FPGA Based Videogame System

[NE146]

19 minutes ago, jamon1567 said:

I will say that using composite with the DAC is not a great experience. Kev seems to have perfectly replicated a very bad Model 1 Genesis composite output (which, respect, but not really what I was looking for) in the sense that there is a lot of rainbow banding or whatever you call it. Unless this was revisited, it's not a great way to play.

Interesting. I'd be curious to check it out.. any particular examples? Granted I don't do the PVM thing but I do do the shitty $60 consumer CRT thing so I'm wondering how the megasg+dac would compare to an actual Genesis over composite for any instances of that banding..

[jamon1567]

11 minutes ago, NE146 said:

Interesting. I'd be curious to check it out.. any particular examples? Granted I don't do the PVM thing but I do do the shitty $60 consumer CRT thing so I'm wondering how the megasg+dac would compare to an actual Genesis over composite for any instances of that banding..

Just start up any game. White text looks all rainbowy (for lack of a better word) for instance. It's easy to see, but the Sonic waterfall would be another. It looks like a rainbow. May not be as prominent on a consumer set as my BVM or Ikegami, but it's def not good. It's like the worst of the Model 1 consoles (my non TMSS one does this too) in this regard.

Edited December 2, 2020 by jamon1567

[CZroe]

1280 * 3 = 3840

720 * 3 = 2160

 

Can't do it with a 1080p display, but a 4K display should be able to integer scale 720p just fine. At least on mine, the input lag is the same for 720p and 1080p, so I just run at 720p.

Yeah, but they almost invariably resample instead of doing nearest-neighbor scaling, which also breaks a proper integer scale. It isn't the kind of thing they expose to the user either. Until we get some kind of 720p to 4K scaler like an XRGB4 or OSSC Pro 2 (Pro isn't even out yet), it doesn't seem likely to happen. Best we can do is capture at 720p and scale in post for archival-quality 4K scaling but that doesn't help for playing/experiencing it yourself in real-time.

 

[vanfanel]

31 minutes ago, NE146 said:

I don't know. I see no huge differences in the clouds at the beginning of Crusader of Centy using Mister's "Composite Blend - Adaptive" setting vs. the Mega SG's dither blending slider. They both display it great!

Yeah, but you are talking abut SELECTIVE blending in both cases. MiSTer also has UNSELECTIVE blending- which is blurry but looks like an RCA-connected MegaDrive, not like that ugly selective solution that makes some parts of the screen look different thank others, ruins text in a lot of games and doesn't do proper transparency on others.

 

Unselective is only present on the MiSTer core. And in theory te slider in the MegaSG core should allow it, but it does not.

 

That problem would take 5 minutes to be fixed or patched for personal preferences on an opensource core. That's why closed solutions are inferior (apart from bit-rot, etc).

Edited December 2, 2020 by vanfanel

[Steven Pendleton]

I finally got my Nt mini Noir shipping notification about 20 seconds ago.

 

Analogue right now:

 

[BrianC]

On 12/2/2020 at 2:03 PM, jamon1567 said:

I will say that using composite with the DAC is not a great experience. Kev seems to have perfectly replicated a very bad Model 1 Genesis composite output (which, respect, but not really what I was looking for) in the sense that there is a lot of rainbow banding or whatever you call it. Unless this was revisited, it's not a great way to play.

I have a TMSS model 1 with excellent sound quality and it doesn't have the rainbow banding that the Mega SG has when using composite via the DAC. S-Video looks awesome, though. Super NT doesn't have the issue with composite. 

[plateofchips]

On 11/30/2020 at 6:34 PM, blzmarcel said:

I find this scenario especially disturbing, as many other vendors and sites tend to handle customs so customers don't need to. I've ordered many things from the UK and other parts of Europe and never had any issue. So either Analogue is dropping the ball with shipping (an area which generally has appeared to be an issue for some time) or the UK is doing something dodgy with the importing, as half the cost of the product really is fishy and reeks of corruption.

It's basically just one of those things and poor timing. Although, as ever, it could have been communicated better: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2020/11/watch_out_europe_-_importing_consoles_from_the_u_s_just_got_a_lot_more_expensive

[jamon1567]

14 hours ago, BrianC said:

I have a TMSS model 1 with excellent sound quality and it doesn't have the rainbow banding that the Mega SG has when using composite via the DAC. S-Video looks awesome, though. Super NT doesn't have the issue with composite. 

