Is it fact that Nintendo Saved Gaming?

[mbd30]

I got my NES sometime around 1988. Before that I had a 2600 and a 7800. The NES was what I had been lusting after for years. Games like "Super Mario Bros.", "Contra" and "Mike Tyson's Punch-Out" seemed a huge leap from what I had been playing on the 2600, and the same old arcade ports such as "Dig Dug" and "Ms. Pac-Man" that I'd been playing on the 7800. Nintendo was significant for me at that time.

[MaximRecoil]

After having the 2600 for four years and the Tandy Coco for four years (1980-1988) I went through consoles pretty quickly:

 

NES - 1988

TG-16 - 1989

Genesis - 1990

SNES - 1993

 

Of those 4 the NES, at the time, held the least interest to me. I never saw it as saving gaming because I had always been gaming, so were my friends, my family, my schoolmates. Sure some got the NES and loved it but no one said - wow I'm glad Nintendo came along and brought back video games. That would have been a "WTF are you talking about" statement at the time. In hindsight I understand it looks that way but for those of us who went through those years in my little part of Southern Ontario, video games continued along just fine and grew in popularity, even if the 2600 and the consoles of that era started to decline in popularity. People just saw the nes as another way to play video games. Newer, and different, but not a holy savior of a dead medium.

Your experience is a rather uncommon one, at least in comparison to my experience in the United States. In the U.S. home computers were never even mainstream, much less hugely popular, until the 2000s when x86 PCs became cheap, and cheap and easy unlimited access to the internet made for a "killer app". Most people I knew growing up in the 1980s did not have a home computer; consoles were far more common (with the Atari 2600 being the most common, until the NES). The only home-computer-specific video game that I can even name is "The Oregon Trail", because of its ubiquity on the Apple II that many public schools had. Even Tetris, a game which started out on home computers, didn't become a household word until it was a pack-in game for the Nintendo Game Boy.

 

The first day of school, 5th grade, September 1985, I marvelled at the pair of TI-99/4A computers that the teacher had hooked up to small black & white TVs in the back of the classroom, because you didn't see home computers very often. While we had some home computers at our school, there were only a few of them (TRS-80s with integrated monochrome white phosphor monitors), and access to them was very limited and shared by the whole school. The only "game" we ever got to play on them was a simple math game with no graphics, just text. It would display a math problem in standard text form, you typed in the answer with the number pad, then it would display the next problem, and so on, and when it was done it would show your time of completion and your percentage of correct answers. However, these TI-99s were different, because they were the personal property of the teacher, so they were always in the room and our class had exclusive access to them (though he never let us use them much; sometimes on break, and if you wanted to wait in line, and if you could get your turn before break was over). He did have a few actual video games for them, which loaded from cassette tapes, but I don't remember what they were called (I know they were very similar to established arcade and/or console games at the time).

 

The kids who had home computers were mostly the "nerd" types, and you didn't usually see those kids at the arcade after school. Maybe because their home computer games had more depth than a typical arcade game, or maybe they just wanted to do their homework instead; who knows?

 

I knew something was going on when my cousin started complaining that he couldn't buy new ColecoVision games anymore, and not long after I bought an Atari 2600 in '85 (for $30, new), and went into Kay Bee Toys & Hobby in the mall to look for games, the clerk said they don't carry those anymore.

[Osgeld]

on the other side of that coin, by the early 90's I didnt know anyone that did not have some form of a computer, mostly tandy 1000's, couple mac's 64's, we had an apple II ... and that was nerds and non nerds alike... though the non nerds might have had 1 game and a bootleg wordprocessor heh

[Austin]

Your experience is a rather uncommon one, at least in comparison to my experience in the United States. In the U.S. home computers were never even mainstream, much less hugely popular, until the 2000s when x86 PCs became cheap, and cheap and easy unlimited access to the internet made for a "killer app". Most people I knew growing up in the 1980s did not have a home computer; consoles were far more common (with the Atari 2600 being the most common, until the NES). The only home-computer-specific video game that I can even name is "The Oregon Trail", because of its ubiquity on the Apple II that many public schools had. Even Tetris, a game which started out on home computers, didn't become a household word until it was a pack-in game for the Nintendo Game Boy.

