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StragglyMarlin5

What is the best second Generation console?

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The Atari 2600 pretty handily, no matter how great the Colecovision and the Vectrex are. Lookup classic video game in the dictionary and you see that 2600 joystick. You know?

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I'm confused by the generations but it definitely seems weird to me that the Colecovision would go with the Intellivision and VCS. The VCS was created to compete with the VES. The Intellivision was created to compete with the VCS. The SuperSystem was originally created to compete with the Intellivision but since it came out the same year as the Intellivision II and Colecovision it ended up competing with both of them and making the 2-port model of the SuperSystem.

 

Since the SuperSystem was Atari's second console it seems odd that the VCS would be in the same generation as the Colecovision. That would make both the VCS and the SuperSystem the same generation. That makes about as much sense as the NES and SNES being the same generation. I think there are two generations here:

 

The first I think of as the wood grain generation because the VCS, Intellivision, and the VES have it. The VES doesn't make it to the next generation.

 

The generation after that I think of as the VCS open hardware generation because the new big three are competing with their new systems with VCS clone attachments. This would be the SuperSystem(Atari 2600 Adapter), Intellivision II(System Changer), and Colecovision(Expansion Module #1).

 

Anyway, it is all confusing. Maybe it is better separating eras based on video game crashes instead of separating generations:

 

1.Pong Era then video game crash of 1977.

2.Atari Era then video game crash of 1983.

5.

3.DRM Era(from the 10NES lockout chip to the entire XBone system) then video game crash of 2014.

4.

which starts to crash in the time after the video game crash of 1983 but before the DRM Era.

6.Libre Video Game Era.

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I still prefer the typical way the Video Game Console Generations has been defined (in the U.S.):

 

1st Generation, 1972-1976 (beginnings): Magnavox Odyssey, various Pong consoles, RCA Studio II, Fairchild Channel F

 

2nd Generation, 1977-1983 (4bit/8bit & Crash): Atari 2600, Bally Astrocade, Magnavox Odyssey 2, Intellivision, Colecovision, Vectrex, Atari 5200, Emerson Arcadia 2001

 

3rd Generation, 1985-1993 (Renewal, 8-bit matures): Nintendo Entertainment System, Sega Master System, Atari 7800, Atari XEGS

 

4th Generation, 1988-1996 (16 bit and then some): TurboGrafx 16, Sega Genesis, Super Nintendo Entertainment System, Neo Geo AES

 

5th Generation, 1993-2000 (3rd Dimension begins): 3DO, Atari Jaguar, Playstation, Sega Saturn, Nintendo 64

 

6th Generation, 1999-2007 (Disc Systems, the era we stopped counting bits): Sega Dreamcast, Playstation 2, Game Cube, Xbox.

 

7th Generation, 2005- (and then there were three): Xbox 360, Playstation 3, Wii.

 

8th Generation, 2012- (going into the future): WiiU, Xbox One, Playstation 4...

Edited by pixelated
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In the US many magazines like Electronic Games talked about the Coleco and 5200 as third generation. Also, 8 bit matured with 5200 and Coleco (Actually started with A8) Intellivision is 16 bit.

And don't forget the NES was released in 83 not 85 ( Famicom is a NES)

Edited by high voltage

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...i did the United States video game console generations...YMMV if you live in Europe or Asia.

 

I didn't realize there was an official US Government position on game console generation assignments. Is that part of Obamacare too?

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I didn't realize there was an official US Government position on game console generation assignments. Is that part of Obamacare too?

 

Shh! I don't wanna share security secrets of the foundations of this country. Might fall apart, Jenga-style.

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I still prefer the typical way the Video Game Console Generations has been defined (in the U.S.):

 

1st Generation, 1972-1976 (beginnings): Magnavox Odyssey, various Pong consoles, RCA Studio II, Fairchild Channel F

 

2nd Generation, 1977-1983 (4bit/8bit & Crash): Atari 2600, Bally Astrocade, Magnavox Odyssey 2, Intellivision, Colecovision, Vectrex, Atari 5200, Emerson Arcadia 2001

 

3rd Generation, 1985-1993 (Renewal, 8-bit matures): Nintendo Entertainment System, Sega Master System, Atari 7800, Atari XEGS

 

4th Generation, 1988-1996 (16 bit and then some): TurboGrafx 16, Sega Genesis, Super Nintendo Entertainment System, Neo Geo AES

 

5th Generation, 1993-2000 (3rd Dimension begins): 3DO, Atari Jaguar, Playstation, Sega Saturn, Nintendo 64

 

6th Generation, 1999-2007 (Disc Systems, the era we stopped counting bits): Sega Dreamcast, Playstation 2, Game Cube, Xbox.

 

7th Generation, 2005- (and then there were three): Xbox 360, Playstation 3, Wii.

 

8th Generation, 2012- (going into the future): WiiU, Xbox One, Playstation 4...

 

But that doesn't indicate how they are defined or what the definition is. The line between each generation seems arbitrary. It can't be defined based on which consoles were competing with each other because competing consoles are listed in different generations. It can't be defined by a company coming out with a new console to replace their last because new consoles are listed in the same generation. It can't be defined by the release years, life span of consoles, and when consoles were discontinued because the years are different. If you listed every single video game console that ever existed and stopped at the 7th Generation then I wouldn't see a definition that would lead me to the conclusion that the WiiU, Xbox One, and Playstation 4 would be part of an 8th generation. Is there a definition that would give me the ability to determine the first console that will start the 9th generation that works with all prior generations?

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I know that. But i did the United States video game console generations...YMMV if you live in Europe or Asia.

