FPGA Based Videogame System

[F34R]

Ok.. phew...

 

I can confirm that the Duck Hunt (VS) (patched Duck Hunt) works on the original NES with an Everdrive N8 os version v.16. I shot the dog just for fun.

[Tanooki]

Hehehehe BLAM! Die dog.

[F34R]

I forgot how cute it is to watch him limp on screen and basically say "F YOU!" lol

[Andromeda Stardust]

The crutches get me every time!

[spoonman]

Still a bit curious about these..

 

 

1. Will the Mega Sg have some type of animated intro/jingle?

 

2. Will there be a way to add the official SMS.bios so the SEGA logo displays when playing SMS carts {along with the audio jingle .."SAY-GAH"}? I'm so used to playing these games on official hardware that it might be strange without it.

 

3. Will we be able to map the SMS PAUSE button to the Sega Genesis Start button? I guess we would have to, unless the SMS cart adapter has a pause button.. Let's hope not.

 

 

With the CollectorVision FPGA failure, I would love to have a way to play it on the Sg. It would be right at home on the Sg...especially if you could connect and use Colecovision controllers into the 9 pin port. I know the CV controllers are not everyone's favorite, but if you grew up playing it that way in the early 80's then you'll have nostalgia for them. The numbers are also necessary with games like Mouse Trap, and Super Action controllers with Rocky, Front Line, Baseball, and more. Playing with the steering wheel and RollerController would also be awesome.

 

I have a Telegames Dina which plays both Sega SG1000 as well as Colecovision cartridges, so it would seem perfectly normal to me.

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2018 by spoonman

[Pixelboy]

With the CollectorVision FPGA failure, I would love to have a way to play it on the Sg.

Failure? You're quite misinformed, my friend. That project is still going ahead. Just not through Kickstarter. I pre-ordered two Phoenixes from CollectorVision's official web site.

[spoonman]

Failure? You're quite misinformed, my friend. That project is still going ahead. Just not through Kickstarter. I pre-ordered two Phoenixes from CollectorVision's official web site.

OK, well the Kickstater was a failure. Are they selling the bare SPARTAN-6 boards without a case?

 

Either way I think it would be great to have the Colecovision core + cart adapter as an option.

[Pixelboy]

OK, well the Kickstater was a failure. Are they selling the bare SPARTAN-6 boards without a case?

No, it's the full system, with custom plastic enclosure, same as what was submitted on Kickstarter. See here: https://collectorvision.com/

 

 

Either way I think it would be great to have the Colecovision core + cart adapter as an option.

You'd need SGM support to make it truly worth it. But regardless, I admit it would be nice to have a ColecoVision cart adaptor on the Mega SG.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Still a bit curious about these..

1. Will the Mega Sg have some type of animated intro/jingle?

2. Will there be a way to add the official SMS.bios so the SEGA logo displays when playing SMS carts {along with the audio jingle .."SAY-GAH"}? I'm so used to playing these games on official hardware that it might be strange without it.

3. Will we be able to map the SMS PAUSE button to the Sega Genesis Start button? I guess we would have to, unless the SMS cart adapter has a pause button.. Let's hope not.

With the CollectorVision FPGA failure, I would love to have a way to play it on the Sg. It would be right at home on the Sg...especially if you could connect and use Colecovision controllers into the 9 pin port. I know the CV controllers are not everyone's favorite, but if you grew up playing it that way in the early 80's then you'll have nostalgia for them. The numbers are also necessary with games like Mouse Trap, and Super Action controllers with Rocky, Front Line, Baseball, and more. Playing with the steering wheel and RollerController would also be awesome.

I have a Telegames Dina which plays both Sega SG1000 as well as Colecovision cartridges, so it would seem perfectly normal to me.

1. Probably.

2. Doubt it.

3. Plausible, but they would have to remap the controller port which may break certain games, as with Super NT occasiinally not detecting controlkers. My guess is button on the cart adapter by default unless a menu option is toggled.