Not every non TMSS model 1 has it (from what I understand anyway), but you're far more likely to find it in one of those. I'm fairly certain Kev used a non TMSS Genesis as the reference for the Mega Sg so he could emulate the sound of those systems accurately, and so apparently whatever that reference was had the rainbow banding issue as well. I wouldn't expect it from the Super Nt since the SNES never had that issue, nor would I have expected it to be an issue with the DAC. I'm not sure what component causes the banding or how big of an effort it would be to rework that piece, but I would have liked to see a model 2 as the source for video, and the non TMSS model 1 for the audio. I can't envision him going back and making what I would assume to be a major change like that at this point though, if it's even possible to frankenstein it together like that.

[plx]

...ordered this controller one day after the JB came out to use it with the coleco core, couldn't predict that the status "useful" changes into "useless"

(regarding the coleco core; haven't tested others yet)

Anyway,

@kevtris , will you add support for that controller in a future firmware?

 

 

Edited December 8, 2020 by plx

[djsquare]

8 hours ago, plx said:

...ordered this controller one day after the JB came out to use it with the coleco core, couldn't predict that the status "useful" changes into "useless"

(regarding the coleco core; haven't tested others yet)

Anyway,

@kevtris , will you add support for that controller in a future firmware?

 

 

Are you saying this controller doesn't work with the new NT mini? It works great on my old NT mini

[Steven Pendleton]

I finally got my Nt mini today. When I was inspecting it, I noticed that there is a Neo Geo controller port on it. I LOVE the Neo Geo and so do you, so I plugged in a Neo Geo controller, but it doesn't work properly! The only thing that works is the C button, which only lets me turn the system off. What the hell? Seriously? ~$500 and the Neo Geo controller port doesn't work?

 

Anyway, it seems that either my 8BIT XMAS 2017 cart is broken or the cart's special screen doesn't seem to work on the Nt mini. Does anyone else have this cart/problems with it on the Nt mini? In any case, time to go play Fire Emblem and Action 52 and stuff.

 

Spoiler

I'm just joking. I know it's not a Neo Geo controller port. You knew that... right? The thing with the C button is true, though.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[CZroe]

I finally got my Nt mini today. When I was inspecting it, I noticed that there is a Neo Geo controller port on it. I LOVE the Neo Geo and so do you, so I plugged in a Neo Geo controller, but it doesn't work properly! The only thing that works is the C button, which only lets me turn the system off. What the hell? Seriously? ~$500 and the Neo Geo controller port doesn't work?
 
Anyway, it seems that either my 8BIT XMAS 2017 cart is broken or the cart's special screen doesn't seem to work on the Nt mini. Does anyone else have this cart/problems with it on the Nt mini? In any case, time to go play Fire Emblem and Action 52 and stuff.
 
Spoiler

I'm just joking. I know it's not a Neo Geo controller port. You knew that... right? The thing with the C button is true, though.

...and mine had an unadvertised Atari 5200 SuperSystem controller port. What a pleasant surprise! Unfortunately, I plugged in a CX-52 and it didn't work, but we all know it could just as easily be the controller to blame here. It's not all bad news though... I tried my CX-53 Trakball and it totally worked for NES Arkanoid and Racemate Challenge II!

NO, NOT REALLY.

 

[Steven Pendleton]

Just now, CZroe said:

...and mine had an unadvertised Atari 5200 SuperSystem controller port. What a pleasant surprise! Unfortunately, I plugged in a CX-52 and it didn't work, but we all know it could just as easily be the controller to blame here. It's not all bad news though... I tried my CX-53 Trakball and it totally worked for NES Arkanoid and Racemate Challenge II!
 

  Hide contents

NO, NOT REALLY.

 

You too? No way! That's quite convenient! They must be customized at random or something!

 

By the way, the Nt mini is a hell of a lot smaller than I thought it would be. I was expecting it to be about the size of the SuperGrafx or the Neo Geo for some reason. I think maybe it's because seeing pictures of the NES on the internet has given me the image of the NES being the size of the SuperGrafx or Neo Geo somehow. Then I get the Nt mini and it's actually not that much bigger than the Sega Nomad or the Mega Sg.

[CZroe]

You too? No way! That's quite convenient! They must be customized at random or something!
 
By the way, the Nt mini is a hell of a lot smaller than I thought it would be. I was expecting it to be about the size of the SuperGrafx or the Neo Geo for some reason. I think maybe it's because seeing pictures of the NES on the internet has given me the image of the NES being the size of the SuperGrafx or Neo Geo somehow. Then I get the Nt mini and it's actually not that much bigger than the Sega Nomad or the Mega Sg.

