The Official Turbografx 16 Thread!

[CZroe]

That's what I was thinking here too.  I don't find the Upergrafx very acceptable considering it's still a ways from being complete and that price tag attached is just over the top too so it's basically dead to me until someone comes along with a reasonable price alternative that's truly compatible.  Mister, not into those and never will touch it, same with like the Pi stuff and the rest as it just seems like a halfass work around that opens the door to an gamer level ADHD/OCD nightmare of too much going on, too many options, too hard to focus on enjoying.  I get what you're saying though, I guess in a way like those optical replacement modules for stuff like the DC, Saturn etc so you can use original hardware but not what drives the file(game.)

Yeah. The price is hard to swallow. The good news is that UGX-02 has come a long way and continues to improve though I doubt the interface will ever be as slick as, say, Super SD System³ menu. There was a UGX update in October that brought 1080p to the table and they just started tweeting about per-game save memory on the SD card (previously saved to selectable banks on the UGX which could be backed up over USB or Ten No Koe Bank). Before that they drastically improved game loading times with a patched Super System Card BIOS and made virtual disc syncronization better than Super SD System³. They've added quite a lot in the last year!

As for the price, in a way, I see it as a value compared to the price of Hi-Def NES plus the price of a Super SD System³... and that seems to be the most fair comparison for the main features. IIRC, UGX-02 cost me around $375 where Super SD System³ costs about $300 alone. Really wish Hi-Def NES was $75... that's what I typically charge for installation! Consider that it's more niche than Hi-Def NES and doesn't require complex/expensive installation and, well, it starts to look even more reasonable.

Like Super SD System³ it also functions as a Turbo Everdrive for most HuCard titles and even works as a virtual Super System Card (despite reports to the contrary). Maybe I just trying to justify my own purchase but I know I would've gladly spent $150 on a Hi-Def NES-style digital video kit with DIY installation even without the ODE and flashcart functions.

My UGX wishlist:
-Support ALL HuCard/TurboChip titles from the SD card including Street Fighter II' Champion Edition (special mapper) so that I wouldn't want to hang on to my Turbo Everdrive (currently supports most but not larger titles).
-Support a virtual Arcade Card Pro in addition to the currently supported virtual Games Express, System Card 1.0, 2.x, and 3.0 (currently lets you combine a cheaper Arcade Card Duo with virtual Super System Card 3.0).
-Support 240p over HDMI for VGA/RGB adapters.
-1200p for 5x integer scale without cropping

[CZroe]

 

My SuperGrafx finally arrived! Yes, the one I ordered back in October...

 

That Economy shipping option really is slow. Definitely by boat. I ordered a lot more a couple weeks later and if the SGX order is any indication it'll be January 15th before I see it.

https://imgur.com/o6Tzxj4

 

Turbo/PCE stuff from that order:

$20.50 boxed Avenue Pad 3 controller (listed as used but clearly new/unused)

$0.75 multi-tap (cheap!)

$25 Super System Card 3.0 (replaces one I ruined recently...oops!)

 

The SGX was missing the AV cable but I had new Genesis 1 / Neo Geo composite AV cables from Console5. You wouldn't want to use these with a Duo because they are not stereo and the audio pinout is wrong. On the other hand, they are perfect for a RAU-30 ROM² Adapter setup like this because composite is wired correctly and you get stereo from the IFU-30 Interface Unit instead. You have to use DIN-5 Genesis / Neo Geo cables unless you mod your console and, even then, you'd have to pay attention to 262° vs. 270° DIN-8. If your Genesis 1 / Neo Geo cable is composite AV and has more than 5 pins then the rest are vestigial and cane be safely removed (typically used for RGB cables).

 

Also received today:

Two more Turbo Everdrives from Krikzz's Black Friday sale ($47.74 each). Apparently my brother ordered these to bundle with our extra Turbo-CD docks even though I was planning to build a few CD Stupid Card 4.0 system cards.

 

 

[CatPix]

Wow, 47$ for an Everdrive?? I missed good stuff here...

[CZroe]

Wow, 47$ for an Everdrive?? I missed good stuff here...

I think so. My brother ordered it and sent me this pic when they arrived yesterday.Almost unreadable if I don't zoom...

