FPGA Based Videogame System

[snatcher1996]

For A LOT of people that reason is to play roms. While not commenting on it is not misleading them the fact is if Analogue were not releasing a jailbreak they would have no reason to keep silent about it because people will still feel misled if they hurry up and pre-order the system and put faith in them only to have Analogue not live up to their past amazing standards after refusing to say anything about it.

 

That would certainly leave many people not feeling well (some obviously irate because this is the internet and everyone is offended) and I would return my console out of principal because I need to vote with my wallet and a lack of rom support is not something I want them to make a policy out of.

 

Well there will always be people not content with their purchase maybe because they feel being mislead. Discussions with those are best being avoided, all the more if they happen in an open forum like this where everyone feels inclined to call others idiots while stating "obvious facts". Maybe Analogue is doing exactly this: Avoiding the drama and stick to the product they envisioned and advertised in the first place. Reading some of the stuff here, I wouldn't blame them.

[Wolf_]

 

Well there will always be people not content with their purchase maybe because they feel being mislead. Discussions with those are best being avoided, all the more if they happen in an open forum like this where everyone feels inclined to call others idiots while stating "obvious facts". Maybe Analogue is doing exactly this: Avoiding the drama and stick to the product they envisioned and advertised in the first place. Reading some of the stuff here, I wouldn't blame them.

That's just extremely poor logic. Doing stuff that is going to leave it up to people to make assumptions will inevitably piss them off if they make the wrong assumption:

 

If someone assumes there is no jailbreak and they spend $180 + $40 shipping to get one and then a jailbreak comes out they have the option to use the extra feature or ignore it and nothing will have changed for them.

 

If someone assumes there is a jailbreak and spends $220 to get a console and it never gets released and they are left to figure it out on their own they will catch on eventually and be pretty damn pissed. Not only that they will also have to pick up a $200 sd2snes for rom support on the snes and a $450-$500 nt mini to have support for the consoles that it covers.

 

Assuming Analogue knows the value of not pissing people off and having a customer base that continues to love them then the only reason they would keep people in the dark about a jailbreak is because one is coming later and they don't want to draw attention to it as something their company officially endorses. Anything else would just be really, really stupid.

[SegaSnatcher]

I think theyre holding back on a jailbreak because they havent decided on whether to let it happen or not.

Maybe theyre debating releasing a Analogue Genesis and if theyre planning that a Core on this device for Genesis would definitely hurt sales.

 

Ill love my Super Analogue with or without extra Cores but I sure would like some TG16 on it!

A future Genesis Core was always going to be saved for a standalone console. There is enough demand to justify it. We won't get cores of consoles where a standalone $200+ console makes sense.

 

 

[snatcher1996]

That's just extremely poor logic. Doing stuff that is going to leave it up to people to make assumptions will inevitably piss them off if they make the wrong assumption:

 

If someone assumes there is no jailbreak and they spend $180 + $40 shipping to get one and then a jailbreak comes out they have the option to use the extra feature or ignore it and nothing will have changed for them.

 

If someone assumes there is a jailbreak and spends $220 to get a console and it never gets released and they are left to figure it out on their own they will catch on eventually and be pretty damn pissed. Not only that they will also have to pick up a $200 sd2snes for rom support on the snes and a $450-$500 nt mini to have support for the consoles that it covers.

 

Assuming Analogue knows the value of not pissing people off and having a customer base that continues to love them then the only reason they would keep people in the dark about a jailbreak is because one is coming later and they don't want to draw attention to it as something their company officially endorses. Anything else would just be really, really stupid.

 

If someone assumes there is a jailbreak and spends $220 to get a console and it never gets released and they are left to figure it out on their own, it's their own goddam fault as they clearly didn't know what they bought when they did.

If Analogue wanted to deal with everyone's unfounded frustration, they would jump into this discussion I am sure.