 

This is pretty much my experience as well. I was born in '82, so started attending school in '87 or so. From then until at least the early '90s ('91/'92 or so), I barely knew of anyone that had a home computer. Especially not the hook-to-the-television kind of the early '80s, like the TI-99, Commodore 64, etc--I didn't even know about those types of computers until the mid 1990's when I first had internet access. Families I knew that had IBM PC Compatible computers did so for business/school/work purposes, and that was about it. Games were secondary, sort of an added bonus that you dabbled with here and there. My own family also had an IBM 286-based PC in the late '80s so my Dad could work on CAD designs both for his primary job and on the side for extra money. We wouldn't have had a computer if it wasn't for that (they were expensive back then). For a while it seemed the Apple IIGS was where most of my school companions experienced computers. With Oregon Trail, of course, and some text adventure games. Where I grew up it seemed computers were bought for a very specific kind of purpose (i.e., productivity), and thus a great gaming experience for someone my age was typically had on a game console. That's all just anecdotal "evidence", of course, but that was my experience nonetheless. Other parts of the country may have been different.

[mbd30]

I had an IBM PC compatible at the time because my dad used it for work. First monochrome and then later upgraded to CGA. As a gaming platform, it was worthwhile in some ways, but it was no NES.

 

My next door neighbor had a TI-99/4A, another friend had a PC, and we knew other people with computers. My family was lower middle class, but we tended to know upper middle class people.

[MaximRecoil]

It sounds like Canada may have been different, and if so, it explains why my Canadian friend played a similar game to Super Mario Bros. on a home computer (which we eventually determined to be "Bros", a very poor knockoff) before ever playing the real game on an NES. I thought that was bizarre at the time, and I didn't even believe her until I made a thread asking about it. I never considered that the gaming situation itself may have been different in Canada. It is hard for me to think of Canada as being much different, because I live in central Maine, only about a 3 hour drive from the Canadian border.

Edited December 15, 2013 by MaximRecoil

[AtariLeaf]

Weird, I was in high school and around 85/86 in the 10th and 11th grade we had "data processing" class which was filled with C64's. All the kids were familiar with them as EVERYONE had one. Some lucky bastards even had Amiga's. I was one of the exceptions having owned a Tandy Color Computer but still loved the C64 - not just the arcade ports which were fantastic but some great adventure and simulation games. We spent a lot of time swapping disks in that class. I'd go home in the afternoon, log onto my coco's bbs with my 300 baud modem and hook up to dozens of local BBS's just in my city which were full of people with home computers. In those days people still owned, bought and played Atari, Intellivision and CV games, actually they bought more since they were heavily discounted.

 

And of course some had the brand new NES - although not many I knew. Nobody cared about it in 85/86 where I lived. We found computer games better, more "sophisticated". Of course I can't remember when SMB came out but I don't remember the initial run of games being anything to write home about. I do remember the commercials with that stupid robot and the stack game or whatever it was. Seemed really lame to me and my classmates. Maybe younger grade school kids were more impressed by it but I was in high school and my peers and I didn't give the NES much thought at all.

 

One thing is for damn sure - we didn't look at it as something that was "saving video games"

 

Makes me wonder if the NES actually saved gaming or just came along at a time when a new younger generation was there to discover and appreciate it. We didn't think video games needed saving. We've had them all along.

 

I do like the NES, at least for its selection of great arcade ports.

Edited December 15, 2013 by AtariLeaf

[MaximRecoil]

Weird, I was in high school and around 85/86 in the 10th and 11th grade we had "data processing" class which was filled with C64's. All the kids were familiar with them as EVERYONE had one.

Was it an elective? I was in high school from '89-'93, and there was a computer class, but I don't know what it was called. There were only 5 or 6 computers in the room, and I remember that at least some of them were running OS/2. The class was an elective, and not very popular, but I suspect that most or all of the kids that signed up for it had home computers, and they were all definitely interested in them in the first place. This kid was one of them. I was more or less friends with him I suppose, but not good friends; we never hung out or anything. I did pay him to do my math homework a few times. Note his Ph.D. in Computer Engineering. Like I said, it was mostly people like him that had home computers (along with people who had parents who had them for business reasons); people who were into it hardcore; it wasn't a mainstream thing by any means.

