FPGA Based Videogame System

[Intense.Mark]

I don't see any company selling an FPGA console with CDROM in the near future although kevtris mentioned that the PS1 is possible with current technology unlike Sega CD and Sega Saturn.

Edited June 18, 2018 by Intense.Mark

[GarrettCRW]

It shouldn't be all that hard for this completely theoretical FPGA Genesis to have the pinout on the side that would connect to an existing Sega CD (it's certainly far easier than creating a setup that would allow one to connect a 32X with the thing).

[Intense.Mark]

It shouldn't be all that hard for this completely theoretical FPGA Genesis to have the pinout on the side that would connect to an existing Sega CD (it's certainly far easier than creating a setup that would allow one to connect a 32X with the thing).

If all connections are present on the FPGA Genesis, it could be possible but Sega CD audio will be separate if the main unit is using HDMI.

[Intense.Mark]

I don't see any company selling an FPGA console with CDROM in the near future although kevtris mentioned that the PS1 is possible with current technology unlike Sega CD and Sega Saturn.

Sorry, this came out different than what I supposed to say. He didn't mention that the Sega CD and Saturn were not possible with current technology. I believe it's just hard to simulate on an FPGA hardware.

[Andromeda Stardust]

If all connections are present on the FPGA Genesis, it could be possible but Sega CD audio will be separate if the main unit is using HDMI.

 

Well if the new Sega fpga offered those pinouts, the cd unit would need to attach to a special card edge on the side which would...

 

A) raise the price by complicating both the shell design and pcb design,

B) the new sega fpga would be woefully undersized if it shares a similar form factorto the super nt,

C) and as one poster above put it, would not offer cd quality output via hdmi since audio is mized inside the cd unit.

 

Obviously not as big an issue as the 32x analog video mixing, but a hurdle nonetheless. I would think at some point the design compromises would outweigh the benefits. Adding an additional SMS slot as a nod to classic sega fans would be much more economical compared to the cd expansion bus.

[kwnage]

C) and as one poster above put it, would not offer cd quality output via hdmi since audio is mized inside the cd unit.

IIRC mixing is done inside the console, e.g. a Genesis 2 + CD combo does output CD audio via the AV port on the console. So that shouldn't be a problem for the possible FPGA MD/Genny.

 

The RCA jacks on the back of the CD unit are optional if you want to have CD audio plugged directly into your HiFi setup. It's also used for Genesis 1 which as we all know doesn't output stereo sound through its AV Port. By using the 3.5mm input on the back of the CD unit one could have the stereo sound from the headphone jack mixed with CD Audio and output through the RCA jacks, bypassing the internal mixer of the console.

Edited June 20, 2018 by kwnage

[Intense.Mark]

Well if the new Sega fpga offered those pinouts, the cd unit would need to attach to a special card edge on the side which would...

 

A) raise the price by complicating both the shell design and pcb design,

B) the new sega fpga would be woefully undersized if it shares a similar form factorto the super nt,

C) and as one poster above put it, would not offer cd quality output via hdmi since audio is mized inside the cd unit.

 

Obviously not as big an issue as the 32x analog video mixing, but a hurdle nonetheless. I would think at some point the design compromises would outweigh the benefits. Adding an additional SMS slot as a nod to classic sega fans would be much more economical compared to the cd expansion bus.

We wouldn't have those issues with the 32x if the Sega Neptune was released. I hope somewhere, someone has the prototype waiting to be revealed just like with the SNES Playstation prototype. Lend it to Kevin and have him reverse engineer it. I haven't read anything about the Neptune being able to connect with the Sega CD though.

 

Next best thing is probably a high end everdrive with super SD system 3 and sd2snes capabilities that can run 32x or Sega CD ISOs.

Edited June 20, 2018 by Intense.Mark

[kwnage]

Next best thing is probably a high end everdrive with super SD system 3 and sd2snes capabilities that can run 32x or Sega CD ISOs.

That would still require video input from the console like the original 32x does. Well at least it would be a bit more reliable than an Everdrive plugged into a 32x on top of a Genesis.

Edited June 20, 2018 by kwnage

[Intense.Mark]

That would still require video input from the console like the original 32x does.

The Genesis, 32x, Sega CD combo is just complex. That's why I'm eager to see a Sega Neptune prototype someday. Sega Pluto, whether it's true or not, did show up.

