Tursi Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 I'm loading code from >A000 to >FFFF and >2300 to >3FFF so I thought there might be a problem with the lower memory (which can usually only be loaded between >2700 and >3FXX with E/A#3). There shouldn't be... the whole point of that loader was to be able to load anywhere in the 32k expansion. Bugs are possible, I guess. But we also use every byte of scratchpad RAM that's marked as 'safe' to use, so if you had cases with uninitialized data that may be it (there's actually a bug in Munchman that we triggered with this loader where you can't end a level because it initializes and counts the dots remaining as a byte, but tests it as a word. If the second byte wasn't zero when you started, the level never ended ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sometimes99er Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 Now, after 30+ years, it's still one of the only piano pieces I can play without errors. Guess we're talking the first sprite movement only ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmusr Posted May 16, 2015 Author Share Posted May 16, 2015 Guess we're talking the first sprite movement only ? Sure . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Vorticon Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 Jet Set Willy actually induced my love for classical music. I listened to JSW on the Speccy and asked my mother "What is this music with the three notes?". She explained it was Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata and showed me the sheet music. Now, after 30+ years, it's still one of the only piano pieces I can play without errors. I wish I had more memory space to improve the TI version, but I had to keep it short. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Tr0otuiQuU This masterpiece was included on the Voyager probes' golden record. A few million years from now, some alien race might listen to it again. A fitting tribute... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
am1933 Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 This masterpiece was included on the Voyager probes' golden record. A few million years from now, some alien race might listen to it again. A fitting tribute... This is my personal favourite versionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Gf7bKK7fM Enjoy!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 (edited) I've just been playing JSW on my BBC Micro Model B and even this commercially released version suffers a problem Rasmus cured immediately on initial feedback on his first beta. Jumping through stairs on the BBC is a PITA. While the Beeb gets a decent conversion, it's limited in colours and missing sprites in a number of places too. It does however, auto-collect the object in The Swimming Pool as per the ZX Spectrum release. In order of favourites to play then, 1. Rasmus' Ti-99/4a version. 2. The ZX Spectrum original release (assuming it's been patched/POKED to allow completion). 3. The Tynesoft BBC Micro version. (Really only spoiled by the difficulty in passing through stairs) 4. Others [TBC]. Somewhere near the bottom of the list is the early Atari 8-bit version I mentioned in a previous post. Man that was a dreadful conversion! Oh, and the C64 version is almost as bad as the Atari version. SQUARE stairs? Ew?! Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
am1933 Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 MSX version was also very good-if you can ignore the bloody awful in-game music. :mad: :mad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 (edited) While I have an MSX, I've never played JSW on it. Watching videos on YouTube, it sounds like the MSX music routine has been given a low-priority interrupt. Movement of the character is also slow and jerky (unless of course, the player was emulating an MSX on a machine too slow to do the game justice). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDp17AoVlXM Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperious Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) In the Youtube vid of a Spectrum walkthrough at about 1.18 JSW jumps up through to another level. I cannot seem to get this to work. Edited May 17, 2015 by Imperious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) You're quite correct. I've just tried this myself and Willy cannot reach the top of the screen from this platform in The Orangery. He can only bounce up and down on this same platform in the latest beta. Another feature for Rasmus to look into. The beauty of the room layouts in JSW is there are multiple ways to traverse them. I have to admit, getting there by following the route in the video you linked and taking this vertical path up from The Banyan Tree requires a high degree of skill and almost perfect mastery of timing. As I try not to cheat when checking rooms for glitches, just getting there from The Banyan Tree via this route proved to be a real PITA. But, yes. Confirmed. This route cannot currently be followed in the present version of Ti-JSW. Edit: How strange?! I left the game running in the background to type the above. When I returned to the game, I found I COULD now jump up into the adjoining screen, "Under The Roof". If Willy is standing on the platform with both feet it doesn't work, but hang one foot off the right-side of the platform as below and you'll make it. In fact, there are a few pixels on this platform which allow the vertical leap to be made. Just not ALL of them! Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperious Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 OK, I found out You can get up there, You just have to be a bit to the right when You jump otherwise You hit a "Roof". Aside from that respawning is a problem, being that if You die because of a mis-jump, You keep respawning in that mis-jump and drop to Your death repeatedly until all lives are gone. Of course I do not know if that is a "feature" of the original. EDIT - Just read the above, looks like we both found the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Usotsuki Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 If the MSX port is that terrible, maybe a backport from Rasmus' version is in order xD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artrag Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) The msx port seems slower but its graphic is very close if not the same of the zx version Edited May 17, 2015 by artrag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Aside from that respawning is a problem, being that if You die because of a mis-jump, You keep respawning in that mis-jump and drop to Your death repeatedly until all lives are gone. Of course I do not know if that is a "feature" of the original. I knew someone who hadn't played before would ask this. The following is an early entry from page 2 of this thread. I'm waiting for someone who has never played the original to complain about the irrecoverable screen-entry death loop. In the original, it was quite possible to move from one room into another from the wrong spot and be killed with no way of avoiding it. Because of the way the game restores you into the room exactly in the manner in which you entered, it's distinctly possible you can lose the game by entering a room from the wrong angle, even with a full compliment of lives. You can only watch as your character repeatedly jumps or drops into the room to his death until your lives deplete. It's a feature of the original and AFAIK, every conversion [past, present and future] should retain this. It gives JSW its unique character. You just need to remember where you screwed up and be more careful next time. The game is a cruel teacher. Mind you, if you can work your way up the Banyan Tree like you did to find this bug, you shouldn't experience many instances of this feature! Nice to see it has you hooked. I think Rasmus chose a fantastic game to convert this time and in the process, introducing new players to the world of Miner Willy. Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Oh, and the C64 version is almost as bad as the Atari version. SQUARE stairs? Ew?! I think it's pretty decent, and there's some interesting stories attached to the conversions. Yes, multiple there. The guy who originally converted Manic Miner got first stab, and something happened, and then another guy Shahid Ahmad (who now works for Sony Europe actually) was brought it on a few weeks notice to make a new version. If you're going to play the C64 version, search for the fully bug fixed version that was done a few years back. The published version has a few issues, and there's no end sequence either! So these were all rectified by a couple of enterprising programmers in their spare time: http://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26285 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperious Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Thanks for that UKRetrogamer, the game is very tough indeed, and I agree that if it's in the original, it should stay. I was playing Miner 2049er before, another hard and frustrating game I'm not as good at these games as I once was, I distinctly remember clocking Parsec back in the 80's before my Original TI died, don't think I would get anywhere near that now. Edited May 17, 2015 by Imperious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) If you're going to play the C64 version, search for the fully bug fixed version that was done a few years back. The published version has a few issues, and there's no end sequence either! So these were all rectified by a couple of enterprising programmers in their spare time: http://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26285 . Thanks for the link. I've found the bug-fixed C64 version in the thread but being a ZX Spectrum owner from back in the day - when the C64 was the "enemy" - I guess my disdain [i wouldn't call it hatred - I currently own a number of C64/C128 models] is deep-rooted. I've just given the C64 game another go with the version you mentioned and (under emulation) it still feels a bit "Meh"! As I said though, it might be a deep-seated disregard for the C64 and I'll give it a try on real hardware at some stage to play it as intended. Maybe this will sway my initial impressions. Still, it's nice to have ANY version of JSW on the micro of your choice, so kudos to the programmers who patched up the C64 version and made it playable. Thanks again for the link. Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Thanks for that UKRetrogamer, the game is very tough indeed, and I agree that if it's in the original, it should stay. I'm a stickler for keeping conversions as close to the original as possible, given any hardware limitations. Any JSW without the death-loop is NOT a JSW game, is a hack or a version with permanent cheat-mode activated IMHO. I'm still a in two minds whether I appreciate Rasmus' addition of The YS "April Showers" room to the Ti conversion but I'm just extremely grateful Rasmus is taking the time to convert JSW to the Ti at all. There are lots of additions and omissions in conversions to other micros. Some due to hardware limitations, some to rushed releases to meet deadlines. Others are just bad coding or hacks. Just go through the ZX Spectrum TOSEC archive and count how many versions/revisions and hacks there are for the original JSW if you want proof of my concerns. Edited May 17, 2015 by UKRetrogamer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmusr Posted May 17, 2015 Author Share Posted May 17, 2015 I'm a stickler for keeping conversions as close to the original as possible, given any hardware limitations. Any JSW without the death-loop is NOT a JSW game, is a hack or a version with permanent cheat-mode activated IMHO. I'm still a in two minds whether I appreciate Rasmus' addition of The YS "April Showers" room to the Ti conversion but I'm just extremely grateful Rasmus is taking the time to convert JSW to the Ti at all. There are lots of additions and omissions in conversions to other micros. Some due to hardware limitations, so to rushed releases to meet deadlines. Others are just bad coding or hacks. Just go through the ZX Spectrum TOSEC archive and count how many versions/revisions and hacks there are for the original JSW if you want proof of my concerns. I didn't realize that the April Showers room was not an original room when I decided to use this data set for the conversion. But as I understand it, the item in this room was moved from another room (First Landing?) where it was invisible (another bug). April Showers is actually a very well designed room - quite tough but very playable. The attached version should fix the bug jumping from 'A bit of tree' to 'Under the roof'. Edit: added cartridge files and source, JSW.dsk jsw.rpk jsw3.bin jsw-source-release.zip 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKRetrogamer Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Confirmed fixed. I've tried all combinations of jumping up from this platform and have managed to move to the next screen every single time. Thanks again. I don't mind the April Showers screen though as I mentioned, I'm a purist when it comes to conversions. I never liked JSW2 AT ALL. With its mix of old and new rooms, it just seemed like a cheap cash-in rather than an official follow up to the original and I wouldn't (and still won't) play it. To me, JSW *IS* JSW and if it's not the original, I'm not in! That said, I wouldn't mind seeing the PROPER sequel Matthew Smith originally planned to release, Willy meets the Tax-man! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Vorticon Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Rasmus, is this considered a final release of JSW? I am just about ready to update the TI Gameshelf and would love to include JSW with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmusr Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 Rasmus, is this considered a final release of JSW? I am just about ready to update the TI Gameshelf and would love to include JSW with it. It seems pretty stable, but I can't say for sure that this is the final release. It's up to you whether you want to include it now with the risk of having to update it later, or wait a little longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Vorticon Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 It seems pretty stable, but I can't say for sure that this is the final release. It's up to you whether you want to include it now with the risk of having to update it later, or wait a little longer. OK I'll delay the update for a week and see if other bugs show up. It's not a biggie for me to update the files on the site, but I would hate for someone to download a buggy version. You seem to have quite a team of play testers here though! On a side note, I have never played JSW before on any platform, so I have nothing to compare it to. Nonetheless, I found the game captivating yet bizarre, like a bad dream. It's creator was a very imaginative person for sure. Needless to say that your conversion is nothing short of amazing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willsy Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) On a side note, I have never played JSW before on any platform, so I have nothing to compare it to. Nonetheless, I found the game captivating yet bizarre, like a bad dream. It's creator was a very imaginative person for sure. Needless to say that your conversion is nothing short of amazing That's EXACTLY how it's meant to feel! Edited May 18, 2015 by Willsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+OLD CS1 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Lazy Jones is kinda like that for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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