FPGA Based Videogame System

[Andromeda Stardust]

4 hours ago, mario64 said:

I’m considering an AVS myself. Anyone know if it can properly play NES Final Fantasy VII Advent Children? The NT Mini has graphical corruption. This is with the N8 Pro of course

If the N8 is causing corruption, it is likely a flashcart issue. The cart should playable on an NES, Famicom, AVS, or NT Mini. If the everdrive causes corruption, it's the mapper driver?

[spoonman]

On 1/3/2020 at 3:54 AM, Kosmic Stardust said:

Not to sound like a retrousb fangirl, but the AVS is comparable both in price and featurewise to the non-jb firmwares features on the super nt and mega sg. In fact both Analogue's 16-bit consoles make perfect spiritual successors to the RetroUSB AVS.

 

There is no means to jailbreak the AVS. Much smaller FPGA and no SD card to load firmware or store ROMs. You'd have to connect it to a PC to flash a different core, if one existed.

^agreed. Though I wonder if one of those USB / splitter power+data cables would possibly work with the AVS. I forget the name of them, but I use one with a newer gen Amazon Fire Stick to connect a USB drive and still power it. 

 

I am pretty happy with the current status of the RetroUSB AVS, aside from the bug in 1.30 final which breaks compatibility with RetroUSB's own 8-BIT XMAS 2017 cart (the neat one with the LCD screen label), but if there is room for more features I'd like to see a color palette which replicates the VS arcade monitors. I miss the way VS SMB looked in the arcade. A CopyNES function and audio EQ might also be nice, but aren't necessary.

 

I'm also not sure if something could replace the online high score feature now that NintendoAge is dead (RIP).

 

I prefer the AVS over playing NES/FC on a MiSTer because I enjoy playing my original carts. I find that I tend to actually stick with a game rather than play it for a couple minutes and then moving on to another game when playing a single cartridge, but I do like the N8 for imports, translations, color fixes, hacks, PC-10, VS., and more. 

 

I also like using original controllers and accessories. I'm not sure if something like the TAITO VAUS spinner controller would work with the MiSTer. Maybe it does, but I know it works great with the AVS. I need to grab a second Japanese spinner for 2 player Arkanoid II. I'll plug that into the JPN Expansion port in the back.

 

 

2 hours ago, Kosmic Stardust said:

If the N8 is causing corruption, it is likely a flashcart issue. The cart should playable on an NES, Famicom, AVS, or NT Mini. If the everdrive causes corruption, it's the mapper driver?

 

Make sure to grab the newest 1.20 OS update. It back ports new mappers and fixes from the new N8 Pro, which was really cool of Krikzz to do!

http://krikzz.com/pub/support/everdrive-n8/original-series/OS/nesos-v1.20.zip

 

1.20 (12/23/2019) Update Changelist

Nesos-v1.20 23.12.2019
1) OS naming convention was changed to make clear differentiation between PRO and OG N8 OS. OG N8 OS is 1.xx and PRO is 2.xx
2) Now save states supported by all mappers.
3) New fully functional MMC5 mapper
4) New FDS audio core
5) Audio core for Sunsof5 mapper by Necronomfive
6) Audio core for VRC7 mapper by Necronomfive
7) Specific games databese update. Now works few more games which require specific settings
8) Minor update from MMC3
9) New mappers support(1):  27, 30, 50, 106, 108, 142, 144, 145, 149, 156, 165, 171, 175, 176, 183, 213, 216, 
9) New mappers support(2):  222, 252, 37, 45, 49, 51, 52, 105, 177, 190, 197, 207, 214, 228, 229, 244, 249, 250,
9) New mappers support(3):  35, 44, 56, 60, 103, 117, 132, 136, 143, 159, 172, 173, 183, 186, 187, 198, 199, 221, 238, 248
10) FDS autoswap blocking function. Hold A to prevent disk swap. This is mostly for test fds sound in zelda intro.
11) Fixed irq counter in Acclaim mmc3 mapper
12) Audio balance option for mappers with expansion audio
13) Some mappers and fixes were back ported from N8-PRO

[pedroTFP]

On 1/3/2020 at 1:31 AM, CZroe said:

Due to the open-source nature, some cores can be extremely accurate and other cores not so much (accurate enough). Luckily, it's always improving. For example, when someone makes a cycle-accurate Motorola X68000 core, all the arcade and consoles which use a 68000 get their 68000 cores updated....

Thanks,

I know about SM and I love the guy and the effort he puts in for all the retro-community.