 

As for your other request concerning Colecovision, the controller ports are not wired same as Sega so it may require additional logic or hardware not initially baked in. Same principal with Atari and other 9-pin cores. Analog was very generous this time on the backwards compatibility front. That 2-in-1 is definitely cool. Where did you get it?

[spoonman]

No, it's the full system, with custom plastic enclosure, same as what was submitted on Kickstarter. See here: https://collectorvision.com/

So they are selling them with 3D printed exteriors? I'm not sure I'd want something that rough looking.

 

You'd need SGM support to make it truly worth it. But regardless, I admit it would be nice to have a ColecoVision cart adaptor on the Mega SG.

I love the Colecovision. My first console was Pong in '76, but the Colecovision is where I really started to appreciate the games. It was where the home ports actually started resembling their arcade counterparts.

 

I'm just not into CV homebrew though. I like the system for the games I played back in the day, and not so much for the MSX or SG1000 ports. The latter games will play on the Sg with the $9.99 cart adapter (or possibly without, and with a JB). Some of the homebrew ports such as Pac-Man Collection are definitely impressive, but since I have no nostalgia for playing it on the CV, I'd probably just play on a later system. IIRC the SGM mostly just adds upgraded sound support and many games don't require it.

 

If the CV Phoenix makes you happy then more power to you, and I hope it works out well. I'd be happy to play it on one of the existing Analogue systems with Kevin's perfect Colecovision core. If the original CV controllers work that would be great, and if not I will manage with the standard Genesis controllers. I've used both quite a bit on my CV system over the years.

 

And if this doesn't happen then I will buy a MiSTer FPGA setup and play it on there. Actually, I'll most likely buy one of those either way since it's looking really nice lately.

 

 

 

That 2-in-1 is definitely cool. Where did you get it?

 

 

I believe I bought it directly from Telegames (from their webpage) in 2000 for $19.99. I played it for about 10 minutes to make sure it worked and then put it back in the box. It only worked when tunednro channel 13, which had way more RF interference for us than channel 3. I didn't have any SG-1000 carts to play so I just saw it as a bit of a drop in quality from my original Colecovision.

Edited November 21, 2018 by spoonman

[Pixelboy]

So they are selling them with 3D printed exteriors? I'm not sure I'd want something that rough looking.

 

Are you trying to stir up controversy here? Did you actually bother to read the caption below the image you posted?

 

 

 

I love the Colecovision. My first console was Pong in '76, but the Colecovision is where I really started to appreciate the games. It was where the home ports actually started resembling their arcade counterparts.

 

I'm just not into CV homebrew though. I like the system for the games I played back in the day, and not so much for the MSX or SG1000 ports. The latter games will play on the Sg with the $9.99 cart adapter (or possibly without, and with a JB). Some of the homebrew ports such as Pac-Man Collection are definitely impressive, but since I have no nostalgia for playing it on the CV, I'd probably just play on a later system. IIRC the SGM mostly just adds upgraded sound support and many games don't require it.

Okay, I get it, you're a purist. Of course, if you don't want to play anything new on the ColecoVision, you certainly don't need an SGM.

 

 

If the CV Phoenix makes you happy then more power to you, and I hope it works out well. I'd be happy to play it on one of the existing Analogue systems with Kevin's perfect Colecovision core. If the original CV controllers work that would be great, and if not I will manage with the standard Genesis controllers. I've used both quite a bit on my CV system over the years.

 

And if this doesn't happen then I will buy a MiSTer FPGA setup and play it on there. Actually, I'll most likely buy one of those either way since it's looking really nice lately.

 

 

 

I believe I bought it directly from Telegames (from their webpage) in 2000 for $19.99. I played it for about 10 minutes to make sure it worked and then put it back in the box. It only worked when tuned to channel 13, which had way more RF interference for us than channel 3. I didn't have any SG-1000 carts to play so I just saw it as a bit of a drop in quality from my original Colecovision.

