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kevtris

FPGA Based Videogame System

Interest in an FPGA Videogame System  

657 members have voted

  1. 1. I would pay....

  2. 2. I Would Like Support for...

  3. 3. Games Should Run From...

    • SD Card / USB Memory Sticks
    • Original Cartridges
    • Hopes and Dreams
  4. 4. The Video Inteface Should be...



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On 2/25/2021 at 2:09 PM, Gemintronic said:

The Mega SG runs my sega genesis homebrew like your typical genesis clone: with super sped up music.  This doesn't happen on original hardware or hardware clones like the JVC X'Eye.

 

The MiSTer just updated their core so my games play like original hardware.  So, for now: MiSTer 1  Mega SG 0

 

The neat thing is both systems are FPGA so it's just a matter of who gets updates and enhancements more often.

do you have a ROM or something I can test out?  also, it could be the YM3438 busy behavior checkbox might change things.  If not I will look into it.  This is the first I heard of this problem.

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11 minutes ago, kevtris said:

do you have a ROM or something I can test out?  also, it could be the YM3438 busy behavior checkbox might change things.  If not I will look into it.  This is the first I heard of this problem.

 

That's because I complained before doing the logical thing and ask for help :)  Sent you the offending Genesis homebrew.  Thanks again!

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31 minutes ago, kevtris said:

I could not reproduce the sms tearing during scrolling in games.  I set up a 1 pixel/frame horizontal scroll and saw no tearing.  what game(s) did you see it in?  also if you feel so strongly about mister, there is a dedicated mister thread.

Look closely at the upper part of the screen in "Batman Returns" and in "Master of Darkness" as you scroll on the first level on any of them. You will see the tearing.

 

Also, please note the missing notes in the music of "Rastan" in FM mode.

 

About the MiSTer, I didn't bring it up this time. I would really want the MegaSG cores to be on par with those on the MiSTer, really. But being closed, we can't fix anything, only you can.

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3 hours ago, kevtris said:

I could not reproduce the sms tearing during scrolling in games.  I set up a 1 pixel/frame horizontal scroll and saw no tearing.  what game(s) did you see it in?  also if you feel so strongly about mister, there is a dedicated mister thread.

Any chance you can get Outrun SMS to stop making the terrible noise in FM mode?


There's some info here:
https://etim.net.au/smsfm/smsfm.html

"In late 2014 there was some extra details discovered about the Japanese SMS sound hardware on detailed in this thread. The benefit is there are no longer 'extra' sound effects playing in Outrun at the start of a race."

 

Note I do not know if on a real Genesis+FM-mod it should work as it does on a real JP SMS, but on a real JP SMS there's no uninitialized PSG at the start of the race. 

(you can get to shut it up if you get offroad, then the noise goes away, if memory serves the noise comes back at the very next section)

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29 minutes ago, phoenixdownita said:

Any chance you can get Outrun SMS to stop making the terrible noise in FM mode?


There's some info here:
https://etim.net.au/smsfm/smsfm.html

"In late 2014 there was some extra details discovered about the Japanese SMS sound hardware on detailed in this thread. The benefit is there are no longer 'extra' sound effects playing in Outrun at the start of a race."

 

Note I do not know if on a real Genesis+FM-mod it should work as it does on a real JP SMS, but on a real JP SMS there's no uninitialized PSG at the start of the race. 

(you can get to shut it up if you get offroad, then the noise goes away, if memory serves the noise comes back at the very next section)

yeah I didn't know about that until now.  I can add this.  thanks for the bug report

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I may have missed it, but Any progress on the Zimba 3000 (or whatever it was being called 😜), Kevin?

 

I know there's the MISTer but I'd really like something more "console" like, that covers a multitude of different systems, similar to the NT Mini (which sadly doesn't look like there's any more being made, at least that's affordable - keep the fancy aluminum case, use plastic and save money). Just curious! :)

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Forgive me if this was fixed with the latest firmware (My Mega Sg is temporarily disconnected at the moment and I haven't had the chance to apply the latest update to see if the Z80 fix corrects my issue). But I thought I'd mention how Desert Strike for the Master System is broken on the Mega Sg with firmware v4.7/JB7.7 and lower, just in case Kevtris didn't know.