 

If that is the case then you should only use USA consoles or have a separate listing for US consoles, eg Atari, Coleco, Intellivision, Mattel, Vectrex, Magnavox, Commodore, Microsoft.

Edited by high voltage

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Okay, you guys bring up some great points. How about we just forget about the whole 'generation' thing and instead just categorize consoles by some other means.

Or just say, "screw it".

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The problem with defining the second generation is that it's very progressive and each console represented an incrimental leap. For example, the 2600 and 5200 exist in the same generation despite the 5200s/A8s obvious technical superiority. The consoles also all came out at different times. I think that a better way to define generations is pre-crash vs post-crash.

Edited by toptenmaterial

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The problem with defining the second generation is that it's very progressive and each console represented an incrimental leap. For example, the 2600 and 5200 exist in the same generation despite the 5200s/A8s obvious technical superiority. The consoles also all came out at different times. I think that a better way to define generations is pre-crash vs post-crash.

 

Yeah, the second generation really seems like two separate but overlapping generations to me.

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The problem with defining the second generation is that it's very progressive and each console represented an incrimental leap. For example, the 2600 and 5200 exist in the same generation despite the 5200s/A8s obvious technical superiority. The consoles also all came out at different times. I think that a better way to define generations is pre-crash vs post-crash.

 

I agree. I think that both the 2600 and 5200 are in the same generation. The intellivision, vectrex, and colecovision were developed to compete against the 2600. The 5200 was designed to compete against them. I think that developers at the time felt that the home market would continue to follow the arcade market. No one was trying to reinvent the wheel. At least until the nes entered the market.

Edited by Manoau2002

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The problem with defining the second generation is that it's very progressive and each console represented an incrimental leap. For example, the 2600 and 5200 exist in the same generation despite the 5200s/A8s obvious technical superiority. The consoles also all came out at different times. I think that a better way to define generations is pre-crash vs post-crash.

 

The PS4 and XBOX One didn't come out when the Wii U did. Couldn't the Wii and Wii U be like the 2600 and 5200?

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Maybe, but I don't think so.

 

The "HD gen" (I call it like that, even if the Wii isn't HD and that some PS2 and Xbox games are able to output HD) stretched more than the previous generations (think about that... from 2006 to 2012, that's 6 years without any new home system. That's the longest time in video game history without a new home system being made) so a 1 year leap between the Wii U and the PS4/Xbone doesn't make it fall back in the "HD gen".

Would the Wii U be released sooner, like in 2009, I would make it part of the current gen. But the Wii U is definitevely next gen.

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The problem with defining the second generation is that it's very progressive and each console represented an incrimental leap. For example, the 2600 and 5200 exist in the same generation despite the 5200s/A8s obvious technical superiority. The consoles also all came out at different times. I think that a better way to define generations is pre-crash vs post-crash.

 

The 2600 existed until 1992 (Atari officially stopped the VCS in 1990, and last official game released in 92), so it's overlapping NES, SMS, 7800, Genesis, SNES, so they're all second gen too, simple.

Edited by high voltage

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Whatever it comes out to be, I would put the XEGS in the same generation as the 5200. They are the same machine for the most part.

 

IMHO, I think the XEGS is just another A8 with a detached keyboard and not a console but that is a different argument.

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Colecovision.

Atari got the ball rolling.

Intellivision made some intelligent changes and doubled the memory.

Colecovision learned from them and made the best system that even the 5200 couldn't top...then the end came.

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Maybe, but I don't think so.

 

The "HD gen" (I call it like that, even if the Wii isn't HD and that some PS2 and Xbox games are able to output HD) stretched more than the previous generations (think about that... from 2006 to 2012, that's 6 years without any new home system. That's the longest time in video game history without a new home system being made) so a 1 year leap between the Wii U and the PS4/Xbone doesn't make it fall back in the "HD gen".

Would the Wii U be released sooner, like in 2009, I would make it part of the current gen. But the Wii U is definitevely next gen.

 

But what makes the PS4/Xbone next generation? What is the definition of a generation to tell that they are and can that definition be applied to every past generation? There were other consoles released. Atari Flashbacks, plug and plays, clone systems,... I can't find a list but there are plenty that were released during that time period or released before but still being sold.

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Atari Flashback and clones aren't "next gen" since they just copy older hardware. That would be like saying the Atari 2600 is 4th gen because it was still sold after the release of the Megadrive and Super Nintendo.

 

They are next gen because they are separate from the current gen by 6 years, a leap in technology and/or (for the Wii U) new way of thinking about gameplay.

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Atari Flashback and clones aren't "next gen" since they just copy older hardware. That would be like saying the Atari 2600 is 4th gen because it was still sold after the release of the Megadrive and Super Nintendo.

 

They are next gen because they are separate from the current gen by 6 years, a leap in technology and/or (for the Wii U) new way of thinking about gameplay.

 

On Wikipedia they are listed in modern generations. I know it isn't always correct but if different websites and different people can't agree on the generations then it is hard to see the line between each generation and which consoles are in them. That's why a definition that fits all generations is needed. With a clear definition there would be no confusion. Without a clear definition video game generations don't even exist.

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Generations are artificial anyway... It's a convenience to define what games systems are the actual ones. The 128 bits era and the coming ones are clear enough, but the earliest ones are blurred.

For me, technically wise, the Atari 2600 and 5200 are different generations, as well as the Colecovision. The Sega SG1000 is supposed to be in the same gen than the Nes and Master System, yet it feels more like a Colecovision-gen system.

Same with the Jaguar and 3DO; they are 32/64 bits gen, yet I feel like the Jaguar is the last of the 16 bits era in mind and realisation, and the 3DO is the first of the 32 bits era.

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