[Kismet]

 

Well there will always be people not content with their purchase maybe because they feel being mislead. Discussions with those are best being avoided, all the more if they happen in an open forum like this where everyone feels inclined to call others idiots while stating "obvious facts". Maybe Analogue is doing exactly this: Avoiding the drama and stick to the product they envisioned and advertised in the first place. Reading some of the stuff here, I wouldn't blame them.

 

Better here than... say the MLiG stream where it was asked every 2 minutes.

 

As said many times in this thread. If people want to play roms, there are already options for that.

 

kevtris could go "surprise, it will support (homebrew) MSU-1 roms from the sd-card only" thus enabling an entirely digital path for the audio. Or maybe kevtris can make his own "expansion chip" cart to sell that runs other cores and only works on the Super NT by connecting it directly to the scaler when detected.

 

At any rate there's plenty of ways of doing things, maybe no JB firmware is forthcoming and some other way of "monetizing" other cores comes along. It's not like the SD2SNES is a closed system.

[NE146]

Analogue has nothing to do with the jailbreak on the NT Mini anyway.. was always something outside of their realm, and unsupported.

[Wolf_]

A future Genesis Core was always going to be saved for a standalone console. There is enough demand to justify it. We won't get cores of consoles where a standalone $200+ console makes sense.

 

 

I disagree. The standalone console would still have genesis cart and controller ports and while it might have a built in 32x it is too early for sega cd and sega mega cdx support so the dedicated console could still offer a expansion port. I know I wouldn't get a hdmi genesis if I would still need my regular genesis around to play some of my games for it.

 

So it would be pretty awesome to get a standalone Genesis that was fully featured and there would still be a reason to upgrade for those that want a better experience and allowing the core for the snes on the genesis and vice versa makes each of them more appealing on their own and people that would never spend $400 on a genesis and snes would be far more tempted to pick them up for $200 and after getting a taste they might buy both for the added features or they might just really love what they've got and tell people how awesome it is and boost sales that way.

 

I'm not saying that will happen but it shouldn't be ruled out because I know I would love a Genesis core but I would also still buy the standalone if it could interface with the sega cd.

 

 

If someone assumes there is a jailbreak and spends $220 to get a console and it never gets released and they are left to figure it out on their own, it's their own goddam fault as they clearly didn't know what they bought when they did.

If Analogue wanted to deal with everyone's unfounded frustration, they would jump into this discussion I am sure.

Yea, that is a wonderful way to treat customers. Not retarded at all. Certainly won't leave anyone upset in ways that could have easily been avoided without making Analogue hated. Totally viable business strategy 10/10 EA approved.

Edited February 12, 2018 by Wolf_

[Thomas83Lin]

 

If someone assumes there is a jailbreak and spends $220 to get a console and it never gets released and they are left to figure it out on their own, it's their own goddam fault as they clearly didn't know what they bought when they did.

If Analogue wanted to deal with everyone's unfounded frustration, they would jump into this discussion I am sure.

I like to assume nothing myself, I'm currently on the fence for getting a sd2snes and some kind of save dumper, just waiting on a yes or no if its getting a jailbreak before making that decision. I think being left in limbo is what is annoying for most.

[Lexibug]

You're all neglecting the One True Reason that Analogue/Kevtris are silent on the custom firmware: krikzz paid them off to boost sd2snes sales. Jokes aside, I got tired of waiting so I just preordered a black Super Nt and pink sd2snes. Next month will be fun!

 

As for the current topic, it is a bit naïve to assume a non-answer means a positive answer. In fact it is dangerous to assume that, as you are misleading potential consumers who may buy the console on the premise of "that Wolf_ guy said there would be custom firmware!!". A non-answer is exactly that: a non-answer. It could be yes, it could be no. You cannot "logic" a positive answer no matter how hard you try.