My question was more about "source reliability" when it comes to accuracy and cores evolution. I know *for sure* that Kevtriss's stuff is 99.9999% cycle accurate, but for the rest is all "heresay", if I may say so.

Is there any proper buglist or "core completion status" about MisTer cores?

I gather Neogeo is cycle accurate (is it?) but what about NES or SMS today, or next month? How can somebody tell if\when MisTer's Genesis core is on par with MegaSG? In other words, how can I be sure that a MisTer core is comparable in terms of accuracy with a Kevtriss one or, if a Kevtriss one doesn't exist (i.e. SEGA CD), what is its level of accuracy?

[CZroe]

Thanks, I know about SM and I love the guy and the effort he puts in for all the retro-community.

My question was more about "source reliability" when it comes to accuracy and cores evolution. I know *for sure* that Kevtriss's stuff is 99.9999% cycle accurate, but for the rest is all "heresay", if I may say so.

Is there any proper buglist or "core completion status" about MisTer cores?

I gather Neogeo is cycle accurate (is it?) but what about NES or SMS today, or next month? How can somebody tell if\when MisTer's Genesis core is on par with MegaSG? In other words, how can I be sure that a MisTer core is comparable in terms of accuracy with a Kevtriss one or, if a Kevtriss one doesn't exist (i.e. SEGA CD), what is its level of accuracy?

 

It's a lot to follow, but it's really down to the reputation of the developers for each core and how public they are. There are a few rockstars on Kevtris' level contributing some of the best cores. While MiSTer as a whole can't point to one trusted person like Kevtris to reflect how well everything as a whole works, it's still got a lot of individual credibility for many of the cores. I don't think Zimba 3000 was ever going to support a bunch of different arcade games and such as a one-man operation so I'm really glad to see the Pocket inviting others to contribute cores and hope it brings MiSTer-like cooperation to their future consoles. 

 

 

This is going to sound petty, but I think the main reason I haven't set up a MiSTer for myself yet is because I'm really annoyed that a full setup has cables coming out from every side. Same reason I dislike using my RetroTink 2X and OSSC. Getting MiSTer-like community involvement with the fit and finish of Analogue consoles would be a dream come true!

 

 

 

[pedroTFP]

I agree.

It'd be super cool if Analogue'd implement some kind of "quality control" over the cores released for the Pocket.

[Drunk_Caterpillar]

7 hours ago, spoonman said:

I am pretty happy with the current status of the RetroUSB AVS, aside from the bug in 1.30 final which breaks compatibility with RetroUSB's own 8-BIT XMAS 2017 cart (the neat one with the LCD screen label), but if there is room for more features I'd like to see a color palette which replicates the VS arcade monitors. I miss the way VS SMB looked in the arcade. A CopyNES function and audio EQ might also be nice, but aren't necessary.

 

I'm also not sure if something could replace the online high score feature now that NintendoAge is dead (RIP).

There are beta firmwares of AVS 1.40 that might fix the issue with that cart, but I haven’t checked myself. Also, installing custom palettes through the Scoreboard app is on the roadmap, but the timeline is kinda foggy right now. 

[mario64]

13 hours ago, Kosmic Stardust said:

If the N8 is causing corruption, it is likely a flashcart issue. The cart should playable on an NES, Famicom, AVS, or NT Mini. If the everdrive causes corruption, it's the mapper driver?

It's a problem with the NT Mini. N8 Pro on an actual Famicom works fine

[Sneakyturtleegg]

2 hours ago, pedroTFP said:

I agree.

It'd be super cool if Analogue'd implement some kind of "quality control" over the cores released for the Pocket.

To me, that would defeat the point of opening up the Pocket for devs. I wouldn't want to see it become regulated. The cream will always rise to the top. The Mister project does fine without regulation. I would like to see a small, free software dev kit or set of tools from Analogue. That way the devs will know how to interact with it initially. After that, it should be wide open.

[CZroe]

To me, that would defeat the point of opening up the Pocket for devs. I wouldn't want to see it become regulated. The cream will always rise to the top. The Mister project does fine without regulation. I would like to see a small, free software dev kit or set of tools from Analogue. That way the devs will know how to interact with it initially. After that, it should be wide open.

Yeah. Now, if they want to spotlight featured cores and such that deserve extra notice due to polish and acuracy, that'd be great!

[SegaSnatcher]

12 hours ago, spoonman said:

I prefer the AVS over playing NES/FC on a MiSTer because I enjoy playing my original carts. I find that I tend to actually stick with a game rather than play it for a couple minutes and then moving on to another game when playing a single cartridge, but I do like the N8 for imports, translations, color fixes, hacks, PC-10, VS., and more. 

