PAL/NTSC compatibility question - please help!

[jetset]

I have quite a few PAL games for my 2600. Currently I have a Panasonic TV that actually auto-detects the signal so I can play an NTSC game, then pop in a PAL game no problem. No screen roll or need to adjust anything. I'm looking to put in a smaller tv (it's not hi def or plasma) but unfortunately it does not have auto detect.

 

Would something like this;

 

eBay Auction -- Item Number: 170982068706

 

would work to convert the (PAL) signal from my 2600 to play NTSC on my tv?

[atari181]

Never known anyone who used one of those. If you decide to try it, I would be interested to know your results.

[Albert]

That is intriguing, I'd also love to know how well it works.

 

..Al

[jetset]

LOL! Well, it;s not looking like you'll lean from me anytime soon. 77 views and only two replies...I would have thought more of the technical minded would have an opinion on this but I'm guessing they're a brand-new product that nobody else has ever tried. In reading some of the reviews of people who bought them for region locked PS3's or WII's purchased overseas the reviews are mixed. Some say "OMG WTF this thing is crap", while just as many say "product works perfectly for what I wanted." They're only about $30-$35 shipped but still that's $30-$35 bucks potentially wasted....

Hopefully someone who has knowledge of these converters will chime in.

[Serious]

I bought a similar device recently to be able to play PAL carts on my NTSC CRT, but my assumption is that I'd need a PAL console to get any use from it. I haven't acquired a PAL console yet, so I haven't tested it.

[jetset]

I bought a similar device recently to be able to play PAL carts on my NTSC CRT, but my assumption is that I'd need a PAL console to get any use from it. I haven't acquired a PAL console yet, so I haven't tested it.

 

Do you have any pal 2600 carts that you could test using an ntsc 2600? Or even a Kroccodile cart with a PAL rom?

[atari181]

 

 

Do you have any pal 2600 carts that you could test using an ntsc 2600? Or even a Kroccodile cart with a PAL rom?

That's what I was thinking, I don't think you need the PAL console.

[Serious]

Yep. I have a few PAL carts.

 

I'll try it out by routing my RF through a VCR (so I can convert the RF to the 3-plug RCA output) and will post my results here.

[jetset]

Yep. I have a few PAL carts.

 

I'll try it out by routing my RF through a VCR (so I can convert the RF to the 3-plug RCA output) and will post my results here.

 

Have you gotten a chance to check?

[Serious]

Yep. Not a good result, so far.

 

Here is what I have tried:

 

PAL game -> NTSC H6er console (RF out) -> Coax adapter -> NTSC VCR -> RCA out -> PAL/NTSC converter -> RCA out -> NTSC CRT TV

 

The game I tried is Master Builder. It is a PAL cart. When I play it normally (RF out direct to TV, without attempting a PAL/NTSC conversion) everything looks normal, except the bottom part of the playfield is not visible.

 

When I route the signal as described above, the picture is B/W only, and the vertical alignment is completely random.

 

 

I believe I will need a PAL console, and possibly a PAL VCR to convert the RF to RCA out (which is what the PAL/NTSC converter needs). My impression is that there are hardware differences between PAL and NTSC hardware, probably in the TIA chip. I could be incorrect about that, but that's the impression I've gotten somewhere.

[jetset]

Much appreciated! Looking like I'll be sticking with the same TV. I did read some of the reviews for the various products...seems to be these converters are hit or miss, and while it's not a lot of $$ I'd rather put the $35 towards a homebrew or something.

[Serious]

I just purchased a PAL Junior from Sweden modded with RCA A/V out.

 

 

I am expecting (hoping) that I should be able to connect this directly to my PAL/NTSC converter and get good results.

 

I will share my results on this thread.

[jetset]

I just purchased a PAL Junior from Sweden modded with RCA A/V out.

 

 

I am expecting (hoping) that I should be able to connect this directly to my PAL/NTSC converter and get good results.

 

I will share my results on this thread.

 

ANy update?

[Serious]

Nope. I haven't received the PAL console, yet. It was shipped from Sweden about a week ago.

[Serious]

ANy update?

 

Ok, I got the console today, hooked everything up, and the results are very disappointing.