"$47.74 USD"

 

Awesome deal, especially considering the cost of a North American Super System Card. At that price, every TG16/TurboExpress should have one regardless.

 

Came from Everdrive.me but they clearly shipped straight from the Ukraine (Krikzz).

 

 

 

 

 

[Tanooki]

Yup good deal there on that ED for sure.

 

I get your point on the UGX-02, and yeah you're probably on it about justifying the huge price tag but if you're happy with it despite the defects it still has because it appears they can be corrected out entirely with future firmware updates, and you're patient, that's all that matters.  I just took myself out of the running on that bunk anyway as I've got a PCE Duo in the mail, heavily modded including the RGB Amp mod inside.  I figure, POUND or someone will in time make a decent HDMI jack and I can go that route, or I'll end up somehow with the PCE MINI in time and of course when it's hacked because with a Duo and an ED for it already, I'm set.

 

I have CDs/SCDs both in the mail and starting to have arrived already yet the console is the mists still.  Stupid thing sat for days in customs and got released yesterday.  When it arrives it will have 3Ds and a few cards.  I got a nice bundle of 3 CDs the other day with Neo Nectaris, Valis 4 and Shubibinman 3 too.  Outstanding as it came from a US military base in Germany is Ys Book 1+2 (US), and I did pick off an alright deal on Gradius II from Japan too.  I can't wait for all this to roll in this and next month.  I also did get a setup of some PCE Works stuff, ebay side there was the US proto of Star Parodier, and from overseas RayXanber III (which includes 2 free) and they're also giving away CD copies of Genjin 1 and 2 too.  All along for awhile now I've had a special copy of Dracula X too.  I can't wait to tear into that hardware whenever it gets here.

[Steven Pendleton]

So for anyone who owns a PC Engine GT, I have been thinking of getting one for a few months. What do you think of it as a system? I have actually played one for maybe 2~3 minutes in a store, but I'm not sure how well that experience translates to actually owning one. Is it worth it to get it recapped, sacrifice CD games entirely, and only be able to run HuCARD games? From what I saw when I tried it, it's basically the opposite of the Nomad: good screen (for the time, despite releasing 5 years earlier), but loses the best part of its library, the CD games. On the Nomad, this isn't really as big of a loss since most of the best games are on cart, and now that the MegaSD exists, even that isn't a problem once you get the triple bypass mod.

 

Many of the best PC Engine games are on CD, though, so no Dracula X, no Super Darius, no Super Darius II, no Gradius II, no Spriggan, no Lords/Winds/Gate of Thunder... basically, does the GT get by with HuCARDs only? I think the answer is probably and definitely "no", but I figured I should ask for actual owners' opinions before I go buy a $400+ handheld, pay more money to get it recapped, and pay more money to build my pitiful library of HuCARDs (I think I only have Dragon Spirit, Bomberman, and the Super System Card right now, and one of those isn't even a game) or get the Everdrive. And a bunch of cash on batteries, of course.

[CZroe]

So for anyone who owns a PC Engine GT, I have been thinking of getting one for a few months. What do you think of it as a system? I have actually played one for maybe 2~3 minutes in a store, but I'm not sure how well that experience translates to actually owning one. Is it worth it to get it recapped, sacrifice CD games entirely, and only be able to run HuCARD games? From what I saw when I tried it, it's basically the opposite of the Nomad: good screen (for the time, despite releasing 5 years earlier), but loses the best part of its library, the CD games. On the Nomad, this isn't really as big of a loss since most of the best games are on cart, and now that the MegaSD exists, even that isn't a problem once you get the triple bypass mod.

 

Many of the best PC Engine games are on CD, though, so no Dracula X, no Super Darius, no Super Darius II, no Gradius II, no Spriggan, no Lords/Winds/Gate of Thunder... basically, does the GT get by with HuCARDs only? I think the answer is probably and definitely "no", but I figured I should ask for actual owners' opinions before I go buy a $400+ handheld, pay more money to get it recapped, and pay more money to build my pitiful library of HuCARDs (I think I only have Dragon Spirit, Bomberman, and the Super System Card right now, and one of those isn't even a game) or get the Everdrive. And a bunch of cash on batteries, of course.