 

 

That is a fair point and I think many are guilty of this, but its all about learning some discipline.  I've beaten a couple of games using flashcarts and MiSter, but yeah its hard not to just want to jump into another game. Also, like you said the hacks and color fixes make some of these games so much more enjoyable.  

P.S.  I hope one day you upgrade your camera gear so we can get some nice quality shots of your AVS with some bokeh backgrounds. 

[Newsdee]

13 hours ago, pedroTFP said:

Is there any proper buglist or "core completion status" about MisTer cores?

Yes. Bugs are tracked on github for each core.

 

Comparisons to the Mega SG and SNT has been made but it's hard to discuss objectively because some take it as an attack to their favorite platform.

 

I will summarize that both MiSTer and Analogue cores for those machines are excellent, but with some slightly different choices and priorities of fixes. As a result one is better in some areas than the other,  and the opposite is true for other areas.

 

I personally think it's a false dichotomy. A full MiSTer setup is cheaper than an SNT + SD2SNES, so one might as well get one and then get the Analogue machines for which you'd want carts or a nicely packaged replacement of the original machine (but single core).

Edited January 8, 2020 by Newsdee

[leonquest]

On 12/30/2019 at 3:22 PM, kevtris said:

I don't understand it either.  I've been called all sorts of nasty things by the Mister community.   They seem to have a vendetta against me and use every opportunity to bash me and/or Analogue.  At first, the Mister devs on there were real nice to me, but when I told them I couldn't release my code in an open source manner, their attitude towards me changed pretty fast.  One of their devs accused me twice of using/stealing his code, and another of the devs there keeps pushing this lie on there as if it were the truth.  Of course I have not looked at a single line of Mister source, except when someone posted it in this thread.

 

As for that blending, I already have something similar, and the idea was to only make it blend when it needed to, instead of all the time.  This way the whole screen doesn't look like someone slathered Vaseline on it.  I can make it blend all the time instead of selectively maybe by setting a slider to min or max and might add that when I do some other changes/fixes.

 

It was pretty amusing; the Mister people on the discord server were making fun of me for the Super nt core being TOO accurate!  I support video modes that the original hardware can do, but aren't terribly useful, simply because it's there and something might use it in the future and got harassed for it.   They carried on for an hour or so with their barrage of hate towards me, and scattered like cockroaches when I started talking.   When the Pocket got announced a few months ago, they'd go on a 2-3 hour hatefest every day.  It was frankly amusing how petty and ironic a lot of their so-called arguments were.

 

They sure are not endearing anyone to the Mister cause with all their hate and abuse towards me.  I just am curious to know what I did to them to make them detest me so.  Awhile back I tried to give them some NES information and was accused of "talking down" to them, so I have stopped trying to help at all.  It seems that if you're not giving away stuff you worked on for years for free, you're not welcome and become a target of ridicule.  When I pointed out that I give out stuff more valuable than code, such as my hardware documentation, they scoff at it.   I am giving away the golden goose (docs) and all they want are a few eggs (source code).  Knowing how the actual hardware works at a register and cycle level lets you reproduce it in any form, be it PC emulator or FPGA core, write games and make compatible hardware.  Trying to extract this kind of information from an emulator can be pretty difficult due to how emulators are written.  They tend to use runahead, catchup, or other hacks to get decent performance which muddies the waters when it comes to figuring out the timing.

 

Due to the single SDRAM nature of the Mister development environment, it makes cycle accuracy impossible or very difficult on many of their later cores, like SA-1 and Superfx for the SNES, the GBA core, and possibly others.  When I have said in the past that something couldn't easily be done, I meant in a cycle accurate way.  Sure, you can make it work if you don't care so much about cycle accuracy, but that is an affront to my whole FPGA mantra of accuracy.  "yeah but it runs the games!"  Sure. But at that point, you might as well be running a Raspberry pi and an emulator if all you care about is running games. 

 

This is pretty much all I will say about the Mister project;  they sure have not made me want to help or support them in any way and I have seen them actively drive away several other people with their attitude.

Hi Kevtris,

 

I'm a regular lurker here, as well as in many other forums, and I'm a big fan of your work since I learned of you through the NES HDMI mod (although I knew about the NSF format for decades, just didn't know it was you).

 

First off, I'd like to state how disappointing it is to have you suffer through all the vitriol from shitty people that are involved in the MISTer community. You did the right thing by stepping away from that. 