 

One solution regarding that is to put the same analog ports from the original Genesis 1 or 2 to the FPGA but I don't think that will happen. No way to output it in digital unless the 32x gets a HDMI mod. All of this is still complicated.

[Jurai]

The Genesis, 32x, Sega CD combo is just complex. That's why I'm eager to see a Sega Neptune prototype someday. Sega Pluto, whether it's true or not, did show up.

 

One solution regarding that is to put the same analog ports from the original Genesis 1 or 2 to the FPGA but I don't think that will happen. No way to output it in digital unless the 32x gets a HDMI mod. All of this is still complicated.

 

wasn't retaining analog output cited as one of the cost factors on the NT Mini?

 

also just now noticed that the transparent Super NT is discontinued, not sure if anyone mentioned it already

[Intense.Mark]

 

wasn't retaining analog output cited as one of the cost factors on the NT Mini?

 

also just now noticed that the transparent Super NT is discontinued, not sure if anyone mentioned it already

I believe that's one of the reasons why super NT is cheaper than the NT mini. What I mentioned is just a possible solution if you want to connect a 32x on an FPGA Genesis. I do believe Kevin can implement 32x functions on an FPGA Genesis though. He just needs to collaborate with the creators/programmers of the 32x emulators like with Byuu.

 

The transparent one was officially discontinued by Analogue last May.

[Jurai]

I believe that's one of the reasons why super NT is cheaper than the NT mini. What I mentioned is just a possible solution if you want to connect a 32x on an FPGA Genesis. I do believe Kevin can implement 32x functions on an FPGA Genesis though. He just needs to collaborate with the creators/programmers of the 32x emulators like with Byuu.

 

The transparent one was officially discontinued by Analogue last May.

 

Oh gotcha, I probably saw the notice about it but was pretty out of it most of May

 

If we some how actually end up with an all in one genny+segacd I'd be really surprised, I imagine it would put price point back at nt mini levels

[Andromeda Stardust]

I believe that's one of the reasons why super NT is cheaper than the NT mini.

 

The transparent one was officially discontinued by Analogue last May.

I think the elephant in the room was that milled aluminum shell, but the omission of analog probably also streamlined the design process and removed a lot of redundant components.

 

The transparent consoles were cool, but got unfairly criticized citing the fact they didn't look like the renders. I don't think it looked any less cool than the smoke translucent N64s or frost game boys to be honest.

 

I got the NA purple color scheme though.

 

 

If we some how actually end up with an all in one genny+segacd I'd be really surprised, I imagine it would put price point back at nt mini levels

I just don't see FPGA CD consoles as being feasible. One could always connect a SATA port for CDROM access though. Then there's the BIOS issues that most CD consoles have to worry about. That might actually be doable with an FPGA PC Engine, but the Sega CD was too complex to quote Kevtris.

 

And I'm sure 32X will technically function on a Mega NT without the video cable. You could still hook the 32X up to a CRT TV and the Mega NT up to an HDTV in the same vicinity (preferably with the HDTV perched or mounted above the CRT) and get both sets of visuals on separate displays without the screen overlay.

[Jurai]

I think the elephant in the room was that milled aluminum shell, but the omission of analog probably also streamlined the design process and removed a lot of redundant components.

 

The transparent consoles were cool, but got unfairly criticized citing the fact they didn't look like the renders. I don't think it looked any less cool than the smoke translucent N64s or frost game boys to be honest.

 

I got the NA purple color scheme though.

 

I just don't see FPGA CD consoles as being feasible. One could always connect a SATA port for CDROM access though. Then there's the BIOS issues that most CD consoles have to worry about. That might actually be doable with an FPGA PC Engine, but the Sega CD was too complex to quote Kevtris.

 

And I'm sure 32X will technically function on a Mega NT without the video cable. You could still hook the 32X up to a CRT TV and the Mega NT up to an HDTV in the same vicinity (preferably with the HDTV perched or mounted above the CRT) and get both sets of visuals on separate displays without the screen overlay.