 

The problem is that pressing the Master System's pause button (i.e., the start button on the Genesis controller) to bring up the map/status screen in Desert Strike locks up the game. Affects both the original cartridge via the SMS cartridge adapter and the rom file via the jailbreak.

 

Timing seems to affect it as well. If you hit the button as soon as you can after lifting off from the destroyer's deck at the start of the game, you'll successfully reach the map screen. But when hitting the pause button to exit the map, the game will lock up and static will be audible. 

 

And if you wait even a few seconds after liftoff, you'll get the lock up and static immediately upon hitting pause to view the map.

Edited by Atariboy

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I was wondering, since this thread seems to be a catch all, but development on the HiDefNES Kit, are any more things being worked on with its core?  I saw the SuperNT still is ticking along with some solid updates, but I was wondering if the NES/FC side of things are seeing any improvement at this point?  I had to go digging to find an update for mine through gametech I think it was and that looked to be I think a couple years old or more.

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On 2/26/2021 at 9:10 PM, kevtris said:

yeah I didn't know about that until now.  I can add this.  thanks for the bug report

If you have time:

 

basically MegaED x7 SMSFM only works in "dual audio" when I turn on the MegaSg FM support for the core, if I leave it off on MegaSg the MegaED SMSFM does NOT kick in. When MegaSg has SMSFM on then both play the music (I hope that doesn't cause bus conflicts).

 

I am not sure if it is something your recreation performs that trips the MegaED (or the games) in not detecting the MegaED x7 SMSFM module, or if it is a bug in the MegaED implementation, at any rate, if you like a puzzle ;-)

 

 

And thanks for chiming in.

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On 2/27/2021 at 12:51 AM, kevtris said:

I could not reproduce the sms tearing during scrolling in games.  I set up a 1 pixel/frame horizontal scroll and saw no tearing.  what game(s) did you see it in?  also if you feel so strongly about mister, there is a dedicated mister thread.

Hi Kevtris, I have this issue on Bart vs the Space Mutants and Deep Duck Trouble. It’s easy to see in the first level of Bart vs if you walk backwards and forwards in front of the bar near the phone booth. Tearing in the top of the screen. Deep duck trouble is a bit more random but it often occurs when scrolling vertically. Mega SG set to NTSC and 1080p60. Happens in all buffer modes. Using genuine carts. Tried 3 different displays too.

 

Hope this helps

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On 2/26/2021 at 7:25 PM, RobDangerous said:

FPGA retro consoles are where I see the biggest benefit on my OLED, they benefit more from the perfect black handling (just think of all those shoot'em up, they tend to look a bit weird on other screens), the very quick switching of the pixels (LCDs are more smeary with fast motion) and the low input lag with very little image degredation than movies and modern games do.

This is good to know.  My first thought was scanlines and how OLED would theoretically make them look great.

 

Not that anyone cares but I thought I'd share this.  My wife and I had a date night this last weekend.  While waiting our 1 hour wait at Chili's for a table, we went to the stores nearby to browse.  I went into Best Buy because their website said they had a LG CX on display.  I was very impressed when I saw it.  The young salesman came over... I tried my best not to giggle under my mask as he did not know anything.  Here are some examples...

 

Me: So what is this "NextGen TV?"

Him: Oh, that means it has a much faster processor.

Me: Reads the ** at the bottom of what it really is.  >_>

 

Me: So is this TV susceptible to image burn-in? 

Him: Oh, no worries.  These newer TVs come already pre-burnt in.

 

Me: Does your company still offer calibration services?
Him: No, we stopped doing that.

Me: Why?
Him: These new TVs come right out of the box not needing calibrated.

Me: *in my head*  Rtings would like to have a word with you...

 

Him: If you want a really great TV, you should think of getting this 8K TV!

Me: Why?  There isn't even any 8K movies or streaming services for it.

Him: Heh...