[AtariLeaf]

I think it was an elective but it was a popular class. Easy credit plus you got to play video games a lot. Win-win

 

Oh another thing I forgot to mention - arcades were still really popular. The mid and late 80's we still had a couple great arcades and machines in every corner store and shopping mall and always had a bunch of kids, teens, and adults around them. I remember playing Mario Bros. and Rampage in the local mall outside of Kmart back then.

Edited December 15, 2013 by AtariLeaf

[ls650]

When I was in high school in the early 1980s, a significant minority (say 25%) of the households of my schoolmates had some form of 8-bit computer: quite a few VIC-20s, some Atari 8-bits, and the occasional Apple II or TRS-80. Maybe 40% to 50% had some form of console, mostly Atari VCS but occasionally an Intellivision or Odyssey 2. When the Colecovision came out, it was fairly popular for a while. I only knew one guy with a Vectrex, and no one with a 5200. There was quite a bit of overlap between computer and console ownership, and it wouldn't have been unusual for a schoolmate to have had both, say a VCS and a VIC-20.

 

When the Commodore 64 came out, it exploded in popularity, and quite a few folks had those within a year or two of release. The NES didn't come out until I was in university. As I recall it was popular, but I was busy with my studies and didn't really pay much attention to console gaming for a few years then.

Edited December 15, 2013 by ls650

[MaximRecoil]

I think it was an elective but it was a popular class. Easy credit plus you got to play video games a lot. Win-win

 

Oh another thing I forgot to mention - arcades were still really popular. The mid and late 80's we still had a couple great arcades and machines in every corner store and shopping mall and always had a bunch of kids, teens, and adults around them. I remember playing Mario Bros. and Rampage in the local mall outside of Kmart back then.

Arcades were popular here throughout the '80s as well; you even saw arcade machines at laundromats, gas stations, convenience stores, and department stores. For me, arcades were where it was at; consoles were just a passable substitute for when I had no quarters.

[Austin]

One thing is for damn sure - we didn't look at it as something that was "saving video games"

 

Of course not, you lived through it and were still playing games as many others were. What people refer to as 'saving games' comes from a financial/business/industry perspective. As it's been stated, after the crash the industry as a whole was just a fraction of it used to be from a financial perspective. It wasn't until the NES that in North America it experienced a massive boom again (again, from a financial/business perspective). I don't really like the term "saved", and I think a better way to put it is that it "resuscitated the industry". The "industry" part being separate from people still playing or buying games. It was big business again, whereas during/a few years after the "crash", it wasn't.

[+Random Terrain]

This is pretty much my experience as well. I was born in '82, so started attending school in '87 or so. From then until at least the early '90s ('91/'92 or so), I barely knew of anyone that had a home computer. Especially not the hook-to-the-television kind of the early '80s, like the TI-99, Commodore 64, etc--I didn't even know about those types of computers until the mid 1990's when I first had internet access. Families I knew that had IBM PC Compatible computers did so for business/school/work purposes, and that was about it. Games were secondary, sort of an added bonus that you dabbled with here and there. My own family also had an IBM 286-based PC in the late '80s so my Dad could work on CAD designs both for his primary job and on the side for extra money. We wouldn't have had a computer if it wasn't for that (they were expensive back then). For a while it seemed the Apple IIGS was where most of my school companions experienced computers. With Oregon Trail, of course, and some text adventure games. Where I grew up it seemed computers were bought for a very specific kind of purpose (i.e., productivity), and thus a great gaming experience for someone my age was typically had on a game console. That's all just anecdotal "evidence", of course, but that was my experience nonetheless. Other parts of the country may have been different.

 

Yes, other parts must have been very different. I lived in Virginia during the 'crash' and it seemed like a lot of teens either had computers or knew someone who did. Nobody I knew had an IBM. 'We' had computers like the VIC-20, Commodore 64, TRS-80, TI-99/4A, and various Atari computers. Seemed like most teens felt like the IBM was some boring expensive thing for rich businessmen. Our computers could do boring stuff, but they were mostly gaming computers in our eyes.