I have a Dina and I never use it. Most homebrews don't work on it, for some technical reason. I recall trying Girl's Garden (the ColecoVision version) and it didn't work at all.

[Jurai]

in case someone missed it, Krikzz and Stoneagegamer are having their annual sale, SD2SNES is $157 https://krikzz.com/store/home/27-sd2snes.html https://stoneagegamer.com/search.php?search_query=sd2snes&section=product

[Jurai]

Tempted to buy a Mega Everdrive X3 to replace my old first gen Mega Everdrive during the sale but if a jailbreak (probably) comes might be pointless I guess

[F34R]

I grabbed a Mega and N64 cart. Saved 94 bucks.

Edited November 22, 2018 by F34R

[spoonman]

Are you trying to stir up controversy here? Did you actually bother to read the caption below the image you posted?

No, of course not. I figured it was the same photo used on their Kickstarter.

I was told by the Collectorvision team that they required the $250,000 to pay for the injection molding, but now they apparently don't need it? I'd personally ask some questions before sending them any money.

 

 

Okay, I get it, you're a purist. Of course, if you don't want to play anything new on the ColecoVision, you certainly don't need an SGM. I have a Dina and I never use it. Most homebrews don't work on it, for some technical reason. I recall trying Girl's Garden (the ColecoVision version) and it didn't work at all

A purist? Hardly. What gives you that idea? I own dozens of system clones, including the RetroUSB AVS, Super NT, SNS-101, the Sg on the way, and more.

 

I was even planning on buying the Phoenix until I started hearing things about it that I wasn't happy about.

Such as no HD output over HDMI, not all HD displays have decent built in upscalers. So that could be an issue.

If the AVS can handle 720p with the same SPARTAN-6 FPGA surely the Phoenix should be able to as well.

 

I also require my clones to handle basic accessories which the original can pull off. In this case, the official CV Expansion Modules, such as the Atari VCS, and Roller Controller.

[Pixelboy]

No, of course not. I figured it was the same photo used on their Kickstarter.

I was told by the Collectorvision team that they required the $250,000 to pay for the injection molding, but now they apparently don't need it? I'd personally ask some questions before sending them any money.

I can see you really dislike doing some fact-checking before typing. First of all, the target was $230,000, and secondly, that amount was meant to cover ALL manufacturing aspects (electronic sourcing and assembly, as well as shipping fees IIRC) not just the injection molding. The metal mold for the casing is indeed very expensive to make, but not THAT expensive. Furthermore, while CollectorVision only managed to reach just over 50% of their funding goal through Kickstarter, it was enough to convince them that there was a real interest in the Phoenix, as many people out there wanted to pledge but didn't want to do it though Kickstarter for various reasons. Now CollectorVision is doing a regular pre-order process via their web site, where people can pre-pay via Paypal (something you can't do on Kickstarter) and this should get them enough money to at least cover the cost of injection molding, and reach the final revision of the electronics. Once the system is available for purchase, more people will come and buy it over time. So in the end it's just going to take longer than expected for them to reach their 1000 unit target milestone.

 

 

 

A purist? Hardly. What gives you that idea? I own dozens of system clones, including the RetroUSB AVS, Super NT, SNS-101, the Sg on the way, and more.

We're not talking about all the systems you happen to own, we're talking about the ColecoVision. Someone who says he is a fan of the ColecoVision but turns his nose up at the ColecoVision homebrew scene is not a fan, he is simply a purist.

 

I was even planning on buying the Phoenix until I started hearing things about it that I wasn't happy about.

Such as no HD output over HDMI, not all HD displays have decent built in upscalers. So that could be an issue.

If the AVS can handle 720p with the same SPARTAN-6 FPGA surely the Phoenix should be able to as well.