Yeah, the NES was way oversized because of the cartridge loading mechanism that fits the already-oversized cartridges completely inside and then moves them down. Once you push down you can literally shove a second cartridge in on top of the first! Then the boxy shape means even more wasted space beside the cartridge and the RF/power/AV module protrudes beyond the footprint of the main PCB in every dimension. Heck, even the choice to include an AC adapter with internal rectification and remote-mounted Power/Reset/LED/controller ports adds to the size.

...not to mention the unused EXT port that fits entirely inside and the deep cable-routing grooves on the bottom that add another half-inch for some expansion option that was never used.

[Steven Pendleton]

2 hours ago, CZroe said:

Yeah, the NES was way oversized because of the cartridge loading mechanism that fits the already-oversized cartridges completely inside and then moves them down. Once you push down you can literally shove a second cartridge in on top of the first! Then the boxy shape means even more wasted space beside the cartridge and the RF/power/AV module protrudes beyond the footprint of the main PCB in every dimension. Heck, even the choice to include an AC adapter with internal rectification and remote-mounted Power/Reset/LED/controller ports adds to the size.

...not to mention the unused EXT port that fits entirely inside and the deep cable-routing grooves on the bottom that add another half-inch for some expansion option that was never used.

Just in terms of function, I'm not sure if that's a good design or completely terrible. It looks huge in pictures on the internet. I guess there's no point in buying one now, though.

 

So I did something dumb. But it worked. I went to charge my controller with the Nt mini's USB thingy, but as I was picking up the end that plugs into the controller, I saw something: my Super Nt. I was like "That won't work... right?", but then I tried it... and it works. The Nt mini can power the Mega Sg and the Super Nt.

 

Anyway, here is what 8 BIT XMAS 2017 is doing. This is hard to photograph because of the lights in the cart, but as you can see, the screen on the cart is not working properly. Will contact RetroUSB to see if it might be a problem with the cart. I have never used this cart before, never dropped it that I can remember, and I have no other carts to put in the NES cart slot, so it shouldn't even be dirty unless Analogue made it preemptively dirty for me for some reason.

 

 

...and after some testing, the games are not working properly, either. It's either the cart or the system. Maybe both. Time to email RetroUSB. Hopefully one of my friends has the NES -> FC cart adaptor for his Famicom so I can test it on his FC.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Steven Pendleton
spelling

[spspspsp]

1 hour ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Anyway, here is what 8 BIT XMAS 2017 is doing. This is hard to photograph because of the lights in the cart, but as you can see, the screen on the cart is not working properly. Will contact RetroUSB to see if it might be a problem with the cart. I have never used this cart before, never dropped it that I can remember, and I have no other carts to put in the NES cart slot, so it shouldn't even be dirty unless Analogue made it preemptively dirty for me for some reason.

Select the 3.6V cartridge voltage option under system settings. Should fix this issue. Did for me, at least.

[Steven Pendleton]

23 minutes ago, spspspsp said:

Select the 3.6V cartridge voltage option under system settings. Should fix this issue. Did for me, at least.

Great, thanks, I'll try that right now!

 

Um... is it safe to do it with the cart in or should I do it with the cart not inserted, power off, and then put the cart in? I suppose I should read the instructions...

 

Well, I removed the cart, changed the option, and it still doesn't work properly. The cart screen still doesn't work 100% properly (it's better, but still doesn't display all of the images properly and it's still upside down for some reason) and although I have not tested all of the games since you have to power cycle the system to change games, at least one of them doesn't work properly and boots you back to the game select screen.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[spspspsp]

29 minutes ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Great, thanks, I'll try that right now!

 

Um... is it safe to do it with the cart in or should I do it with the cart not inserted, power off, and then put the cart in? I suppose I should read the instructions...

 

Well, I removed the cart, changed the option, and it still doesn't work properly. The cart screen still doesn't work 100% properly (it's better, but still doesn't display all of the images properly and it's still upside down for some reason) and although I have not tested all of the games since you have to power cycle the system to change games, at least one of them doesn't work properly and boots you back to the game select screen.

Huh. I just put mine back in and it came up correctly. I am booting directly to cartridge, no delay, if that makes a difference.

 

Which game isn't working for you?

[Steven Pendleton]

35 minutes ago, spspspsp said:

Huh. I just put mine back in and it came up correctly. I am booting directly to cartridge, no delay, if that makes a difference.

 

Which game isn't working for you?

Alright, I'll try that and see how it works, as well as testing all of the games.

 

By the way, I'm guessing this is you on GitHub. https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Nt-Mini-Noir-Jailbreak/issues/36 The option is there in the menu. "Swap confirm and cancel" or something like that. I have no idea why the hell B was the default confirm and A the default cancel...