Edited February 12, 2018 by Lexibug

[snatcher1996]

I disagree. The standalone console would still have genesis cart and controller ports and while it might have a built in 32x it is too early for sega cd and sega mega cdx support so the dedicated console could still offer a expansion port. I know I wouldn't get a hdmi genesis if I would still need my regular genesis around to play some of my games for it.

 

So it would be pretty awesome to get a standalone Genesis that was fully featured and there would still be a reason to upgrade for those that want a better experience and allowing the core for the snes on the genesis and vice versa makes each of them more appealing on their own and people that would never spend $400 on a genesis and snes would be far more tempted to pick them up for $200 and after getting a taste they might buy both for the added features or they might just really love what they've got and tell people how awesome it is and boost sales that way.

 

I'm not saying that will happen but it shouldn't be ruled out because I know I would love a Genesis core but I would also still buy the standalone if it could interface with the sega cd.

 

Yea, that is a wonderful way to treat customers. Not retarded at all. Certainly won't leave anyone upset in ways that could have easily been avoided without making Analogue hated. Totally viable business strategy 10/10 EA approved.

 

Don't be pissed if you don't get a Porsche after ordering a VW I guess.

[Fafner]

A future Genesis Core was always going to be saved for a standalone console. There is enough demand to justify it. We won't get cores of consoles where a standalone $200+ console makes sense.

 

 

That was my thought too.

Even if a Genesis Core came out on the Super Id still buy a Analogue Genesis console but I think Im in the minority on that....

[Mattelot]

Yea, that is a wonderful way to treat customers. Not retarded at all. Certainly won't leave anyone upset in ways that could have easily been avoided without making Analogue hated. Totally viable business strategy 10/10 EA approved.

 

Honestly, he's right. If you buy a product based up assumption, you're choosing to take that risk. It has nothing to do with "treating" customers.

[mrnarse]

For those that didn’t see the MLiG stream last night, here’s some of the stuff discussed that I can remember:

 

-Don’t expect 32X, N64, or Saturn FPGA solutions anytime in the near future, or ever. The 32X and Saturn have way too many chips inside doing too much for a FPGA to handle. The way video is handled by 32X in conjunction with the Genesis is also really difficult to implement. The N64 runs at too fast a speed, and the RAM is different in a way that would make it extremely difficult to implement.

 

-The Sega CD seems off the table too, as having to run that hardware at the same as a Genesis core might be too much for a FPGA to handle. He hasn’t investigated the GBA much, so no word on the feasibility of it.

 

-Kevtris says Neo Geo and PS1 are doable. Neo Geo is a “brute force” machine with hardware that can be reverse engineered into a FPGA. The PS1 seems to run things slow enough that Kevtris believes he can make an FPGA core for it.

 

-Don’t expect settings profiles for the Super NT anytime soon. Kevtris said it would be pretty hard to implement into the firmware, so if he does decide to put it in there it’ll take some time to do.

 

-He was thinking about maybe putting a SPC player in the firmware, but it’s not a priority and may or may not happen. If it does, it wouldn’t be anytime soon.

 

-No comment on jailbreaks, obviously.

[Mattelot]

The PS1 seems to run things slow enough that Kevtris believes he can make an FPGA core for it.

 

As awesome as that would be, I can't imagine how much space would be needed on a SD card for jailbreaking...

[mrnarse]

As awesome as that would be, I can't imagine how much space would be needed on a SD card for jailbreaking...

A USB data port in addition to a SD card slot would be nice on a FPGA PS1

[Wolf_]

You're all neglecting the One True Reason that Analogue/Kevtris are silent on the custom firmware: krikzz paid them off to boost sd2snes sales. Jokes aside, I got tired of waiting so I just preordered a black Super Nt and pink sd2snes. Next month will be fun!

 

As for the current topic, it is a bit naïve to assume a non-answer means a positive answer. In fact it is dangerous to assume that, as you are misleading potential consumers who may buy the console on the premise of "that Wolf_ guy said there would be custom firmware!!". A non-answer is exactly that: a non-answer. It could be yes, it could be no. You cannot "logic" a positive answer no matter how hard you try.