If only they'd finish this project:

 

I got mine at a Goodwill thrift store for a few bucks and have been hanging onto it for the promise of CD games through the card slot ever since. I know Hi-Score Girl made a big deal about being able to play Street Fighter II' on the go but you really don't want to play it like that (not enough buttons; uses Select to swap between punches and kicks). I'd say you're right on the money regarding CD vs. HuCards and it's more of a collector piece until we get over the hurdle.

 

 

[Steven Pendleton]

4 minutes ago, CZroe said:

If only they'd finish this project:

 

I got mine at a Goodwill thrift store for a few bucks and have been hanging onto it for the promise of CD games througb the card slot ever since. I know Hi-Score Girl made a big deal about being able to play Street Fighter II' on the go but you really don't want to play it like that (not enough buttons; uses Select to swap between punches and kicks). I'd say you're right on the money regarding CD vs. HuCards and it's more of a collector piece until we get over the hurdle.

It's funny you mention both this GT CD project thingy and Street Fighter. I'd never played Street Fighter in my life until the dude at the store put Street Fighter in the GT for me to test since it was sitting at his counter. I was instantly lost, though, since I don't know the controls or literally anything else about the game.

 

I've been wondering about this thing to run CD games on the GT for a while now, and I think he said that it was supposed to be done last year, but apparently that didn't happen or I would have seen it on RetroRGB or something. I haven't really kept up with it since it was announced, though. Good that he chose that game to demo, though; I actually bought my PC Engine just for Dracula X, and it was totally worth it to spend all of that cash to do it 100% legit. I wish I could have played this when it was released. Then again, I also never played this series until late January~early February of 2019, so I missed out on a lot of not-Sega stuff from then.

 

The PC Engine GT itself is clearly a high-quality product aside from the caps being bad, and you can definitely feel it just by holding it. It's just too bad that GT = no CD games at all for now.

[CZroe]

It's funny you mention both this GT CD project thingy and Street Fighter. I'd never played Street Fighter in my life until the dude at the store put Street Fighter in the GT for me to test since it was sitting at his counter. I was instantly lost, though, since I don't know the controls or literally anything else about the game.  

I've been wondering about this thing to run CD games on the GT for a while now, and I think he said that it was supposed to be done last year, but apparently that didn't happen or I would have seen it on RetroRGB or something. I haven't really kept up with it since it was announced, though. Good that he chose that game to demo, though; I actually bought my PC Engine just for Dracula X, and it was totally worth it to spend all of that cash to do it 100% legit. I wish I could have played this when it was released. Then again, I also never played this series until late January~early February of 2019, so I missed out on a lot of not-Sega stuff from then.

 

The PC Engine GT itself is clearly a high-quality product aside from the caps being bad, and you can definitely feel it just by holding it. It's just too bad that GT = no CD games at all for now.

 

The guys working on it don't seem motivated to finish because other ODEs exist now (SSDS3 and UperGrafx). I've spoken with RGR/Retro Game Restore about it on Facebook Messenger and it sounds like they aren't actively developing it. 

They recently shared a bunch of images for clear PC Engine shell and clear HuCards but they don't seem interested in making these for the people who want them. Everything seems to be a personal project with low volumes.

 

 

 

 

[Steven Pendleton]

5 minutes ago, CZroe said:

The guys working on it don't seem motivated to finish because other ODEs exist now (SSDS3 and UperGrafx). I've spoken with RGR/Retro Game Restore about it on Facebook Messenger and it sounds like they aren't actively developing it.

They recently shared a bunch of images for clear PC Engine shell and clear HuCards but they don't seem interested in making these for the people who wants them.

Disappointing. The clear PC Engine does look really cool, but I think I'll stick with my CoreGrafx + SSDS3 for now. I will also be getting the PC Engine Mini on launch day (provided it doesn't show up when I am at work), and I guess that will be fun to play around with for an hour before I go back to the real thing. I already played it at Tokyo Game Show and I did play Dracula X with the PC Engine GT bezel on. That's probably the closest we will get to playing CD games on the GT for now.