 

You might be interested in this Electronic Games article from 1984:

 

https://archive.org/stream/Electronic_Games_Volume_02_Number_17_1984-12_Reese_Communications_US#page/n62/mode/1up

 

Here are a few paragraphs from that article:

 

Things change fast in the computer universe. As recently as two years ago, the idea of having a microcomputer in the home seemed pretty remote to most people. Now as many American families own a microcomputer as had a programmable videogame console back in January 1983, the peak of the cartridge system boom. By the end of this holiday season, 16% -20% of all U.S. homes will have a microcomputer, thanks to the hardware sales which are expected to top 6.5 million for 1984.

 

If the general public is dipping into the computer ocean, then the nation's gamers are cannonballing into the same waters. A recent independent study of subscribers to Electronic Games shows that almost 55% have already purchased home computers. The survey was completed during the summer, so the anticipated strong fourth-quarter sales should greatly increase this percentage by the end of the year. Interestingly, more EG readers buy computer software, about 60%, than own computers at the present time. According to follow-up interviews, the fact that some prospective computer owners are already buying software for use on friends' machines accounts for the apparent discrepancy.

 

Why are people buying so many computers? Ralph Baer, the father of the videogame, asserts that there are only three legitimate reasons for buying a computer: word processing, linkage to a network through a modem, and entertainment. That's an extreme view, admittedly, but though other experts might subdivide any of Baer's broad categories, it's hard to knock down the basic tenet that games are one of the main reasons computers are finding a place in the home.

 

Sales figures don't lie. More than one out of every two pieces of software sold in the U.S. is a game. And because game-lovers buy programs more often than other computerists, leisureware is likely to maintain its dominance for a long time to come.

 

You might also want to check out the 7 page gifts for gamers section in the same issue:

 

https://archive.org/stream/Electronic_Games_Volume_02_Number_17_1984-12_Reese_Communications_US#page/n21/mode/2up

[Dr Manhattan]

No it was Commodore, but Nintendo really helped to revive retailer confidence.

[AtariLeaf]

Sounds like it's reasonable to assume that the rising popularity of home computers, in a way, may have helped "cause the crash" (frankly I hate the term crash because I don't really think it's totally accurate) since people were getting sick of the shovelware that was out there. I wonder if as many people would have jumped to computers if consoles were able to keep things fresh and different - which is what the nes was -something fresh and different.

 

As much as I love donkey kong, pacman, space invaders, galaxian, etc (and which I'm a primary collector of) the general public doesn't want to see constant updated versions of the same game year after year. Hmmm. Doesn't THAT sound familiar.

Edited December 15, 2013 by AtariLeaf

[JamesD]

...

 

As much as I love donkey kong, pacman, space invaders, galaxian, etc (and which I'm a primary collector of) the general public doesn't want to see constant updated versions of the same game year after year. Hmmm. Doesn't THAT sound familiar.

But isn't that mostly what Nintendo does?

[Jess Ragan]

If I am looking for an answer how did I lose?

Also since you are the desperate one spinnig and no on agrees with you aren't you the confederate redneck who refuse to admit he lost?

 

Atari lost. You can try to pretend otherwise, but Nintendo BURIED Atari in the late 1980s, and by the 1990s, Atari was irrelevant as a console manufacturer. You can split hairs, whine that Nintendo didn't start this, didn't start that, people were playing (entirely different) games on computers, blah blah blah, but regardless of how you try to revise history, Nintendo was hugely instrumental in the reconstruction of the American video game industry. If it were up to Atari, we would have been playing regurgitations of Centipede and Asteroids in the late 1980s, and the industry wouldn't have grown nearly as quickly.

 

I'm starting to agree with the other members of AtariAge that you're either an overzealous fanboy or a troll. Every thread you've started has the bitter aftertaste of devil's advocacy and historical revision, and you're not satisfied until you've bullied the answer you want from other AA members. You say "Was XXX a failure?," when what you really mean is "XXX wasn't a failure, and I won't be happy until you agree with me." Don't count on me to validate your wrongheaded opinions, and I doubt you'll get that validation from anyone else.