As long as we make the assumption that Analogue's master plan isn't the absolutely retarded: "We'll keep everyone in the dark so that the lack of a jailbreak won't hurt our sales" plan then what they are actually doing becomes very clear. Some people seem determined not to see obvious evidence though.

 

 

Don't be pissed if you don't get a Porsche after ordering a VW I guess.

No. That's like asking what engine is in a Porsche and being told "no comment" so you order a Porsche but it might come with a vw engine inside because it hasn't been confirmed. Obviously only a total jackass would ship the latter product.

 

 

As awesome as that would be, I can't imagine how much space would be needed on a SD card for jailbreaking...

795gb for every US game, an additional 124gb if you want the Pal exclusives that never got an American release, and an additional 316gb if you want the Japanese exclusives that were never released in US or Pal regions. So 1.2tb not counting hacks, translations, and homebrew.

[snatcher1996]

That's like asking what engine is in a Porsche and being told "no comment" so you order a Porsche but it might come with a vw engine inside because it hasn't been confirmed. Obviously only a total jackass would ship the latter product.

 

The 911's advertised and confirmed engine is a Super Nintendo

 

There is not GT3 in production at the moment unfortunately, so don't expect to get one if you ordered a 911.

[Pixelboy]

795gb for every US game, an additional 124gb if you want the Pal exclusives that never got an American release, and an additional 316gb if you want the Japanese exclusives that were never released in US or Pal regions. So 1.2tb not counting hacks, translations, and homebrew.

So a 1.2tb SD card... I'm sure Kevtris can have that ready for us by next week.

[Wolf_]

So a 1.2tb SD card... I'm sure Kevtris can have that ready for us by next week.

Well 1tb sd cards are already a thing. By the time a ps1 fpga is ready with any luck 2tb sd card will be affordable and that should fit all the supported cores on it.

[Toth]

We're obviously getting a jailbreak firmware which is why they have declined to comment about it.

 

 

How many people have purchased these (un-returnable) consoles under the assumption they will be able to be jailbroken at some point? If they just came out and said it wasn't going to happen a lot of people would not buy one.

[Wolf_]

How many people have purchased these (un-returnable) consoles under the assumption they will be able to be jailbroken at some point? If they just came out and said it wasn't going to happen a lot of people would not buy one.

I'm sure it can be returned. Even if the company makes a policy of not accepting returns then you can still just go directly to your bank and contest the charges. Rest assured one way or another if that was their strategy people would be furious and they would get their money back. It would be completely not worth the damage it would do to Analogue's reputation for that to be their business strategy.

[Maarek_Stele]

I would love to see a jailbreak at some point and love to see additional cores added to the system as well as we have seen with the NT Mini, but personally, I would have purchased it anyway. I knew going in there were no promises for either a JB or additional cores and still didn't hesitate. The accuracy promise of FPGA based systems to truly preserve these aging systems is enough for me and I want to support that.

[Major_Havoc]

It's too bad Kev was so generous this last time giving away his years-long work for free, that it triggers a number of demanding consumers who now expect it.

[Mattelot]

That was my thought too.

Even if a Genesis Core came out on the Super Id still buy a Analogue Genesis console but I think Im in the minority on that....

 

I would still buy one for that as well for a more authentic experience... plugging in my Genesis controllers, etc.

[mrnarse]

A couple more interesting tidbits from the livestream:

 

-The MLiG guys were hoping for a 7x mode that could be used for full screen Game Boy gaming with a Super Game Boy, but Kevtris shot that possibility down.

 

-This was a theoretical question so don’t go reading into this as confirmation of anything, but someone asked how difficult it would be to port cores written for the NT Mini’s FPGA chip to the more powerful FPGA chip used in the Super NT. Kevtris said it would be pretty easy to do.