Gyruss on 5200 vs Colecovision

[Lynxpro]

Before I get any further, I must state I love Gyruss on the 5200 but I have to ask why the graphics are so much less detailed than the Colecovision version.

 

Both ROMs clock in at about 13K and the arcade original apparently at 48K.

 

I'm curious whether the Colecovision version shares any of the arcade's source code since both used Z80 CPUs. Granted, the arcade version used *2* Z80 CPUs, a Motorola 6809 CPU, an Intel micro-controller chip, and 5 General Instruments audio chips, but who's counting?

 

What I also find interesting is I consider the game play of the 5200 version closer to the arcade original vs the Colecovision version even if the graphics on the Colecovision are closer to the original. The music in both the 5200 and Colecovision versions sound the same to my ears even though the Colecovision has the extra SFX included.

 

Could the 5200/A8 version be improved upon - if the source code was available - to put the graphics and SFX on par with the Colecovision port? Would it require extra RAM?

[boxpressed]

I can't answer any of your technical questions, but this is one of the few action/twitch games whose ColecoVision port is superior to the 5200 port, I find. I don't need arcade-quality graphics, but the 5200's visuals are just too blocky, almost like the 5200 is operating in some kind of low-res mode.

 

This game is 100% better on both platforms with an arcade stick, btw.

[jetset]

It does seem like the A8/5200 version was a rush job. The 5200 tends to have better graphics on a majority of the "like" games, but Gyruss certainly is an exception.

[Tempest]

There's an unreleased A8 version that was shown on the back of the box. Maybe the released version WAS a rush job?

[atarian63]

am I missing something? I have both and think the 5200 is better

[Lynxpro]

I think the gameplay on the 5200 is closest to the arcade version but the Colecovision has the better quality graphics. As Jetset suggested, the graphics on the 5200 version seemed to be a rush job and not a good representation of what the A8/5200 could do.

[Rybags]

A8/5200 version uses a lower resolution graphics mode than C64 or Coleco.

I can't recall seeing a box picture but possibly the C64 version is depicted.

 

So, comparing graphics resolution - you'd have effective 160x100 for the 5200 version, 160x200 for the C64, and 256x200 for the Coleco.

Looking at some pics that show up... the objects on the Coleco version look somewhat monochrome, did they just use single colour sprites or are some objects multicoloured?

 

With some extra effort, the Atari version could easily have been done in 160x200 mode - some more programming effort would be needed and it would probably have made it exceed the 16K ROM size.

 

Quite possible the Coleco version uses sprites for most of the objects, the Atari version would be mostly bitmap softsprites and generally they use quite a bit more memory, plus the display routine uses yet more.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Rybags

[slampam]

CV has the advantage when GFX needs sharp angles. (1x1 pixels)

5200 firing SFX is heard during challenge stages but not when music plays, yet Pokey has 4 channels?

Ultimately this 5200 version is pointless as the set game window is too small. It forces the GFX to squish down. (Check out the C64 version for proper window size and 2x1 GFX.)

Perhaps offset colors would make badies look less blocky:

...change this hex string... 44 46 28 44 78 28 74 2A 28 24 C8 28 C4

...to something like this... 44 B6 28 44 98 28 74 DA 28 24 08 28 C4

Gyruss-autofire-color.zip

[+Defender_2600]

 

With some extra effort, the Atari version could easily have been done in 160x200 mode - some more programming effort would be needed and it would probably have made it exceed the 16K ROM size.

 

 

 

I agree. Here is a little example:

 

 

 

[Lynxpro]

If one were to increase the resolution, it would be preferable to change the display to favor the vertical aspect vs the original horizontal since most of us are today using TV screens much larger than we used back in 1982-83 when maximizing the entire 13"-19" screen was so important. I'm not an A8 expert but I'd think overscan might be possible. Combined with soft fonts, the 5200 should be able to match the Colecovision version.

 

If a homebrew hack could be done, we could today use a 32K ROM (plus 16K RAM on the cart) to bring it up to spec. That might go a long way to matching the Colecovision's TI graphics chip with built in 16K RAM.

[Kyle22]

Gyruss was always one of my favorite games on the A8. I would love to see a re-make. Now, we have lots of RAM and storage, so there are many possibilities.

[Synthpopalooza]

I am also wondering if it might be possible to double-buffer the PMG memory. Use double line res, set up memory for 2 PMBASEs, and switch between the two on every VBLANK, along with the PMcolor registers. Combine this with priority blending, it may be possible to get extra colors for your players.

[Rybags]

Since the game was cart-based, like most it was likely developed with 16K RAM systems in mind.

Sadly in some cases that means using Gr. 7 instead of 15 simply as a memory saving measure.

[Lynxpro]

True, but using the extra 16K RAM possible on the cart as well should make significant improvements. And that's just keeping with period-piece tech from the 5200's era and no going the modern Ultimate SD Cart option.

[Coleco]

I picked this game up around 85 at Kaybee for the 5200 when they were selling games for about 1.99 along with a really cheap Competition Pro (which makes the game a ton better if your joystick is perfectly centered. I loved the game and thought the graphics were great for the time. It's all a matter of perspective, I guess, but it got me back into playing the 5200 for a while.

[Jess Ragan]

It's fine on the Atari 5200 (despite others bitching about the control), but I do wish the resolution hadn't been so coarse. It would have made a big difference. It always feels like the enemies are too close to you because there's so little onscreen real estate.

[Nebulon]

It's fine on the Atari 5200 (despite others bitching about the control), but I do wish the resolution hadn't been so coarse. It would have made a big difference. It always feels like the enemies are too close to you because there's so little onscreen real estate.

That's exactly the sensation that I got from it. It feels too crowded.

 

The cool mock-up that Defender_2600 did sure shows how wicked it would look in 160x192 mode.

[Lynxpro]

That's exactly the sensation that I got from it. It feels too crowded.

 

The cool mock-up that Defender_2600 did sure shows how wicked it would look in 160x192 mode.

Link please!

[Kyle22]

Scroll up to post #9

[Kjmann]

Anthony Weber was originally coding Gyruss for parker brothers (His version is what you see on the back of the box) then at the last minute parker bros decided to release their own in house version. I Don't know why they decided this. Anthony Weber (Who I've chatted with in email several times) Doesn't know either.

 

 

-Kjmann

[atarian63]

Anthony Weber was originally coding Gyruss for parker brothers (His version is what you see on the back of the box) then at the last minute parker bros decided to release their own in house version. I Don't know why they decided this. Anthony Weber (Who I've chatted with in email several times) Doesn't know either.

 

 

-Kjmann

Wonder how far he got. anything that could be finished maybe

[Kjmann]

He Said it was 99% Finished. just some bugs to work out. When I get it, I will release it. =)

[Kyle22]

one of my favorites. Love to see a new version

[Twin_power]

I'm interested in that release. I would buy a cartridge for an improved Gyruss version. Hope to see some demos and/ or video of its gameplay soon on AA. Thanks for the info.

[BillyHW]

Was the 5200 version just a lazy port of the A8 version? If so, then that probably explains the differences. The CV version was just made later and more effort was put into it.

 

I though the Famicom/NES version was good too.