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How has this not been posted yet? Retro VGS

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So I suppose this is just another "vaporware" 3D video... :ponder:

https://www.facebook.com/RETROVGS/videos/792533447482594/

 

 

We know they have the Jaguar casing molds. That's nothing new. I could've bought those. It doesn't mean I'm making a new console.

 

 

Just to fill in the details:

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/233486-translucent-jaguar-console-pre-orders/

 

 

At 45US$ and assuming they can pocket 20US$ for each, the 10K they spent for the molds then needed 500 sales to break even.

 

EDIT:

Apparently they already broke even so .... yeah the empty cases only means they are selling them as empty cases so far:

http://shopreadretro.com/collections/merch/products/jaguar-translucent-console-shell-and-accessories

Edited by phoenixdownita

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And we were illustrating a point ... in spite of all the hype no prototype board has been seen yet, let alone one in action.

 

EDIT:

I count madman and me in the "we".

 

 

EDIT2:

At 1 week from the kickstarter it would be nice to see one of these "assembled" in working conditions.

Working = it turns on to some basic test (a color wheel or something), some character fonts etc... something minimal (a 3D rotating cube given they taunt some 3D capabiltites).

Edited by phoenixdownita
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something minimal (a 3D rotating cube given they taunt some 3D capabiltites).

 

You want a rendered mock-up of a rendered console showing a rendered cube? Rend-ception!

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I'd be happy if all those 3D renders were actually done on the actual console hardware .... ;-)

But that's not the case.

 

I would appreciate an old school video where the engineers (there's more than one right?) show a working proto that hopefully fits in the shells.

 

Going to kickstarter with only "an idea" and molds is very no no!!

Edited by phoenixdownita
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Going to kickstarter with only "an idea" and molds is very no no!!

 

 

 

It looks like it's gonna be just that.

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Hey, progress! It's about time.

 

 

If some edge connectors plopped onto an obviously cardboard base with an ink-jet printout badly stuck to the top is 'progress'.....

 

And we all thought Jack.T was a cheap skate!

 

So about a week or so before the kickstarter... You want $3m... and all you've got is an ink jet printout and some cardboard. This console is mesmerizing... like a train wreck.

Edited by CyranoJ
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If some edge connectors plopped onto an obviously cardboard base with an ink-jet printout badly stuck to the top is 'progress'.....

 

And we all thought Jack.T was a cheap skate!

 

So about a week or so before the kickstarter... You want $3m... and all you've got is an ink jet printout and some cardboard. This console is mesmerizing... like a train wreck.

Thats a high quality Chinese PCB! :lol:

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If some edge connectors plopped onto an obviously cardboard base with an ink-jet printout badly stuck to the top is 'progress'.....

 

Well, to give them at least an ounce of credit, it is more than 3D rendered images.

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If thats the final cart connector there won't be any 32 bit wide carts because there aren't enough pins for a 32 bit data bus and the number of address lines (along with suitable control/clock signals, power supplies etc.) required to access 128M of code/data. The connector doesn't appear to be keyed either.

 

Edit: Cart data would need to be copied to RAM for execution in native 32bit games which would mean some kind of "loading" screen as the ROM to RAM copying process takes place. Either that, or the game runs at reduced speed with 2x16bit accesses to pull in the code/data required.

Edited by GroovyBee

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Well, to give them at least an ounce of credit, it is more than 3D rendered images.

 

You think that 'pcb' weighs an ounce? LOL

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So SVideo is no more?

The connector is missing, please glue one on before the kickstarter.

 

Also the order of the HDMI and DC power is inverted, fix the 3D rendering, that looks amateur-ish (with that reflection under the "PCB" that can't possibly be visible .... rush rush)

 

4 sinks for 7805 .... you've got to be kidding me!!! It's 2015 there's much better options and a switching regulator these days runs cool at 2/2.5 A

 

 

Edit:

When I said a working proto in the shell I mean't working, you know with a test screen on a CRT?