 

Okay, so somehow it's working better pretty much every time you say something to me! Now it works perfectly with 2 exceptions: first, the 2016 game doesn't work. Black screen + music. The other issue is that the cart label is still upside down for some reason, but it displays everything properly now. It's just that it's all upside down.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[spspspsp]

26 minutes ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Alright, I'll try that and see how it works, as well as testing all of the games.

 

By the way, I'm guessing this is you on GitHub. https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Nt-Mini-Noir-Jailbreak/issues/36 The option is there in the menu. "Swap confirm and cancel" or something like that. I have no idea why the hell B was the default confirm and A the default cancel...

 

Okay, so somehow it's working better pretty much every time you say something to me! Now it works perfectly with 2 exceptions: first, the 2016 game doesn't work. Black screen + music. The other issue is that the cart label is still upside down for some reason, but it displays everything properly now. It's just that it's all upside down.

IIRC, there is a sensor in the cart that adjusts the label according to whether the cart is vertical or horizontal (like in an AVS system). Not sure why yours isn't working, but at least the display is mostly displaying correctly now.

 

The 2016 game is a pinball game, with a title screen showing kids ice skating around a tree. Works on my system--but it's not that engrossing--so I wouldn't personally miss it too much if it didn't play.

 

And thanks for pointing out the swap feature. I missed that in the settings!

Edited December 9, 2020 by spspspsp

[Steven Pendleton]

31 minutes ago, spspspsp said:

IIRC, there is a sensor in the cart that adjusts the label according to whether the cart is vertical or horizontal (like in an AVS system). Not sure why yours isn't working, but at least the display is mostly displaying correctly now.

 

The 2016 game is a pinball game, with a title screen showing kids ice skating around a tree. Works on my system--but it's not that engrossing--so I wouldn't personally miss it too much if it didn't play.

 

And thanks for pointing out the swap feature. I missed that in the settings!

Yeah, I figured something might be wrong with the sensor in the cart, but I have no way to verify it, so...

 

The cart's positioning makes a huge difference, as it seems that if it leans backwards, it goes back to having the display not working properly and stuff. I think some of the games might not have been working properly because of that. If the cart leans forwards, the label works properly aside from orientation and the 2016 game, which doesn't work no matter what I do.

 

Well, it mostly works and it's just a gimmick cart, even if it is an expensive one, and the games are on their website in case I actually want to play them. Thanks.

 

I noticed this some time ago, but the Mandelbrot zoomer does some weird things if you zoom in too far...

Edited December 9, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[plx]

7 hours ago, djsquare said:

Are you saying this controller doesn't work with the new NT mini? It works great on my old NT mini

Right, with the Noir. Pad and buttons are working fine (tested in nes mode) , but my intention was to use the num pad

for coleco games... How about the old mini and coleco? Can you test, just to be curious ..?

Edited December 9, 2020 by plx

[djsquare]

4 hours ago, plx said:

Right, with the Noir. Pad and buttons are working fine (tested in nes mode) , but my intention was to use the num pad

for coleco games... How about the old mini and coleco? Can you test, just to be curious ..?

yeah it works with the old Coleco core and the Arcadia 2001, that's pretty much the reason I picked it up off Ebay years ago. I'm sure the new NT Mini will get an update to support it

[Steven Pendleton]

Seems the in-game clock in Pokemon Gold/Silver/Crystal doesn't work as intended on the Nt mini. Sad, but expected. I guess I will just have to play Crystal Clear since that gives you an option to set the clock manually every time you play it if needed.

 

Also, is it me, or does the -3db cut not work on GB and GBC cores? The audio is super loud on those cores and I have to set my monitor to 50% just to avoid going deaf when using those cores. I tried the -3db cut just to reduce the volume and it seems to not do anything that I notice, unlike on the Mega Sg and Super Nt, where it makes a huge and immediately noticeable difference in volume.

Edited December 10, 2020 by Steven Pendleton

[CZroe]

Seems the in-game clock in Pokemon Gold/Silver/Crystal doesn't work as intended on the Nt mini. Sad, but expected. I guess I will just have to play Crystal Clear since that gives you an option to set the clock manually every time you play it if needed.
 
Also, is it me, or does the -3db cut not work on GB and GBC cores? The audio is super loud on those cores and I have to set my monitor to 50% just to avoid going deaf when using those cores. I tried the -3db cut just to reduce the volume and it seems to not do anything that I notice, unlike on the Mega Sg and Super Nt, where it makes a huge and immediately noticeable difference in volume.

Original cartridges or the jailbreak?