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FPGA Based Videogame System


kevtris

Interest in an FPGA Videogame System  

682 members have voted

  1. 1. I would pay....

  2. 2. I Would Like Support for...

  3. 3. Games Should Run From...

    • SD Card / USB Memory Sticks
    • Original Cartridges
    • Hopes and Dreams
  4. 4. The Video Inteface Should be...


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That was my 1st post and I definitely do appreciate everything that has been done with the Super NT and I also own one from the 1st preorder. I really hope you are not saying higan is a copycat because the Super NT probably wouldn't be as accurate as it is today without the work that byuu (the creator of higan) has done.

 

Mmm.. I believe Higan was being labeled as 2nd rate - because software emulation, because not Analogue. Higan is really reference material.

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Ok so I'm a little confused by the new save system. When do we go into the system menu to save our game? Just lost a few minutes progress in Star Ocean.

 

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk

With the new firmware released a few days ago when you press down and select on the game your on it saves automatically now. It works great for me. Make sure you save your progress before pressing down and select.

Edited by Odin Belmont
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yeah but that only runs NES/fami. It won't run any of the over a dozen systems the ntm runs.

Well a cost reduced NT Mini could technically do the same thing. Or the Super NT, if your alleged partner in crime decides to release one! :evil:

 

 

I think the jailbreaker is busy perfecting the SNES core for the Super NT right now. ;)

Suffice to say this is common knowledge at this point. ;-)

 

First rule about discussing the author of the jailbreak software: we don't discuss the author of the jailbreak software... :ahoy:

 

Second rule: I tend to break my own rules a lot! :P

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Doesnt look like NT Minis are getting another production run anytime soon.

 

https://twitter.com/analogue_co/status/978983514145153025?s=21

 

 

 

This news sucks ass.

 

They could make the NT mini cheap plastic model, but they choose not too. Very disappointing

I think people saw the writing on the wall some time ago. NT Mini (in it's current state) cannot be sustained, and I have a pretty good feeling the elephant in the room is that massive alu brick they milled down.

 

As for the Super NT, they will produce more runs on it.

 

 

http://www.retrousb.com/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=78

 

 

If memory serves, which it may not, kevtris previously stated that a GBA core would be very difficult, ps1 may even be easier.

Yes, this.

 

I have an AVS and it's awexsome. The Super NT is for all purposes and intents, a spiritual successor to the AVS concept. Brian went with the K.I.S.S. principal when designing the console, which is why there aren't a lot of options. I get the impression that 9k LE Xlinx FPGA is just barely large enough to run the AVS, another reason why it can't be stuffed full of extraneous menu options. The NT Mini is a 25k LE Cyclone V and has a lot more headroom. The Super NT is even larger hence even more options.

 

Possibly the only fallout with the price disparity between the AVS and NT Mini, besides the fact the NT Mini sold fewer units, was the AVS Limited Edition, which is still available for purchase AFAIK for $650. Hardly a "Roles Royce" option compared to the NT Mini:

http://www.retrousb.com/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=77

 

Super NT console design and menu interface would be easy to tweak into a Sega Genesis with backwards compatibility with Sega Master System baked in (and dual cart slots like the NT Mini and RetroUSB AVS). JB firmware or cartridge adapters could provide easy access to SG-3000/1000 and Game Gear games with little modification or changing cores. FM sound via a menu option. Sorry but Sega CD and 32X are just not in the cards, however SMS support would win a lot of classic era Sega fans from Europe and other PAL territories.

 

I don't think dual cart slots add a ton of expense. More than probable the analog outputs with supplemental support circuitry (which supposedly is being worked on for Super NT and future console use) adds cost, but nothing compared to the over the top aluminum body. I doubt Analogue will be targeting the high end market anymore when there's a lot more money to be made on mid-teir price bracket products that don't suck.

 

As long as Kevtris remains at the helm, good things will come. :D

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With the new firmware released a few days ago when you press down and select on the game your on it saves automatically now. It works great for me. Make sure you save your progress before pressing down and select.

Thank you for clarifying this. I did it before and it didn't work. Maybe the menu-warning should clarify for new users as well.

 

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk

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I think people saw the writing on the wall some time ago. NT Mini (in it's current state) cannot be sustained, and I have a pretty good feeling the elephant in the room is that massive alu brick they milled down.

 

As for the Super NT, they will produce more runs on it.

 

 

Yes, this.

 

I have an AVS and it's awexsome. The Super NT is for all purposes and intents, a spiritual successor to the AVS concept. Brian went with the K.I.S.S. principal when designing the console, which is why there aren't a lot of options. I get the impression that 9k LE Xlinx FPGA is just barely large enough to run the AVS, another reason why it can't be stuffed full of extraneous menu options. The NT Mini is a 25k LE Cyclone V and has a lot more headroom. The Super NT is even larger hence even more options.