 

yeah idk, cdrom access even just tossing a sata port seems pretty iffy on support, and nobody aesthetically wants a random bullshit cdrom drive sitting out next to their system, if they don't go full on actual hardware addon support I don't see some plug in random hardware solution happening

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

yeah idk, cdrom access even just tossing a sata port seems pretty iffy on support, and nobody aesthetically wants a random bullshit cdrom drive sitting out next to their system, if they don't go full on actual hardware addon support I don't see some plug in random hardware solution happening

random bullshit hanging off the fpga is basically what would happen though. If a supplier for CD ROM drives is provided, there is the issue of DC drive firmware playing nice with the fpga. If the manufacturer changes random bullshit to the drive internals or firmware, then all of a sudden you have issues with some units not working correctly, even if ones before did. Or a manufacturer/supplier discontinues a particular model of CDROM drive that the developer spend time developing customized drive firmware so the CDROM drive could read from system X. Now he has to source another vendor of CDROM drives and create a new custom firmware for that in order to maintain compatibility with the FPGA console.

 

It's a potentially damning situation for homebrew hardware projects. Just because a drive "just works" connected to any motherboard on any operation system in a PC environment, doesn't guarantee it will play nice to stream data directly to an FPGA at 1x speed from a special proprietary disc format that isn't 100% compatible with redbook CDROM. I think all SATA drives send all data in chunks anyway, so an older PATA drive may be better adept at interfacing with an FPGA at low speeds. I already have enough issues writing to 20 year old 74 minute CDR media rated for 1-4x, on a modern SATA drive designed to write at 8x-48x speeds. The disc may not burn properly at 8x or the SATA drive may refuse to burn it at all, even though it is purportedly good media. And the drive in question was purchased in 2005 but still works. The late 90s CDR media I was struggling to write with it was only 7 years old at the time the drive was purchased.

[spoonman]

Strange to not see any firmware updates or talk of updates in so long.

 

Is it possible to have an option where one could remove the Gaussian interpolation filter used on SNES audio?

I know it would make lower sample rate audio sound trebly, possibly scratchy, but I'm curious how it would sound without the low pass filtering.

 

I always hear Sega fans trashing the SNES, claiming the sound is ruined by the audio being horribly muffled. I don't feel this way. I love both FM Synth (and own several classic 80's Yamaha synth keyboards) as well as Wavetable Synth.

Just curious if this was at all possible without too much trouble.

[cacophony]

Strange to not see any firmware updates or talk of updates in so long.

 

Analogue only has 1 engineer, and that engineer has presumably been moved over to full time work on their next product(s). The exact same thing happened with the Nt Mini dev cycle. We're still waiting for that engineer to give us the planned Intellivision core

 

I do hope we eventually see more updates for both the Nt Mini and the Super Nt, but at this point they're both very polished products so there's no reason not to be patient.

Edited June 24, 2018 by cacophony

[Tanooki]

Strange to not see any firmware updates or talk of updates in so long.

 

Is it possible to have an option where one could remove the Gaussian interpolation filter used on SNES audio?

I know it would make lower sample rate audio sound trebly, possibly scratchy, but I'm curious how it would sound without the low pass filtering.

 

I always hear Sega fans trashing the SNES, claiming the sound is ruined by the audio being horribly muffled. I don't feel this way. I love both FM Synth (and own several classic 80's Yamaha synth keyboards) as well as Wavetable Synth.

Just curious if this was at all possible without too much trouble.

Agreed, and even if not from them but also unofficial sources too.

 

It would be nice to see more audio choices as even emulators going back probably 10-15 years now have allowed to disable such things for a more raw sourcing of the audio. And I've seen that baseless comment thrown about by Sega fans, always chocked it up to envy given how tinny and metallic their audio tended to sound while many samples did in fact come off highly compressed and muffled or unintelligible in part or completely. SNES had it at times, but it was a developer choice to use garbage audio and run it that way. I never felt it had the problem enough to generalize the system for it, but some games do have stand out moments where it just comes out as being off. Not trying to really ding Sega either, the audio chip they did go with sounds stunning in the arcade, but just lacked for one reason or another in so many console titles it made me wonder where the sacrificial cuts were made.

[kevtris]

Sorry about the lack of updates and radio silence but I've been hard at work on stuff and can't really discuss anything. I haven't forgotten about anyone, but I am busy working all the time again.

[pedroTFP]

Man, no need for apologizing, we love you and can't wait to know officially what you're working on!

[leods]

I am very glad to hear that. Have fun Kev. And rest a bit too.

[F34R]

I'm guessing he's not working on Super NT any more then.

[Jagasian]

It has been confirmed. Kevtris is working on the official Zimba 3000.

[Pixelboy]

It has been confirmed. Kevtris is working on the official Zimba 3000.

Confirmed where?

[Lost Gaijin]

Confirmed where?

He was joking man.

 

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