 

Here's a video of me testing several games with it.

 

[jetset]

Ah well. Thanks so much for sharing! Guess I'll live with the TV I have!

[Serious]

I'm not ready to give up on this, and will continue to look for a way to use this PAL console.

 

My next step is probably to buy another brand of converter.

 

I also have an RCA to VGA converter, but I really want to use this on a regular CRT TV, so I'm not sure that really helps me.

[atari181]

Thanks for the info, you're right, very disappointing. I was hoping it would be better.

[Seob]

Maybe a small Commodore 1084 monitor would be nice. If i'm correct it can be used both with Pal and Ntsc. Looks like it is easier to convert Ntsc to Pal then the other way around. I'm glad most tv's i can buy here support Pal/Ntsc/Secam since i live in Europe. The only thing i need is a good step down converter. And i'm ready to go.

Can't you use a old vcr that supports Pal/Ntsc? I had some Ntsc stuff back then and i used a vcr that supported Ntsc to Pal to run those before i had a tv capable of handling Ntsc.

[+SpiceWare]

Maybe a small Commodore 1084 monitor would be nice. If i'm correct it can be used both with Pal and Ntsc.

You are correct - that's how I play PAL 2600 and Amiga CD32 games. The vertical picture size needs to be adjusted and the colors will be wrong on the 2600, they're OK on the CD32, but both of those are minor issues.

Edited May 7, 2013 by SpiceWare

[darthkur]

Sorry that I didn't notice this thread sooner. Those devices are shite. I got one years ago to try to use both a Sinclair Spectrum +2 and an Amstrad CPC 464. You still have to make some manual adjustments like vertical hold and the colors are all washed out looking and incorrect. I'm STILL looking for an affordable option to use those systems and have them function like they were designed to. I even bought a special monitor and traveled many miles to pick it up. Was supposed to be multisignal compatible. Sure it displays PAL nice and clear........in b&W.

[Serious]

I tried direct connection to my HDTV from the PAL console, which I've heard works, and that definitely didn't work for me. (Even though it isn't what I want, since I want to use my CRT TV if I can).

 

I have another idea I'm going to try. Somewhere, I have a VGA to RCA adapter, but I don't know where, offhand. If I can find that, I will couple that with the opposite type of adapter (PAL console -> RCA -> RCA to VGA adapter -> VGA -> VGA to RCA adapter -> RCA -> NTSC CRT TV) to see if converting to VGA and back somehow works some magic.

[Serious]

My latest attempt has yielded better results.

 

By using the above configuration (converting RCA-Y to VGA then back to RCA-Y), I was able to get the full image on my NTSC CRT TV. However, there are color issues.

 

Asteroids: B/W picture

Master Builder: Colors are so bright that the image is blurry.

Room of Doom: Color. But I'm not sure its the right color?

 

The issues on the last 2 may be something that can be overcome by tweaking the settings on the VGA to RCA-Y converter, but given that I only got a B/W picture from Asteroids, I suspect that the color conversion isn't happening.

 

The RCA-Y to VGA converter says on the box that it can automatically switch between PAL and NTSC, so I expected color conversion wouldn't be an issue. Again, it may be the VGA to RCA-Y converter that is the problem.

 

When I connected the VGA out signal directly to my HDTV's VGA in, I got an "Invalid Signal" error on the screen. I don't know exactly what to make of that.

 

Maybe what I need is a VGA converter that is known to work well with PAL?

[+thegoldenband]

A poster over at Sega-16 speaks highly of the Atlona CDM-660 for PAL > NTSC conversion (he uses it for Amiga gaming), but it can't take RF so you'd need an Atari 2600 with a video mod.

[CatPix]

What you need mostly is a 50 to 60 Htz converter.

 

PAL to NTSC cannot work properly because your game system being NTSC, it will ALWAYS send an NTSC color subcarrier.

So unless you have a cleverly ade converter, it try to pick up a PAL colot signal when you send an NTSC signal.

 

Your best hope is to have a monitor and TV with a V-hold tuning, either automatic (most Euro TV can display 60 Htz signal without manual control) or manual.

 

Of course such devices are useful if you have a PAL system.