[Rhomaios]

Your experience is a rather uncommon one, at least in comparison to my experience in the United States. In the U.S. home computers were never even mainstream, much less hugely popular, until the 2000s when x86 PCs became cheap, and cheap and easy unlimited access to the internet made for a "killer app". Most people I knew growing up in the 1980s did not have a home computer; consoles were far more common (with the Atari 2600 being the most common, until the NES). The only home-computer-specific video game that I can even name is "The Oregon Trail", because of its ubiquity on the Apple II that many public schools had. Even Tetris, a game which started out on home computers, didn't become a household word until it was a pack-in game for the Nintendo Game Boy.

 

The first day of school, 5th grade, September 1985, I marvelled at the pair of TI-99/4A computers that the teacher had hooked up to small black & white TVs in the back of the classroom, because you didn't see home computers very often. While we had some home computers at our school, there were only a few of them (TRS-80s with integrated monochrome white phosphor monitors), and access to them was very limited and shared by the whole school. The only "game" we ever got to play on them was a simple math game with no graphics, just text. It would display a math problem in standard text form, you typed in the answer with the number pad, then it would display the next problem, and so on, and when it was done it would show your time of completion and your percentage of correct answers. However, these TI-99s were different, because they were the personal property of the teacher, so they were always in the room and our class had exclusive access to them (though he never let us use them much; sometimes on break, and if you wanted to wait in line, and if you could get your turn before break was over). He did have a few actual video games for them, which loaded from cassette tapes, but I don't remember what they were called (I know they were very similar to established arcade and/or console games at the time).

 

The kids who had home computers were mostly the "nerd" types, and you didn't usually see those kids at the arcade after school. Maybe because their home computer games had more depth than a typical arcade game, or maybe they just wanted to do their homework instead; who knows?

 

I knew something was going on when my cousin started complaining that he couldn't buy new ColecoVision games anymore, and not long after I bought an Atari 2600 in '85 (for $30, new), and went into Kay Bee Toys & Hobby in the mall to look for games, the clerk said they don't carry those anymore.

 

I beg to differ. Computers were definitely ubiquitous in the 90s, I had one and I *loved* the arcades. Maybe not every family had one, but enough of them did. The only thing is that the games I had for the computer were vastly different from console games. Mostly this was my ignorance, but for me PC meant adventure games (King's Quest, 7th Guest, or Myst), first-person shooters (Duke Nukem!), or the Windows Entertainment Pack, while consoles were RPGs (Final Fantasy, or action-adventure like Zelda) and platformers (Mario, Sonic, Donkey Kong). Funny how I still hate playing adventure games on anything but a computer!

[MaximRecoil]

I beg to differ. Computers were definitely ubiquitous in the 90s,

Not even close to being ubiquitous for most of the 1990s. X86 PCs were still ridiculously expensive ($1500 for a "cheap" one), and the old "connect to your TV" ones from the 1980s were considered obsolete by most people. The SNES and Genesis, and then the PlayStation and N64, were hugely popular by that time, and took care of most people's gaming needs.

 

In the mid 1990s, Windows 95 was released, which made it very easy to connect to the internet, and was a very user-friendly OS in general. This gave X86 PCs a big shot in the arm, but they were still $1500 for a cheap one. By the late 1990s, all of the roadblocks had been removed, i.e., cheap PCs were available from companies like eMachines, most ISPs had ditched the ridiculous pay-by-the-minute internet access plan and had gone to a relatively cheap flat rate per month for unlimited access plan, and Windows 98 was out, which was better than Windows 95. This is when home computers became mainstream. People with no prior computer knowhow or interest started getting them just so they could get online. Video games never prompted many grandmas to run out and buy e.g. a Commodore 64, but email, etc. certainly prompted plenty of them to buy x86 PCs. Even my father has a PC with internet access, and he won't even try a video game; he's flat-out refused vehemently every time I've tried to get him to try a video game. The internet made home computers appealing to a far wider audience than video games and business applications ever did, which is how they became mainstream; nearly as ubiquitous as a telephone or TV these days.