  • Haha 1

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On 2/28/2021 at 10:02 PM, Enragedwhale said:

Hi Kevtris, I have this issue on Bart vs the Space Mutants and Deep Duck Trouble. It’s easy to see in the first level of Bart vs if you walk backwards and forwards in front of the bar near the phone booth. Tearing in the top of the screen. Deep duck trouble is a bit more random but it often occurs when scrolling vertically. Mega SG set to NTSC and 1080p60. Happens in all buffer modes. Using genuine carts. Tried 3 different displays too.

 

Hope this helps

Hi,

 

I had a lengthy conversation with Kevtris about this yesterday on Discord.

Initially he noted that these games ("Deep Duck Troube", "Bart vs Space Mutants", "Batman Returns" and "Master of Darkness") are all PAL-only releases.

So Kevtris tested them with a 1080p 50Hz mode, instead of a 1080p 60Hz mode, and he could not see any tearing.

I replicated that configuration, and I couldn't see any tearing in 1080p 50Hz mode either.

So my conclusion was that these are PAL games, programed for a 20ms per vblank period, while NTSC only gives the games 16ms per vblank period, so these strange tearing problems would be due to the game's code being prepared for 50Hz instead of 60Hz.

 

The problem is that games like "Alex Kidd in Miracle World" and "Castle of Illusion", which are both USA & Europe ROMs/carts, also show the exact same tearing in 60Hz.

 

However, Kevtris can't replicate that tearing (I repeat: Master System NTSC games on a 60Hz video mode) on his setup.

So, do you have any means of recording the defect so we can show him? If we don't, I fear he won't be able to fix it.

 

Also, tearing is present on GameGear games in 60Hz modes. Which of course is NOT supposed to happen because GameGear is ~60Hz.

Edited by vanfanel

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3 hours ago, vanfanel said:

Hi,

 

I had a lengthy conversation with Kevtris about this yesterday on Discord.

Initially he noted that these games ("Deep Duck Troube", "Bart vs Space Mutants", "Batman Returns" and "Master of Darkness") are all PAL-only releases.

So Kevtris tested them with a 1080p 50Hz mode, instead of a 1080p 60Hz mode, and he could not see any tearing.

I replicated that configuration, and I couldn't see any tearing in 1080p 50Hz mode either.

So my conclusion was that these are PAL games, programed for a 20ms per vblank period, while NTSC only gives the games 16ms per vblank period, so these strange tearing problems would be due to the game's code being prepared for 50Hz instead of 60Hz.

 

The problem is that games like "Alex Kidd in Miracle World" and "Castle of Illusion", which are both USA & Europe ROMs/carts, also show the exact same tearing in 60Hz.

 

However, Kevtris can't replicate that tearing (I repeat: Master System NTSC games on a 60Hz video mode) on his setup.

So, do you have any means of recording the defect so we can show him? If we don't, I fear he won't be able to fix it.

 

Also, tearing is present on GameGear games in 60Hz modes. Which of course is NOT supposed to happen because GameGear is ~60Hz.

I’ll give this a shot when I get home in a few hours. I don’t have any capture gear but 120fps Iphone video should suffice? 
 

Any tips on the troublesome areas to try?

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Ok so I have a quick and dirty 120fps GoPro vid of castle of illusion tearing.

 

I also have a vid of Bart vs tearing on the mega SG and then the same exact cart running on genuine ntsc hardware through an OSSC on the same display not tearing what so ever.

 

I’m terrible at this sort of stuff so who wants them sent where and what sort of file sizes are acceptable? Straight from the go pro they are massive!

 

I can put together more comprehensive  videos but it’ll be a few days before I have time but I believe these suffice for comparing the SG to real hardware. 
 

 

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3 hours ago, Enragedwhale said:

Ok so I have a quick and dirty 120fps GoPro vid of castle of illusion tearing.

 

I also have a vid of Bart vs tearing on the mega SG and then the same exact cart running on genuine ntsc hardware through an OSSC on the same display not tearing what so ever.

 

I’m terrible at this sort of stuff so who wants them sent where and what sort of file sizes are acceptable? Straight from the go pro they are massive!