 

Also his way of typing in English is very Japanese.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[CZroe]

Disappointing. The clear PC Engine does look really cool, but I think I'll stick with my CoreGrafx + SSDS3 for now. I will also be getting the PC Engine Mini on launch day (provided it doesn't show up when I am at work), and I guess that will be fun to play around with for an hour before I go back to the real thing. I already played it at Tokyo Game Show and I did play Dracula X with the PC Engine GT bezel on. That's probably the closest we will get to playing CD games on the GT for now.

 

Also his way of typing in English is very Japanese.

I read somewhere that he was Taiwanese or a Japanese person living in Taiwan so you're probably right on the money.

 

[Steven Pendleton]

5 hours ago, CZroe said:

I read somewhere that he was Taiwanese or a Japanese person living in Taiwan so you're probably right on the money.

 

Yeah, most Japanese people that I have met type in English exactly this way if they are not approaching native-level or business-level fluency, so it wouldn't surprise me.

 

Still, I'll be posting my thoughts on the PC Engine Mini here and in the PC Engine Mini thread since that's over in the High Score Club for some reason. I only got about 15 minutes with it at Tokyo Game Show, which is definitely not enough to judge it accurately. I really hope it's not as bad as the Mega Drive Mini. It's really damn cute, especially with the Super 32X and Mega-CD Mini set while sitting next to the real thing, but it's definitely far from great as a game system.

 

I only got my PC Engine maybe 5~6 months ago and only got the SSDS3 in late December and have barely had time to play it much, but it's definitely impressive as hell and I will continue to tell everyone to to buy one and play it because it deserves way more love and respect than it gets outside of Japan.

[Tanooki]

At the price of the LT hell no it isn't worth it unless you're a collector being stuck with HuCards alone.

 

But, if reality put that in the range of a the GT/Turbo Express definitely and that's what you're asking about.  You're being pretty short sighted as the massively larger and fantastic library Japan go over the mediocre weak US list of game cards makes all the difference.  I went with a Core Grafx for a couple years on just a couple dozen cards, then an everdrive.  I only have a Duo now because a wicked deal popped up on here or I still would be fine.  Yes the CDs are nice, but they're not a necessity, and you can easily just do those CDs anyway on a computer with magic engine or another emulator just fine.

 

Despite the fact I could make a fast $100+ easily I still have my CG2, it's just in a drawer for now is all.  I still see some potential there at this point.

[NE146]

15 hours ago, Steven Pendleton said:

So for anyone who owns a PC Engine GT, I have been thinking of getting one for a few months. What do you think of it as a system? I have actually played one for maybe 2~3 minutes in a store, but I'm not sure how well that experience translates to actually owning one. Is it worth it to get it recapped, sacrifice CD games entirely, and only be able to run HuCARD games?

I dont know anything about the PC Engine GT, but I bought the tg16 at launch, had a PCE adapter and went to town on Hucard games. When the Turbo CD came out I passed on it purely because of price and that continued for the next couple decades where I barely payed any attention to the CD games. I now see that how unfortunate that was. When I bought a Turbo Everdrive a few years ago, I realized that I had already played the majority of games available to death because the truth is the library of Hucard games isn't exactly huge. So unless you're new to it, there's not much to it.  Point of my story is for Turbo, you cannot survive on hucard alone. In my opinion you NEED the CD games else you're just missing out on some of the strongest entries in the Turbo library.

[Tanooki]

4 hours ago, NE146 said:

I dont know anything about the PC Engine GT, but I bought the tg16 at launch, had a PCE adapter and went to town on Hucard games. When the Turbo CD came out I passed on it purely because of price and that continued for the next couple decades where I barely payed any attention to the CD games. I now see that how unfortunate that was. When I bought a Turbo Everdrive a few years ago, I realized that I had already played the majority of games available to death because the truth is the library of Hucard games isn't exactly huge. So unless you're new to it, there's not much to it.  Point of my story is for Turbo, you cannot survie on hucard alone. In my opinion you NEED the CD games else you're just missing out on some of the strongest entries in the Turbo library.

You basically ages ago took the route I just did a few years back and it worked, except I skipped the adapter but I'm familiar with it, had one a time ago too.  That thing was magic and TTI/TZD sold those things for a very affordable and it opened a huge door.  The US card library was such garbage on the whole, sure there were a few gems that did make it, but out of just under 100 titles, most were average or crap.  So I get him saying that junk about TG sucking and all that needing CDs, but if you stick to cards and Japan it's gold.  Konami directly, then Capcom, Namco, Sega, Taito and a few others direct or with intermediary developers put some insane stuff on the system.

