulation as a tool, not a source of enjoyment, but that's just me. I will use an emulator to grab screenshots, or to test something, or to check out some new information about a particular old game. I have a good joypad which I like to use with emulators, but still, I need to have a really good reason to play an emulated game on my PC rather than, say, reply to e-mail.

[The Usotsuki]

I've thought of setting aside a piece of the basement here as a "retro room".

[akator]

Nostalgia leads to disappointment because it is often based on intangible, inaccurate, unquantifiable things like emotions and memories. Go ahead, look up an old girlfriend or boyfriend on the internet. Chances are you will not be happy with the results, perhaps even leading to your once happy memories being forever tarnished by reality.

 

It's a bad idea to do anything, even gaming, in an attempt to relive the past. It's not reliable.

 

That's why I don't think most people who are into classic gaming are doing it for nostalgia. Anyone who buys a 2600 and expects things to be the same as it was in 1980 is going to be massively disappointed. That 2600 won't be around long if it was only purchased to relive some old memories. However, it is still possible to enjoy the 2600 because of game design and play quality. The people who are keeping these things around and playing them are not doing it just to be young again. They might be doing it to have fun, though

[the.golden.ax]

Nostalgia leads to disappointment because it is often based on intangible, inaccurate, unquantifiable things like emotions and memories. Go ahead, look up an old girlfriend or boyfriend on the internet. Chances are you will not be happy with the results, perhaps even leading to your once happy memories being forever tarnished by reality.

 

It's a bad idea to do anything, even gaming, in an attempt to relive the past. It's not reliable.

 

That's why I don't think most people who are into classic gaming are doing it for nostalgia. Anyone who buys a 2600 and expects things to be the same as it was in 1980 is going to be massively disappointed. That 2600 won't be around long if it was only purchased to relive some old memories. However, it is still possible to enjoy the 2600 because of game design and play quality. The people who are keeping these things around and playing them are not doing it just to be young again. They might be doing it to have fun, though

 

I did that a few times. Damn, those girls got FUGLY. I mean it, no joke. It's a good thing Galaga is ageless.