 

Possibly the only fallout with the price disparity between the AVS and NT Mini, besides the fact the NT Mini sold fewer units, was the AVS Limited Edition, which is still available for purchase AFAIK for $650. Hardly a "Roles Royce" option compared to the NT Mini:

http://www.retrousb.com/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=77

 

Super NT console design and menu interface would be easy to tweak into a Sega Genesis with backwards compatibility with Sega Master System baked in (and dual cart slots like the NT Mini and RetroUSB AVS). JB firmware or cartridge adapters could provide easy access to SG-3000/1000 and Game Gear games with little modification or changing cores. FM sound via a menu option. Sorry but Sega CD and 32X are just not in the cards, however SMS support would win a lot of classic era Sega fans from Europe and other PAL territories.

 

I don't think dual cart slots add a ton of expense. More than probable the analog outputs with supplemental support circuitry (which supposedly is being worked on for Super NT and future console use) adds cost, but nothing compared to the over the top aluminum body. I doubt Analogue will be targeting the high end market anymore when there's a lot more money to be made on mid-teir price bracket products that don't suck.

 

As long as Kevtris remains at the helm, good things will come. :D

 

I so want the VS Limited Edition. Wished it was a little cheaper. It looks lovely

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With the new firmware released a few days ago when you press down and select on the game your on it saves automatically now. It works great for me. Make sure you save your progress before pressing down and select.

Yeh, important to remember that it saves the save. I can see that being confusing. Save the game, (in the game, the same as if it were a real cartridge), then enter the file browser to write the game's save file to the SD card (otherwise it's left in RAM only, and gone when the system is shut down or the game exited).

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I think the jailbreaker is busy perfecting the SNES core for the Super NT right now. ;)

 

The JB almost certainly has no control over the FPGA core. They can only tweak the MC (microcontroller) firmware, because those functions exist in the firmware. If the firmware secretly had a NES FPGA core from the mini in it, that would be the only way to have that core, and we would have also seen it already. The MC firmware can not change how the FPGA is wired.

 

If people still don't understand how the NT Mini and SuperNT work:

- There is separate RAM for the FPGA and the MC

- The FPGA runs the "NES" or "SNES" part, the MC runs the menu's, file i/o, sd-card, graphics settings, etc.

 

You can't add anything to the FPGA that isn't already in it. The entire reason the NT Mini could load other cores was because the MC allowed the FPGA core to be swapped with another and load the game rom directly into the RAM. Thus it's like hitting the reset button on the game console, and why there is boot time that the SNES does not have.

 

To add expansion chips to the firmware, requires writing another core that has that chip in it, and that core would only be able to read rom files, because you can't have two GSU-1's (real and fpga) running at the same time.

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Yeh, important to remember that it saves the save. I can see that being confusing. Save the game, (in the game, the same as if it were a real cartridge), then enter the file browser to write the game's save file to the SD card (otherwise it's left in RAM only, and gone when the system is shut down or the game exited).

Ah, I see. Good to know how it works too, thank you :)

 

Also, with there now being an option to save the RAM, is that the same thing? So save in game, enter the system menu, then save the RAM?

 

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk

Edited by Lost Gaijin
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The JB almost certainly has no control over the FPGA core. They can only tweak the MC (microcontroller) firmware, because those functions exist in the firmware. If the firmware secretly had a NES FPGA core from the mini in it, that would be the only way to have that core, and we would have also seen it already. The MC firmware can not change how the FPGA is wired.

 

If people still don't understand how the NT Mini and SuperNT work:

- There is separate RAM for the FPGA and the MC

- The FPGA runs the "NES" or "SNES" part, the MC runs the menu's, file i/o, sd-card, graphics settings, etc.

 

You can't add anything to the FPGA that isn't already in it. The entire reason the NT Mini could load other cores was because the MC allowed the FPGA core to be swapped with another and load the game rom directly into the RAM. Thus it's like hitting the reset button on the game console, and why there is boot time that the SNES does not have.

 

To add expansion chips to the firmware, requires writing another core that has that chip in it, and that core would only be able to read rom files, because you can't have two GSU-1's (real and fpga) running at the same time.

Are we sure that it is not possible for the microcontroller to rewrite small portions of the fpga firmware on the fly (aside from writing the whole thing in one go during the 5-10 + minutes where the console blacks out). I understand you are fairly knowledgable, but unless you've dissected either the firmware or probed the pcb or have some other insight into the inner workings, what you are saying is just speculation.