 

That said if you're sticking to no flash kits, buying things, then you're on the nose, the turbo sucks unless you have CDs.

[Steven Pendleton]

8 hours ago, NE146 said:

I dont know anything about the PC Engine GT, but I bought the tg16 at launch, had a PCE adapter and went to town on Hucard games. When the Turbo CD came out I passed on it purely because of price and that continued for the next couple decades where I barely payed any attention to the CD games. I now see that how unfortunate that was. When I bought a Turbo Everdrive a few years ago, I realized that I had already played the majority of games available to death because the truth is the library of Hucard games isn't exactly huge. So unless you're new to it, there's not much to it.  Point of my story is for Turbo, you cannot survive on hucard alone. In my opinion you NEED the CD games else you're just missing out on some of the strongest entries in the Turbo library.

Well, the system is region locked and I can't exactly go buy a US TurboExpress here, so I am forced to either use an Everdrive (which means I can play US games anyway) or Japanese HuCARDs. Either way, I don't have to worry about the pitiful amount of US games in general. I think there are only about 138 titles released in the US compared to the 700 or so that Japan got. That's including CD for both sides, though, and I think it goes 300 HuCARD and 400 CD games or something like that, so I'd have about 300 games to choose from.

[NE146]

1 hour ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Well, the system is region locked and I can't exactly go buy a US TurboExpress here, so I am forced to either use an Everdrive (which means I can play US games anyway) or Japanese HuCARDs. Either way, I don't have to worry about the pitiful amount of US games in general. I think there are only about 138 titles released in the US compared to the 700 or so that Japan got. That's including CD for both sides, though, and I think it goes 300 HuCARD and 400 CD games or something like that, so I'd have about 300 games to choose from.

Oh geeze.. I literally just googled "PC Engine GT" and see it is the portable. I had no idea  

 

But yep, about if I recall there are a little less than 300 hucard titles total, not counting Supergrafx ones. I was bemoaning the fact that I had intentionally ignored more than half of the game library simply because it was on CD, but that's changed now and I'm a Turbo CD convert ? . But that obviously doesn't come into play with the handheld. 

 

 

 

[Steven Pendleton]

54 minutes ago, NE146 said:

Oh geeze.. I literally just googled "PC Engine GT" and see it is the portable. I had no idea  

 

But yep, about if I recall there are a little less than 300 hucard titles total, not counting Supergrafx ones. I was bemoaning the fact that I had intentionally ignored more than half of the game library simply because it was on CD, but that's changed now and I'm a Turbo CD convert ? . But that obviously doesn't come into play with the handheld. 

 

 

 

Yeah, the GT is really damn cool. I thought it was kind of pointless compared to the Nomad since the Nomad can play most the best Genesis games since they are on carts instead of CDs (too bad Japanese Mega Drive carts almost never fit, so no portable Gleylancer for me without the MegaSD. Sonic 1 fits for some odd reason, though, and I'm not complaining! Japanese Sonic & Knuckles uses the US/EU cart shape so it fits perfectly, but Sonic 3 & Knuckles in it looks ridiculous, though) but the GT can't run CD games right now, which are probably overall better than the HuCARD games. Then I actually played the Nomad and was more impressed by the GT. Impressed enough to seriously consider buying one and getting it recapped, anyway.

Edited March 4, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[Tanooki]

Arguably though the CD games some really just aren't better.   You have to keep in mind that the CD system was the first and the primary uses was both enhanced CD quality audio music and mass storage for more assets to use in a game that the little HuCard could not handle.  I mean look at the file sizes, 1MB was about it for the cards, except for SF2CE and I'm sure you noticed it is uniquely bulging at 2.5MB in size, and then it's obvious what the CD primarily did in many cases with over 600MB at play there.  A lot of games had that solid music redbook or otherwise and then heaps of added animation, cutscenes played out as slides or sometimes flowing, never really thankfully resorted to ugly as sin early FMV though at least.  Again though the handheld really isn't that limited when you factor in Japan as there's so much quality it is ridiculous.  You're looking at it for the now and having a budget, but going at it as just someone who is an average game buyer maybe 1-2mo on the second hand side of things, you've got a ton of stuff to work through.