[Rhomaios]

Meh, $1500 isn't that expensive, and there were cheaper still. This seems to indicate that 44% of people under 50 had a computer in 1995 with 15% growth from the year before. Maybe "ubiquitous" is a bit strong, but it certainly wasn't "rare", especially if you would eliminate the lower income houses entirely, which would mean that a larger percent of middle income to affluent would have a computer. This site, however, gives different numbers, though certainly not "super rare" sort of numbers. Also, neither take into account the popularity of the Mac in school, which would have exposed even more kids to computers and computer games.

 

A good way to gauge all this, though, is by sales numbers. The 7th Guest, a CD-only game, sold 2-3 million, no small feat if computers were "rare" in 1993. Economically, the country was well off in 1995 as well, so it's not like a $1500 computer would have been absolutely unreasonable.

 

I'm not disagreeing that consoles weren't as popular in the 90s, but both my memory and the numbers seem to indicate that a good number of Americans had them. They were familiar to me throughout the mid to late 90s, and I was by no means rich. And 2 million copies of a game that required CD hardware on a computer is no chump change, either. Finally, add in Macs in school and you have yourself a solid argument that computer use blossomed before the 2000s.

 

Edit: Yet more numbers about the growth of computer ownership in the 90s. http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/seind00/c8/c8s3.htm

Edited December 16, 2013 by o.pwuaioc

[MaximRecoil]

Meh, $1500 isn't that expensive, and there were cheaper still.

Yes, it is. $1,500 is expensive for a computer now, and it was even more expensive in the '90s. I bought an '84 Ford Escort in 1992 for $450. I bought an '83 Ford F100 with 60,000 miles in 1994 for $750. I bought a brand new Colt Government Model .45 ACP in 1991 for $479. I bought a like-new Colt AR-15 SP1 in 1993 for $500. $1,500 isn't that expensive for an electronic gizmo? Uh huh.

 

This seems to indicate that 44% of people under 50 had a computer in 1995 with 15% growth from the year before. Maybe "ubiquitous" is a bit strong, but it certainly wasn't "rare", especially if you would eliminate the lower income houses entirely, which would mean that a larger percent of middle income to affluent would have a computer. This site, however, gives different numbers, though certainly not "super rare" sort of numbers. Also, neither take into account the popularity of the Mac in school, which would have exposed even more kids to computers and computer games.

"The poll found that 32% of households overall have a PC. Of those, 15% have been bought in the past year (between 1994 and 1995)"

 

I already said that home computers got "a shot in the arm" in 1995 with the introduction of Windows 95, and this confirms it. The number of households with computers was a lot lower in the first half of the 1990s.

 

A good way to gauge all this, though, is by sales numbers. The 7th Guest, a CD-only game, sold 2-3 million, no small feat if computers were "rare" in 1993. Economically, the country was well off in 1995 as well, so it's not like a $1500 computer would have been absolutely unreasonable.

I didn't say they were "rare", I said they weren't mainstream, and certainly not "ubiquitous". Also, I see "over 2 million" mentioned on various sites, but I'm not seeing "2-3 million", so where did you get that figure? I'm also not seeing the period of time, i.e., did it sell "over 2 million" in 1993, or did it sell "over 2 million", period? Where did those sales occur? Strictly in the United States, or in other countries as well?

 

I'm not disagreeing that consoles weren't as popular in the 90s, but both my memory and the numbers seem to indicate that a good number of Americans had them. They were familiar to me throughout the mid to late 90s, and I was by no means rich. And 2 million copies of a game that required CD hardware on a computer is no chump change, either. Finally, add in Macs in school and you have yourself a solid argument that computer use blossomed before the 2000s.

As I said before, PCs started to get big in 1995, and started to get huge in the late 1990s. They didn't approach "ubiquitous" status until the 2000s.

[+Random Terrain]

Not even close to being ubiquitous for most of the 1990s. X86 PCs were still ridiculously expensive ($1500 for a "cheap" one), and the old "connect to your TV" ones from the 1980s were considered obsolete by most people. The SNES and Genesis, and then the PlayStation and N64, were hugely popular by that time, and took care of most people's gaming needs.