Ah, so you're not only a purist, but you're a perfectionist as well? During the Kickstarter campaign, several people got vocal about the 720p thing, and guess what: The CollectorVision people were listening. Now I'm not saying I know that they intend to upgrade their ColecoVision core to output at 720p (I don't have any insider knowledge of the Phoenix project) but it can be reasonably assumed that they will at least look into it. Time will tell if 720p output will be offered down the line. But for now I'd like to point out that when you played the ColecoVision when you were a kid (or so I would assume) your TV was a CRT (probably with a slightly fuzzy picture) and you enjoyed playing ColecoVision games without complaining about the picture quality. Why can't you enjoy it now on a modern TV?

 

 

I also require my clones to handle basic accessories which the original can pull off. In this case, the official CV Expansion Modules, such as the Atari VCS, and Roller Controller.

Like I said, a purist, and a perfectionist.

Edited November 22, 2018 by Pixelboy

[cybercylon]

To me, the fact that it only outputs 480p isn't that much of a big deal. Scalers inside a TV are not the greatest, but upscaling a digital signal isn't as messy as up scaling noisy, older analog signals (e.g., RF, composite, S-video). I have a VGA modded ColecoVision, and I am running the VGA signal through a VGA to HDMI converter, and the picture looks pretty darn good.

 

I'd buy a CollectorVision system if I could, but thanks to unexpected medical expenses over the last 6-8 months.... probably not. Who knows... Santa might be nice to me this year..

[Bmack36]

No, of course not. I figured it was the same photo used on their Kickstarter.

I was told by the Collectorvision team that they required the $250,000 to pay for the injection molding, but now they apparently don't need it? I'd personally ask some questions before sending them any money.

 

To be clear on the kickstarter goal. It was set such that we would essentially break even assuming all of the pledges would be the lowest reward level possible (which in hindsight might not have been the best way) as we weren't sure what the ratio or guarantee of higher level reward levels would be. What the kickstarter showed us was that there was enough interest in the higher level rewards (which lower the total money needed drastically as the margin is fairly low on standard system) for us to feel comfortable moving forward with the system, even with doing the injection molding.

[kevtris]

To me, the fact that it only outputs 480p isn't that much of a big deal. Scalers inside a TV are not the greatest, but upscaling a digital signal isn't as messy as up scaling noisy, older analog signals (e.g., RF, composite, S-video). I have a VGA modded ColecoVision, and I am running the VGA signal through a VGA to HDMI converter, and the picture looks pretty darn good.

 

I'd buy a CollectorVision system if I could, but thanks to unexpected medical expenses over the last 6-8 months.... probably not. Who knows... Santa might be nice to me this year..

I wasn't going to say anything about the system, but since people are talking about it here, I might as well.

 

I think 480p only was a mistake- TVs and monitors have poor scaling and when I am testing video, there's a really obvious difference between 720p, 1080p and 480p. The latter looks blurry, like your glasses are dirty. When you do a direct A/B compare, going from 480p to even 720p seems like you've cleared the fog off a window. All the hostility against people who brought up the inconvenient truth that it was 480p only was bad for the cause. Calling such people "trolls" was disingenuous at best.

 

It was fully reasonable to ask questions and raise concerns about it, and beating those people down for no reason other than their opinion was unprofessional and poor form.

 

Also, showing Atari 2600 running on it, but only in VGA form and not HDMI was sort of deceptive, because there's a whole frame buffer system that has to be created before 2600 can be displayed over HDMI (unless you stick to games that output a single scanline count, and/or try to get your monitor to accept different frame rates, and don't mind it blacking out every time it changes). The system has no VGA port (though technically one could be added via the expansion port) so showing it running on a video output the board doesn't have was as Dave Jones of eevblog says.. "a little how ya doin'".

 

Speaking of frame rate, I don't think the system outputs an exact 60.0Hz frame rate either since it's basically raw digital VGA f18a video being transcoded into HDMI, and I don't think this outputs an exact 60.0Hz frame. If you do not output 60.0 exactly, there are plenty of monitors and TVs that will choke on it and give a black screen or similar. When making a product that will be used on potentially thousands of different TV and monitor models, it must conform to the HDMI standard as closely as possible. You MUST borrow or buy an HDMI analyzer to ensure compatibility.