[Steven Pendleton]

22 minutes ago, Tanooki said:

Arguably though the CD games some really just aren't better.   You have to keep in mind that the CD system was the first and the primary uses was both enhanced CD quality audio music and mass storage for more assets to use in a game that the little HuCard could not handle.  I mean look at the file sizes, 1MB was about it for the cards, except for SF2CE and I'm sure you noticed it is uniquely bulging at 2.5MB in size, and then it's obvious what the CD primarily did in many cases with over 600MB at play there.  A lot of games had that solid music redbook or otherwise and then heaps of added animation, cutscenes played out as slides or sometimes flowing, never really thankfully resorted to ugly as sin early FMV though at least.  Again though the handheld really isn't that limited when you factor in Japan as there's so much quality it is ridiculous.  You're looking at it for the now and having a budget, but going at it as just someone who is an average game buyer maybe 1-2mo on the second hand side of things, you've got a ton of stuff to work through.

I meant that most of the best games are on CD, not that CD = better by definition. There are plenty of great HuCARD games like Salamander and R-Type I and II, which are probably better than R-Type Complete CD because the CD music is... yeah... not great.

[+Black_Tiger]

8 hours ago, Tanooki said:

Arguably though the CD games some really just aren't better.   You have to keep in mind that the CD system was the first and the primary uses was both enhanced CD quality audio music and mass storage for more assets to use in a game that the little HuCard could not handle.  I mean look at the file sizes, 1MB was about it for the cards, except for SF2CE and I'm sure you noticed it is uniquely bulging at 2.5MB in size, and then it's obvious what the CD primarily did in many cases with over 600MB at play there.  A lot of games had that solid music redbook or otherwise and then heaps of added animation, cutscenes played out as slides or sometimes flowing, never really thankfully resorted to ugly as sin early FMV though at least.  Again though the handheld really isn't that limited when you factor in Japan as there's so much quality it is ridiculous.  You're looking at it for the now and having a budget, but going at it as just someone who is an average game buyer maybe 1-2mo on the second hand side of things, you've got a ton of stuff to work through.

SFII isn't actually bulging. The bump plate is purely decorative.

[CZroe]

SFII isn't actually bulging. The bump plate is purely decorative.

That's definitely the case for Populous and two revisions of the Super System Card but I have yet to see inside Street Fighter II'. Got a link?

Tennokoe Bank has a battery but nothing else there needs the bulge.

[Tanooki]

I guess you didn't like my choice of wording, so be it.  I would like to see it torn open as I was understanding there was more/larger chip(s) inside so added space was needed.

[Steven Pendleton]

I can't seem to find the internals of Street Fighter II' at all even after searching both DuckDuckGo and Google in Japanese. Weird. I figure someone must have taken it apart by now.

 

And this has nothing to do with Street Fighter II''s internals, but has anyone seen the PC Engine PT? Seems really cool, but too bad about the aspect ratio. That could probably be fixed, I think.

 

 

Edited March 4, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[CatPix]

It's possible that when they made it, they only had Tennokoe Bank shells available to make room for the extra chips; I mean, even if they are "flat" chips, they only had HuCards in 3 formats : long sticker (smaller chip room) short sticker (longer room for chips) and Tennokoe/Populous bulging shell.

Either they didn't wanted to design a "super short" sticker Hu-card for SFII or they though that it would be advertising itself as "super massive large game" with the bulging shell, even if it's actually empty.

To make it clear :

"long sticker" :

 

"short sticker"

 

And I realise that later, Hudson did made at least a "long PCB" Hucard :

 

I assume that at this point cost to manufacture them with that big of a hollow space was cheaper, or the extra price fo the Duo card made up for it. If SFII had been released later it probably would have come in that Hu-card Style too.

 

Note that the Arcade Card Pro does come in "bulging case".

 

Despite the fact that it only contain a few Ko more of RAM. So I assume that it was either an aesthetic choice for Cd-Rom² owners or a price-cutting measure. Though mostly an aesthetical choice.