 

I can put together more comprehensive  videos but it’ll be a few days before I have time but I believe these suffice for comparing the SG to real hardware. 
 

 

Fantastic! If you get to upload a video, we can pass it to Kevtris on discord so he can see there's tearing with SMS NTSC games on 60Hz video modes.

 

For uploading I can recommend dropbox, or maybe we could exchange Telegram so you can send me the videos directly if that's OK so I can send them to Kevtris, or you can give them to Kevtris directly on discord.

Some seconds of video, even at 1080p, shouldn't be so big. I can convert the videos from 4K to 1080p if needed.

How big are the video files straight from the GoPro?

 

Also, in the Castle Of Illusion video you have uploaded I can't see more than 5-6 frames and tearing is not visible. Is it supposed to be visible there?

Edited by vanfanel

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4 minutes ago, vanfanel said:

Fantastic! If you get to upload a video, we can pass it to Kevtris on discord so he can see there's tearing with SMS NTSC games on 60Hz video modes.

 

In Castle Of Illusion video you have uploaded I can't see more than 5-6 frames and tearing is not visible. Is it supposed to be visible there?

Sorry struggling to get them compressed to a sensible size on my iPhone. That clip should have been 5s and clearly shows tearing. Let me bang my head against this for a bit and I’m sure I’ll get them uploaded.

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@Enragedwhale

 

Very good news, as I have spoken with Kevtris and he could see the defect. He's currently busy, but he will investigate.

Record more NTSC games if you can, please :)

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Here a Dropbox folder where I’ll keep uploading vids as required.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/e5xxvr8lmznarl2/AAARJYURFCAIqvpWLZgEPmYna?dl=0

 

I’ve just added 2 Bart vs the Space Mutants videos. I know it’s a PAL only release on the Master System but I don’t believe it should be dismissed for a couple of reasons.

 

Compared to the NES and Genesis releases it much slower at 50hz. Not just gameplay but the music too. It sounds much closer at 60hz.

 

And more relevant to the accuracy of the MS core on the Mega SG, it runs perfectly on a NTSC master system. The 2nd video I uploaded titled NTSC MS shows the exact same cart running on genuine hardware through an OSSC on the same display. It’s smooth as butter.

 

I also like it as a game to demonstrate the issue as you simply have to walk a couple of screens over and you can see the tearing clear as day in the roof of the bar. I also noted that whilst it does not tear at 50hz on the Mega SG, it does have a repeatable stutter at the same spot that doesn’t happen on real hardware at 50hz. Of course I made sure to change the res to 1080p50.

 

I’m happy to check out more NTSC games as suggested. My time is limited so could I please have some suggestions of games where it’s visible in the early stages? It’ll be a few days before I have more time so please be patient.

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On 2/25/2021 at 1:55 PM, SegaSnatcher said:


I'm sorry, but I feel calling the MiSTer project "garbage" is total disrespect to all the developers who have put in so much work into that project.  Maybe its not for you, but it definitely is not garbage.  I think we should use the word "garbage" for products that actually deserve that title.
 

Agreed. It irritates me when the word "garbage" is thrown around describing anything that isn't 100% flawless. Obviously what one deems "garbage" is subjective, but I see the term thrown around way too often without consideration.

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7 hours ago, Austin said:

Agreed. It irritates me when the word "garbage" is thrown around describing anything that isn't 100% flawless. Obviously what one deems "garbage" is subjective, but I see the term thrown around way too often without consideration.

And it's an especially inappropriate term when the alternatives have an equivalent number of bugs or inaccuracies

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I noticed that the Mega Sg's automatic cartridge and CD audio option now seems to work with the MegaSD. I thought it didn't work properly before, but maybe I'm wrong. Anyway, it seems to work properly now.

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Looks like the No-Intro Knuckles in Sonic 2 ROM isn't loading from the Mega Sg's SD card slot on 7.8 for some reason. The same file works if I load it with the MegaSD and my real carts work as well. I posted it over on the GitHub. Is this happening for anyone else?

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