 

I won't defend their actions as there's no excuse, but the truth is, there are shitty people everywhere so this isn't a "MISTer community" thing. I see the same thing with people on everdrive forums, on xbox and playstation forums, hell even on my neighborhood or at work. A few rotten apples sometimes ruin it for the rest of us, but thankfully this is not the case yet for the MISTer project, at least not for me, as their shittiness does not detract from the awesomeness of the project. The way I see it is, the MISTer is the Zimba3K that we wanted so badly and never got from you (and that's ok, I know now you were meant for something bigger, better, which is what you are doing with Analogue). Vocal minorities are always the worst, but they don't speak for us all.

 

Amongst all of the brilliant FPGA coders that I've seen since the start of the MISTer project, I believe that you are the best (and also most notorious thanks to your NES HDMI mod) and I beleive this was why you were recruited by Analogue to make the NT mini, Super NT, etc. You guys make the perfect match together, as Analogue is awesome at marketing, and together you've brought the scene some wonderful contributions that I think are worth having, even with something like the MISTer out there. If I had the money I would buy every single one of their products. Sadly, after saving for an entire year I only had funds for the MISTer, I don't earn much and I have a 3 year old (plus salaries in my country and line of business suck).

 

I hope to see more of your products, and I hope I can actually afford them all at some point, but I am also at the expectation of getting a new MISTer core any day of the year which is an awesome feeling to have, which no other project out there can give me.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is F*** those people, thank you for all of your contributions, you keep doing you. I'm just another one of your fans trying to remind you that not everyone out there is shitty and ungrateful, some of us look up to you.

[ijor]

On 12/24/2019 at 9:11 AM, Kaide said:

I’ve already pointed out this is wrong. The only legally safe reimplementation is a clean room implementation. Not doing so risks it being marked as a derivative work.

And no, this isn’t why GPL isn’t open source. It generally isn’t considered an OSS license because it requires derivative works also be GPL

 

May be just for the records ...

 

People talk a lot about GPL and other licenses for FPGA cores. But, those are software licenses that don't apply directly to FPGA cores. Logic design falls outside the scope of copyright!

This is an extract from the official GPL faq itself:

 

Quote

Can I use the GPL to license hardware?

 

Any material that can be copyrighted can be licensed under the GPL. GPLv3 can also be used to license materials covered by other copyright-like laws, such as semiconductor masks. So, as an example, you can release a drawing of a physical object or circuit under the GPL.

 

In many situations, copyright does not cover making physical hardware from a drawing. In these situations, your license for the drawing simply can't exert any control over making or selling physical hardware, regardless of the license you use.

 

Now, FPGA cores are a bit of a grey area because it might be claimed they have similarities to a software process. I an not going to elaborate here and I am not a layer anyway. Just be aware, this is not software!

[ijor]

On 1/2/2020 at 8:36 PM, pedroTFP said:

I've a question about FPGA cores accuracy. I mean: without that, an FPGA core is not different from any RPi.

Now, we know Kevtriss's stuff is accurate (I own both MegaSG and SuperNT), but is it the same for all MisTer cores? In which measure? Is there any reliable source or a % status of the cores completion?

 

It depends on each core. MiSTer is an open project. Multiple developers are involved and some cores are ported from other platforms. So some cores are extremely accurate (my ST core is assumed to be fully cycle accurate), some not so much. Unfortunately, AFAIK there is no such table or list describing the level of accuracy or completion of each core.

[ijor]

On 12/30/2019 at 5:22 PM, kevtris said:

I don't understand it either.  I've been called all sorts of nasty things by the Mister community.   They seem to have a vendetta against me and use every opportunity to bash me and/or Analogue.  At first, the Mister devs on there were real nice to me, but when I told them I couldn't release my code in an open source manner, their attitude towards me changed pretty fast.  One of their devs accused me twice of using/stealing his code, and another of the devs there keeps pushing this lie on there as if it were the truth.  Of course I have not looked at a single line of Mister source, except when someone posted it in this thread.

 

Hi Kevtris,

 

It is awful and regrettable if you were treated without respect. But please don't generalize. There are many MiSTer developers and most without much contact with each other.

[Kaide]

 
Now, FPGA cores are a bit of a grey area because it might be claimed they have similarities to a software process. I an not going to elaborate here and I am not a layer anyway. Just be aware, this is not software!

That’s a fair point.

However, not everything is or needs to be in the VHDL. Anything running on the ARM SoC can be GPL’d as usual.

