Jump to content
DINTAR816

New pacman for atari 2600

Recommended Posts

It's been said, but you deserve to hear it again: It's flat out amazing how much you have crammed into 4K. Well done!

 

If I may make one suggestion, the last note of the first half of the intermission theme cuts off a little too soon in the latest build, throwing off the beat. Other than that I have no complaints!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

wow. Amazing how all this is crammed into 4k. One thing I noticed is that while the safe area works, it works a little too well. In the arcade, it doesn't work when Pac-Man is in a ghost's line of sight or if a ghost sees Pac-Man move, but in this version, it works even when a ghost in on Pac-Man's tail.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Hi all, I added the "ready!" using both "player", but it took more bytes than I expected, although I could change the "kernel" to save bytes used for that. :)
In this version I use the reg "vblank" to see if that is the cause of "slowdown" that said Albert is happening in your machine. ;-)
Maybe this could be the latest version of 4K, or at least I get to optimize the code even more and can add other things. :-D

 

Bravo! you did it! Give the dog a bone! This version officially trumps 4k in every way... ;)

 

Now to perfect it by secretly adding that extra bank when nobody's looking. 8k, shhhh... :sleep:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awesome! Keep working on it! You may want to extend the bottom of "r" another byte down so it doesn't look like "neady".

 

Also compared to the arcade version, the monsters dont slow down when they turn blue. But that makes it a big challenge on the higher levels.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awesome! Keep working on it! You may want to extend the bottom of "r" another byte down so it doesn't look like "neady".

 

Also compared to the arcade version, the monsters dont slow down when they turn blue. But that makes it a big challenge on the higher levels.

They also do not slow down in the escape tunnel when they are blue. Maybe they don't slow down MORE when they are already slow from being blue. I just noticed that they are hard to catch.. lol.

Edited by darryl1970

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just tried this out on my 7800 and it is AMAZING! I can't believe this is being done in only 4k. If Atari had released this version back in the day, it would have gone down in history as one of the best arcade ports ever for that system.

 

I wish I had a time machine so I could go back to 1982 and sneak this version into Tod Frye's office.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just tried this out on my 7800 and it is AMAZING! I can't believe this is being done in only 4k. If Atari had released this version back in the day, it would have gone down in history as one of the best arcade ports ever for that system.

 

I wish I had a time machine so I could go back to 1982 and sneak this version into Tod Frye's office.

 

I agree. I dont think you could have made this version of PacMan with the programming technology they had in 1982.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I dont think you could have made this version of PacMan with the programming technology they had in 1982.

Nope. Off by a couple of years at least. But that does not include dev time (which is impossible to figure). It would have been lucky to reach the Jr. while it was still in retail. But given the difference in programming environments, I don't believe it would have been that fortunate (the same is true for most modern programs). Weeks would have been years.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nope. Off by a couple of years at least. But that does not include dev time (which is impossible to figure). It would have been lucky to reach the Jr. while it was still in retail. But given the difference in programming environments, I don't believe it would have been that fortunate (the same is true for most modern programs). Weeks would have been years.

The developer could have used a legacy Editor/Assembler and a 1982 SuperCharger cart for testing :)

Which modern tools do you think make the most difference?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stella due to its integrated debugger.

I do not develop for the 2600, but I have heard horror stories about 2600 development. I am sure the debugger is huge. I heard that programmers would have to wait for their code to compile to see the smallest change. I would think that the modern day PC in general allows instant gratification in itself. Not having to wait to see results of a simple change could have made a huge difference in itself. I am sure the debugger is the icing on the cake. Just pointing out another level of disadvantage for the early programmers.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Faster assembly. Debugger in emulators like Stella. Modern tools for programming the 2600 (including graphics). Access to years of knowledge gathered about the 2600 and Pac-man itself (like disassembly of the code and ghost AI analysis). The internet (aka the ability to consult other developers about things). Less limits on ROM size (although the OP IS limiting himself to 4k so that does not really count in this case).

 

Just to name a few.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Faster assembly. Debugger in emulators like Stella. Modern tools for programming the 2600 (including graphics). Access to years of knowledge gathered about the 2600 and Pac-man itself (like disassembly of the code and ghost AI analysis). The internet (aka the ability to consult other developers about things). Less limits on ROM size (although the OP IS limiting himself to 4k so that does not really count in this case).

 

Just to name a few.