 

I am not knocking their system or the creators of it at all, and I would not have said anything but it was brought up here. This is all my opinion and everyone is free to disagree with it :-)

[AtariBrian]

I wasn't going to say anything about the system, but since people are talking about it here, I might as well.

 

I think 480p only was a mistake- TVs and monitors have poor scaling and when I am testing video, there's a really obvious difference between 720p, 1080p and 480p. The latter looks blurry, like your glasses are dirty. When you do a direct A/B compare, going from 480p to even 720p seems like you've cleared the fog off a window. All the hostility against people who brought up the inconvenient truth that it was 480p only was bad for the cause. Calling such people "trolls" was disingenuous at best.

 

It was fully reasonable to ask questions and raise concerns about it, and beating those people down for no reason other than their opinion was unprofessional and poor form.

 

Also, showing Atari 2600 running on it, but only in VGA form and not HDMI was sort of deceptive, because there's a whole frame buffer system that has to be created before 2600 can be displayed over HDMI (unless you stick to games that output a single scanline count, and/or try to get your monitor to accept different frame rates, and don't mind it blacking out every time it changes). The system has no VGA port (though technically one could be added via the expansion port) so showing it running on a video output the board doesn't have was as Dave Jones of eevblog says.. "a little how ya doin'".

 

Speaking of frame rate, I don't think the system outputs an exact 60.0Hz frame rate either since it's basically raw digital VGA f18a video being transcoded into HDMI, and I don't think this outputs an exact 60.0Hz frame. If you do not output 60.0 exactly, there are plenty of monitors and TVs that will choke on it and give a black screen or similar. When making a product that will be used on potentially thousands of different TV and monitor models, it must conform to the HDMI standard as closely as possible. You MUST borrow or buy an HDMI analyzer to ensure compatibility.

 

I am not knocking their system or the creators of it at all, and I would not have said anything but it was brought up here. This is all my opinion and everyone is free to disagree with it :-)

 

And people should to listen to you of all people with your experience . And not make your post disappear like when you warned opcode about using old chips for his possible upcoming system . And yes , a mod and a few other people like to blast people for their opinions and questions / concerns .

[Reaperman]

All the hostility against people who brought up the inconvenient truth that it was 480p only was bad for the cause. Calling such people "trolls" was disingenuous at best.

 

It was fully reasonable to ask questions and raise concerns about it, and beating those people down for no reason other than their opinion was unprofessional and poor form.

 

 

I think it was sketchy not to have clearly laid the resolution/framerate facts out in the campaign itself, especially when I asked directly in the comments section.

 

That whole experience soured me a bit on the system, but rather a lot on the coleco community in general. I learned my lesson from the thing, and will probably avoid that forum going forward. Even the mods there were heaping on people. I was sorely tempted to PM them about it, but in a first for me here, I was a little worried about a ban.

 

The NT mini's colecovision support seems better in general, but I really did like the phoenix's controller/keypad support, cart support, as well as support for sgm--because those sgm games are all kinds of cool.

 

I know that there's somebody in this thread who's played around at least two of those 3 phoenix advantages on an NT mini already, if not all three.

Edited November 22, 2018 by Reaperman

[kevtris]

 

And people should to listen to you of all people with your experience . And not make your post disappear like when you warned opcode about using old chips for his possible upcoming system . And yes , a mod and a few other people like to blast people for their opinions and questions / concerns .

Did my post on that get deleted? I didn't notice. If so, that was a douchey thing to do, because I was just being honest and trying to save them a huge headache down the line when they were getting hundreds of parts only to find out half of them don't even work, because they were pulls sold as new, and/or factory rejects that were remarked, or simply not available. It's pretty difficult to buy 100-1000+ parts that were last made in the 90's and are otherwise very uncommon and get known good product.