Depends on where this blend routine is implemented. Is it in the core or the SoC code?

Although if it is in the core, there’s still something to be said about not yoinking IP from a community that is already suspicious (unwarranted as it may be). And at the end of the day, anything like this *should* be handled by a lawyer.

[ijor]

On 1/13/2020 at 3:48 AM, Kaide said:

However, not everything is or needs to be in the VHDL. Anything running on the ARM SoC can be GPL’d as usual.

Depends on where this blend routine is implemented. Is it in the core or the SoC code?

Although if it is in the core, there’s still something to be said about not yoinking IP from a community that is already suspicious (unwarranted as it may be). And at the end of the day, anything like this *should* be handled by a lawyer.

 

 

Everything that is software can, of course, be GPL'd or copyrighted/licensed as any other software. That includes not only software actually running on the ARM, but also any firmware running on the FPGA. That's why arcade cores (normally) aren't distributed with the ROMs.

 

I'm not familiar with the blending, but any realtime video processing must be done at the FPGA side.

 

We are talking about the legal aspects. I fully agree that ethically, and disregarding the exact letter of the law, it is not recommended to go against the author willing.

[spoonman]

On 1/7/2020 at 12:46 PM, Drunk_Caterpillar said:

There are beta firmwares of AVS 1.40 that might fix the issue with that cart, but I haven’t checked myself. Also, installing custom palettes through the Scoreboard app is on the roadmap, but the timeline is kinda foggy right now. 

According to the changelog it seems to address issues with PAL games. 

1.40b2
  Fixes some PAL games with audio and game speed issues
1.40b3
  Fixes more PAL games (ppu)
1.40b4
  Fixes boot to black screen issue in Mega Man 5. May break other games!

There were some posts on NintendoAge (R.I.P.) talking about those firmwares causing problems with some NTSC games so I stayed away from it. IR would be nice to get the RetroUSB XMAS 2017 cart working on the AVS, but not at the expense of glitching official games, or dropping back to older firmware and losing major features. 

 

I emailed their customer support a couple times over the past 2 years and never heard back. It seems Brian has his hands full with his family.

I think if he plans on continuing with the AVS now would be the time to get all of the bugs worked out once, as well as adding any new possible features. Once Analogue releases their Nt Mini successor (Analogue 8?) The competition will likely slow sales on the AVS.

 

 

 

Quote

MEGAOS-V3.12 14.01.20201

1. SVP core fpr Virtua Racing (not working with Mega-SG)

2. Fixed SMS rom loading over USB

 

Good news for Mega Everdrive X7 owners. Krikzz added support for Virtua Racing.

Bad news for Analogue Mega Sg owners, It doesn't work on your system... For some reason. 

Edited January 15, 2020 by spoonman

[phoenixdownita]

18 hours ago, spoonman said:

...

 

 

Good news for Mega Everdrive X7 owners. Krikzz added support for Virtua Racing.

Bad news for Analogue Mega Sg owners, It doesn't work on your system... For some reason. 

Ahem:

MEGAOS-V3.13 16.01.2020
1. SVP compatibility fix for Mega-SG (required console firmware v4.7)

[jamon1567]

14 hours ago, phoenixdownita said:

Ahem:

MEGAOS-V3.13 16.01.2020
1. SVP compatibility fix for Mega-SG (required console firmware v4.7)

Gonna have to assume he means it won't work through the Krikzz cart on the Mega Sg.

[CZroe]

Gonna have to assume he means it won't work through the Krikzz cart on the Mega Sg.

Then what did it "fix?"

[RetrogamerX]

2 hours ago, jamon1567 said:

Gonna have to assume he means it won't work through the Krikzz cart on the Mega Sg.

 

The game works fine with Mega Everdrive X7 on Mega Sg after the fix.

[jamon1567]

4 hours ago, CZroe said:

4 hours ago, jamon1567 said:

Gonna have to assume he means it won't work through the Krikzz cart on the Mega Sg.

Then what did it "fix?"

Sorry, misread that and thought it was a Mega Sg update.

[vanfanel]

I have found this video that explains how important blending is on the Sega Megadrive games, and why having a coherent, complete, un-selective blending option like the MiSTer core has is an almost basic thing with the Megadrive in particular:

 

Dithering on the Sega Genesis

 

You will understand why I am asking so much to get it done right on the MegaSG even if I am already enjoying this on the MiSTer

 

[atm94404]

Since this Twitter poll was also posted on the Amico thread, it seems only fair it also be here: