Kids react to Apple II

[potatohead]

Yeah, first thing we did was hit the books. Apple computers shipped with good enough books to understand the computer reasonably. One could get a few more, and have a very, very good grasp of the machine, for just some reading.

 

(My favorite reading time was Geography class.)

 

Anyway, there are two basic schools of thought going on here.

 

The people who believe having to read something means the software isn't good enough, are interested in software as an enabler. They get prompted and taken through doing something, whatever it is, and it's process for them. Make it lean, keep choices few and sane, and just blast through and get it done, whatever it is.

 

Often, there is an assumption of not keeping a lot of stuff in our heads too. Things change, software to do them changes, and it's all just gotta work for people of various skill levels.

 

Others, see software as a tool, and they may very frequently be content creators of some sort, or they may be working on task complexity that transcends not having to read. We still do hear them grumble about this and that, "why read", but progress is slow, because task complexity is high. Additionally, there is some expectation of building skill and or building on the software itself.

 

Early on, we didn't actually have the first type mentioned above, mostly because a lot of this stuff was really new to most people. Good docs made sense. Great docs weaved in some education, or put code and other hard technical info out there, so people could find their way and get some education at the same time.

 

Today, far less education is needed, so it's not getting done. IMHO, that's what people like us bitch about.

 

We know better. The education still needs to get done, and if we don't, we won't develop our next future software people and we lose out to those who do. IMHO, this is changing slowly, but not slowly enough.

 

Now, some software started down that road even on the Apple ][. I was playing Robot Odyssey last night, running through the absolutely brilliant in-game tutorials. If you've not seen this title, play it. The tutorials are a lot of fun, and far more open ended than you think. To me, that's getting some education in, while helping the user through a task, and being a useful, effective UI all in one.

 

There will always be documentation needs. But, the greater information availability today means the bare minimum is some technical information where people can fill those gaps however they want to / need to.

 

That Apple ROM listing was how I got started writing my very first 6502 Assembly Language programs. Actually, it was machine language as I would hand assemble it, then type the bytes in before I knew about the Mini Assembler.

[Keatah]

Having the hardware and software manuals together and available instantly enabled me to develop a great homogeneous understanding of the hardware and software and how it all fit together. Proceeding from the theoretical and conceptual stage down into the specifics. And when the time came to use the material it felt old hat. Apple II and TRS-80 documentation was fantastic and written for both the technical and lay-person simultaneously. This enabled one to progress at their own rate. And when you learn at your best speed you learn better than anyone else having to adhere to coursework.

 

My early technical library (for a kid) consisted of the following:

 

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/basic/Applesoft%20BASIC%20Programming%20Reference%20Manual%20-%20Apple%20Computer.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/basic/BASIC%20Programming%20Reference%20Manual%20(Green).pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/os/dos/DOS%20Manual.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/os/dos/DOS%203.2%20Instructional%20and%20Reference%20Manual.pdf

 

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/basic/Beagle_Bros-Apple%20Commands%201984.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/basic/Beagle_Bros-Peeks,%20Pokes%20&%20Pointers%201984.pdf

 

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/io/Hayes%20Micromodem%20II%20-%20Owner%27s%20Guide.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/io/Hayes%20Micromodem%20II%20Manual.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/io/Grappler+%20Operators%20Manual.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/ae/TimeMaster%20II%20H.O%20-%20User%20Manual%20v1.2.pdf

ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.com/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/storage/disks/Sider%20User%27s%20Manual.pdf

 

https://archive.org/details/Getting_Started_with_TRS-80_Basic_1981_Tandy

http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/t80ppc/p1manual.pdf

http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/t80ppc/p1refcrd.pdf

http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/t80ppc/p1print.pdf

 

The only manual not listed is the Epson MX-80 III F/T with GrafTrax because it apparently has not been scanned in yet. On my to-do list.

 

I remember taking one or two of these to school almost everyday.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Keatah

[Streck]

I could not disagree more. It's the pre-internet thinking that holds older people back from taking advantage of it.

 

 

There's a bit of truth in both sides here.

 

Each generation of thinking holds a certain unique value. You'll find axioms and assertions from every decade that are perpetually useful, and which usually didn't even originate during that time, but far earlier. There is benefit to be found in an older perspective.

 

However, there's no single source of gospel truth, and it is, sadly, natural for people to become rigid in their thinking, to cling to what they already know, to resist change to the point of willful ignorance. Just as today's kids don't understand how older generations approached, used, and understood technology, we often don't understand how today's kids do the same... and sometimes we're not even interested in knowing, which is tragic and reprehensible.

 

(There's a lively discussion going on at the newsgroup comp.sys.apple2 right now about the very existence of this Apple II subforum on AtariAge, and it's rather revealing of what certain demographics think about Web forums and social media like Facebook - not that this wasn't obvious - but I'm gratified to see some of the "old guard" participating here and in other places.)