 

Unless it's something common like a sound chip or RAM chip or whatever, a single sourced Yamaha VDP is going to be nearly impossible to source in any kind of production quantity. Heck, I have problems getting things that went end of life 6 months ago, let alone 20-25+ years ago!

 

If you want to see how bad the counterfeit/re-mark chip industry is, just check out ebay. Search for AY-3-8910. Any chip that is laser marked is a fake. Let's see. I see dozens of auctions for faked chips. The first results are some chips that have been painted black and a new marking stamped on. Yeah, I think GI is still making chips in 2013! (they have a 2013 date code). Seeing how GI was bought by Microchip in the early 90's, this is hilarious. And another that has been painted black and laser etched with a Microchip logo, and a 2016 date code. I think these chips were last produced some time in the early 90's, and did carry a Microchip logo, but it was always stamped and never laser etched. This is just 1 chip, now multiply that by all the sound/video/etc chips on the market.

 

Then again, I only have had 25 years experience with the whole "making electronic hardware and selling it" racket, so maybe I don't know a lot about it. I've made and sold thousands of hi def NES adapters and all of our products at work as well and several FPGA videogame systems that have hit the market. Clearly I don't know what I am talking about!

[AtariBrian]

He deleted your post almost instantly but now acts like it was his decision to do just what you advised him to do . And having a custom chip built .

[kevtris]

He deleted your post almost instantly but now acts like it was his decision to do just what you advised him to do . And having a custom chip built .

Interestingly The Opcode guy thanked me in a private message for the info and I'm glad he got something out of it and saw it before it got nuked. Without constructive criticism, projects get stuck in a hug-box echo chamber and then people can lose sight of the big picture. Sure, trolling is not a good thing and isn't constructive, but calling actual criticism "trolls" when it is not helps absolutely no one. Once your project gets a wider audience than 1 sub forum, the narrative cannot be controlled. I saw lots of complaints about youtube comments/videos in that thread. If those people only got to see the hate that I receive all the time from youtube and other sources, they'd blanch. I just take it in stride and don't worry about it.

 

I am always happy to receive well thought out constructive criticism, and I do not need to be protected from wrongthink. There was a lot of mister talk in this thread awhile back but I didn't say anything or complain about it because people want to talk about it. It's like going to a Coke convention and then talking about how Pepsi is so much better, and you shouldn't drink Coke. I bet if I was talking about the virtues of my 1080p HDMI Coleco core in the Phoenix thread, it would've been nuked from orbit in literally seconds.

[opcode]

Interestingly The Opcode guy thanked me in a private message for the info and I'm glad he got something out of it and saw it before it got nuked. Without constructive criticism, projects get stuck in a hug-box echo chamber and then people can lose sight of the big picture. Sure, trolling is not a good thing and isn't constructive, but calling actual criticism "trolls" when it is not helps absolutely no one. Once your project gets a wider audience than 1 sub forum, the narrative cannot be controlled. I saw lots of complaints about youtube comments/videos in that thread. If those people only got to see the hate that I receive all the time from youtube and other sources, they'd blanch. I just take it in stride and don't worry about it.

 

I am always happy to receive well thought out constructive criticism, and I do not need to be protected from wrongthink. There was a lot of mister talk in this thread awhile back but I didn't say anything or complain about it because people want to talk about it. It's like going to a Coke convention and then talking about how Pepsi is so much better, and you shouldn't drink Coke. I bet if I was talking about the virtues of my 1080p HDMI Coleco core in the Phoenix thread, it would've been nuked from orbit in literally seconds.

 

 

Wait, you mean this post: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/280280-introducing-project-pegasus-at-prge-and-retroworldexpo-2018/?p=4110351

It is still there, was never removed.

 

You shouldn't listen to certain well known trolls in these forums. I guess that is what I needed to get him removed for good...