 

Kevtris has stated it IS possible to port over the 8-bit cores, however this will require some amount of effort on his part to pull off. We know he is busy fixing bugs. We don't know if he is allowed to do so by his contract with Analogue, or if he is pursuing other interests. The existence of the jb firmware is a jesture of goodwill towards those requesting a jb core, and it's anonomous release through smokemonster is a good way of dissociating the cores from association with analogue.

 

But the assumption that a third party is able to "hack" the firmware to add rom loading, within a few short hours of official release, is a bit far fetched at this point. It could get a nightly release, then I drive to work and learn about both simultaneously by the following afternoon when I return home.

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Are we sure that it is not possible for the microcontroller to rewrite small portions of the fpga firmware on the fly (aside from writing the whole thing in one go during the 5-10 + minutes where the console blacks out). I understand you are fairly knowledgable, but unless you've dissected either the firmware or probed the pcb or have some other insight into the inner workings, what you are saying is just speculation.

 

Kevtris has stated it IS possible to port over the 8-bit cores, however this will require some amount of effort on his part to pull off. We know he is busy fixing bugs. We don't know if he is allowed to do so by his contract with Analogue, or if he is pursuing other interests. The existence of the jb firmware is a jesture of goodwill towards those requesting a jb core, and it's anonomous release through smokemonster is a good way of dissociating the cores from association with analogue.

 

But the assumption that a third party is able to "hack" the firmware to add rom loading, within a few short hours of official release, is a bit far fetched at this point. It could get a nightly release, then I drive to work and learn about both simultaneously by the following afternoon when I drive home.

 

They aren't adding rom loading. The rom's for Super Turrican already exist, copy and paste that code with the file manager that exists as part of the LED pattern browser. That all already exists in the firmware. For all we know the ability to play roms from the SD card always existed and is just hidden from being shown in the menu.

 

Like I'm not trying to have a re-run of the conversation we had dozens of pages ago about who the Firmware Fairy is, but the MC firmware is fundamentally a different thing from the FPGA firmware, and the PIC32 can readily be decompiled if you decrypt it. You can not decompile a FPGA firmware to my knowledge, because it's not "program code", it's literately a map of wires and switches and each FPGA firmware blob only works with the hardware it's designed to be used in, with the FPGA chip it's designed to be used on. Like if you have the code to compile the FPGA, yes you probably could make the changes necessary to make the NT Mini cores run on the Super NT, but clearly that is not going to happen because that would require the source code to those cores.

 

To the best of my knowledge the NT Mini and Super NT work this way:

 

Boot, load MC firmware

MC firmware load FPGA firmware

FPGA put in halt mode until told to load cart or rom

FPGA output goes through line doubler

Output of MC is overlaid over FPGA linedoubled output

if ROM, copy to FPGA ram, then boot FPGA

 

In the JB NT Mini, when you select another core, it has to back to step 2. I would not risk any kind of tampering with the FPGA blob unless you've already RE'd the hardware and mapped where all the pins go. If you already have another FPGA blob you wrote and know how the pins are connected, you could conceivably (eg jwdonal could do this) load another FPGA blob onto the device.

 

But it has to be said that one should not expect any "new" features in the JB firmware that are not in the firmware. So that means no additional cores. Presumably there is nothing actually stopping that from happening short of kevtris having the time for it and any pressure from Analogue not to. If some of us bought the Super NT with this being an eventuality, just sit tight and enjoy what you have right now. There is no promise of it, but it's too tempting not to.

 

My prediction for the NT Mini however is that they will likely just issue another version of the Super NT PCB with the NES controller ports and NES cartridge slots to avoid all the other additional costs. However it will likely disappoint people who wanted a 4-port version. In fact I was kinda surprised there wasn't 4 controller ports on the Super NT, but I didn't let that put me off it either. The production costs would go down further if they can buy parts in quantity that they can use with both systems, and any future system.

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I think people saw the writing on the wall some time ago. NT Mini (in it's current state) cannot be sustained, and I have a pretty good feeling the elephant in the room is that massive alu brick they milled down.

 

As for the Super NT, they will produce more runs on it.

 

Yes, this.

 

I have an AVS and it's awexsome. The Super NT is for all purposes and intents, a spiritual successor to the AVS concept. Brian went with the K.I.S.S. principal when designing the console, which is why there aren't a lot of options. I get the impression that 9k LE Xlinx FPGA is just barely large enough to run the AVS, another reason why it can't be stuffed full of extraneous menu options. The NT Mini is a 25k LE Cyclone V and has a lot more headroom. The Super NT is even larger hence even more options.