[how about you hide a Rpi2 under the cardboard so we can see something on a screen]

 

Edit2:

If you give me bs that you will use the Genny 2 8 pins AV connector for SVideo, think again as that is only for RGB, composite and Audio (L/R). with even just 1 GND that's already 7, add in CSync and 8 -> no space for SVideo

http://www.hardwarebook.info/Sega_Genesis_2/32X/Nomad_A/V

.... mmmhhhhh you should have used the Saturn 10 pins AV connector which incredibly supports all of the above and SVideo

http://www.hardwarebook.info/Sega_Saturn_A/V

.... or the PS2 connector ...

http://www.hardwarebook.info/PlayStation_A/V

Edited by phoenixdownita

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If some edge connectors plopped onto an obviously cardboard base with an ink-jet printout badly stuck to the top is 'progress'.....

 

Yeah, I mean it shows that 'something' fits in the case, but it would have been more effective paired with a screenshot or walkthrough video with the sofware drawing out the traces. I also was hoping for fpga dev board shots to show something running. Show us that the software's there...because it is, but I really want to see the competence to get it downloaded and running, because I keep coming back to...

 

It's a jag shell. With decisions like that, even less can be assumed in terms of competence than on a normal project. Really the whole decision-making stack of this thing will be in question every step of the way until it's fully working, largely because the first decision made was so very poor. At the heart of it, I have huge trust issues with my money and a team that would even briefly consider reusing the jag shell. My guess is that this "VGS" won't get very far in, and the "jag-haters" will be blamed for it failing, which would be silly because it never should have been tied to that thing in the first place.

 

More case ideas:

Plain, but not a jag case, so bonus there (link)

Ooh, optional walnut sides (link), that should hit the target market nicely.

A $400 system might want walnut sides.

Edited by Reaperman

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That board is obviously not populated. In fact it appears to be made of paper. No traces or actual chips besides the connectors. Also the back panel is either missing or wide open. Did one of the engineers see this rant and throw together a mockup in 15 minutes? :ponder:

 

If thats the final cart connector there won't be any 32 bit wide carts because there aren't enough pins for a 32 bit data bus and the number of address lines (along with suitable control/clock signals, power supplies etc.) required to access 128M of code/data. The connector doesn't appear to be keyed either.

 

Edit: Cart data would need to be copied to RAM for execution in native 32bit games which would mean some kind of "loading" screen as the ROM to RAM copying process takes place. Either that, or the game runs at reduced speed with 2x16bit accesses to pull in the code/data required.

62 pins is plenty more than enough in these days when nearly every modern connector and interface (except RAM modules and PCI bus) is high speed and serialized. Did you really expect a 108-pin Jag connector?

Edited by stardust4ever

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Fixed that for ya :-

 

That cardboard is obviously not populated. No traces or actual chips besides the connectors.

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62 pins is plenty more than enough in these days when nearly every modern connector and interface (except RAM modules and PCI bus) is high speed and serialized. Did you really expect a 108-pin Jag connector?

Wouldn't serial access to mask ROMs require additional hardware in each cart?

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Wouldn't serial access to mask ROMs require additional hardware in each cart?

EPROMs are generally 8 or 16-bit. Some newer ones are serial though. Mask ROMs can be anything you want. NES, SNES used 8-bit mask ROMs. Genesis used 16-bit. N64 Mask ROMs were read through some hybrid series/parallel format, sending data to the N64 in chunks. If you're going to custom fab the mask ROMs anyway, the address decoding, if present, can be included in the chip. However I would imagine whatever address decoding system they use will be compatible with modern flash chips so they can use either off-the-shelf flash or custom mask ROMs as an option. Besides, 16-bit addressing would leave plenty of spare pins to perform other functions. Even IDE hard drives only had a 16-bit bus with 40 pins and those were pretty darned fast for legacy systems. The "80 pin" ribbon cables just ran grounds every other wire to suppress noise. If the RetroVGS can stream 8-bits or 16-bits at a time by streaming them off the chips in serialized "chunks" at high data rates, it would be very easy to meet or exceed the speed of modern USB or SD card devices.

Edited by stardust4ever
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