 

In the mid 1990s, Windows 95 was released, which made it very easy to connect to the internet, and was a very user-friendly OS in general. This gave X86 PCs a big shot in the arm, but they were still $1500 for a cheap one. By the late 1990s, all of the roadblocks had been removed, i.e., cheap PCs were available from companies like eMachines, most ISPs had ditched the ridiculous pay-by-the-minute internet access plan and had gone to a relatively cheap flat rate per month for unlimited access plan, and Windows 98 was out, which was better than Windows 95. This is when home computers became mainstream. People with no prior computer knowhow or interest started getting them just so they could get online. Video games never prompted many grandmas to run out and buy e.g. a Commodore 64, but email, etc. certainly prompted plenty of them to buy x86 PCs. Even my father has a PC with internet access, and he won't even try a video game; he's flat-out refused vehemently every time I've tried to get him to try a video game. The internet made home computers appealing to a far wider audience than video games and business applications ever did, which is how they became mainstream; nearly as ubiquitous as a telephone or TV these days.

 

How did you guys get onto that subject? I thought we were talking about gaming? Computers like the VIC-20, Commodore 64, TRS-80, TI-99/4A, and various Atari computers were being used by more and more gamers by 1984 and that's half a decade before the 1990s:

 

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/219372-is-it-fact-that-nintendo-saved-gaming/?p=2885982

 

In the USA, the TI-99/4A was $99 at one point. The VIC-20 was only $100 or less by 1983. The Commodore 64 was less than $200 in 1984. I don't feel like looking up the rest right now. In 1984, you could buy certain computers for about the same price as a game console.

 

I got an Amiga 500 in 1992 for $299. That was my computer until 1999 when I was given a Windows PC that could access the Internet.

[Rhomaios]

Yes, it is. $1,500 is expensive for a computer now, and it was even more expensive in the '90s. I bought an '84 Ford Escort in 1992 for $450. I bought an '83 Ford F100 with 60,000 miles in 1994 for $750. I bought a brand new Colt Government Model .45 ACP in 1991 for $479. I bought a like-new Colt AR-15 SP1 in 1993 for $500. $1,500 isn't that expensive for an electronic gizmo? Uh huh.

 

 

"The poll found that 32% of households overall have a PC. Of those, 15% have been bought in the past year (between 1994 and 1995)"

 

I already said that home computers got "a shot in the arm" in 1995 with the introduction of Windows 95, and this confirms it. The number of households with computers was a lot lower in the first half of the 1990s.

 

 

I didn't say they were "rare", I said they weren't mainstream, and certainly not "ubiquitous". Also, I see "over 2 million" mentioned on various sites, but I'm not seeing "2-3 million", so where did you get that figure? I'm also not seeing the period of time, i.e., did it sell "over 2 million" in 1993, or did it sell "over 2 million", period? Where did those sales occur? Strictly in the United States, or in other countries as well?

 

 

As I said before, PCs started to get big in 1995, and started to get huge in the late 1990s. They didn't approach "ubiquitous" status until the 2000s.

 

I already retracted "uniquitous", but you didn't mention the part about them being in plenty of offices and schools. The 3M figure came from various sources, and there are no breakdowns of sale numbers that I can find. Unfortunately, the 80s and 90s are horrible years for evidence.

 

 

I'm not sure we're arguing different things at this point. Your first post seemed to imply they were rare in the 90s and only got popular in the 2000s, whereas I maintained they were popular in the 90s and got super-popular in the 2000s. Here on out it's probably just a debate about semantics, since the numbers don't lie (except when you misquote them, as I accidentally did ).

[AtariLeaf]

But isn't that mostly what Nintendo does?

Ironically yes, but it was a general comment about the industry as a whole today - Madden, COD, Halo, Mario, etc

[AtariLeaf]

 

 

In the USA, the TI-99/4A was $99 at one point. The VIC-20 was only $100 or less by 1983. The Commodore 64 was less than $200 in 1984. I don't feel like looking up the rest right now. In 1984, you could buy certain computers for about the same price as a game console.

 

I got an Amiga 500 in 1992 for $299. That was my computer until 1999 when I was given a Windows PC that could access the Internet.

This is a huge reason computers became popular in the 80's. They were at a very easy price point, you could do all kinds of grown up stuff like word processing, or, like most of us, play video games. Anyone know what the NES cost when it first came out in the US?