Oh. So really nothing significant. .. :-D

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi all, I added the "ready!" using both "player", but it took more bytes than I expected, although I could change the "kernel" to save bytes used for that. :)

In this version I use the reg "vblank" to see if that is the cause of "slowdown" that said Albert is happening in your machine. ;-)

Maybe this could be the latest version of 4K, or at least I get to optimize the code even more and can add other things. :-D

Your vblank change did not fix the problem on my end, but I'm seeing it with another game also. I'm going to ping Stephena to see if he can help me figure it out, as it's making it difficult to test games on this machine!

 

..Al

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do not develop for the 2600, but I have heard horror stories about 2600 development. I am sure the debugger is huge. I heard that programmers would have to wait for their code to compile to see the smallest change. I would think that the modern day PC in general allows instant gratification in itself. Not having to wait to see results of a simple change could have made a huge difference in itself. I am sure the debugger is the icing on the cake. Just pointing out another level of disadvantage for the early programmers.

IMO this doesn't make as huge a difference as you might think, it was a lot of fun developing that way and still is.

 

Debuggers are cool but it doesn't take too much longer to do your own debugging with a trace program; sometimes it's necessary - I've encountered bugs in Stella (and documented them for Stephena) by using the trace approach.

 

I think macro assemblers may be the most significant advantage today, Atari had one of the first but not until the late 80's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's strange, I got a macro assembler on my C64 in about 1984. Kind of primitive, but (apart from when I've done hand-assembly) I've never used an assembler that didn't have macros.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's strange, I got a macro assembler on my C64 in about 1984. Kind of primitive, but (apart from when I've done hand-assembly) I've never used an assembler that didn't have macros.

What kind of Macro's did it support raindog? Macro languages (like the one in dasm) are high level scripting languages that generate blocks of asm. I've seen standard Assemblers for the c64 that just convert the mnemonics and calc offset addresses referred to as "Macro Assemblers" for some reason and never understood why.

 

Edit: Wow it really did have Macro's! That's a pretty advanced feature for bitd:

http://project64.c64.org/misc/assembler.txt

Edited by Mr SQL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Edit: Wow it really did have Macro's! That's a pretty advanced feature for bitd:

http://project64.c64.org/misc/assembler.txt

Yeah, that was the one. I've certainly used more capable macro assemblers in the 30 years (sigh...) since, but I didn't realize at the time how high of a bar CBM was setting, especially considering how slow and primitive their stock BASIC was.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just tried this out on my 7800 and it is AMAZING! I can't believe this is being done in only 4k. If Atari had released this version back in the day, it would have gone down in history as one of the best arcade ports ever for that system.

 

I wish I had a time machine so I could go back to 1982 and sneak this version into Tod Frye's office.

Do it! Deloreans aren't cheap though, and Flux Capacitors haven't been invented yet!

 

Just Take the hex code and print it out to the ticker tape they fed to the ROM burning machine. Sneak in when noone's around, or while the programmer is asleep, place the freshly burned cart on his desk, along with a printout of the ASM code, with a sticky note saying "check this out!"

 

History will be rewritten. Pacman will be a smashing success, and the slim possibility the crash may be averted. Gamers in today's modern age, much like back in the day, will have a choice between Nintendo, Atari, or Sega. (MS & Sony can shove it) :grin:

 

But then if we rewrite history, where is the person who programmed this game and was sent back in time to deliver it? So many paradoxes... :ponder:

Edited by stardust4ever
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not possible, since the market was already headed toward the crapper before Pac-Man was made. The "glut of bad games" cause so often mentioned is complete bunk. The main issue was relatively new entertainment tech emerging where the console industry could not compete against (home video, PC's, CD's). Too many chefs in the kitchen was the secondary factor IMO. BTW computing speed and modern debuggers are only part of the "programming environment" I mentioned. We also have the history of the programs themselves (i.e. many examples to draw from), nearly-instant public feedback of what works and what doesn't, and programming for recreation rather than a 9-5 job.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi, as mentioned darril1970 about speed, I modified fright speed (blue) and tunnel. now it's slower. :)

Another thing, when in blue mode, the speed is the same in the tunnel (fright speed mode), I think that this is so in the arcade, I'm not sure.

I also modify the letter "r" from "ready", I think it's better now.

In this version I've saved about 23 bytes more, now there are about 46 bytes free, now I'm thinking how I could use those free bytes.

This is not the latest version of 4k, will be the next. :-D



pacman2600_4k_sl.bin

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...