 

Possibly the only fallout with the price disparity between the AVS and NT Mini, besides the fact the NT Mini sold fewer units, was the AVS Limited Edition, which is still available for purchase AFAIK for $650. Hardly a "Roles Royce" option compared to the NT Mini:

http://www.retrousb.com/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=77

 

Super NT console design and menu interface would be easy to tweak into a Sega Genesis with backwards compatibility with Sega Master System baked in (and dual cart slots like the NT Mini and RetroUSB AVS). JB firmware or cartridge adapters could provide easy access to SG-3000/1000 and Game Gear games with little modification or changing cores. FM sound via a menu option. Sorry but Sega CD and 32X are just not in the cards, however SMS support would win a lot of classic era Sega fans from Europe and other PAL territories.

 

I don't think dual cart slots add a ton of expense. More than probable the analog outputs with supplemental support circuitry (which supposedly is being worked on for Super NT and future console use) adds cost, but nothing compared to the over the top aluminum body. I doubt Analogue will be targeting the high end market anymore when there's a lot more money to be made on mid-teir price bracket products that don't suck.

 

As long as Kevtris remains at the helm, good things will come. :D

What does K.I.S.S stand for?

 

EDIT: Nevermind found out.

Edited by SegaSnatcher
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Kevtris, I found a compatibility issue with the Super NT and the Retro Circuits SA-1 4-in-1 multicart:

https://www.retrocircuits.com/product/sa-4in1-marvelous-mario-rpg-and-more/

 

The multicart allows for games to be switched through by holding select for a few seconds. This works on the Super NT and every game is playable. However, the save games are lost when switching between games by holding select on the Super NT. I tested an official SNES and this issue did not reproduce.

 

Any idea if this can be fixed in a firmware update?

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Kevtris, I found a compatibility issue with the Super NT and the Retro Circuits SA-1 4-in-1 multicart:

https://www.retrocircuits.com/product/sa-4in1-marvelous-mario-rpg-and-more/

 

The multicart allows for games to be switched through by holding select for a few seconds. This works on the Super NT and every game is playable. However, the save games are lost when switching between games by holding select on the Super NT. I tested an official SNES and this issue did not reproduce.

 

Any idea if this can be fixed in a firmware update?

 

When you are playing a game and quit out of it does it save like normal? Does this only happen when you are switching between the titles on the cart?

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When you are playing a game and quit out of it does it save like normal? Does this only happen when you are switching between the titles on the cart?

Yes, when I quit the game, power off the Super NT, and power back on, the save remains. Just when holding reset to switch, the save games get erased on the Super NT. An official SNES does not have this issue.

 

I found a work around. Instead of holding the Super NTs reset button to cycle through games, holding the hotkey combo to reset (up and select on the controller), causes the multicart to cycle through the games and does not erase the save games.

Edited by Jagasian
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FX chip support has been added to sd2snes:

https://twitter.com/smokemonstertwi/status/978875015402872833?s=21

Wow, I never thought I'd see the day! :o This is good news for both the SD2SNES, as well as the Super FX, right?

 

 

 

I have heard the limited clear AVS pairs very nicely with their annual Xmas carts! :D

The XMAS cart also looks very nice on the stock AVS as well. Especially the 2017 model with the LCD screen.

[VIDEO]

[/VIDEO]

 

Just leave the flap open. :)

RetroUSB-AVS_NES30_Pads-02-vgo.jpg

 

8BitXmas2017-04.jpg

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I'd call that an understatement!

 

The Gameboy is the only incomplete one of all the cores AFAIK, but many think it's still the best way to play Gameboy on a modern display all things considered (amount of lag, audio quality, scaling options, etc)

 

there is already a "physical" gb core for super nt, the super gameboy. I think that one pinball game is the only thing that wont run on it.

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there is already a "physical" gb core for super nt, the super gameboy. I think that one pinball game is the only thing that wont run on it.

 

 

I know, but from what I've heard many consider the Nt Mini core to be superior. From memory the Nt Mini core has better audio quality (no buss hiss) and supports the desirable 7x (screen filling) scale. Plus the Super Gameboy apparently introduces a bunch of input lag (extra 40ms)

 

There is an issue opened for Super Nt scaling on the Super Nt: https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Super-NT-Jailbreak/issues/94

Edited by cacophony
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Wow, I never thought I'd see the day! :o This is good news for both the SD2SNES, as well as the Super FX, right?

 

 

 

 

The XMAS cart also looks very nice on the stock AVS as well. Especially the 2017 model with the LCD screen.

[VIDEO]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkdntklJdDA[/VIDEO]

 

Just leave the flap open. :)

RetroUSB-AVS_NES30_Pads-02-vgo.jpg

 

8BitXmas2017-04.jpg

 

awesome. i put decals on my avs to. and a nintendo entertainment system logo for the lid. i ordered a chrome super nintendo logo for the super nt as well.

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